Official GB vs Pat's, studs n duds

[Mondio]

The answer is in your statement. Notice what the Patriots did on offense?

1. Played fast, keeping the Packer defense out of sync and unable to substitute.
2. Used creative "trick plays" successfully to keep drives going or get huge chunks of yards.
3. Didn't spend 30 seconds of the play clock standing in a huddle picking their noses. This allowed TB to actually look at the defense he was facing and audible if need be.

#3 is still my biggest beef with the way AR and the Packers are running their offense. They are more effective playing faster and not wasting so much time huddling up and then getting to the line with little time on the play clock. This offense is playing with no sense of urgency, even when down 2 scores. Combing #2, the Packer offense is about as Vanilla as I have ever seen it.

BTW.....WTF was going on with letting Scott Punt the ball at the end of the half with 14 seconds still on the clock and almost the same amount of time on the play clock? Surprisingly with all 3 timeouts, Brady merciful took a knee, but that decision by MM or Zook to not let the clock run all the way down was just plain stupid and are the little things the Packers seem to continuously get wrong.

Playing fast might help, I think this offense is stuck with paralysis thru analysis before the snap.

There's nothing creative about a Jet sweep. We've run them. Our offensive line allows way too much penetration and way too quickly to ever even think it might be a good idea. Everyone hears "innovative" and "creative" and "young coach" over and over and over from the talking heads being paid to keep you listening and they think thats it. All I see is failed execution over and over and over again. From everyone including the QB. The Pats throw back is a play that happens with such rarity. GB wouldn't need it if they could hold on to the ball, or execute a dump off pass. This offense shouldn't need tricks. They need to execute.

Again last night, everyone screaming for more run. I get it. And there was a time, run, run, both successful with WIlliams, then hey put 8 in the box and we switched to a pass. As it should happen. Bulaga go blown up, Williams couldn't get into his dump off spot and with a defense in Rodgers' face, they couldn't complete a simple dump off with green in front. Later they couldn't even complete a screen to Jones. There were troubles up and down that oline again, right AND left sides.

 

[Zartan]

Studs

The Defense played well enough to win that game.

Duds
Jones
Whitehead with that bonehead ejection.

 

[Edward S Duda]

Roughing the kicker was a bad call.
A GB spot later in the game was short of the 1st down, but I dont see the calls as equal. 15 and 1st down was big for NE
The fumble was the turning point obviously.
Dont watch many Packer games but seems like Rodgers had more talent around him in the past.
Injuries for GB were a factor. Not an excuse, but a factor when youre already thin if my eyes are right about talent.
Not a troll, but the Vikings are better right now. Not sold on Detroit or Chicago.
If MM is gone I am not sure who you would replace him with.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

Stud: MVS

Duds: Too many to list, but I'll single out lack of creativity in play-calling.

 

[adambr2]

Duds: Whichever scout thought that signing Marcades Lewis would be a productive move. Are we absolutely certain that this man actually plays for the Packers?

 

[AmishMafia]

I think if you take into account the horrible offensive line play, Rodgers gets the nod.

My impression is the Packers got as much or more QB pressure than the Patriots. Brady passes more quickly and doesnt wait for something to develop.

and they desperately need a right tackle and a guard.

Why do they desperately need a right tackle? What did you see in Spriggs that leads you to think he needs to be desperately replaced? He had the best game of his career. NE shifted the rush to his side and he still held his own. I didnt see him give up a pressure. Granted I was intoxicated, but he actually looked good out there.

 

[Packer96]

Damn, had to go to bed, 4:45 comes early on Sunday nighters. We had just stuffed them at the goal line and I felt pretty good about our chances. Should have known

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

If MM is gone I am not sure who you would replace him with.

If you poke around the forum, you will find some posters are planning on replacing him with Belichick.....warn your fellow Bostonian's!

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Absolutely agree on #3. Everybody's onto you AR. Nobody is drawn offsides anymore. Give it the ******** hell up.

Yup and it isn't just his ******** around trying to get the defense to jump that bothers me the most, its not getting the offense lined up fast enough for Rodgers to go through his reads and audibles. If after all that, he has time and wants to play cat and mouse with the defense, go for it. This desire to be known as the GOAT of pulling the defense offsides and getting free plays is only smart when you take care of things on your side of the ball first.

Last night AR got one free play by catching the Pats with too many men on the field, that "free play" resulted in......5 yards and Rodgers almost getting hurt as we was hit throwing up an in complete pass. Meanwhile, we gave them the 5 yards back on a play that saw Rodgers nonchalantly tying his shoe and then leisurely huddling up and not having enough time to snap the ball. Don't even get me started on all of the timeouts over the years that have had to be burned by the Packers due to this style of play.

If I am MM and the Packers, I am working all week on Huddle Management....get this offense consistently looking like the group of veterans that they are and not a bunch of guys playing in preseason together for the first time.

 

[Arod2gjdd]

I honestly can't even bring myself to do studs/duds anymore. MVS is a beast

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

There's nothing creative about a Jet sweep. We've run them. Our offensive line allows way too much penetration and way too quickly to ever even think it might be a good idea. Everyone hears "innovative" and "creative" and "young coach" over and over and over from the talking heads being paid to keep you listening and they think thats it. All I see is failed execution over and over and over again. From everyone including the QB. The Pats throw back is a play that happens with such rarity. GB wouldn't need it if they could hold on to the ball, or execute a dump off pass. This offense shouldn't need tricks. They need to execute.

I actually might have agreed with your statement weeks ago, but it has become very apparent that the offense needs to rely on more than just execution to score more points. You may think "trick and gadget plays" aren't what the Packers need to win, but all you have to do is look at what the Patriots did last night. Brady was in a bit of a funk, their offense was sputtering and McDaniels started digging through his playbook and boom....the Patriots are on a roll.

Yes, the Packers offense needs to execute better, but do they have the firepower to play Vanilla and go toe to toe with good teams by just running the same basic plays over and over?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think if you take into account the horrible offensive line play, Rodgers gets the nod.

On going story of "Who is better Rodgers or Brady?" was fully on display last night....AR may "look better", but in the end Wins and Losses are what most people remember.

 

[Mondio]

I actually might have agreed with your statement weeks ago, but it has become very apparent that the offense needs to rely on more than just execution to score more points. You may think "trick and gadget plays" aren't what the Packers need to win, but all you have to do is look at what the Patriots did last night. Brady was in a bit of a funk, their offense was sputtering and McDaniels started digging through his playbook and boom....the Patriots are on a roll.

Yes, the Packers offense needs to execute better, but do they have the firepower to play Vanilla and go toe to toe with good teams by just running the same basic plays over and over?

I'd say if you can't execute a screen, you can't execute a jet sweep without a player to do it with. You know why it works for the Rams? Look at their roster. they have more top 10 picks on just offense than we have 1st rounders it seems. it's one thing to say do it, now tell me with who? Remember that trick play we tried a few weeks ago with Monty, how did that go with an oline that allows penetration somewhere on every play? never even got to pitch it back, now we're expecting the team to do a pitch and a throw back?

If we can't execute a screen pass, how much time are you devoting to a few trick plays that will work 10 times a year maybe? Everyone makes fun of MM and talking about fundamentals. Well it's what this team needs to do more of and better.

 

[gopkrs]

Yup and it isn't just his ******** around trying to get the defense to jump that bothers me the most, its not getting the offense lined up fast enough for Rodgers to go through his reads and audibles. If after all that, he has time and wants to play cat and mouse with the defense, go for it. This desire to be known as the GOAT of pulling the defense offsides and getting free plays is only smart when you take care of things on your side of the ball first.

Last night AR got one free play by catching the Pats with too many men on the field, that "free play" resulted in......5 yards and Rodgers almost getting hurt as we was hit throwing up an in complete pass. Meanwhile, we gave them the 5 yards back on a play that saw Rodgers nonchalantly tying his shoe and then leisurely huddling up and not having enough time to snap the ball. Don't even get me started on all of the timeouts over the years that have had to be burned by the Packers due to this style of play.

If I am MM and the Packers, I am working all week on Huddle Management....get this offense consistently looking like the group of veterans that they are and not a bunch of guys playing in preseason together for the first time.

I agree with this. But I think we should just be hiking the ball. Rodgers checking over the defense seems to be helping the defense more than our offense.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I agree with this. But I think we should just be hiking the ball. Rodgers checking over the defense seems to be helping the defense more than our offense.

I definitely think he needs to mix it up. Walk up and take quick snaps if he sees what he likes. But not the same damn thing almost every time...walk up...survey the defense, shift his offense around, realize there is only 1 second on the play clock and then seemed rushed.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I'd say if you can't execute a screen, you can't execute a jet sweep without a player to do it with. You know why it works for the Rams? Look at their roster. they have more top 10 picks on just offense than we have 1st rounders it seems. it's one thing to say do it, now tell me with who? Remember that trick play we tried a few weeks ago with Monty, how did that go with an oline that allows penetration somewhere on every play? never even got to pitch it back, now we're expecting the team to do a pitch and a throw back?

If we can't execute a screen pass, how much time are you devoting to a few trick plays that will work 10 times a year maybe? Everyone makes fun of MM and talking about fundamentals. Well it's what this team needs to do more of and better.

As I read over this I was both nodding and shaking my head in agreement and disagreement. Much of it sounds like an excuse to just stick with basics. I played Football and even a bunch of kids were able to pull off some "trick" plays, because we practiced them. I am getting the feeling that MM goes into Practice each week with the attitude of "we need to get back to basics and fundamental football". When you have as many veterans on the offense as the Packers do, that is so underwhelming to me.

If throwing 2 yard passes on 3rd and 10 or 40 yard passes on 3rd and 2 is "fundamental football", than I think MM needs to rethink his fundamentals. Yes, I am aware that those decisions aren't always as a result of the play called by MM.

I'm not even going to look it up, because I think I can safely say that the Packers probably are at the bottom of the league in Red Zone proficiency. Why? No imagination.

 

[Mondio]

they suck at 3rd downs and redzone. We hit on big plays. We're not consistent, why? because we don't do the little things well every play. Jet sweeps don't help in the redzone. Trick plays work against unsound football teams. I always think of wrestling and how many kids tried the "trick" moves because nothing else they did worked. Occasionally a desperation move worked, but mostly they just lost against a more fundamentally sound opponent. I could beat 80 % of the guys I faced with 3 moves, variations off the single leg I learned at age 6, an escape I also learned at 6 and a spiral ride on the mat. Tricks work against undisciplined and sloppy. If you're disciplined and tight, you don't need tricks. Green Bay doesn't need tricks, there's a reason they aren't used often.

A jet sweep doesn't work against an oline allowing penetration all over. a screen does. What happens when the QB doesn't deliver a catchable ball? call a jet sweep next time?

 

[gopkrs]

I definitely think he needs to mix it up. Walk up and take quick snaps if he sees what he likes. But not the same damn thing almost every time...walk up...survey the defense, shift his offense around, realize there is only 1 second on the play clock and then seemed rushed.

Problem is...AR never sees exactly what he wants. Just hike the ball! But agree, mix it up some. And MM is not utilizing Jones as an option for the dump off. How can Gurley and Kamara get so many good plays in the flat when everyone knows they are gonna do it, and we don't even try with Jones.

 

[easyk83]

Pro tip. switch to whiskey. It hits faster and costs about the same.

Improper order, 5 yards.

On going story of "Who is better Rodgers or Brady?" was fully on display last night....AR may "look better", but in the end Wins and Losses are what most people remember.

Its kinda like Emmett Smith vs Barry Sanders. One was better for highlights and one was decidedly better for winning football games. Sanders would bust lots of sensational long runs, but he might kill multiple drives with backwards runs before he gets you that 60 yarder. Likewise with Rodgers sure he'll make sensational plays spinning away from the rush and firing darts downfield but how often does our offense stall because he' looking off open receivers for those big plays down field?

I hate to say it but Rodgers is reminding me more and more of Brett Favre in his later years.

 

[PackAttack12]

I hate to say it but Rodgers is reminding me more and more of Brett Favre in his later years.

Brett Favre could only dream of throwing just 1 interception through 8 games of a season.

 

[easyk83]

Problem is...AR never sees exactly what he wants. Just hike the ball! But agree, mix it up some. And MM is not utilizing Jones as an option for the dump off. How can Gurley and Kamara get so many good plays in the flat when everyone knows they are gonna do it, and we don't even try with Jones.

What sort of candy *** throws the ball less than 20 yards downfield.

-Aaron Rodgers, speaking rhetorically.

 

[easyk83]

Brett Favre could only dream of throwing just 1 interception through 8 games of a season.

Yeah but sacks are drive killers too, and he's on pace for 40 plus again.

 

[Mondio]

Problem is...AR never sees exactly what he wants. Just hike the ball! But agree, mix it up some. And MM is not utilizing Jones as an option for the dump off. How can Gurley and Kamara get so many good plays in the flat when everyone knows they are gonna do it, and we don't even try with Jones.

because they do it well, we don't. Last week Rodgers dumped one off to Jones, and it was not in a catch and run place. It was in a spot Jones had to twist for, change momentum and then gather and go. he was tackled before he even got started. He had one last night that was ok, then we tried a screen and Rodgers threw it at his feet with blockers in front. Zero chance. We had another one last night to Williams, who is the better receiver out of the backfield and Bulaga fell, Williams had to chip extra hard, was taken out of his path and was 3 feet away practically, not in the flat, when Rodgers had to zing it over his head because of pressure. Ugly play.

We only have so many downs. Only so many chances and our 30 million dollar QB likes to go down field on most of them. That's ok, but only if we're hitting on these other plays when we need to. We aren't. Therefore teams never respect anything against us except the downfield pass. It's all they have to worry about. We're not consistent enough to do the other things and our protections aren't good enough to make every play last 6 seconds before deciding to throw the ball. But then we can't seem to run a screen either. Run more of them? or let your QB try and hit MVS downfield? It all plays off each other. More first downs means we run more plays. More plays means we have more balance. But we always get desperate and go big or go home it seems.

 

[easyk83]

because they do it well, we don't. Last week Rodgers dumped one off to Jones, and it was not in a catch and run place. It was in a spot Jones had to twist for, change momentum and then gather and go. he was tackled before he even got started. He had one last night that was ok, then we tried a screen and Rodgers threw it at his feet with blockers in front. Zero chance. We had another one last night to Williams, who is the better receiver out of the backfield and Bulaga fell, Williams had to chip extra hard, was taken out of his path and was 3 feet away practically, not in the flat, when Rodgers had to zing it over his head because of pressure. Ugly play.

We only have so many downs. Only so many chances and our 30 million dollar QB likes to go down field on most of them. That's ok, but only if we're hitting on these other plays when we need to. We aren't. Therefore teams never respect anything against us except the downfield pass. It's all they have to worry about. We're not consistent enough to do the other things and our protections aren't good enough to make every play last 6 seconds before deciding to throw the ball. But then we can't seem to run a screen either. Run more of them? or let your QB try and hit MVS downfield? It all plays off each other. More first downs means we run more plays. More plays means we have more balance. But we always get desperate and go big or go home it seems.

Downfield passes need to be set up, Rodgers trying to constantly pushing it downfield is part of why our offense is so inconsistent right now.

 

[Mondio]

Downfield passes need to be set up, Rodgers trying to constantly pushing it downfield is part of why our offense is so inconsistent right now.

oh, i know. If we have 2 runs, you KNOW he's going downfield on the next. He's part of the problem. but most of our runs are set up off the pass. Teams always play pass against us. We're not a running team like the Rams can be. Jones is good in a role. If we lined up and ran 1st and 2nd down every time I think we'd be behind the chains more often than not. It's part of the reason our 3rd down stinks and so does our redzone. Our run sets up nothing. Our pass does. If our run game were legitimate, teams would worry about it and it would open up the 3rd down and redzone play book.