Free Agency: WR

[Crockett&Tubbs]

Just for the record I would love to see Janis succeed but I´m not overreacting to two great catches he made on broken plays. And please could we stop talking about what he did during the preseason??? Larry Pinkard had a 77-yard TD reception during this year´s preseason finale, want to bring him in for Adams as well???

With all due respect, Pinkard had one play. Janis has had numerous plays, and it's mostly been his deep-speed (something the Packers clearly missed all year long) that allowed him to make those plays. Plus, he CAUGHT them. I think he's caught touchdowns over the top from Hundley, Tolzien, and maybe even a third QB, not sure.

I liked Pinkard, talked with his dad a few times last year during camp. I suspect if he was in uniform and in Adams place that Detroit game where he had 20 passes thrown to him, that Pinkard would have produced more than 70-something yards. Of course, we'll never know.

I do believe this: Even without Jordy Nelson, I think 30 NFL GMs would have taken the Packers WR core over the Panthers receiving core. I also think most GMs would have taken the Packers over the Patriots. And also probably 25+ would have taken ours over the Seahawks.

Why did we struggle so much but Wilson, Cam, Brady still passed great? Wilson lost his supposed-superstar TE passing threat in Jimmy Graham.

I still cannot get over a WR getting 20 balls thrown his way, from the MVP Aaron Rodgers, and it only resulting in 70 total yards. That's atrocious. Unimaginable. And Adams had other bad games, and drops.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

With all due respect, Pinkard had one play. Janis has had numerous plays, and it's mostly been his deep-speed (something the Packers clearly missed all year long) that allowed him to make those plays. Plus, he CAUGHT them. I think he's caught touchdowns over the top from Hundley, Tolzien, and maybe even a third QB, not sure.

I liked Pinkard, talked with his dad a few times last year during camp. I suspect if he was in uniform and in Adams place that Detroit game where he had 20 passes thrown to him, that Pinkard would have produced more than 70-something yards. Of course, we'll never know.

I do believe this: Even without Jordy Nelson, I think 30 NFL GMs would have taken the Packers WR core over the Panthers receiving core. I also think most GMs would have taken the Packers over the Patriots. And also probably 25+ would have taken ours over the Seahawks.

Why did we struggle so much but Wilson, Cam, Brady still passed great? Wilson lost his supposed-superstar TE passing threat in Jimmy Graham.

I still cannot get over a WR getting 20 balls thrown his way, from the MVP Aaron Rodgers, and it only resulting in 70 total yards. That's atrocious. Unimaginable. And Adams had other bad games, and drops.

There's no denying the receiving corps was a disappointment in 2015. The coaching staff would have played Janis if they had thought he would have helped the passing game but two receptions on 12 targets during the regular season understandably didn't boost the staff's confidence either.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

There's no denying the receiving corps was a disappointment in 2015. The coaching staff would have played Janis if they had thought he would have helped the passing game but 2 receptions on 12 targets during the regular season understandably didn't boost the staff's confidence either.

Granted, he still produced 79 yards on those 12 targets, which is the same yards as Davante did on 20 targets against the Lions.

Also, I know for a fact that a few of those misses were underthrows by Rodgers where Janis got deep, blew by the CB, as he did in Arizona for the 4th down catch and earlier in the game not once but twice. Aaron underthrew him once and overthrew him another time, throwing it late and outta the back of the end zone.

I also remember another game, a road game, where Janis was open deep and Rodgers pass was underthrown. I do remember the big one on a deep pass along the left sideline where Janis did not make a good adjustment at all, unlike the Hail Mary. I forgot what Janis said about that one, but it looked clueless. He said he had a hard time picking up the ball at first IIRC.

All 10 misses were not because Janis "ran bad routes", which is what MM and AR would like us to believe. Couldn't possibly ever be Aaron's fault.

I wish I had film of all the passes thrown to Janis. If anybody does, please show us.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Granted, he still produced 79 yards on those 12 targets, which is the same yards as Davante did on 20 targets against the Lions.

Also, I know for a fact that a few of those misses were underthrows by Rodgers where Janis got deep, blew by the CB, as he did in Arizona for the 4th down catch and earlier in the game not once but twice. Aaron underthrew him once and overthrew him another time, throwing it late and outta the back of the end zone.

I also remember another game, a road game, where Janis was open deep and Rodgers pass was underthrown. I do remember the big one on a deep pass along the left sideline where Janis did not make a good adjustment at all, unlike the Hail Mary. I forgot what Janis said about that one, but it looked clueless. He said he had a hard time picking up the ball at first IIRC.

All 10 misses were not because Janis "ran bad routes", which is what MM and AR would like us to believe. Couldn't possibly ever be Aaron's fault.

I wish I had film of all the passes thrown to Janis. If anybody does, please show us.

You'te applying double standards here as you solely blaming Adams for not getting more receiving yards on 20 targets (which probably weren't all perfectly thrown balls and mostly pretty short throws) but on the other hand posting that Janis isn't at fault for catching only two of 12 balls thrown his way.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

You'te applying double standards here as you solely blaming Adams for not getting more receiving yards on 20 targets (which probably weren't all perfectly thrown balls and mostly pretty short throws) but on the other hand posting that Janis isn't at fault for catching only two of 12 balls thrown his way.

I disagree. I recall many dropped passes by Adams, as well as him stopping a route which led to an Int.
I can't recall Janis dropping passes like Adams has. Not just this year either. Last year Adams had some big drops.

Again, just because McCarthy did this or said that, doesn't mean they didn't err. I think the results in Arizona are strong indications that they did, in fact, err in forcing so many balls to Adams, while sitting Janis.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

We should only keep 5 WR's on the roster, plus practice squad. I'm not a lover of Abbrederis like many Sconnies are. But I think he's a better WR than Adams.

However, I feel one of those 2 has to go. Janis, Montgomery have to stay with their big play ability. And of course Jordy & Cobb. So that leaves you between Abbrederis and Adams. Nobody would trade us anything for Abbrederis. I don't know what we could get for the 2014 2nd round pick. But it seems more than what Abbrederis could fetch.

If we could turn Adams into a possible starting ILB or TE, do it.

 

[Sky King]

Let's take stock of the situation. MM's deft organizational changes have resulted in one coach who has two position groups to oversee and one coach that lost his play calling responsibilities and currently has no bonafide coaching assignment other than to serve as as a sort of sidekick. There's been a need, the extra coach to fill-it, and nothing has happened.

The coach with dual roles saw both of his position groups falter significantly. The play caller progressively saw his plays get sniffed-out as though the defenses were listening on headsets to his play calls. And the once mighty offense (that no team feared anymore) resembled the Packers of the 70's and 80's. The "fix" apparently was to fire two other coaches on offense. Maybe they deserved to be shown the door due their own merits. But the rest of the offensive staff remains intact despite their dismal failures and dysfunction last season. Incredible.

Thus, the Packers still have a part-time coach for QBs and WRs, and we all know how well that worked-out for several key players last season. Adams is the #118 rated receiver out of #119? Good grief! If that alone doesn't scream loudly that "WE HAVE A PROBLEM WITH PART-TIME COACHING!!!" then our HC may be losing it if he fails to act decisively. The Packers may continue their downward trend next season unless something is done to correct this glaring deficiency and, so far, the status quo seems to be prevailing. Which free-agent WR or #2 draft choice will they get their hands on next?

If Janis isn't learning to run crisp routes, who's teaching him (or not)? If Cobb continues to drop catches because he has developed any bad habits, who's coaching him (or not)? If A. Rodgers keeps throwing off his back foot, flees from the pocket too early, fails to pull the trigger when guys are actually open, and wears his frustration on his sleeve, who's going to counsel him (or not)? Whom and when for all players concerned?

Purely speculation on my part but I would theorize that MM has to sack at least one more coach in order to make room for a legitimate WR coach. If neither Bennett nor Clements is willing to accept a demotion gracefully (to make the staff whole once again), then MM could be delaying taking any action now until he sees if some other team makes one of his at-risk coaches an offer. That may save him from having to fire yet another potential ex-friend and help them all to save face.

After the SB concludes, as usual, there will be several **** candidates (from those two teams, especially the winner) to compete against the Packer coaches who may be at risk of losing their current jobs. After the lemons they squeezed last season other teams may have soured on them as coaching candidates -- if they are even being seriously considered at all by any other teams after last season's pratfalls.

MM's reorganization was the likely cause of this mess. It's going to be very interesting to see if he has the skill-set to resolve it. Stay tuned.

 

[TJV]

I still don’t see some acknowledging Janis’ responsibility for his lack of PT. After the win against the Chargers in which Janis caught 2 passes for 79 yards, when asked if Janis earned more PT, Rodgers “I think it’s yet to be determined” and Van Pelt likened the Packers offense to calculus and Janis admitted his college offense was algebra by comparison.

In a 10/14/15 (before the Chargers game) Jason Wilde article titled “Long distance dedication” Jordy Nelson has some comments about Janis. Under the sub-title “Figuring it out” he writes about Janis not earning Rodgers’ trust and therefor playing only 33 of the Packers 348 offensive plays so far.

When Nelson was asked if he thought Janis could give the offense what it lacks without him, he said Janis must show greater consistency in order to earn such an opportunity. “It’s the fact of someone taking pride in their work and being consistent. That’s what it comes down to,” Nelson said. “The main thing I ever focused on was being the same guy every day. Whether it was the coaches or it was Aaron, whenever I go out there, whether it’s practice or a game, you know what to expect [from me]. And I think that’s where it comes from. “[Janis] made some big plays in preseason and in practice, but it’s the consistency level, day-in and day-out. In the classroom, when you get asked a question, you have to be able to sit there and answer it – and it’s not just Jeff, it’s everybody – and answer it the way [Rodgers] wants it answered. So he knows you know what you’re doing. And it goes from there.”

http://pro.wauk-am.tritonflex.com/common/page.php?feed=2&id=22311&is_corp=1

When Nelson talks about what he did to earn the coach's and Rodgers' trust, the clear implication is Janis needs to do that as well. It's all about consistently knowing where you're supposed to be and how you're supposed to be adjusting to what the defense is doing. If the Wonderlick test means anything, Janis isn't stupid: He scored 30. I hope he does all he can before next season to prepare mentally because his physical talents are obvious.

 

[PackerDNA]

I think it's part of a process. It's a very long way from Saginaw Valley State to the NFL.

 

[jrock645]

Let's take stock of the situation. MM's deft organizational changes have resulted in one coach who has two position groups to oversee and one coach that lost his play calling responsibilities and currently has no bonafide coaching assignment other than to serve as as a sort of sidekick. There's been a need, the extra coach to fill-it, and nothing has happened.

The coach with dual roles saw both of his position groups falter significantly. The play caller progressively saw his plays get sniffed-out as though the defenses were listening on headsets to his play calls. And the once mighty offense (that no team feared anymore) resembled the Packers of the 70's and 80's. The "fix" apparently was to fire two other coaches on offense. Maybe they deserved to be shown the door due their own merits. But the rest of the offensive staff remains intact despite their dismal failures and dysfunction last season. Incredible.

Thus, the Packers still have a part-time coach for QBs and WRs, and we all know how well that worked-out for several key players last season. Adams is the #118 rated receiver out of #119? Good grief! If that alone doesn't scream loudly that "WE HAVE A PROBLEM WITH PART-TIME COACHING!!!" then our HC may be losing it if he fails to act decisively. The Packers may continue their downward trend next season unless something is done to correct this glaring deficiency and, so far, the status quo seems to be prevailing. Which free-agent WR or #2 draft choice will they get their hands on next?

If Janis isn't learning to run crisp routes, who's teaching him (or not)? If Cobb continues to drop catches because he has developed any bad habits, who's coaching him (or not)? If A. Rodgers keeps throwing off his back foot, flees from the pocket too early, fails to pull the trigger when guys are actually open, and wears his frustration on his sleeve, who's going to counsel him (or not)? Whom and when for all players concerned?

Purely speculation on my part but I would theorize that MM has to sack at least one more coach in order to make room for a legitimate WR coach. If neither Bennett nor Clements is willing to accept a demotion gracefully (to make the staff whole once again), then MM could be delaying taking any action now until he sees if some other team makes one of his at-risk coaches an offer. That may save him from having to fire yet another potential ex-friend and help them all to save face.

After the SB concludes, as usual, there will be several **** candidates (from those two teams, especially the winner) to compete against the Packer coaches who may be at risk of losing their current jobs. After the lemons they squeezed last season other teams may have soured on them as coaching candidates -- if they are even being seriously considered at all by any other teams after last season's pratfalls.

MM's reorganization was the likely cause of this mess. It's going to be very interesting to see if he has the skill-set to resolve it. Stay tuned.

Brilliantly said.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I disagree. I recall many dropped passes by Adams, as well as him stopping a route which led to an Int.
I can't recall Janis dropping passes like Adams has. Not just this year either. Last year Adams had some big drops.

Again, just because McCarthy did this or said that, doesn't mean they didn't err. I think the results in Arizona are strong indications that they did, in fact, err in forcing so many balls to Adams, while sitting Janis.

Aside of two lucky plays (according to Nelson a hail mary is all luck) Janis had five receptions for 43 yards, nothing to get ecstatic about. You keep ignoring the fact that Adams has had some good games since joining the Packers as well and his numbers are way better than Nelson's over the first two seasons.

We should only keep 5 WR's on the roster, plus practice squad. I'm not a lover of Abbrederis like many Sconnies are. But I think he's a better WR than Adams.

However, I feel one of those 2 has to go. Janis, Montgomery have to stay with their big play ability. And of course Jordy & Cobb. So that leaves you between Abbrederis and Adams. Nobody would trade us anything for Abbrederis. I don't know what we could get for the 2014 2nd round pick. But it seems more than what Abbrederis could fetch.

If we could turn Adams into a possible starting ILB or TE, do it.

Trading Adams would result in the Packers only having two receivers best suited to play on the outside with Janis automatically being the starter opposite Nelson without any true back-up for the position. Terrible idea.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

Let's take stock of the situation. MM's deft organizational changes have resulted in one coach who has two position groups to oversee and one coach that lost his play calling responsibilities and currently has no bonafide coaching assignment other than to serve as as a sort of sidekick. There's been a need, the extra coach to fill-it, and nothing has happened.

The coach with dual roles saw both of his position groups falter significantly. The play caller progressively saw his plays get sniffed-out as though the defenses were listening on headsets to his play calls. And the once mighty offense (that no team feared anymore) resembled the Packers of the 70's and 80's. The "fix" apparently was to fire two other coaches on offense. Maybe they deserved to be shown the door due their own merits. But the rest of the offensive staff remains intact despite their dismal failures and dysfunction last season. Incredible.

Thus, the Packers still have a part-time coach for QBs and WRs, and we all know how well that worked-out for several key players last season. Adams is the #118 rated receiver out of #119? Good grief! If that alone doesn't scream loudly that "WE HAVE A PROBLEM WITH PART-TIME COACHING!!!" then our HC may be losing it if he fails to act decisively. The Packers may continue their downward trend next season unless something is done to correct this glaring deficiency and, so far, the status quo seems to be prevailing. Which free-agent WR or #2 draft choice will they get their hands on next?

If Janis isn't learning to run crisp routes, who's teaching him (or not)? If Cobb continues to drop catches because he has developed any bad habits, who's coaching him (or not)? If A. Rodgers keeps throwing off his back foot, flees from the pocket too early, fails to pull the trigger when guys are actually open, and wears his frustration on his sleeve, who's going to counsel him (or not)? Whom and when for all players concerned?

Purely speculation on my part but I would theorize that MM has to sack at least one more coach in order to make room for a legitimate WR coach. If neither Bennett nor Clements is willing to accept a demotion gracefully (to make the staff whole once again), then MM could be delaying taking any action now until he sees if some other team makes one of his at-risk coaches an offer. That may save him from having to fire yet another potential ex-friend and help them all to save face.

After the SB concludes, as usual, there will be several **** candidates (from those two teams, especially the winner) to compete against the Packer coaches who may be at risk of losing their current jobs. After the lemons they squeezed last season other teams may have soured on them as coaching candidates -- if they are even being seriously considered at all by any other teams after last season's pratfalls.

MM's reorganization was the likely cause of this mess. It's going to be very interesting to see if he has the skill-set to resolve it. Stay tuned.

Very well said. For Adams to be rated almost dead-last, with Aaron Rodgers as his QB for every game, that says a lot.
The coaching, the part time thing, that's unbelievable. Was there a budget shortage?

I don't know what will happen in the next few months and into the 2016 season, but I expect there will be positive changes. And positive results. I think 2015 will go down as a blip on the radar.
I sure hope so.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

Trading Adams would result in the Packers only having two receivers best suited to play on the outside with Janis automatically being the starter opposite Nelson without any true back-up for the position. Terrible idea.

Like mentioned above, Adams was rated #118 out of #119 last year (excluding his drops, he averaged 9.7 yards per catch... that's worse than a typical TE. RB Gio Bernard had the same avg on 49 receptions to Adams 50 receptions, but Adams had 97 targets to Gio's 66).

If you don't think that Janis will improve on that, then you really haven't seen Janis run by people. Or notice his improvement late when he got more opportunities.

Adams wasn't even a rookie, and again, he had Rodgers thrwing to him, not rookies like Mariota, Winston, or stiffs like in Houston, Cleveland, etc.

Also, I hope you don't just consider Montgomery and Abbrederis as "slot" guys. Who are New England's guys who are "best suited to play outside"?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Like mentioned above, Adams was rated #118 out of #119 last year (excluding his drops, he averaged 9.7 yards per catch... that's worse than a typical TE. RB Gio Bernard had the same avg on 49 receptions to Adams 50 receptions, but Adams had 97 targets to Gio's 66).

If you don't think that Janis will improve on that, then you really haven't seen Janis run by people. Or notice his improvement late when he got more opportunities.

Adams wasn't even a rookie, and again, he had Rodgers thrwing to him, not rookies like Mariota, Winston, or stiffs like in Houston, Cleveland, etc.

Also, I hope you don't just consider Montgomery and Abbrederis as "slot" guys. Who are New England's guys who are "best suited to play outside"?

First of all I don't give a damn about PFF's ratings (they had Rodgers with a negative grade after throwing five TDs vs. the Chiefs early this season, enough said).

You're putting way too much stock into yards per catch. While I agree that Janis most likely would top Adams numbers that's mainly because he's only capable of running deep routes.

The Packers could line up Montgomery and Abbrederis on the outside but there's no doubt both are best suited to play in the slot.

When talking about the Patriots receiving corps you realize they have Gronk, don't you???

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

First of all I don't give a damn about PFF's ratings (they had Rodgers with a negative grade after throwing five TDs vs. the Chiefs early this season, enough said).

You're putting way too much stock into yards per catch. While I agree that Janis most likely would top Adams numbers that's mainly because he's only capable of running deep routes.

The Packers could line up Montgomery and Abbrederis on the outside but there's no doubt both are best suited to play in the slot.

When talking about the Patriots receiving corps you realize they have Gronk, don't you???

Gronk is a beast of a TE, and I vividly remember how much worse Brady was when missing him after the ripped ACL a few years ago.
Same impact as losing our #87 had.

Yards per catch (as is yards per carry) is a very solid indicator of a receiver's effectiveness. True, it doesn't account for drops, which Adams also has had issues with.

This offense was missing speed. ESPN Rob Demovsky wrote an article about that during the season.
McGinn and Wes Hodkiewkicz mentioned it quite a few times. Speed. No coincidences defenses started to crowd up, making everything else harder.
What does Janis possess that nobody else has shown? Just that, speed. Also good size, and apparently better hands than Adams. I don't know what else to say.... AR & MM tried to build up Adams into some training camp superstar, they put a lot of eggs in that basket. And they lost. Failed. Wasted season. Should have force-fed Janis all those chances, surely couldn't have been as disastrous as Adams was.

We need to get down to 5 WRs. Janis has shown more as a WR plus he's a very good special teamer.
You cutting Abbdereris and getting nothing for him? Or would you take a 3rd or 4th rounder for Adams?

As for that PFF rating of the Chiefs game, agreed, they are insane. Here's more on that, them trying to explain their BS: https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2015/09/29/why-aaron-rodgers-earned-a-slightly-negative-grade/

 

[PackerDNA]

First of all I don't give a damn about PFF's ratings (they had Rodgers with a negative grade after throwing five TDs vs. the Chiefs early this season, enough said).

You're putting way too much stock into yards per catch. While I agree that Janis most likely would top Adams numbers that's mainly because he's only capable of running deep routes.

The Packers could line up Montgomery and Abbrederis on the outside but there's no doubt both are best suited to play in the slot.

When talking about the Patriots receiving corps you realize they have Gronk, don't you???

Thank you. Way too much stock in PFF to the point where even large sports sites build articles around them; "according to PFF". . Too many times I've seen intelligent, in depth analysis derailed by 'according to PFF'.
Screw PFF.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Gronk is a beast of a TE, and I vividly remember how much worse Brady was when missing him after the ripped ACL a few years ago.
Same impact as losing our #87 had.

Yards per catch (as is yards per carry) is a very solid indicator of a receiver's effectiveness. True, it doesn't account for drops, which Adams also has had issues with.

This offense was missing speed. ESPN Rob Demovsky wrote an article about that during the season.
McGinn and Wes Hodkiewkicz mentioned it quite a few times. Speed. No coincidences defenses started to crowd up, making everything else harder.
What does Janis possess that nobody else has shown? Just that, speed. Also good size, and apparently better hands than Adams. I don't know what else to say.... AR & MM tried to build up Adams into some training camp superstar, they put a lot of eggs in that basket. And they lost. Failed. Wasted season. Should have force-fed Janis all those chances, surely couldn't have been as disastrous as Adams was.

We need to get down to 5 WRs. Janis has shown more as a WR plus he's a very good special teamer.
You cutting Abbdereris and getting nothing for him? Or would you take a 3rd or 4th rounder for Adams?

As for that PFF rating of the Chiefs game, agreed, they are insane. Here's more on that, them trying to explain their BS: https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2015/09/29/why-aaron-rodgers-earned-a-slightly-negative-grade/

It's pretty easy to defend a receiver who relies solelyon speed. Janis isn't a good route runner and doesn't use his huge radius to catch balls away from.his body, that's why he didn't get more snaps.

IMO it's ridiculous to assume McCarthy and Rodgers didn't want Janis on the field for whatever dubious reason you might come up with. The truth is that Adams, although struggling most of the season, was the better option.

BTW I don't understand the reasoning behind having to get down to five receivers.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Thank you. Way too much stock in PFF to the point where even large sports sites build articles around them; "according to PFF". . Too many times I've seen intelligent, in depth analysis derailed by 'according to PFF'.
Screw PFF.

I was fine with using some of their stats you weren't able to find anywhere else (unfortunately they don't offer renewals anymore) but their grading system is complete BS.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

It's pretty easy to defend a receiver who relies solelyon speed. Janis isn't a good route runner and doesn't use his huge radius to catch balls away from.his body, that's why he didn't get more snaps.

How is anyone going to improve? Play him more, and last year was the perfect chance to do so. We saw the strides he made in the last game alone. He improved more than Adams did. Adams regressed. We paid the price for that mistake.

[QUOTE="captainWIMM]IMO it's ridiculous to assume McCarthy and Rodgers didn't want Janis on the field for whatever dubious reason you might come up with. The truth is that Adams, although struggling most of the season, was the better option.[/QUOTE]
Anyone would have been a better option than Adams. Both for A) results and B) getting Janis more time working on the field with Rodgers, learning, and being able to fully utilize his physical gifts, speed & size.
As for WHY MM and or AR didn't go with Janis, let's just say this: MM has made plenty of personnel mistakes. All coaches do. And Rodgers would still have Jarrett Boykin and Ruvell Martin on the team if he made the decisions. Him throwing 20 balls to Davante that one game tells you his judgment is clouded. Bad decisions.

[QUOTE="captainWIMMBTW] I don't understand the reasoning behind having to get down to five receivers.[/QUOTE]
Because we usually only play 4, and carry 5. But if they keep 6, then we both can be happy. Except I still want Janis' speed and big play ability out there more than Adams. Janis needs reps. And he should have been the one to get them last year moreso than Adams. That was a big mistake. Where did Adams get us? He played against crappy competition in college, terrible defenses, and had a great QB throwing to him. His stats were just as inflated as Janis' were. Does anyone see Adams running great routes, all the time? He's stopped on routes that turned into Ints a few times. He's dropped more than his share of balls. And he's never that I can remember burned a CB deep for a long TD over the top.

I know there aren't many (my son is one), but I don't understand what makes someone thing Adams has big time talent. His Fresno numbers? Great first name?

 

[TJV]

And Rodgers would still have Jarrett Boykin and Ruvell Martin on the team if he made the decisions.

What makes you believe this?

And again, in your opinion does Janis bear any responsibility for his lack of PT? Is it your opinion that he's done everything he could possibly do to get more PT? (If that's not your opinion, that's how you are coming across IMO.) Do you think Jordy Nelson has a grudge against Janis? If not, why did he tell a reporter what he did as quoted above in post 108?

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

What makes you believe this?

And again, in your opinion does Janis bear any responsibility for his lack of PT? Is it your opinion that he's done everything he could possibly do to get more PT? (If that's not your opinion, that's how you are coming across IMO.) Do you think Jordy Nelson has a grudge against Janis? If not, why did he tell a reporter what he did as quoted above in post 108?

As for Jordy, I believe he is a great player, who respects his coaches and whatever the decisions they make, right or wrong (yes, coaches do make mistakes). He's smart enough to not question anything of his coaches in public. Now privately, he may speak honestly.

It's also possible that Janis' work ethic has not been as great as they wanted. He might clash with Rodgers, and if one clashes with Rodgers, that's not a good thing.

Is it possible that Adams was a great practice player but bad in games, or is it possible that Adams was not a great practice player but that the coach and/or Rodgers wanted to pump up his confidence, for some reason. He was a 2nd round pick, whereas Janis a last round pick.

It continues to amaze me, this: Last year, and most of this year, fans were saying "Hey, Janis is fast, we need fast, he's made plays in games in preseason when thrown to deep, so let's give Janis the chance now, since our offense is bogged down and we have the slowest set of WRs/TEs in the NFL. But coaches didn't play him and Rodgers didn't pass to him.
Then, finally, when they had no other choice but to play him (not by their choice, but by circumstances out of their control), then Janis produced. He produced more than Adams had all year, even in a game where Rodgers threw to him TWENTY times.... and still, there are Janis-haters who don't see the mistake the coaches made all year long by continuing to put their trust in everyone else, besides Janis.

 

[TJV]

As for Jordy, I believe he is a great player, who respects his coaches and whatever the decisions they make, right or wrong (yes, coaches do make mistakes). He's smart enough to not question anything of his coaches in public. Now privately, he may speak honestly.

That was the first time I remember reading/hearing Jordy call out anyone and it wasn't a matter of him not questioning his coaches. He was asked a question about Janis by a reporter. He could have said, ‘he just needs experience…’ or ‘we’ll see’ or some other politically correct answer that doesn’t really answer the question. Instead he did answer. I have no reason to believe he’d say anything different in private.

I don’t see any Janis-haters here and I don’t think there’s even a handful of posters who have never criticized the coaching staff. Every reasonable person realizes all people make mistakes. I don’t think Rodgers or the coaching staff or Nelson have a grudge against Janis or want him to fail. I honestly believe the coaching staff gave Janis the number of snaps they did because they thought that was best for the Packers. As I posted in-season, I think they were wrong. I think its clear Janis is going to make the team based upon his STs play. The only thing left for me is to hope he dedicates himself mentally as he hasn’t before and becomes the consistent receiving threat his physical talents indicate he can be.

 

[Shawnsta3]

If you're a Packer fan, I think you've got to root really hard for Janis to be special. We've seen the game changing ability on special teams and now receiving in the Cards game, but we need him to take the next step and make the team with Nelson's return to an elite offense and SB contender once again, rather than a Chris Matthews flash in the pan.

I've criticized Janis quite a bit for his known shortcomings, but IMO he could be key to this team next year.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

I have no reason to believe he’d say anything different in private.

I don’t see any Janis-haters here and I don’t think there’s even a handful of posters who have never criticized the coaching staff. Every reasonable person realizes all people make mistakes. I don’t think Rodgers or the coaching staff or Nelson have a grudge against Janis or want him to fail. I honestly believe the coaching staff gave Janis the number of snaps they did because they thought that was best for the Packers. As I posted in-season, I think they were wrong. I think its clear Janis is going to make the team based upon his STs play. The only thing left for me is to hope he dedicates himself mentally as he hasn’t before and becomes the consistent receiving threat his physical talents indicate he can be.

It seems we're more in agreement than it appeared originally.
With what happened on the field this year, and then what we saw Janis get done in the last game, it's clear to everyone now that this guy should have been playing more often all along, as many Packer fans were clamoring for.

I study people for a living, in a sense, as a teacher and a coach. I read body language. I try to "read between the lines" frequently. While you may not do this, I am sure you can remember your playing days, whatever sport it may have been. Let's take a generic football team for example. Let's say 60 boys.

They all are different. Different personalities, some more popular than others. Some more arrogant than others. Some meaner, some nicer, some more likable, some less likable. Some strange dudes.

I can't tell you WHAT exactly it is, but my observations for 2 years now have led me to believe that Janis is not well-liked among his teammates, as many other players are. This for sure is from Rodgers. IMO, Janis' personality apparently clashes with Rodgers, and that's a hard hurdle to overcome.

WHY it is, I don't know. A good guess is perhaps he hasn't put in the work. He has been lazy in practice compared to what Rodgers wants, expects. Compared to Jordy, etc.
Or maybe he's cocky. That should not be the case coming from where he came from, and what round, etc.

Psychologists are often wrong with their assessments. Counselors make mistakes, as coaches do.
I could be wrong, especially since I have not spoken with these guys, other than a few tweets to and from Janis and Nelson and Cobb, but not about this.

It is my belief that either Janis' personality, or his lack of fire/commitment in practice is why Rodgers hasn't gone to bat for him, so to speak, as he did for Adams. I know Adams is a good kid from what I've been told. Not so sure about Janis. Adams, I believe, is a big gamer. Plays a lot of video games. Janis, I'm not sure. He's an outdoorsman, a hunter, fisherman. I don't believe Rodgers is.

Personally, I wish Rodgers & Janis would play golf together.
But in the off-season, even if Janis WANTS to work more, in private with Rodgers, it's gotta be hard as Aaron has his private life, with his Hollywood girlfriend.
Reading the playbook in February and March is one thing. It's being on the field, working with the QB, building an on-field rapport, that is the key.

Final point is this: I think it's clear now, to everyone, that physically, talent-wise, that Jeff Janis has what we were hoping for when we drafted the 6-years-younger-Jordy-clone. Now. what do we do to maximize it?

 

[thequick12]

Josh Gordon would be cool but we really don't need or have room for a free agent or draft pick addition at wr provided Nelson is back