Packers estimated to be $28M under cap for 2015

[ivo610]

While Byrd had a disappointing season in New Orleans, ending on IR, his cap hit during the first three years of the deal the Saints signed him to will be lower than the deal Peppers signed with the Packers. So we would have been able to afford to sign Byrd.

Its pretty obvious which move was the better one isnt it?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Its pretty obvious which move was the better one isnt it?

The jury still out on that in the long haul. Just taking this season into consideration it's obvious Peppers had the bigger impact.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

You're right. There was not. That's a risk TT takes when sticking to his philosophy. Happened to the Packers at ILB last year as clearly nobody at that position also provided good value or trades didn't work out for them to get one.

I hope it works out better at ILB next offseason.

 

[HardRightEdge]

If we had only signed Byrd like everyone here wanted!!!

Who will be this years big name FA that everyone wants us to sign? Predictions?

Who needs free agency? As discussed previously, release Hawk and Jones, trade for Pat Willis, net cap hit 1.7 mil. SF has Borland playing well in his spot and they're going to be over the cap and needing to off load some vets.

Oh my, that would cost a draft pick!

 

[ivo610]

Who needs free agency? As discussed previously, release Hawk and Jones, trade for Pat Willis, net cap hit 1.7 mil. SF has Borland playing well in his spot and they're going to be over the cap and needing to off load some vets.

Oh my, that would cost a draft pick!

Well we would have to outbid every other team for a 30 yr old declining, coming off the ir, player.

It's easy to throw out scenarios like that but they take two willing parties to make it happen, which is oh so rare

 

[Carl]

Who needs free agency? As discussed previously, release Hawk and Jones, trade for Pat Willis, net cap hit 1.7 mil. SF has Borland playing well in his spot and they're going to be over the cap and needing to off load some vets.

Oh my, that would cost a draft pick!

Anything higher than a 4th would not be worth it.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Well we would have to outbid every other team for a 30 yr old declining, coming off the ir, player.

It's easy to throw out scenarios like that but they take two willing parties to make it happen, which is oh so rare

You're right! Thompson is frequently an unwilling party. Others will want to participate if the 49ers are offering.

As far as Willis "declining", he could still be playing this season but chose to clean up a nagging injury for the long haul. He's got at least 2 good years left which happens to be the balance of his contract. It's also helpful to note there's no guarantees in the two years left in his contract. There is less risk in Willis' contract than the deal Peppers signed.

I predict Willis will be playing at Pro Bowl level for somebody next year.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Anything higher than a 4th would not be worth it.

Oh, I think they'd want at least a 3rd. rounder. Thompson would not offer more than a 6th. So I do not expect the deal to get done.

On second thought, Thompson would wait for the 49ers to cut him so he would not have to pay anything. Willis would then be traded elsewhere.

 

[ivo610]

You're right! Thompson is frequently an unwilling party. Others will want to participate if the 49ers are offering.

As far as Willis "declining", he could still be playing this season but chose to clean up a nagging injury for the long haul. He's got at least 2 good years left which happens to be the balance of his contract. It's also helpful to note there's no guarantees in the two years left in his contract. There is less risk in Willis' contract than the deal Peppers signed.

I predict Willis will be playing at Pro Bowl level for somebody next year.

I guess for the anti ted crowd its teds the unwilling party and for the pro ted crowd its the other team thats the unwilling party. And others just see it as two sides being unwilling to come to terms.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Byrd is a great example, like Steven Jackson in the 2013 offseason, where TT ignored the media and fan hoopla and drafted a replacement. Eddie Lacy was a great pick and didn't cost the $12 million that Jackson did. Ha Ha Clinton-Dix was another great pick and hasn't cost Green Bay the $26.3 million guaranteed cap hit ($54 million total) that the Saints will endure.

TT isn't perfect by far. He's still one of the best GMs the Packers have ever had and his prudence and drafting acumen allow him to resign Rodgers, Nelson, Matthews, and soon to be Cobb when they are due. There will be more misses, and it could be at ILB next year. It's part of the rock'n'roll lifestyle of the NFL.

Thompson brought Steven Jackson and Chris Canty in for discussions a couple of years back. It's not that he didn't want those players; he did not want to pay them what they could get elsewhere (or enough for them to want to come to Green Bay).

As far as Byrd is concerned, I'd never pay a safety that kind of money. That said, it's not like Clinton-Dix has shown himself to be an impact player. I'm not convinced that if the Packers had signed Byrd, he'd not been injured, Peppers was not signed, and an OLB was taken in the draft this would not be a better defense.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I guess for the anti ted crowd its teds the unwilling party and for the pro ted crowd its the other team thats the unwilling party. And others just see it as two sides being unwilling to come to terms.

I'm neither anti-Ted nor pro-Ted. I just don't happen think as highly of him as most in these pages.

He's put together a good offensive unit. He's put together a below average defensive unit costing $10 mil more in cap than the offense. His results are mixed. Memories are short; folks tend to forget how ordinary the talent was exposed to be when Rodgers went down. Swap his QB for an average one and he has an average team. That would indicate he's an average GM.

He drafted Rodgers and hired McCarthy. One can make a career out of that. Oh, by the way, there's something I have not said yet this week...fire Capers.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Anything higher than a 4th would not be worth it.

The Packers selected Khyri Thornton in the third round this year who was saved of being cut by a season ending injury. I would be more than happy to have Patrick Willis if all it takes would be a third round pick.

 

[PikeBadger]

Who needs free agency? As discussed previously, release Hawk and Jones, trade for Pat Willis, net cap hit 1.7 mil. SF has Borland playing well in his spot and they're going to be over the cap and needing to off load some vets.

Oh my, that would cost a draft pick!

LOL, Clearly not a draft and develop disciple are you HRE?

 

[Carl]

I'm neither anti-Ted nor pro-Ted. I just don't happen think as highly of him as most in these pages.

He's put together a good offensive unit. He's put together a below average defensive unit costing $10 mil more in cap than the offense. His results are mixed. Memories are short; folks tend tend to forget how ordinary the talent was exposed to be when Rodgers went down. Swap his QB for an average one and he has an average team. That would indicate he's an average GM.

He drafted Rodgers and hired McCarthy. One can make a career out of that. Oh, by the way, there's something I have not said yet this week...fire Capers.

Overall results matter more than 8 games without his best player. His best defensive pick was out many of those games too. It does not make sense to me to remove a guys best draft pick and then judge him. It's also very common for teams to get worse or better dramatically with QB changes.

Plus, it's not nearly as simple as just removing Rodgers and saying this is how the team would be. First of all, without him we'd have like $100 million to spend on the rest of the team. Also, we would have been picking higher in the draft and getting more talent on the rest of the team.

The Rams, Browns, and Bills are all teams with solid defenses but no answer at QB. Are their GMs better despite the teams being worse?

 

[Carl]

The Packers selected Khyri Thornton in the third round this year who was saved of being cut by a season ending injury. I would be more than happy to have Patrick Willis if all it takes would be a third round pick.

In hindsight it's easy to say we should have gone a different route with a pick. We have no idea who TT might end up with picking with his next 3rd rounder.

We also have picked Burnett, Finley, James Jones, and Richard Rodgers in that round.

I don't think it's worth giving up a 3rd for an old players who's been injured recently.

 

[HardRightEdge]

LOL, Clearly not a draft and develop disciple are you HRE?

About as much as Ted Thompson. You guys act like the Peppers signing never happened.

Draft and develop together with select free agent signings is the road many teams follow to success.

I'm just not a Ted Thompson disciple.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Overall results matter more than 8 games without his best player. His best defensive pick was out many of those games too. It does not make sense to me to remove a guys best draft pick and then judge him. It's also very common for teams to get worse or better dramatically with QB changes.

Plus, it's not nearly as simple as just removing Rodgers and saying this is how the team would be. First of all, without him we'd have like $100 million to spend on the rest of the team. Also, we would have been picking higher in the draft and getting more talent on the rest of the team.

The Rams, Browns, and Bills are all teams with solid defenses but no answer at QB. Are their GMs better despite the teams being worse?

I said Thompson signed Rodgers and McCarthy and that a guy could make a career out of that. I try to be balanced.

 

[HardRightEdge]

http://www.packersnews.com/story/sp...tthews-future-not-inside-linebacker/20286317/

 

[ivo610]

I'm neither anti-Ted nor pro-Ted. I just don't happen think as highly of him as most in these pages.

He's put together a good offensive unit. He's put together a below average defensive unit costing $10 mil more in cap than the offense. His results are mixed. Memories are short; folks tend to forget how ordinary the talent was exposed to be when Rodgers went down. Swap his QB for an average one and he has an average team. That would indicate he's an average GM.

He drafted Rodgers and hired McCarthy. One can make a career out of that. Oh, by the way, there's something I have not said yet this week...fire Capers.

Good? you wonder why you appear to be anti TT. His 2011 offense at the time was the 2nd best offense of all time (points scored). This one is the best in the league. Yet you say just good?

I think its funny when people fault ted for not having another Aaron Rodgers on the bench. Its just ridiculous. Taking away the player who has the most cap space dedicated to him is probably going to affect the team more than taking away Derrick Carr from the Raiders.

This team was built around the best player, taking him away would obviously affect the team drastically. We could build a team around an average skilled QB but what would be the point in that? Wasting Aarons talent? Him getting hurt is a risk you take when building the team around a player who can do things no other QB in the league can do.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Good? you wonder why you appear to be anti TT. His 2011 offense at the time was the 2nd best offense of all time (points scored). This one is the best in the league. Yet you say just good?

The QB just might be the best to have played in the post-modern game. The rest are "good", yes.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I think its funny when people fault ted for not having another Aaron Rodgers on the bench. Its just ridiculous.

I agree. That's clearly not my point.

Taking away the player who has the most cap space dedicated to him is probably going to affect the team more than taking away Derrick Carr from the Raiders.

This team was built around the best player, taking him away would obviously affect the team drastically. We could build a team around an average skilled QB but what would be the point in that? Wasting Aarons talent? Him getting hurt is a risk you take when building the team around a player who can do things no other QB in the league can do.

If you want to judge 10 years of drafting and team building on the back of 1 draft pick while comparing that performance to an organization digging out from a decade of legendary dysfunction, that's certainly your right.

I prefer to look at the entire body of work.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

$28m sounds like alot. But we have alot of core guys. and alot of stars. And another 10 rookies to sign next year! Plus Ted likes his cush... I wonder if this number figures in the speculated cap raise this year?

We always have a big list of free agents, because ted keeps 10 rookies a year, and many of those play out their rookie deal. All our guys are in house, and we rarely give more than a 5 year deal. So thats literally 20+% roster turnover every year.... Ted and the coaches have put a system together that teaches, and keeps the guys young (and cheap). Only the best of the best get 2nd and 3rd contracts...

Cobb, Bulaga, Raji, Tramon, Guion, House, Richardson. Plus Bush, Barclay, Lattimore, Boykin, Tolzien, TE Taylor... These and the 10 rookies we always keep. Makes 20 players and only 28 mil.

 

[ivo610]

I agree. That's clearly not my point.


If you want to judge 10 years of drafting and team building on the back of 1 draft pick while comparing that performance to an organization digging out from a decade of legendary dysfunction, that's certainly your right.

I prefer to look at the entire body of work.

As opposed to judging the tenure of a gm on half a season where we still won the division? Haha

 

[HardRightEdge]

As opposed to judging the tenure of a gm on half a season where we still won the division? Haha

That's right. I'm not judging him on a 1/2 season. Others might judge him on the back half of 2010, however.

 

[HardRightEdge]

$28m sounds like alot. But we have alot of core guys. and alot of stars. And another 10 rookies to sign next year! Plus Ted likes his cush... I wonder if this number figures in the speculated cap raise this year?

We always have a big list of free agents, because ted keeps 10 rookies a year, and many of those play out their rookie deal. All our guys are in house, and we rarely give more than a 5 year deal. So thats literally 20+% roster turnover every year.... Ted and the coaches have put a system together that teaches, and keeps the guys young (and cheap). Only the best of the best get 2nd and 3rd contracts...

Cobb, Bulaga, Raji, Tramon, Guion, House, Richardson. Plus Bush, Barclay, Lattimore, Boykin, Tolzien, TE Taylor... These and the 10 rookies we always keep. Makes 20 players and only 28 mil.

The cost of rookies is only about $2 - $3 mil given where the Packers will be picking. When you get to the 3rd. round they're paid close to minimum. And every one that's kept has a counterpart that's dropped. Whatever and how many draft picks make the roster, subtract that many second year vet salaries as the minimum offset.

Raji is a take-it-or-leave-it proposition. He won't be getting another $4 mil, that's for certain; I'd say his odds of coming back are no better than 50/50. Guion won't cost much and dare I say he's not close to being a core player. Barclay coming off surgery and slated to play backup if/when Bulaga is signed won't cost much. Richardson, Bush, Lattimore, Boykin, Tolzien...these are the kinds of players who get replaced with draft picks. You mentioned Taylor which illustrates the point...he was released earlier this year.

According to the NFL, the average career among players who make it to a season-opening 53 man roster is 6 years. That means the average team turns over 9 players per year who leave the game, voluntarily or otherwise. When you consider FAs signing elsewhere and guys getting cut who sign elsewhere, a 20% turnover (11 guys) is probably below the league average.

Cobb and Bulaga will cost some money. Tramon Williams too if he sticks. House a little, Barclay a little. With deferred cap through signing bonuses there should be ample cushion.