Joe Whitt / Winston Moss FIRED - merged threads

[Deleted member 6794]

I'm still not giving Whitt a pass for this garbage. I'm already shuddering at the idea of Goff just dropping back and throwing it in the deep middle to Kupp, Cooks or Woods in 2 weeks.

I do think our offense will get on track eventually to get tempo control in games, but don't think it's going to happen soon enough to go pound for pound with the Rams. This secondary has gotta get cleaned up or Whitt has to go.

The Packers secondary is improved over the past two seasons ranking 17th in opposing passer rating. While I expect the Rams to put up points against Pettine's unit their defense hasn't been elite by any means currently ranking three spots behind Green Bay in that category.

 

[Mondio]

I never understood how people can be so adamant about something they know nothing about? I mean really, tell me 1 single thing you know about Joe Whitt and his coaching, what he's taught and what he's doing wrong, specifically. We can all see lapses in the defense. but this is at EVERY level. The Dline has mad emistakes, LB'er play DB and safety. They gave up a couple big plays, and that has to get better, but seriously, there were about 6-7 passes that accounted for almost all of their offense. And if you're going to blast the man for the first half, what about the 2nd? How many passing yards and points given up? Did he just figure out how to coach DB's at halftime and get them up to speed?

I get it, the past hasn't reflected well on the DB's and there are a lot of reasons for it. Mostly injury related and that should be obvious, maybe it's blindingly obvious? I don't know, but it should be. anyway, when former Packer greats think Whitt is a great coach, i'm thinking they have a better take on things. so far i've seen nothing other than a couple individual breakdowns and scheme related things that have lead to big plays more so than anything I could possibly pin on Whitt and his coaching techniques. And though it looks the same, I think it has more to do with 6 weeks in to a new defense. If they're doing this in year 2-3 maybe you're on to something, but right now I think you're just guessing. Maybe you guys have more insight?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

anyway, when former Packer greats think Whitt is a great coach, i'm thinking they have a better take on things. so far i've seen nothing other than a couple individual breakdowns and scheme related things that have lead to big plays more so than anything I could possibly pin on Whitt and his coaching techniques.

At some point Whitt has to be held accountable if the secondary doesn't perform at a level above league average though.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

He should be held accountable for allowing the lousy Bethard to get any pass yards and TDs.

 

[Mondio]

At some point Whitt has to be held accountable if the secondary doesn't perform at a level above league average though.

And that’s fine, do you think now is the point to draw conclusions? Every good guy we had here that’s was good here too when not injured is somewhere else. We have all new DBs other than safety and 1 injured 2nd year player and are 6 weeks into a new defense. Is now the time to draw conclusions?

 

[Mondio]

He should be held accountable for allowing the lousy Bethard to get any pass yards and TDs.

Pretty much what I expected. You got nothing but emotional reactions to everything

 

[Deleted member 6794]

And that’s fine, do you think now is the point to draw conclusions? Every good guy we had here that’s was good here too when not injured is somewhere else. We have all new DBs other than safety and 1 injured 2nd year player and are 6 weeks into a new defense. Is now the time to draw conclusions?

In my opinion it's too early to draw any conclusions about the secondary. I want the unit to improve over the course of the season though. Otherwise Whitt should be brought into question.

 

[gopkrs]

If nothing else he should be accountable for not recognizing talent and placing players in positions to fail.

 

[gopkrs]

I say give Leroy a shot.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

Pretty much what I expected. You got nothing but emotional reactions to everything

I'm willing to bet Pettine is at odds with Whitt

 

[Mondio]

I'm willing to bet Pettine is at odds with Whitt

Why? Example please

 

[Mondio]

If nothing else he should be accountable for not recognizing talent and placing players in positions to fail.

Such as? Did he call the defensive plays in the game? And if so, does he just figure out how to coach well at halftime?

 

[gopkrs]

Such as? Did he call the defensive plays in the game? And if so, does he just figure out how to coach well at halftime?

I would imagine that he has a lot of input on which DBs get re-signed and also what positions they play. Something that has been repeated constantly on this board. Although nobody has been talking about position coaches having anything to say. btw I noticed that on some plays Ha Ha is playing way too deep again. He should be in position to break up passes down the middle semi deep. It only takes a two big steps forward to be in position. So you are content with our DBs play?

 

[Mondio]

a position coach is not a GM, don't think they're even close. I'm not even sure they're on the same totem pole to even measure how far down a position coach is in the grand scheme of roster decisions. Maybe Ha Ha plays deep because thats where he has to because of speed limitations? I am not content with DB play. Tramon is what he is at this point in his career. Alexander looks very promising and needs to get back on the field. Jackson looks like the guy we all wanted to draft and King is up and down, mostly because he can't stay on the field because of injury. Get them all 6 games together with Breeland in the mix and I have a feeling things will be different. I've also noticed there have been more "coverage" sacks this year for us because of improved play in the defensive backfield. I'd call it a work in progress. and if King goes out, Jackson is running at 60% and Alexander plays thru an injury that needs surgery I'm not going to call Whitt done then either. But I know many will be ready to.

 

[GB2016]

If he doesn't find a way to get HAHA of the field he will be accountable.

 

[gopkrs]

a position coach is not a GM, don't think they're even close. I'm not even sure they're on the same totem pole to even measure how far down a position coach is in the grand scheme of roster decisions. Maybe Ha Ha plays deep because thats where he has to because of speed limitations? I am not content with DB play. Tramon is what he is at this point in his career. Alexander looks very promising and needs to get back on the field. Jackson looks like the guy we all wanted to draft and King is up and down, mostly because he can't stay on the field because of injury. Get them all 6 games together with Breeland in the mix and I have a feeling things will be different. I've also noticed there have been more "coverage" sacks this year for us because of improved play in the defensive backfield. I'd call it a work in progress. and if King goes out, Jackson is running at 60% and Alexander plays thru an injury that needs surgery I'm not going to call Whitt done then either. But I know many will be ready to.

Well of course the GM has the final decision. But if he is not getting some of his information from the people who actually coach the players; he won't be much of a GM. What a total lack of communication that would be. And arrogant. imho

 

[Mondio]

And Hayward and Hyde were both a causality of cap and FA with young guys behind them that looked like they were going to replace them. What makes you think Whitt told Ted to get rid of them?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

This isn't a new thing with the Packer secondary, its been going on for years and mostly with CB's! Most wanted to blame Capers for it, some pointed the fingers at TT as well. While both of those guys should be accountable for a pretty consistently crappy D, why should Whitt get a free pass? For those saying he needs more time and "what has he done wrong?". Are you watching the same games I am? Let me ask you "What has he done well?". Shields......that is about it. Do we know Whitt was solely responsible for Shields gong from an UDFA to a Pro Bowler? Did having Woodson and Williams on the team help?

If you are someone asking "Why is Whitt's job in jeopardy?" I ask you "Why shouldn't it be?" Which current players are examples of why Whitt is a great coach?

 

[Mondio]

I told why, did you miss it?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

And Hayward and Hyde were both a causality of cap and FA with young guys behind them that looked like they were going to replace them. What makes you think Whitt told Ted to get rid of them?

Hayward and Hyde both got better when they left Green Bay. Can you 100% say they would have done the same had Green Bay kept them? I can't say either way, but as guys like them and Randall leave GB and improve, I think its a telling sign.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I told why, did you miss it?

All I saw was you taking the blame off Whitt and putting it on injuries, the GM and the DC. Position coaches teach fundamentals and work individually with players on perfecting technique as well as where to be on the field for each formation. All things that seem to be issues with our secondary over a long period of time.

What can you say Whitt has done well? I don't put much stock in former players saying "great guy, he should be a HC".

 

[Mondio]

I don't know, i've never been in a single practice. and yes, injury is probably the overwhelming reason we've had poor secondary play over the years. Unless you're seeing teams with #4 DB's being starters and excelling i'm going to maintain that position. Especially in a year when your 2 "stud" olb's are mostly injured. Recipe for success right?. I'm not going to rehash every year. To me it's obvious. and former players saying someone is a good coach should mean something. It's certainly means more than someone who has never played for the man.

and so far this year there has been a fairly obvious improvement in the Defensive backfield despite being worse at OLB and safety. In fact i'd say the DB's, despite missing 2 guys fairly regularly has made our underwhelming pass rush look better by keeping coverages longer. So yeah, i'm going to let a season play out with some healthy guys under a new scheme before I go making declarations based on pass misconceptions. Unless you think of course Guys like Gunter are forming the backbone of every elite defensive backfield in the league?

 

[TornSolace]

Samuel George Shields III!!!

Game, set, match.

How are you that simple in the head?

 

[TornSolace]

Shields is to busy being awesome right now

So what and your point is? He is in a contract year.

 

[TornSolace]

Joe Whitt has got to go. Our guys are getting lost out there with Tate and Golladay and are not getting any effective communication.

I really don't believe it's the scheme, I think it's the way they're being coached to recognize plays. And I'm in no way attempting to let Capers off the hook or say that his firing was unjustified, but Whitt has practically coached every DB in his and now Pettine's scheme.

To me, these results are damning on Whitt and if I'm Mike McCarthy, I'm firing Whitt and letting Pettine advocate bringing someone in that he's worked with either from his days in New York or Cleveland.

But I want McCarthy to go also it has been long enough he is too complacent and has wasted most of Rodgers career. And Mark Murphy needs to go also. I am so sick of those two bums