Cobb could be sidelined at start of camp

[firstdown]

Davis will likely have to be more than a punt returner to make the roster this season - If he can't contribute more as a WR, special teams play probably isn't enough for GB to keep him around.

Davis is a lot better receiver than he is a returner. In his senior year in college, he lead all power 5 conference receivers in yards after catch. He also had a 1 1/2 % drop rate, while playing the 11th toughest schedule. By comparison, Allison drops 4 times more passes than Davis with half the YAC. Allison had 48 targets for Green Bay last year, and only 1 reception over 20 yards. Davis had 6 targets, with 2 receptions over 20 yards. He's playing on a 3rd year bargain-for-Green Bay contract, no way in heck does he get cut.

 

[Mondio]

I had high hopes for Davis coming out of college, was wondering why he lasted so late in the draft. But he has shown pretty much zero in the way of playing receiver in the NFL. returning punts is the only way he's earned any of his money so far

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Davis is a lot better receiver than he is a returner. In his senior year in college, he lead all power 5 conference receivers in yards after catch. He also had a 1 1/2 % drop rate, while playing the 11th toughest schedule. By comparison, Allison drops 4 times more passes than Davis with half the YAC. Allison had 48 targets for Green Bay last year, and only 1 reception over 20 yards. Davis had 6 targets, with 2 receptions over 20 yards. He's playing on a 3rd year bargain-for-Green Bay contract, no way in heck does he get cut.

I don't care about Davis' final season in college as he has done diddly-squat as a receiver for the Packers in two seasons. Therefore it's entirely possible that he won't make the roster as long as the team finds an adequate replacement for him as a returner.

Allison is a possession receiver who most likely will never catch a ton of deep balls. There's a distinct chance he won't make the 53 this season as well.

 

[Dantés]

Davis is a lot better receiver than he is a returner. In his senior year in college, he lead all power 5 conference receivers in yards after catch. He also had a 1 1/2 % drop rate, while playing the 11th toughest schedule. By comparison, Allison drops 4 times more passes than Davis with half the YAC. Allison had 48 targets for Green Bay last year, and only 1 reception over 20 yards. Davis had 6 targets, with 2 receptions over 20 yards. He's playing on a 3rd year bargain-for-Green Bay contract, no way in heck does he get cut.

Davis is young enough that there is still the possibility that there's more there in the receiving game than he's shown through two seasons. However, he only has 8 career receptions to this point. There's no evidence to support the idea that, in the NFL, he's a better receiver than returner. This is especially true considering that he was 3rd in average yards per punt return in 2017 and he was even better the year before.

His distinction in the return game is his ticket to make the roster, if indeed he does make it. His play on offense certainly hasn't won him any security. If the team likes someone as much or more in the PR game, he's probably a goner. The roster is stacked with several young, talented receivers who will be trying to take his roster spot and they all have more "bargain" years than he does on their contracts.

 

[Dantés]

With the Packers being in need of at least one of the rookie receivers contributing this season I expect all of them to get a ton of snaps with Rodgers in training camp to build some chemistry with #12.



There's no doubt Cobb is overpaid based on his production over the past three seasons. That doesn't mean it would be smart to overpay for Montgomery as well who hasn't shown anything justifying signing him to a five-year deal or paying him $5 million a season.



Davis has to make smarter decisions on when to return or fair catch a punt though.

Yeah, I think they will all get snaps with Rodgers, but given that there are only so many of them (Adams, Cobb, and Allison will take many as well), I think the majority of snaps of any one of those 2nd string guys will come with Kizer/Hundley.

 

[firstdown]

I don't care about Davis' final season in college as he has done diddly-squat as a receiver for the Packers in two seasons. Therefore it's entirely possible that he won't make the roster as long as the team finds an adequate replacement for him as a returner.

Allison is a possession receiver who most likely will never catch a ton of deep balls. There's a distinct chance he won't make the 53 this season as well.

I think that drafting 3 wide receivers this year was more a referendum on Allison and Clark than it was on Davis. A so-called possession receiver like Allison shouldn't be dropping 1 out of every 15 passes, and also fumbling the ball in crucial situations. Davis is a possession receiver (1 drop per 60 passes) who is also a burner. Those guys are rare. I think the coaches were intrigued by Clark's size, but he looked pretty bad in the last couple of games. I think they played him a lot in the last few games not because he jumped over Allison and Davis, but because they were preparing for the draft and they were thinking of getting tall, athletic receivers. Clark is very green. Just a year or 2 in college playing receiver. He failed at his preferred sport of basketball, and I think it makes his chance at succeeding at football a bit of a longshot, especially here at Green Bay with new, experienced receivers who have his same measurables. And Yancey is still in the mix too, it's going to be an interesting preseason.

Good luck to all of them, you never know what'll happen, do you? We all thought that Adams was garbage after his second season, and now he's making 14 mil a year, so what do we know?

 

[Dantés]

I think that drafting 3 wide receivers this year was more a referendum on Allison and Clark than it was on Davis. A so-called possession receiver like Allison shouldn't be dropping 1 out of every 15 passes, and also fumbling the ball in crucial situations. Davis is a possession receiver (1 drop per 60 passes) who is also a burner. Those guys are rare. I think the coaches were intrigued by Clark's size, but he looked pretty bad in the last couple of games. I think they played him a lot in the last few games not because he jumped over Allison and Davis, but because they were preparing for the draft and they were thinking of getting tall, athletic receivers. Clark is very green. Just a year or 2 in college playing receiver. He failed at his preferred sport of basketball, and I think it makes his chance at succeeding at football a bit of a longshot, especially here at Green Bay with new, experienced receivers who have his same measurables. And Yancey is still in the mix too, it's going to be an interesting preseason.

Good luck to all of them, you never know what'll happen, do you? We all thought that Adams was garbage after his second season, and now he's making 14 mil a year, so what do we know?

How do we know what kind of receiver Davis is when he only has 8 catches to his name so far?

 

[HardRightEdge]

Thanks for the video. Alexander had SEVEN blockers within 10 yards of where he caught the ball, blocking 7 defenders. Textbook special teams blocking. On Davis' 65 yard return against Cleveland, we had 8 guys at the line trying to block the punt, which left only two blockers for Davis. After Davis caught the ball, it was him and only one blocker surrounded by 7 Cleveland defenders.

Alexander- 7 blockers for 7 defenders. Davis- 1 blocker for 7 defenders. Amazing and timely return by Davis. Crunch time, we needed it and Davis delivered. I'll take Davis over Alexander returning punts any day.

My post was addressing the question, "who else ya got", if Davis were released. My only problem with Davis retruning punts is he lets too many balls hit the ground rather than coming up for the fair catch.

It's pretty evident Alexander can track the ball and is elusive. You also see the elusiveness in his INT returns. I just wouldn't take the injury risk.

I expect Davis to be doing that job opening day. Alexander might be the injury backup to Davis if it is not Cobb.

There were 2 WRs dedicated to special teams last season. I think going with 1 should not be an issue. Keeping Davis along with Adams and Cobb still leaves 3 or 4 spots open to the competition. Or pencil in Allison if you like then may the best 2 or 3 in the crownd win.[/QUOTE]

 

[HardRightEdge]

How do we know what kind of receiver Davis is when he only has 8 catches to his name so far?

We've seen him preseason. We've seen him in games taking snaps in addition to those 8 catches. He's not very good. Now that McCarthy has gone from "second year jump" to "second or third year jump" one could wish upon that possibility.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Cobb’s dubious injury history is a coup for Allison. Allison is arguably the least talented of the group: Allison, Moore, MVS, EQSTB, Yancey, and Clark. However, he is far and away the most established. The staff would be hard pressed to cut him, given that. If Davis holds on to the PR job, then it’s possible that only two of the rookies make the roster, and probable that both Yancey and Clark are gone.

Yancy and Clark going back to the practice squad would be a low risk assumption. That gets you to 7 WRs with Davis. Nobody plucked Yancey or Clark off the PS last season and they haven't done anything to change anybody's mind. Maybe one of the ex-Packer scouting guys now in Cleveland might have an eye on one or the other but I don't think we'd be losing much.

There are a bunch of guys with a lot to prove. Figure on Moore to make the roster because of the draft investment. Everything else is up for grabs as far as I'm concerned until we get a gander at these guys in preseason. And who makes the game day roster will depend on who beside Davis can contribute on special teams.

 

[Dantés]

Yancy and Clark going back to the practice squad would be a low risk assumption. That gets you to 7 WRs with Davis. Nobody plucked Yancey or Clark off the PS last season and they haven't done anything to change anybody's mind. Maybe one of the ex-Packer scouting guys now in Cleveland might have an eye on one or the other but I don't think we'd be losing much.

There are a bunch of guys with a lot to prove. Figure on Moore to make the roster because of the draft investment. Everything else is up for grabs as far as I'm concerned until we get a gander at these guys in preseason. And who makes the game day roster will depend on who beside Davis can contribute on special teams.

What I am wondering about is a scenario where multiple of the following are clearly 53 man roster worthy: Valdes-Scantling, St. Brown, Yancey, and Clark. It would be a bummer to see one or more flash some real potential and then get poached by another team.

But in order to keep more than one of those guys, one of the following would have to happen: Davis would have to be replaced in the return game, Allison would have to be replaced in the offense, or they would have to decide to keep 7 wide receivers.

 

[HardRightEdge]

What I am wondering about is a scenario where multiple of the following are clearly 53 man roster worthy: Valdes-Scantling, St. Brown, Yancey, and Clark. It would be a bummer to see one or more flash some real potential and then get poached by another team.

But in order to keep more than one of those guys, one of the following would have to happen: Davis would have to be replaced in the return game, Allison would have to be replaced in the offense, or they would have to decide to keep 7 wide receivers.

That's the equation.

But who else ya got to return punts? Forget Montgomery; he's a mess back there. Alexander? Cobb? Those guys don't seem like prudent options. There has been no effort to replace Davis if you discount Alexander.

Scroll down to post 270 on this page: https://www.packerforum.com/threads/training-camp-position-battles.79280/page-11#

I would observe that with the KO rule change Davis may be slated for KO returns as well. The KO team can no longer get a running start and more return team players have to set up closer to the 10 yard set back. Blockers will engage defenders with less head of steam, they will engage them quicker, and it will be easier to put some slow in their roll. It stands to reason that will result in more free run space for the returner before meeting resistance which puts a premium on a returner with giddyup in his gitalong and elusiveness over tackle breaking. That would be Davis over Montgomery, and there isn't any other option there either. Besides, Montgomery's upright running style makes him once again an injury waiting to happen; that's how he got a kidney bruise, cracked ribs, and then reinjured the ribs. He needs to get the knack for getting low before contact, but he's getting into "old dogs don't learn new tricks" territory in year 4.

Now, if Alexander doesn't at least crack the nickel group and is relegated to a half dozen dime snaps per game, they may put him in for punts. I don't expect that. Then what? Roll the dice with Montgomery on KOs? I guess that's the only option under the "cut Davis" scenario.

It's worth considering that Davis was drafted to make the game day 45 as a return specialist. He was actually a better KO man than a punt return guy in college:

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/trevor-davis-1.html

That plan was derailed when he showed unsteady hands and tentative play as a rookie. After a decent showing last season, and given the lack of effort to replace him, I'd assume he's the Plan A return specialist at this stage.

You could then figure on 7 WRs including Davis, and probaly 5 on the game day roster including Davis unless one of the other guys wins a gunner job. St. Brown's dad would object.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Yeah, I think they will all get snaps with Rodgers, but given that there are only so many of them (Adams, Cobb, and Allison will take many as well), I think the majority of snaps of any one of those 2nd string guys will come with Kizer/Hundley.

It's possible the Packers plan on one of the rookies starting opposite of Adams entering this season. Therefore I expect them to get a significant amount of snaps with Rodgers as well.

I think that drafting 3 wide receivers this year was more a referendum on Allison and Clark than it was on Davis. A so-called possession receiver like Allison shouldn't be dropping 1 out of every 15 passes, and also fumbling the ball in crucial situations. Davis is a possession receiver (1 drop per 60 passes) who is also a burner. Those guys are rare. I think the coaches were intrigued by Clark's size, but he looked pretty bad in the last couple of games. I think they played him a lot in the last few games not because he jumped over Allison and Davis, but because they were preparing for the draft and they were thinking of getting tall, athletic receivers. Clark is very green. Just a year or 2 in college playing receiver. He failed at his preferred sport of basketball, and I think it makes his chance at succeeding at football a bit of a longshot, especially here at Green Bay with new, experienced receivers who have his same measurables. And Yancey is still in the mix too, it's going to be an interesting preseason.

Good luck to all of them, you never know what'll happen, do you? We all thought that Adams was garbage after his second season, and now he's making 14 mil a year, so what do we know?

How do we know that Davis drops only one in 60 balls as he has only been targeted a total of 14 times in the NFL??? Once again, I don't expect him to contribute significantly as a receiver but he might make the roster as a returner.

With the Packers having drafted three receivers it's probable that neither Yancey or Clark make the team. Allison might be on the bubble as well.

What I am wondering about is a scenario where multiple of the following are clearly 53 man roster worthy: Valdes-Scantling, St. Brown, Yancey, and Clark. It would be a bummer to see one or more flash some real potential and then get poached by another team.

I don't believe either Yancey or Clark will be worthy of being on the 53.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

Davis is a lot better receiver than he is a returner. In his senior year in college, he lead all power 5 conference receivers in yards after catch. He also had a 1 1/2 % drop rate, while playing the 11th toughest schedule. By comparison, Allison drops 4 times more passes than Davis with half the YAC. Allison had 48 targets for Green Bay last year, and only 1 reception over 20 yards. Davis had 6 targets, with 2 receptions over 20 yards. He's playing on a 3rd year bargain-for-Green Bay contract, no way in heck does he get cut.

We'll see.

Step one is getting open.

 

[Dantés]

It's possible the Packers plan on one of the rookies starting opposite of Adams entering this season. Therefore I expect them to get a significant amount of snaps with Rodgers as well.



How do we know that Davis drops only one in 60 balls as he has only been targeted a total of 14 times in the NFL??? Once again, I don't expect him to contribute significantly as a receiver but he might make the roster as a returner.

With the Packers having drafted three receivers it's probable that neither Yancey or Clark make the team. Allison might be on the bubble as well.



I don't believe either Yancey or Clark will be worthy of being on the 53.

I’m not projecting either to make the roster either, but both are young and talented and could make noise in camp given that it’s only their second season.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I’m not projecting either to make the roster either, but both are young and talented and could make noise in camp given that it’s only their second season.

While I agree that both Yancey and Clark could develop into decent players they're definitely a long shot to make the roster with the Packers having drafted three receivers.

 

[Dantés]

While I agree that both Yancey and Clark could develop into decent players they're definitely a long shot to make the roster with the Packers having drafted three receivers.

Yeah, that’s my point. The sheer number of young talents at the position could mean cutting one or more player that is otherwise roster worthy. Of course, it could also mean that they throw five guys at the wall and only two stick and they can keep both.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Yeah, that’s my point. The sheer number of young talents at the position could mean cutting one or more player that is otherwise roster worthy. Of course, it could also mean that they throw five guys at the wall and only two stick and they can keep both.

Unfortunately I don't expect all of the young receivers to prove being roster worthy.

 

[Dantés]

Unfortunately I don't expect all of the young receivers to prove being roster worthy.

Of course not. That’s not what I’m saying.

Adams and Cobb are locked in. Let’s say for the sake of the scenario that Allison makes it based on experience in the offense, Davis makes it based on special teams, and Moore makes it based on draft pedigree.

So that’s five players and they’re probably only keeping six. That leaves one spot for Valdes-Scantling, St. Brown, Yancey, and Clark to fight over.

I don’t expect all four of those guys to be working keeping. But it’s possible that two of them are. And in that case, you’d have to let a good player go.

Certainly they aren’t all going to be worth a spot. It’s also possible that only one distinguishes himself. But they’re all talented players with a shot. It’s not like we’re talking about a bunch of training camp fodder.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Adams and Cobb are locked in. Let’s say for the sake of the scenario that Allison makes it based on experience in the offense, Davis makes it based on special teams, and Moore makes it based on draft pedigree.

So that’s five players and they’re probably only keeping six. That leaves one spot for Valdes-Scantling, St. Brown, Yancey, and Clark to fight over.

I don’t expect all four of those guys to be working keeping. But it’s possible that two of them are. And in that case, you’d have to let a good player go.

Certainly they aren’t all going to be worth a spot. It’s also possible that only one distinguishes himself. But they’re all talented players with a shot. It’s not like we’re talking about a bunch of training camp fodder.

It's possible the Packers keep seven receivers on the roster with Davis solely being used on special teams. In my opinion that leaves Allison, Moore, Valdes-Scantling, St. Brown, Yancey and Clark fighting for four spots.

It's true that the team could end up having to release a talented player though.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Of course not. That’s not what I’m saying.

Adams and Cobb are locked in. Let’s say for the sake of the scenario that Allison makes it based on experience in the offense, Davis makes it based on special teams, and Moore makes it based on draft pedigree.

So that’s five players and they’re probably only keeping six. That leaves one spot for Valdes-Scantling, St. Brown, Yancey, and Clark to fight over.

I don’t expect all four of those guys to be worth keeping. But it’s possible that two of them are. And in that case, you’d have to let a good player go.

Certainly they aren’t all going to be worth a spot. It’s also possible that only one distinguishes himself. But they’re all talented players with a shot. It’s not like we’re talking about a bunch of training camp fodder.

I can see them keeping 7 WRs if enough of them are deemed worthy. With Burks and Jones as possible S/ILB swing men a spot could be picked with that versatility. But that's probably not going to happen.

I agree 6 is a reasonable expectation if for no other reason than with so many guys in the hunt for jobs the opportunities to flash in preseason will be limited. And if you don't flash, the odds of getting picked up on by somebody for their roster is a low probability. After a couple of preseason games judgements will be forming and the guys expected to make the roster will get more snaps, with even less flash opportunities for the others.

The fear that somebody promising will get picked up by somebody for their roster tends to get exagerated in these Lake Wobegone dog days when all the children are better than average. You might have to pay them a little more than the PS minimum if a similar offer is made by another team for their PS. Yancey was a 5th. rounder, ended up on the PS, and nobody signed him away. And the Packer practice squad would be more attractive than many others in that one WR position is wide open and could remain so into the next season, Cobb will be a FA, and there's the prospect of playing with an elite QB.

By the way, whatever happend to Charles Johnson after 2014?

 

[Conso]

If Thompson left us with one thing, it was a deep wr corps. Nelson already gone. And add a new batch of rookies. I am not only OK with the current situation. I'd take it a step further, and cut/trade Cobb. Make room for Montgomery to be on the field all the time. Jones/williams at rb. Graham/Lewis getting good reps at TE. This team is not forced to be wr heavy. And there is a lot of great prospects deep on our depth charts, who need to see the field.

Monty is a stud. Get him the ball and let him do his thing.

It’s more like if TT did one thing it was coast through his job all these years, with only exception being AR he was handed the reigns of a powerhouse team and led it to a slow decline. Each year was high hopes and almost always made the playoffs, but almost always lost and usually early. Some people are happy with that, “but we win all these division titles?!” Since the main goal of every NFL team is to be SB champs, then I guess TTs goal was to remain second best. Sure we won a SB or two, but we’ve also had arguably 2 of the best QBs of all time back to back over the time of what 20 something years with how many real titles to our name? By real titles mean SB champs, every teams main end goal each year. All in all I guess I’m saying TT was apparently satisfied with being second best and beyond AR, really did nothing.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

It’s more like if TT did one thing it was coast through his job all these years, with only exception being AR he was handed the reigns of a powerhouse team and led it to a slow decline. Each year was high hopes and almost always made the playoffs, but almost always lost and usually early. Some people are happy with that, “but we win all these division titles?!” Since the main goal of every NFL team is to be SB champs, then I guess TTs goal was to remain second best. Sure we won a SB or two, but we’ve also had arguably 2 of the best QBs of all time back to back over the time of what 20 something years with how many real titles to our name? By real titles mean SB champs, every teams main end goal each year. All in all I guess I’m saying TT was apparently satisfied with being second best and beyond AR, really did nothing.

OK, a lot of posters around here are well aware that I have criticized Thompson a lot but to suggest that he was fine with being second best and that he did nothing beyond drafting Rodgers is ludicrous.

I might not have liked his reluctancy to use all methods available to improve the roster and he definitely had some weak drafts over the past few years but overall he did a good job.

 

[Dantés]

@captainWIMM @HardRightEdge

Yes, it’s possible that they keep 7 receivers if the roster overall stays pretty healthy.

 

[Dantés]

It’s more like if TT did one thing it was coast through his job all these years, with only exception being AR he was handed the reigns of a powerhouse team and led it to a slow decline. Each year was high hopes and almost always made the playoffs, but almost always lost and usually early. Some people are happy with that, “but we win all these division titles?!” Since the main goal of every NFL team is to be SB champs, then I guess TTs goal was to remain second best. Sure we won a SB or two, but we’ve also had arguably 2 of the best QBs of all time back to back over the time of what 20 something years with how many real titles to our name? By real titles mean SB champs, every teams main end goal each year. All in all I guess I’m saying TT was apparently satisfied with being second best and beyond AR, really did nothing.

Lololol