Fire Capers

[brandon2348]

Someone said it in chatbox earlier. "We got a bunch of nickle and dime backs." Thats what we got.

 

[Cincinnatus_WKRP]

Someone said it in chatbox earlier. "We got a bunch of nickle and dime backs." Thats what we got.

Spot on.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Yup, Packers finish one win away from a SB trip and the doomer and gloomers want to burn the whole house down. Should have seen this coming. Might as well fire everyone but AR, start over and see if we can compete with.......Cleveland?

 

[bigboypasses]

A pile of ****? We were at full strength on Defense. IF you are calling our Starters a pile of ****.. id agree with you. But who drafts these guys? TT with the help of Mccarthy and Capers. Randall and Rollins both suck... they are garbage. Ladarius gunter is a scrub. Who's fault is this? Why cant our coaches actually coach. Why don't our players progress throughout the season instead of making the same mistakes over and over and over.

Also, Tackling has nothing to do with personel.

TT clearly missed on Randle and Rollins. They both lack explosion out of breaks to play successful man to man.

Not fair to single out Gunter. He is an UDFA and has played well at times. He shouldnt be our no.1 and is doing the best with what he has to work with.

But our Secondary has sucked for 10 years now. Even when the Packers had Tramon Williams, Sam Shields, and Casey Hayward, Micah Hyde. They still sucked.
2011: 32nd (411 YPG)

2012: 11th (337 YPG)

2013: 25th (372 YPG)

2014: 15th (347YPG)

2015: 18th (348YPG)

2016: 22nd (364YPG)

The below says it perfectly.

If a player is missing tackles consistently, it’s the job of the coaching staff, and the coordinator running that staff, to improve the player. If multiple players are missing those tackles, and continue to miss those tackles, those players shouldn’t continue playing, unless the person making the personnel decisions doesn’t care much about that part of the game.

All coaches need better players, it’s the ones who can deal with that problem well who succeed. If a coach can’t adjust to the talent he has, he’s not a very good coach. Capers is notorious for throwing whoever he’s got available into whatever crazy blitz package he might feel like running at the time, regardless of that player’s skill set. A great player in a flawed system is just as effective as an average player in a great system. Now, if you take an average player and put him in a flawed system, you get what the Packers currently have on defense.

 

[bigboypasses]

Yup, Packers finish one win away from a SB trip and the doomer and gloomers want to burn the whole house down. Should have seen this coming. Might as well fire everyone but AR, start over and see if we can compete with.......Cleveland?

When you keep giving up 38+ points in the playoffs, something has to give. You call it doom and gloom.. I'll call it respecting your fan base.

 

[bigboypasses]

Yup, Packers finish one win away from a SB trip and the doomer and gloomers want to burn the whole house down. Should have seen this coming. Might as well fire everyone but AR, start over and see if we can compete with.......Cleveland?

So you are okay with GB winning just 2 superbowls while having Favre and Rodgers for 25 years? When will packers fans be sick of this ****?

 

[brandon2348]

Also, Tackling has nothing to do with personel.

But our Secondary has sucked for 10 years now. Even when the Packers had Tramon Williams, Sam Shields, and Casey Hayward, Micah Hyde. They still sucked.
2011: 32nd (411 YPG)

2012: 11th (337 YPG)

2013: 25th (372 YPG)

2014: 15th (347YPG)

2015: 18th (348YPG)

2016: 22nd (364YPG)

The below says it perfectly.

If a player is missing tackles consistently, it’s the job of the coaching staff, and the coordinator running that staff, to improve the player. If multiple players are missing those tackles, and continue to miss those tackles, those players shouldn’t continue playing, unless the person making the personnel decisions doesn’t care much about that part of the game.

All coaches need better players, it’s the ones who can deal with that problem well who succeed. If a coach can’t adjust to the talent he has, he’s not a very good coach. Capers is notorious for throwing whoever he’s got available into whatever crazy blitz package he might feel like running at the time, regardless of that player’s skill set. A great player in a flawed system is just as effective as an average player in a great system. Now, if you take an average player and put him in a flawed system, you get what the Packers currently have on defense.

Your preaching to the Choir but all those guys you listed are 5'10-5'11 and other then Shields arent blazers so I dont know why they were ever drafted if we need corners to play 1 v 1 man to man on an island in Capers exotic blitz defense. I personally think Dix is better suited as a box safety too.

Man i miss Nick Collins and Charles Woodson. It worked that year with those guys and Sammie on an island and using Williams as a "boundary corner".

We simply dont have those guys now.

 

[bigboypasses]

Even better, enlighten me how Masthay was better over the last 2 years of his NFL career? Go crazy here, don't just use his gross average. I want to know how he was with flipping field position. How well he was kicking inside the 20. Masthays best kicks came between the 40's, when he kicked the ball into or out of the endzone.

I will start you out.

Masthay had 81 punts his final year: 18 were downed inside the 20. 14 Fair catches. 41 returned
Schum had 56 punts: 19 were downed inside the 2o. 18 fair catches 16 returned.

I was a big skeptic when Schum was brought in, but he proved to be a much better punter than Masthay had been. Am I saying he is a top 10 punter? No, but you saying Masthay or Mortell were better? Really?

BTW, Tossing Mortell's name out as being a better option, doesn't help your case.

Are you joking? Mortell had 9 punts in pre season. He averaged 45.1 yds and 42 net. 5 of those punts were inside the 20 with 0 TB. You clearly know nothing. Mortell gave up one big run back against SF of like 20 yards. Other than that.. he was pretty good.

 

[bigboypasses]

That's true. When you couple those misses with TT's inability to sign (or hatred of signing) any veterans, you're left with guys like Gunter playing in big spots.

My issue is that clearly MM or AR doesn't have the balls to go up to TT and demand they acquire some talent through a trade or FA. AR knows he can't win a ring with this Defense. We are 4-5 years away at best. Only decent thing about our Defense is our line and they sucked today.

 

[BrokenArrow]

Falcons went from garbage D to SB in 2 years.

Falcons are there because they are lucky enough to have ZERO significant injuries. In the NFL injuries can make the difference in being #1 and #32.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Are you joking? Mortell had 9 punts in pre season. He averaged 45.1 yds and 42 net. 5 of those punts were inside the 20 with 0 TB. You clearly know nothing. Mortell gave up one big run back against SF of like 20 yards. Other than that.. he was pretty good.

and Mortell is currently employed by......??? I guess you are one of the few armchair GM's who feel he is....pretty good.

Saying just what you said leads me to believe you don't trust what coaches do, because you think you know more based on what you see, in preseason no less. Do you realize coaches spend a lot of time in practices, film room, unit meetings, etc. with these players? For you to use stats from 3 preseason games and 9 punts to declare Mortell a better punter than Schum doesn't say much to me. Which is how we started this conversation.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

When you keep giving up 38+ points in the playoffs, something has to give. You call it doom and gloom.. I'll call it respecting your fan base.

Yup, the Packer organization clearly disrespects its fan base, especially the ones who know far more than the people they hire.

 

[BrokenArrow]

Our offense would only have been good enough if it had put up 45 or more. Pretty tall order.

Especially when 3 of your top 4 WRs are playing hurt, you lose your best RB, you lose both guards, your backup RB has a back injury and your QB is playing with the flu.

 

[BrokenArrow]

Someone said it in chatbox earlier. "We got a bunch of nickle and dime backs." Thats what we got.

No, we've got a bunch of guys who played hurt all season and it showed. That's what we've got.

 

[brandon2348]

No, we've got a bunch of guys who played hurt all season and it showed. That's what we've got.

Every team has guys playing hurt. It was a heck of a run and we came up short and yeah the pedal broke as I posted earlier.

Atlanta won 1 more regular season game then us and ended up with a bye and two home games.

We definitely had a tougher road. It seems like every year that how it works out.

 

[bigboypasses]

Yup, the Packer organization clearly disrespects its fan base, especially the ones who know far more than the people they hire.

So back to my original point. Do you think it's a success or failure? That GB has only won 2 championships in 25 years with arguably 2 of the to 10 QB's to ever play the game.

Eli Manning has 2.
Ravens won 2 with Trent Dilfer & Joe Flacco.
Rex Grossman has been to a SB.
The broncos have been to 3 and won 2 since they beat us in SB 32.

 

[BrokenArrow]

But Masthey is a better punter than Schum. I let the numbers speak. Masthay & Schum both suck. So I am not sure how you can say Schum will be okay.. when he did worse than the man that was run out of town.. because he was god awful.

Masthay career: 44.2 avg & 40.1 Net
Schum: 43.2 & 39.1

Masthay didn't suck and neither does Schum. Masthay set the team record for net average for a season and he got rewarded by being replaced. We're not a dome team. No punter is going to come in here do what dome punters do. This is Green Bay.

 

[bigboypasses]

Masthay didn't suck and neither does Schum. Masthay set the team record for net average for a season and he got rewarded by being replaced. We're not a dome team. No punter is going to come in here do what dome punters do. This is Green Bay.

But I expect the replacement to be a significant upgrade. Schum is a downgrade.. which is saying a lot.

 

[BrokenArrow]

So finishing 27th in punting isn't an issue?

No, it's not. Not in 95 years of Packer football. It's a product of the environment and it's that simple.

 

[BrokenArrow]

Rex Grossman has been to a SB.

Yeah, but he didn't get them there. Orton did.

 

[bigboypasses]

Yeah, but he didn't get them there. Orton did.

Not saying much.

 

[bigboypasses]

No, it's not. Not in 95 years of Packer football. It's a product of the environment and it's that simple.

I don't give a damn about 95 years of football. I know Green Bay history in and out.. but Packer fans need to stop referencing the history when trying to make a valid point. In 25 years GB has won 2 superbowls with AROD And Favre.

 

[bigboypasses]

You think Vince Lombardi would give a damn about winning the first 2 SB's with 17 teams? Come on. GB has been competitive in the last 2 decades..but they have wasted 2 of the best QB's to ever play the game.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

So back to my original point. Do you think it's a success or failure? That GB has only won 2 championships in 25 years with arguably 2 of the to 10 QB's to ever play the game.

Eli Manning has 2.
Ravens won 2 with Trent Dilfer & Joe Flacco.
Rex Grossman has been to a SB.
The broncos have been to 3 and won 2 since they beat us in SB 32.

I wasn't in a discussion with you concerning this. But since you seem to want to drop your notion of Masthay and Mortell are better than Schum......

You are obviously a fan who considers a SB win the only measure of success and anything else is a failure. So no matter what I say or what information is shown to you concerning just how successful the Green Bay Packers have been in the last 20 + years, you won't be satisfied, since in your eyes, they are a failure.

 

[bigboypasses]

I wasn't in a discussion with you concerning this. But since you seem to want to drop your notion of Masthay and Mortell are better than Schum......

You are obviously a fan who considers a SB win the only measure of success and anything else is a failure. So no matter what I say or what information is shown to you concerning just how successful the Green Bay Packers have been in the last 20 + years, you won't be satisfied, since in your eyes, they are a failure.

Yes, so do all the players and coaches and GM's. They get paid to bring in super bowls. Everything else is a failure. If you think Favre and Rodgers winning 2 super bowls is success ... that is terrible.

Eli manning......has won 2.
Rex Grossman and Orton went to the SB.
Ravens won 2 with Flacco and DILFER. Come on.