What ya think about TT???

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I support Thompson and I'll agree there were mistakes made in evaluating in the backups. Not just on Thompson though. I'm sure MM and the QB coach played a role in keeping them around for so long.

So is it possible for you to agree as well that Thompson absolutely messed up the following positions as well??? OL, ILB and safety???
 

GoPGo

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Packers have a good WR corp but we don't have the physical freak wide receivers like Chicago.

I didn't see them do anything that Nelson doesn't routinely do when he has Rodgers on the field and Cobb is a beast after the catch that neither of their guys are. Their top 2 WRs might be a little better overall than ours, but our top 4 smokes theirs.
 

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So is it possible for you to agree as well that Thompson absolutely messed up the following positions as well??? OL, ILB and safety???

Absolutely messed up? Of course not.

The 0-line has been good at run blocking this season and were in the top 10 in pass protecting until two weeks ago. They've had a few bad two weeks of pass protecting recently though. I think Bahktiari is a good pick and can't blame TT for the Bulaga and Sherrod injuries.

At safety, Burnett was playing solid and only getting better until this season. No way to know if he would get worse. I'll admit that he has not done a good job in replacing Collins, but have to give him credit for drafting Collins.

As far as ILB, I haven't read about how Jones and Hawk have played this year so I cannot evaluate that.
 

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Absolutely messed up? Of course not.

The 0-line has been good at run blocking this season and were in the top 10 in pass protecting until two weeks ago. They've had a few bad two weeks of pass protecting recently though. I think Bahktiari is a good pick and can't blame TT for the Bulaga and Sherrod injuries.

At safety, Burnett was playing solid and only getting better until this season. No way to know if he would get worse. I'll admit that he has not done a good job in replacing Collins, but have to give him credit for drafting Collins.

As far as ILB, I haven't read about how Jones and Hawk have played this year so I cannot evaluate that.

I find it comical when TT gets a pass for player who get injured or underperform. "you can't blame TT for the Oline, because he has addressed it with many picks." Or its not TTs fault that Hawk doesn't play like a top 10 pick." or "TT used high pick to help our D, what more should he have done? Give me names and how they would affect the cap."

Yet its unfair for us to say that TT can't take the credit for AR performing above his spot picked expectations.
 

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You don't think the Packers were lucky Rodgers was still on the board at #24 in 2005???
Every team from the one picking in the second spot to #23 were also “lucky” Rodgers fell to them but only one pulled the trigger and selected him, even though he had a starting QB in place.
And in your totally blind support of everything Thompson does don't you realize this team would have had a way different record since 2008 if Rodgers wouldn't have dropped to them???
You don’t follow along very well, do you? Not only in following the team and not realizing players who were, or were not available, but also in reading this board: You may not have read any of my posts before this thread (nothing wrong with that, of course) but I have criticized Thompson and I have advocated he make moves that he didn’t. But in this thread I’ve posted Thompson made a mistake regarding the backup QBs, so your charge I “totally blind support of everything Thompson” looks a little silly.

OTOH, your bias is becoming clearer. You’ve been a member of the board for almost 1 ½ years yet 25 of your 31 posts have occurred after the losing streak. Let me guess, you’re a big Favre fan and Thompson hater, right?
 

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I find it comical when TT gets a pass for player who get injured or underperform. "you can't blame TT for the Oline, because he has addressed it with many picks." Or its not TTs fault that Hawk doesn't play like a top 10 pick." or "TT used high pick to help our D, what more should he have done? Give me names and how they would affect the cap."

Yet its unfair for us to say that TT can't take the credit for AR performing above his spot picked expectations.

TT must have saw something in Rodgers that warranted spending a first round pick on him. Or did he just pick his name out of a hat?
 

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Not all talent evaluations are correct. In fact, more aren't. The drafts proves that.
Great point. Some people think it is easy to assess talent - physical skills are easy, but there is much more to it than that. Each season there are maybe 3 or 5 players who can step in day one and play at the NFL level - these are the only guys who are 'easy' to project. A bunch more get it during or soon after training camp and produce well as rookies. Most, though, you hope are able to make the step up within a year or two. So, the vast majority of NFL draft picks you are projecting what they may become with work, training, and growth. You can't predict how strong a player will become or his motivation to work - especially after you cut him a check for more money he has ever seen in his lifetime - opening up not-positive-for-athletes-opportunities he has never known. And I don't just mean drugs - I mean big houses with pools; women; vacations; fine dining; etc. All of which are fine (except the drugs of course) - just brings about some level of distraction.
 

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I didn't see them do anything that Nelson doesn't routinely do when he has Rodgers on the field and Cobb is a beast after the catch that neither of their guys are. Their top 2 WRs might be a little better overall than ours, but our top 4 smokes theirs.

I like Jordy as much as the next guy (he's the best WR on the Packers, even with Cobb healthy) but those are some serious Green n' Gold glasses you're wearing :cool:

The three WRs have similar yardage numbers (though Nelson on slightly fewer catches) but let's remember that Nelson had Rodgers at QB for seven games. I think we can all agree that a great QB makes his WRs better and while Marshall and ALshon have played with Cutler/McCown (big downgrade from Rodgers) we've seen Jeffrey put up TWO 200+ yard games while Marshall has been his usual dominant self.

I would probably agree that right now Alshon and Jordy are similar players, but don't forget that Alshon is only in his second year. As for Marshall, he's a more physical WR than anyone on our roster and his work in the run game is light years better than anything our guys do.

Please, don't take this as an anti-Jordy post. I love Jordy, he's a top-10 WR in the NFL when Rodgers is around. However, Marshall and Alshon are top-10 WRs when anyone is under center (unless you believe that Cutler/McCown aren't that much worse than Rodgers). I think that's the difference.
 

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The three WRs have similar yardage numbers (though Nelson on slightly fewer catches) but let's remember that Nelson had Rodgers at QB for seven games. I think we can all agree that a great QB makes his WRs better and while Marshall and ALshon have played with Cutler/McCown (big downgrade from Rodgers) we've seen Jeffrey put up TWO 200+ yard games while Marshall has been his usual dominant self.
That's more a product of having a limited number of targets in Chicago than anything else. Rodgers spreads the ball around far more than either of those guys do.

Jordy can make any catch Jefferies can and probably a couple he can't. There isn't a single WR in football who works the sideline as well as JN does.
 

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You are correct, but you're right there, discrediting posters, many times when they take issue with what TT has created.

I never discredit any one..I am fine with people hating ted..I am sorry if it seems that way

Ted has made mistakes.. The ol, and some on the def side..the qb one he should habe had it secured sooner. I have supplied enough facts to support my stance that Wallace may have been ok..others dont, but I am felt like I am being called an idiot when I defend my stance..

If anything, the posters on your side ridicule ones that allow Ted some leeway
 
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ivo610

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Marshall is better at WR than anyone on our roster. Jeffery better than cobb? Idk.
 
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Every team from the one picking in the second spot to #23 were also “lucky” Rodgers fell to them but only one pulled the trigger and selected him, even though he had a starting QB in place.

That´s why I give credit to Thompson for making the pick and sticking with him in 2008.

OTOH, your bias is becoming clearer. You’ve been a member of the board for almost 1 ½ years yet 25 of your 31 posts have occurred after the losing streak. Let me guess, you’re a big Favre fan and Thompson hater, right?

I´m sorry I don´t have that much time to spend 24/7 on this board. After seeing the team play without Rodgers it became pretty clear to me this team doesn´t have a lot of talent without Rodgers. So I wanted to ask some other fans what they think about it.

I was a big Favre fan until 2007, don´t think anything is wrong with that. And no, I don´t hate Thompson and as you´re a self-proclaimed genius in following this board you should have realized I gave credit to him for some of his moves. But I don´t have a problem criticizing him either for moves he hasn´t made, addressing the OL, ILB and safety position.

And I think that I have a valid point that if this team wouldn´t have Aaron Rodgers they would have had a hard time making the playoffs since 2008. And not making the playoffs for six straight season normally result in the GM getting fired.
 

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I´m sorry I don´t have that much time to spend 24/7 on this board. After seeing the team play without Rodgers it became pretty clear to me this team doesn´t have a lot of talent without Rodgers. So I wanted to ask some other fans what they think about it.
No time to discuss Packer success, but plenty of time to complain after a few losses. Got it.

New term for this: 'Fowl weather anti-fan'

Smh at people who want pro bowl level players at every position

'Don from Wisconsin' called into NFL radio last night to chat with Bill Polian. Don said he was fed up with Thompson and how terrible of a GM he was. He angrily listed all of the high draft picks who were not helping the team: Pat Lee, Justin Harrell, Darin College, Brian Brohm, Sherrod, and a few others were all examples of Thompson’s incompetence. Polian finally cut him off. In a very disgusted and agitated tone, Polian said “That’s it. I’ve heard enough from you. Its simple – just start following another team. Thompson has built one of the strongest and deepest rosters in the NFL and if you don’t like it just follow another team. You don’t like what he is doing – just start following another team.” They immediately took another caller, the foolishness of the caller not even worthy of a comment, let alone a discussion.

(I know I used quotes above – but I am only paraphrasing)

You know what? It’s embarrassing as a Packer fan to hear some of these fools on the radio. It is tempered on these internet forums because the whole world isn’t hearing it. But to hear this attitude live is a different matter. Wonder how it sounded to 85% of NFL fans out there who would swap rosters in a heartbeat with the Packers?
 
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No time to discuss Packer success, but plenty of time to complain after a few losses. Got it.

New term for this: 'Fowl weather anti-fan'

Posting stuff on a message board doesn't make you a better fan!!!

BTW I've never said a word about not supporting the team, I'm questioning some of Thompson's moves.
 
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That´s why I give credit to Thompson for making the pick and sticking with him in 2008.



I´m sorry I don´t have that much time to spend 24/7 on this board. After seeing the team play without Rodgers it became pretty clear to me this team doesn´t have a lot of talent without Rodgers. So I wanted to ask some other fans what they think about it.

I was a big Favre fan until 2007, don´t think anything is wrong with that. And no, I don´t hate Thompson and as you´re a self-proclaimed genius in following this board you should have realized I gave credit to him for some of his moves. But I don´t have a problem criticizing him either for moves he hasn´t made, addressing the OL, ILB and safety position.

And I think that I have a valid point that if this team wouldn´t have Aaron Rodgers they would have had a hard time making the playoffs since 2008. And not making the playoffs for six straight season normally result in the GM getting fired.

Sorry, I don`t recall TJV proclaiming himself as a genius :eek:. He stands by what he believes is all.
 

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Posting stuff on a message board doesn't make you a better fan!!!
Agreed. Don't you see it as unusual, though, that you only post for the negative and not the positive? To complain and not to compliment?

Personally, I question lots of his moves and many of his draft picks. The worst pick of all time was Nick Collins. Shook my head in disgust on that one. Hell, he wasn't even listed as a possible draft pick in many of my draft guides. I learned quickly that TT is tops in talent evaluation and that maybe I should give him the benefit of the doubt.

I'm a poker player, I know that no matter what cards I am dealt, or how clever I play, I can always get beat on any given hand. But if I play smart and keep the odds on my side, in the long run I will win. Someone hits a 4 outer on the river to get a full house, I fold my flush and compliment him on his excellent hand. He never knew he was getting only 0.2 pot odds (you only call if you are over 1). I know TT isn't going to hit on every draft pick, you are a fool to think otherwise, but I know at the end of the draft, the Packers are walking away with more talent than most teams, including many that are drafting 20 picks before us.
 

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I find it comical when TT gets a pass for player who get injured or underperform. "you can't blame TT for the Oline, because he has addressed it with many picks."

.

I do use that as a reason..

So @Bus Cook why can't people use the reason that he has addressed the o-l with many picks?

On the other hate Ted thread I laid out why I think the o-l is an issue, but I think Ted did address it (but didnt use free agency)


So I would like your reasoning why Buluga, Sherrod injuries and the many draft picks are not good enough?

Also what should have Ted done?
 
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Agreed. Don't you see it as unusual, though, that you only post for the negative and not the positive? To complain and not to compliment?

Maybe it's a little unusual and I'll promise to post during winning streaks in the future.

I know TT isn't going to hit on every draft pick, you are a fool to think otherwise, but I know at the end of the draft, the Packers are walking away with more talent than most teams, including many that are drafting 20 picks before us.

I would have agreed with that in the offseason of 2011. Since then I don't think that's true anymore. As I've stated before only 8 of the 18 players Thompson has drafted in '11 and '12 are still on the roster and aside from Randall Cobb and Casey Hayward have contributed significantly. Too early to rate the 2013 class although Eddie Lacy looks like the real deal.
 

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Maybe it's a little unusual and I'll promise to post during winning streaks in the future.
Promise?

:)
I would have agreed with that in the offseason of 2011. Since then I don't think that's true anymore. As I've stated before only 8 of the 18 players Thompson has drafted in '11 and '12 are still on the roster and aside from Randall Cobb and Casey Hayward have contributed significantly. Too early to rate the 2013 class although Eddie Lacy looks like the real deal.
Part of draft and develop is the develop part. Sunshine made the same claim in another thread,

http://www.packerforum.com/threads/for-the-record-tt-critics-stake-your-position.48999/#post-529554


listing all the great players drafted by TT in the early years. Thing was, almost all of them had little impact until their 3rd or 4th year. James Jones didn't really step up till his 6th year. There is still plenty of time for some of the remaining '11 and '12ers to take the step.
 

Bus Cook

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So @Bus Cook why can't people use the reason that he has addressed the o-l with many picks?
its the equivalent of saying:
that our backup QB issue was solved by drafting Coleman and Brohm.
that when potty training your dog, getting it to crap on the floor instead of the carpet is success
that having a hot blonde tell you to get away from her or she'll call the police is hitting on a babe
that by ******** in a light bulb full of mercury is solving questionable global warming
that by eliminating "F" scores on report card makes fewer kids fail

Trying does not mean crap, in and of itself. Do gooders who think it does are doing a disservice to themselves and the cause they purport to be "helping"

If TT picks a bunch of failures, he is a failure. With respect to the oline, TT has picked a bunch of failures, and has used a disproportionate number of picks to attempt to correct his failure. That makes TT's ability to draft Olinemen












wait for it































not quite yet
























ok now




























a failure.
 

longtimefan

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its the equivalent of saying:
that our backup QB issue was solved by drafting Coleman and Brohm.
that when potty training your dog, getting it to crap on the floor instead of the carpet is success
that having a hot blonde tell you to get away from her or she'll call the police is hitting on a babe
that by ******** in a light bulb full of mercury is solving questionable global warming
that by eliminating "F" scores on report card makes fewer kids fail

Trying does not mean crap, in and of itself. Do gooders who think it does are doing a disservice to themselves and the cause they purport to be "helping"

If TT picks a bunch of failures, he is a failure. With respect to the oline, TT has picked a bunch of failures, and has used a disproportionate number of picks to attempt to correct his failure. That makes TT's ability to draft Olinemen












wait for it































not quite yet
























ok now




























a failure.

You didnt even answer my questions..
 

longtimefan

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So @Bus Cook

I agree 100% that one bad issue is he never got a suitable o-l...But it isnt like he ignored (your words, he ignored the o-l) for 8 years...You are just stretching the line issues a bit

Buluga is a fine one, (1st RT rookie to be starter on a SB winning team?? Might be wrong) but injury plays a part in some of our troubles...Sherrod as well..He drafted those 2 as #1.. Those were suppose to be book ends for a long time...

He has tried to fix it...Sitton and TJ are quality guys and were drafted in the 4th round..If Sherrod and Buluga never got hurt--those are solid 4 guys..

You go into camp with Buluga, TJ, Sitton, ED Smith, along with others...A total of 15 lineman...Then as preseason is about to start, down goes probably your best tackle..Ted can't be faulted for that...Even if you do, he drafted 2 T this year..

I think this past draft Ted was worried that Sherrod might not play this year, hence why he drafted 2 T..

As it turns out Bakh--was a solid pick up to replace Buluga...Maybe if he didnt go down, Bakh plays somewhere else?? Then that isnt a horrible line..

I would like your reasoning why Buluga, Sherrod injuries and the many draft picks are not good enough? e didnt ignore the o-l as you claim

Also what should have Ted done? In your eyes..
 

Bus Cook

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So @Bus Cook

I agree 100% that one bad issue is he never got a suitable o-l...But it isnt like he ignored (your words, he ignored the o-l) for 8 years...You are just stretching the line issues a bit

Buluga is a fine one, (1st RT rookie to be starter on a SB winning team?? Might be wrong) but injury plays a part in some of our troubles...Sherrod as well..He drafted those 2 as #1.. Those were suppose to be book ends for a long time...

He has tried to fix it...Sitton and TJ are quality guys and were drafted in the 4th round..If Sherrod and Buluga never got hurt--those are solid 4 guys..

You go into camp with Buluga, TJ, Sitton, ED Smith, along with others...A total of 15 lineman...Then as preseason is about to start, down goes probably your best tackle..Ted can't be faulted for that...Even if you do, he drafted 2 T this year..

I think this past draft Ted was worried that Sherrod might not play this year, hence why he drafted 2 T..

As it turns out Bakh--was a solid pick up to replace Buluga...Maybe if he didnt go down, Bakh plays somewhere else?? Then that isnt a horrible line..

I would like your reasoning why Buluga, Sherrod injuries and the many draft picks are not good enough? e didnt ignore the o-l as you claim

Also what should have Ted done? In your eyes..
Drafting garbage is ignoring. He doesn't get A for effort just because he's drafted almost 30 olinmen, the vast majority of whick just plain sucked. I like Bulaga too, but he's been injured more than 50% of the time. You can't count that as a hit. Sure its not TT fault he gets injured every year, but it doesn't make him a hit.

You can list names and give stats and makeup a fantasy Oline with your best 5 TT oline picks but at the end to the day, we have had the most sacks in the NFL over the last three years. If you are trying to protect some bum, that may be fine, but we now are painfully aware, that AR and BF are crown jewels. Priority #1 should be to protect them.

What I would have done differently? I would have recognised that my drafting skills where not up to par with the headlines about them, and gone after some proven horses to protect my QBs. When and if my draft projects came along, I could discard the FA and move on. When your team is the worst at giving up sacks and set a record for games not rushing for 100 yards, it can't be that difficult to find replacement for the Barbres and Newhouses of the world.
 

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