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The 2019 Dantés Draft Thread

Discussion in 'Draft Talk' started by Dantés, Dec 15, 2018.

  1. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    Actually I wasn't talking about specific players in this year's draft but that it's easier for rookies in general to have an immediate impact as a box safety compared to lining up at free safety.
     
  2. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    I see.

    I think it's generally easiest for players to line up at the positions that best match their talent and skillsets.
     
  3. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    It has taken even some really good free safeties some years to perform at a high level in the NFL. Nick Collins being a prime example.
     
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  4. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    It's true that it's a harder role, but if you have a rookie whose skill/talent leans more towards FS responsibilities, I don't think you're helping him by putting him in a SS role simply because it's considered to be the easier position.
     
  5. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    You're most likely right about that. Therefore I would feel more comfortable selecting a safety primarily excelling in the box.
     
  6. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    I disagree, but mostly because there is only one box safety in this draft who I think is any good (Rapp). Abram is one of the more overrated prospects out there.
     
  7. GleefulGary

    GleefulGary Cheesehead

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    I think Sheldrick Redwine could be a lesser version of CGJ.
     
  8. GleefulGary

    GleefulGary Cheesehead

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    That was more due to a scheme change than talent/readiness.
     
  9. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    I could see that.
     
  10. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    I don't consider that to be true as Bob Sanders was the defensive coordinator during Collins' second and third year as well as the fourth in which he broke out.
     
  11. GleefulGary

    GleefulGary Cheesehead

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    For some reason I thought Capers was the DC in 08. My bad.

    Anyways, some safeties are ready early and some aren't. There were a bunch last year that did well as rookies like Jessie Bates and Justin Reid.
     
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  12. OldSchool101

    OldSchool101 Peerless Beer, Lacrosse WI

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    Yeah. I like his versatility. He’s a Micah Hyde type but better, turbo athletic version. He doesn’t have concerns with deep speed like Micah had. I’d be very pleased if we can land him.
     
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  13. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    Let's do a first round mock draft...
    1. ARI: K. Murray, QB, OK- I would not be totally shocked if the Cardinals turn out to be bluffing in a bid to get Oakland to trade a huge haul to move up to #1. However, I see the logic of drafting Murray as well (Keim is on a really hot seat, has to have a big improvement, Murray could be electric enough to save his job). I'm projecting Rosen to LA.
    2. SF: N. Bosa, ED, OSU- When big brother Joey came out, there was plenty of discussion among Chargers fans about whether the pick would be Ramsey or Buckner or someone of that ilk. Then Bosa made it to #3 and the Chargers brass put their card in as fast as they could. I think it will be similar with Nick and the Niners.
    3. NYJ: Q. Williams, iDL, UA- Fans would likely lose their minds to see the Jets pass on EDGE Josh Allen for Williams, given that they've need edge rushers for... ever. However, Williams is just so far above Allen as a prospect that I can't justify the pick. Plus, it isn't like they don't have room for Williams in their starting defense.
    4. OAK: J. Allen, ED, UK- I don't get the top 5 love for Allen, but it seems that almost everyone else does. Finding an edge rusher to try to replace Mack's production has to be a huge priority for Gruden. Allen won't come anywhere close to doing that, but he fits the idea. And the Raiders don't necessarily make great picks anyhow.
    5. DEN: D. Lock, QB, MIZZ- Elway, who for years has been the most overrated GM in football, has to be desperate for a QB at this point. Even he can't be dumb enough to think Flacco is really a solution. Here I have him moving up to #5 to make sure he secures his guy in front of the Giants.
    6. NYG: E. Oliver, iDL, UH- The Giants need edge help for sure, but they also don't have anyone like Oliver on their defensive line. Gettleman is the same GM that doubled up on iDL in rounds 1 and 2 in 2013 for the Panthers. He loves to draft linemen. Oliver would likely do more for their pass rush than any edge rushers left here.
    7. JAC: J. Taylor, OT, FLA- After releasing Jermey Parnell, the Jags have a pretty glaring hole at right tackle. The guy currently slated to start would be 2018 4th rounder Will Richardson, who missed his rookie season. Taylor is one of a handful of options, but just strikes me as a great fit for what they want to do in their offense.
    8. DET: J. Williams, OL, UA- Offensive line hasn't been a common pick for DET, but it makes some sense. They have a pretty big hole at RG, and they are also getting into the waning years of RT Ricky Wagner both in terms of his contract and his performance. Williams makes sense in both spots and is just better value than someone like Gary.
    9. WAS: D. Jones, QB, DUKE- Most of the time that QB's go in the first round, it's via trade up. Here I have Washington coming up an extra spot ahead of Cincy to secure their guy. I have not watched these QB's, so I'm really basing this on what I'm hearing regarding who the NFL likes. I do know Jones is a guy who wins by being on time and accurate in the short game, which fits Jay Gruden well.
    10. TB: D. White, LB, LSU- I believe that the Bucs love White, but this makes a lot more sense to me than taking him at #5 overall. White is immensely talented, but I can't help smelling a bust here given his questionable instincts and propensity to play out of control. A bust for Tampa would make sense.
    11. CIN: D. Haskins, QB, OSU- The Bengals have a new coach, which often means a new QB. They have zero cap implications if they cut or trade Dalton. There haven't been any extension talks. In other words, there are lots of signs that they could take a QB. They get aced out for Jones by WAS, so they settle for Haskins here who the NFL reportedly doesn't like as much as the media.
    12. GB: D. Bush, LB, UM- With the QB action put to bed, I don't see a trade down in this particular mock. Dillard still makes some sense to me, but @JanisJubilee passed along that Jim Nagy, who runs the Sr Bowl, feels that Dillard is a LT only. So let's look at a different scenario. The Packers get the best linebacker in the draft, the rare player who combines elite athleticism with great fundamentals and instincts. Pettine could cook up a whole lot of nasty with a guy like Bush.
    13. HOU: A. Dillard, OT, WSU- The tanking Dolphins move down as Houston comes up to secure a legit left tackle. The Texans OL is legitimately horrendous both on paper and on the field. Dillard needs plenty of refinement coming out of that offense, but he is immensely talented and has proved a quick study this off-season.
    14. ATL: B. Burns, ED, FSU- The Falcons' best edge rusher was seeking treatment for mental illness this off-season. Burns is overrated, as his fans tend to sweep his strength deficiencies under the rug, but he remains an elite athlete who is technically advanced. He would at least offer value as a sub rusher in passing situations. The team that takes him will obviously be banking on him getting bigger/stronger at the next level.
    15. BUF: T. Hockenson, TE, IA- The Bills' TE room is pretty spare. Positional value aside, Hockenson is a top 5 player in this class. He would give Josh Allen a really secure target from the position, help their running backs with his blocking, and demand attention away from their receivers. The Bills taking him here is more reasonable than at #9. My ideal draft for the Packers would have them moving down to this pick for either Hockenson or Bush.
    16. CAR: M. Sweat, ED, MSU- The Panthers have got to have more help at DE. It's a critical position in that defense and their depth chart at the position is terrible. It would be Sweat or Gary here in this scenario. Sweat is the better prospect, but his heart issue may mean he drops later. Brugler seems to think that it wasn't nearly as much of a concern as it was for Maurice Hurst.
    17. NYG: R. Gary, ED, UM- Gary is immensely talented, but I would be terrified of drafting him. The word on him is that he's very much a fan of his own talent, which might explain why he didn't capitalize on his potential at Michigan. But he fills a big need here and could be a great get if he responds well to coaching at the next level.
    18. MIN: C. Ford, OL, OK- I'm not really sold that Ford fits great with what Minny wants to do on offense now that Kubiak is overseeing things, but their OL sucks and Ford is the best guy left on the board. His versatility would obviously help sort out their best five guys, as he could play both inside and outside.
    19. TEN: C. Ferrell, ED, CLEM- The Titans have now moved on from both edge stalwarts Brian Orakpo and Derrick Morgan. They signed Cameron Wake to be a pass rush specialist, and they have Harold Landry waiting in the wings, but they really lack someone to give them power and stability outside. Ferrell would bring that, albeit not in a flashy package.
    20. PIT: M. Brown, WR, OK- I am pretty skeptical that a 166 lb WR can survive in the NFL, but this mock is about my projections, not my preferences. Weight aside, every well connected analyst seems to think Brown will go in the 1st round. I still have my doubts, but this match makes sense as his closest stylistic comp is Antonio Brown.
    21. OAK: G. Williams, CB, LSU- Eager to make sure they secure one of the few legit CB prospects in the draft, Oakland uses some of its immense pick capital to move up and take Greedy Williams. Incidentially, I don't like Williams much as a prospect, so this fit feels right.
    22. BAL: P. Campbell, WR, OSU- The Ravens are building an unconventional offense, so what better fit than an unconventional WR? Campbell would be a screen/jet-sweep weapon to incorporate into the run-heavy Lamar Jackson experience. Jackson needs player who can create with the ball in their hands. Campbell's inexperience downfield would be mitigated by his usage.
    23. MIA: C. Wilkins, iDL, CLEM- After moving down for the extra draft capital, MIA looks for the best, highest character, foundational building block they can find. In this scenario, that's Wilkins. Teams in the Dolphins' situation are best served looking for high floor players who can help establish culture.
    24. SEA: D. Risner, OL, KSU- The Seahawks' line was much improved in 2018, but they still need to improve everywhere other than LT and C. Risner is ideal in that he can fill whatever spot they need the most. His nasty play demeanor and run-block first mentality would play well with what they're trying to do there.
    25. PHI: D. Lawrence iDL, CLEM- The Eagles have found their success by building strong units in the trenches. While they have Cox and Malik Jackson, neither profiles anything like the massive and talented Lawrence. While Lawrence's film was hot and cold in 2018, which is typical for big iDL's anyways, it was revealed that he was playing through an injury.
    26. IND: B. Murphy, CB, UW- The Colts have a pretty big need at cornerback. Murphy may not end up going this high because he's not very big and he's not very fast, however neither his size nor his speed are prohibitive concerns. What he is, is a really good football player, who would instantly become the best natural corner on the roster.
    27. OAK: N. Fant, TE, IA- The Raiders have a hole at this position after losing Jared Cook. So here, they replace him with a player who is similar in a lot of ways. Fant is really fast and explosive, however he isn't as dynamic as you'd expect with the ball in his hands, and whether the ball ever gets secure in his hands in the first place is questionable.
    28. AZ: G. Bradbury, C, NCSU- The Cardinals own this pick for the purposes of this scenario as I had them trading Rosen to the Chargers. They really need to take the best OL available here. In this scenario, that's Bradbury. They drafted Mason Cole last year to play the pivot, but if it were me, I would take Bradbury and move Cole over to the guard competition.
    29. KC: J. Tillery, DL, ND- Tillery might seem redundant on the Chiefs, given that his most frequent comparison is Chris Jones, but the value here is really good, and they could easily play together. Both will be able to move between end and tackle in their new 4-3, given them versatility to get two very dangerous players on the field together.
    30. GB: A. Brown, WR, Miss- As the wide receiver position has been picked a little bit and the run on safeties hasn't started yet in this mock, I will have the Packers take their guy for the slot at #30. Brown is a shockingly quick for such a big, strong WR. He wins after the catch with that combination of elusiveness and power. From 2016-2018, Brown broke 50 tackles, gained 7.6 YAC, and has been one of CFB's best big play threats.
    31. LAR: E. McCoy, OL, TAMU- The Rams need some immediate help on the interior. Depending on how things shake out with other players already on the roster, that help may need to come at guard or center. McCoy's value lies in his versatility. He would be able to slot in to whatever spot helps the rams the most.
    32. NE: Z. Allen, DL, BC- I could see a trade down before making this pick, but I could see a match like this for the Patriots. Allen works both inside and outside, much like Trey Flowers. It would be a lot like them to find a cheap, rookie contract version of the guy they just allowed to leave for 17M/season.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
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  14. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    This is an excellent thread highlighting Hockenson's blocking:

    https://twitter.com/Cover_1_/status/1118854406567604224

    Hockenson is not #1 on my board for the Packers, but he is up there. I am convinced that he would help this offense get where it wants to go more than any other player in this class. The whole idea of the offensive system that LaFleur is installing is to be able to run and pass effectively out of the same exact looks with the same exact action. He wants to erase predictability and the prevent the defense from subbing personnel. A TE like Hockenson makes that sort of approach super effective. He is an extension of the OL when you want to run, and a dangerous receiving threat when you don't.
     
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  15. gbgary

    gbgary Cheesehead

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    [​IMG]
     
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  16. PackFan2

    PackFan2 Cheesehead

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    I should be posting this in the high low consensus but theres just too many threads. this is the most up to date soo..


    Anyways- Why do people like Josh Allen EDGE from Kentucky? Doesn't seem like a guy who deserved top 5, with some saying hes top 3. All he does is speed rush. Tall and lanky but poorly built with a weak lower body (like Sweat). Too small to play with hands on the ground and not enough experience to play 3-4 outline linebacker (coverage and run stop). If anything Sweat is comparable to Allen but measurement and experience wise. Idk if anyone else feels this way? I'd like more info or perspective cause right now I feel like Allen is the (I dare say) next big bust. Theres always a bust in every draft lol.
     
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  17. GleefulGary

    GleefulGary Cheesehead

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    Allen, for whatever reason, reminds me of Kyler Fackrell. Better, obviously, but not a top 15 pick. When you're an edge, and your best ability isn't rushing the passer, you just can't go that early. He's way too overhyped for me.
     
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  18. GleefulGary

    GleefulGary Cheesehead

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    I actually think the best edge after Nick Bosa in this draft is Chase Winovich.

    Brian Burns is a very good pass rusher, but OT's are gonna cheat outside on him, and he cannot play the run. Winovich is better, imo.
     
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  19. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    I would put Sweat above Winovich, but it's not a crazy take.
     
  20. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    The longer I follow the draft, the more I realize how much I don't know. Every year, people are adamant about so many prospects and projections and every year, the draft defies our expectations. This is what makes it so fun, and so much better than the draft of any other sport. However, this realization has also made me less specific in my own projections, as I realize that I really don't have a really particular grip on where most of these prospects are going.

    So with that said, here is my final list of players at each position that I like for the Packers when I factor the following criteria: 1) who could realistically be there (for pick #12)? 2) what do they need at each position? 3) what players fit what they want to do? 4) how does their athletic talent fit tendencies? 5) how good is their film?

    I don't think these are necessarily the best players at their respective positions, nor are these the only ones I like, but when I put the criteria together, these are the guys who stand out to me.

    Quarterback: At most, the Packers should just invest a later pick in a developmental prospect who can join the Kizer/Boyle mix and hopefully improve the backup situation.
    • Brett Rypien, Boise State (5th-6th)
    • Easton Stick, North Dakota State (6th-7th)
    Running Back: Aaron Jones is a stud and he is tailor made to run in a wide zone offense, so I think this position is more about compliment than feature. Thus I am looking for talented runners who might be had later who can compete with Williams for that spell back role. Special teams help is a bonus.
    • Devine Ozigbo, Nebraska (4th-5th)
    • Troy Pollard, Memphis (4th-5th)
    • Travis Homer, Miami (5th-6th)
    • Alex Barnes, KSU (5th-6th)
    Tight End: TE is a spot that the Packers could invest in as early as #12, and as late as the middle rounds, depending on when value presents itself. Given LaFleur's offense, the importance of being multiple from the same personnel groupings, and the importance of auxiliary blocking in the running game, I am prioritizing blocking in the guys that I want for the Packers. Ideally, an in-line "Y" tight end could be found, but an "H" should be in play too.
    • T.J. Hockenson (Y), Iowa (1st)
    • Irv Smith (H), Alabama (2nd-3rd)
    • Kahale Warring (Y), SDSU (2nd-3rd)
    • Foster Moreau (Y/H), LSU (4th-5th)
    • Trevon Wesco (H/Y), WVU (4th-5th)
    Wide Receiver: The Packers have a lot of potential in this position group already, but they are lacking a YAC playmaker to man the slot. Thus that is the style of player I'd like to see them target. If they can return punts, that would be fantastic, because our PR game is pitiful.
    • A.J. Brown, Ole Miss (1st-2nd)
    • Deebo Samuel, South Carolina (2nd)
    • Mecole Hardman, Georgia (3rd-4th)
    • Diontae Johnson, Toledo (4th-5th)
    Offensive Tackle: Unless internally there is a ton of optimism that Spriggs has or will turn a corner, Green Bay needs to find a RT of the future sooner rather than later. I would be disappointed if that didn't happen this year, as the tackle class is good and fairly deep. I am hoping they land a player in the top 3 rounds.
    • Jonah Williams (T/G), Alabama (1st)
    • Andre Dillard (OT), WSU (1st)
    • Dalton Risner (T/G), KSU (1st-2nd)
    • Kaleb McGary (OT), UW (2nd)
    • Max Scharping (T/G), NIU (2nd-3rd)
    • Chuma Edoga (OT), USC (3rd)
    • Trey Pipkins (OT), Sioux Falls (4th)
    Interior Offensive Line: This position is a little hard for me to read, as there are a lot of bodies on the roster along the interior, but we don't know how they fit into the new offense. Perhaps the FO feels great about some of the players in house, and this is low priority. Or perhaps LaFleur and Gute have performed an internal review, and a new guard is high on their list. Hard to say. But here are some guys that I think would fit.
    • Chris Lindstrom (G/T), Boston College (1st-2nd)
    • Elgton Jenkins (C/G), Miss. State (1st-2nd)
    • Connor McGovern (G/C), Penn State (2nd-3rd)
    • Michael Jordan (G/C), Ohio State (3rd-4th)
    • Hjalte Froholdt (C/G), Arkansas (4th-5th)
    • Mitch Hyatt (G/T), Clemson (5th-6th)
    Interior Defensive Line: Lots of pundits have lauded this defensive line class, and I understand that it's good at the top, but there is very little depth along the interior. Perhaps the Packers won't see it that way, but after round one, I don't find a lot of guys that interest me. If the right guy is there early, it's never a bad thing to add to the trenches, but I don't think it's critical that they invest a ton here.
    • Christian Wilkins (3T), Clemson (1st)
    • Jerry Tillery (5T/3T), Notre Dame (1st-2nd)
    • Armon Watts (5T/3T), Arkansas (3rd-4th)
    • Khalen Saunders (3T/1T), W. Illinois (3rd-4th)
    • Renell Wren (5T/3T), Arizona State (3rd-4th)
    • Daniel Wise (3T), Kansas (4th-5th)
    Edge: Much like wide receiver, the Packers have a variety of skill-sets here already, with one notably missing. They have a jumbo edge who can reduce inside (Z. Smith), a reliable edge setter for the strong side (P. Smith), and a multiple player who can blitz/drop (K. Fackrell), but they don't have a burner who can threaten the edge with pure speed. So that's what I'm looking for.
    • Ben Banogu, TCU (3rd)
    • Christian Miller, Alabama (3rd-4th)
    • Oshane Ximines, Old Dominion (3rd-4th)
    • Jordan Brailford, Oklahoma State (4th-5th)
    • Justin Hollins, Oregon (4th-5th)
    • Kaden Elliss, Idaho (6th)
    Off-Ball Linebacker: This is another spot that, like iOL, is hard to figure. It may be that the FO has plans to extend Martinez and likes their odds that Burks or Jones emerge as a good WILL and thus only target depth. Or it may be that they want to let Martinez walk and are unsure of the young guys. So I could envision this position being the 1st pick or a late round situation depending on internal feelings. There is only one guy I love in the 1st round. If they can't get him, I'd like them to add depth with some potential to possibly supplant Martinez (or at least give them some leverage so they don't have to pay him tons of money).
    • Devin Bush, Michigan (1st)
    • Jahlani Tavai, Hawaii (3rd-4th)
    • Germaine Pratt, N.C. State (3rd-4th)
    • Cameron Smith, USC (4th)
    • T.J. Edwards, Wisconsin (4th-5th)
    • Bobby Okereke, Stanford (4th-5th)
    Safety: There is a huge roster hole here next to Amos. I view Jones as a dime linebacker. I guess Raven Greene is the next best option currently on the roster? It's not a great picture. Thus I expect this to be an early priority and would hope for someone with a combo skill-set who would allow Pettine to use his starting safeties interchangeably.
    • Juan Thornhill, Virginia (1st-2nd)
    • Nasir Adderley, Delaware (2nd)
    • Chauncey Gardner-Johnson, Florida (2nd)
    • Darnell Savage, Maryland (2nd)
    • Mike Edwards, Kentucky (3rd)
    • Amani Hooker, Iowa (3rd)
    • Sheldrick Redwine, Miami (4th)
    Cornerback: Given recent investments in this position coupled with a poor draft class, I could envision them entirely skipping it. However, it is the most critical spot in Pettine's defense so a corner being selected anywhere should surprise exactly no one (except maybe at #12). I haven't spent much time on this position group, but here are a handful of man corners who I think are interesting.
    • David Long, Michigan (1st-2nd)
    • Sean Bunting, W. Michigan (1st-2nd)
    • Corey Ballentine, Washburn (3rd-4th)
    • Jimmy Moreland, James Madison (4th-5th)
     
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  21. PackFan2

    PackFan2 Cheesehead

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    Last edited: Apr 22, 2019
  22. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    It kind of ticks me off that people leak this info and then certain players get labeled as dumb. It's meant to be confidential for a reason.
     
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  23. GleefulGary

    GleefulGary Cheesehead

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    I once scored a 72 on the wonderlic.
     
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  24. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    ???

    Ohhhh... I see what you mean.

    No, Janis-- we aren't talking about a "how many licks does it take to get to the center of tootsie pop" contest. Although a 72 is respectable.

    I would explain it, but I don't think it would make sense to you.
     
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  25. Mondio

    Mondio Cheesehead

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    Doesn't surprise me who's printing them either
     
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