Rodgers miffed about loss of Van Pelt

[BrokenArrow]

I guess I'm confused about why talking to your best player is somehow destroying the "team" structure? All I said was that communication is helpful. Yes, better players get things that other players don't. The best player in the NFL deserves to get more leeway than others.

In what way would consulting with Rodgers to get permission to fire a coach who deserved to be fired have been helpful?

 

[Poppa San]

In what way would consulting with Rodgers to get permission to fire a coach who deserved to be fired have been helpful?

What part of decided to not seek a contract extension equates to being fired at the end of said contract?

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

They spent the first four rounds on defense last year. Tired of all these posters saying it was all Capers and the exact same posters want more premium capital spent on defense this year. Start drafting offense and use free agency to fill immediate holes on defense the rest of the way out with Rodgers. It's our only chance.

I think the reason more blame has been put on Capers is because some of our ex players that were TT's picks had big years this last year as opposed to the failures they had in Capers's system, so the thought is that Capers was taking them out of position to succeed, and I believe there is truth to that.

And by the way I want to see offensive weapons like Fumagalli at TE and some young explosive WRs added in there to get back back to the old days of short passes turned into 50 yarders returned here to Green Bay. I just think we still need to look at a few areas on D where we could use a game-changing guy and get him either via draft, or via the open market like we did Woody and Peppers.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

I would also just add, I don't feel the team is trying to cut Rodgers out of the whole who stays who goes with the coaches. To me the way this is sounding, AVP was wanting to move on, and to me it's him who Rodgers should be miffed at. Now, if Rodgers did talk to him before he jetted out of here and he said that MM and Brian G were snubbing him in any way like they may have done with Bennet (I'm still not clear on the full story there), perhaps Rodgers does have some grounds to be upset at MM or management or whoever has been overseeing this overhaul. But AVP was looking to get a bump up in pay on another team like a coaching position in Buffalo where he came from or something, then Rodgers should not be upset at the Pack at all unless it was something where they didn't notify him beforehand to give him a chance to talk AVP into staying.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

The bottom line is that a player does not decide his coach. Do you think Brady is whinning that he is losing Josh McDaniels next year? That is not how the NFL works. I did not see exactly what Aaron said, but I hope it was taken out of context and Aaron isn’t being a princess. He is more than allowed to express an opinion on the fact that his coach is gone, but if he is seriously upset that no one consulted him, that is assanine and he should just focus on getting and staying healthy. Yes, he is the Packers glory boy, but he is not involved (nor should be involved) in football operations. Do your job and move on. Van Pelt had nothing to do with Rodgers success and could not prepare Hundley. He deserved to go.

Not a good analogy considering Brady is much closer to retirement than Rodgers and could announce it if he won the SB again tonight, and the talking heads and fan rumor mill kept on putting JMD's name up in the head coach job offer talks.

Personally, I don't think Rodgers is trying to tell the team's management how they should do their job. I'm thinking somewhere in there this thing just happened real suddenly and he just didn't get any word about it, and considering the QB coach is the guy who spends the most time with Rodgers in drills and routines, you can see why it probably is something he feels he should at least be talked to about.

As to what Van Pelt's work here looked like, I don't think we can totally judge that. I blamed him somewhat when Rodgers had a low point in 2015 and early 2016, but then Rodgers got back into the high level play mode so he got vindicated. And as to Hundley, well certainly Hundley's in-game mechanics looked bad and had me wondering if AVP wasn't failing to address them in practice, but I think you could put Hundley on just about any other team and the results would stay the same. I might be more inclined to judge AVP on QB work had we seen Flynn get significant playing time in 2014 or Callahan get to start games this year.

 

[Poppa San]

I might be more inclined to judge AVP on QB work had we seen Flynn get significant playing time in 2014 or Callahan get to start games this year.

Especially after he did such a great job with Scott Tolzien the past few years.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

Especially after he did such a great job with Scott Tolzien the past few years.

Man you Hundley bumpers are really reaching to try and let him (Hundley) off the hook.

 

[gopkrs]

I don't think brady would retire if he won today. He would go for 3 in a row. Go Eagles!

 

[gopkrs]

I believe Hundley has a pro arm. Why he could not throw at all accurately rolling left to me shows the QB coach did not work with him enough.

 

[PackAttack12]

While I agree with most of what you said, I am getting tired of hearing the argument of "our defense didn't help make Hundley look good". Our defense didn't help make the team as a whole look good, but the Defense has nothing to do with how Hundley performed on offense. The defense being better helps with time of possession, the final score and wins and losses, but none of them are on the field while Hundley is performing. Plain and simple, Hundley was inconsistent, showed a few promising things, but also showed that he is far from being a good QB at this point in his career. Had Hundley been the Vikings or Eagles backup QB from week 7 on, I highly doubt either of them make the playoffs.

I was referring specifically to the team results. A better defense would have resulted in Hundley not having to do as much for the Packers to win games. The poster I was quoting insinuated that the Packers struggles were exclusively due to Hundley's incompetence. My point is this team has a million other issues besides the backup QB.

 

[BrokenArrow]

What part of decided to not seek a contract extension equates to being fired at the end of said contract?

I GET THAT. But I was responding to someone else's specific scenario.

 

[BrokenArrow]

I believe Hundley has a pro arm. Why he could not throw at all accurately rolling left to me shows the QB coach did not work with him enough.

A lot of guys who don't even play football have NFL arms. My brother-in-law can chuck a football 60+ yards in the air without really trying and he's 46 years old. Only a select few have NFL brains. Hundley doesn't appear to be one of them.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I was referring specifically to the team results. A better defense would have resulted in Hundley not having to do as much for the Packers to win games. The poster I was quoting insinuated that the Packers struggles were exclusively due to Hundley's incompetence. My point is this team has a million other issues besides the backup QB.

Maybe, but the Packers were 4-1 before Hundley took over. While the defense was not very good most of the year, Hundley was a big part of the reason why the Packers finished as poorly as they did. Using the "logic" that the defense didn't help Hundley, one can also use that same logic and say, Hundley didn't help the defense. So was the defense bad strictly due to Hundley? Bottom line, Hundley was not good enough and the team lost. I don't even think the Eagles or Vikings defense would have saved the Packer season with Hundley behind center.

 

[RepStar15]

Not a good analogy considering Brady is much closer to retirement than Rodgers and could announce it if he won the SB again tonight, and the talking heads and fan rumor mill kept on putting JMD's name up in the head coach job offer talks.

Personally, I don't think Rodgers is trying to tell the team's management how they should do their job. I'm thinking somewhere in there this thing just happened real suddenly and he just didn't get any word about it, and considering the QB coach is the guy who spends the most time with Rodgers in drills and routines, you can see why it probably is something he feels he should at least be talked to about.

As to what Van Pelt's work here looked like, I don't think we can totally judge that. I blamed him somewhat when Rodgers had a low point in 2015 and early 2016, but then Rodgers got back into the high level play mode so he got vindicated. And as to Hundley, well certainly Hundley's in-game mechanics looked bad and had me wondering if AVP wasn't failing to address them in practice, but I think you could put Hundley on just about any other team and the results would stay the same. I might be more inclined to judge AVP on QB work had we seen Flynn get significant playing time in 2014 or Callahan get to start games this year.

It’s more likely that Nick Foles retires if he wins this game than Tom Brady. I do not know what fake media you have been listening to, but he has absolutely zero intention on retiring. And yes Josh McDaniels got a head coaching offer in Indy and will be there next year. The QB coach is not decided by the QB it’s decided by the organization. Rodgers may be uneasy with someone new coming in, but that’s because by nature people do not like change. But as we know change is good and allows us to evolve. I’m sure this time next year we will not hear a word about AVP out of Rodgers mouth. It will be old news. Moving on.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

It’s more likely that Nick Foles retires if he wins this game than Tom Brady. I do not know what fake media you have been listening to, but he has absolutely zero intention on retiring. And yes Josh McDaniels got a head coaching offer in Indy and will be there next year. The QB coach is not decided by the QB it’s decided by the organization. Rodgers may be uneasy with someone new coming in, but that’s because by nature people do not like change. But as we know change is good and allows us to evolve. I’m sure this time next year we will not hear a word about AVP out of Rodgers mouth. It will be old news. Moving on.

1. I don't listen to any media.

2. Unless you've personally spoken to Brady, you don't know what his intentions are or know if he would change his mind in an instant.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

Oh, also I just heard Gronkowski was considering retirement, and if he does indeed do it, I'm willing to bet Brady changes his mind about playing till he's 43 or whatever because he needs his TE in order to succeed.

 

[PackAttack12]

Maybe, but the Packers were 4-1 before Hundley took over. While the defense was not very good most of the year, Hundley was a big part of the reason why the Packers finished as poorly as they did. Using the "logic" that the defense didn't help Hundley, one can also use that same logic and say, Hundley didn't help the defense. So was the defense bad strictly due to Hundley? Bottom line, Hundley was not good enough and the team lost. I don't even think the Eagles or Vikings defense would have saved the Packer season with Hundley behind center.

See I totally disagree with that thought.

Aaron Rodgers is the only guy on planet Earth that could routinely get a team with a defense as porous as ours to the postseason year in and year out. Of course Hundley was bad, but that doesn't take away from the fact that this team lacks true difference makers. Devante stood out. The running game stepped up a bit, but outside of that, modest o-line play, awful defensive play, and it really highlighted the lack of a difference that Jordy and Cobb were able to make as well.

A better quarterback gives the Packers a chance. But let's not gloss over the fact that the team needs upgrades across the board. That's my only point. I'm not disagreeing with your point on Hundley. But HE is not the reason this team fell short this year. He's a part of the reason, but just the same way that he couldn't get it done behind center, there's a lot of other guys on the 53 that couldn't get it done either.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

See I totally disagree with that thought.

Aaron Rodgers is the only guy on planet Earth that could routinely get a team with a defense as porous as ours to the postseason year in and year out. Of course Hundley was bad, but that doesn't take away from the fact that this team lacks true difference makers. Devante stood out. The running game stepped up a bit, but outside of that, modest o-line play, awful defensive play, and it really highlighted the lack of a difference that Jordy and Cobb were able to make as well.

A better quarterback gives the Packers a chance. But let's not gloss over the fact that the team needs upgrades across the board. That's my only point. I'm not disagreeing with your point on Hundley. But HE is not the reason this team fell short this year. He's a part of the reason, but just the same way that he couldn't get it done behind center, there's a lot of other guys on the 53 that couldn't get it done either.

I don't think we are that far off in our thinking

Some people have suggested that Hundley's poor performances were due in large part to the Packers having a below average defense and it seemed like you were trying to say the same thing. Could the Packers have won a few more games with a better defense in 2017? Probably. But a better defense doesn't all of a sudden turn Hundly into a Pro Bowl QB. Just the same as Aaron Rodgers doesn't instantly turn our defense into a top 10 defense.

Do the Packers need to get better on Defense as well as offense? Of course, but even if they accomplish that and AR goes down again, they need much better QB play than what Hundley gave them to even sniff the playoffs.

 

[PackAttack12]

I don't think we are that far off in our thinking

Some people have suggested that Hundley's poor performances were due in large part to the Packers having a below average defense and it seemed like you were trying to say the same thing. Could the Packers have won a few more games with a better defense in 2017? Probably. But a better defense doesn't all of a sudden turn Hundly into a Pro Bowl QB. Just the same as Aaron Rodgers doesn't instantly turn our defense into a top 10 defense.

Do the Packers need to get better on Defense as well as offense? Of course, but even if they accomplish that and AR goes down again, they need much better QB play than what Hundley gave them to even sniff the playoffs.

We aren't far off for sure. I'm not absolving Hundley, but having more support around him would have made his job a lot easier. Wentz went down, and what happens? They win the SB. Really good defense that can pressure, really good skill guys, really solid running game, one of the best TE threats in the game, etc. Yes, Foles is miles better than Hundley, but Hundley would have had .500+ record with that cast of players to support him. If Wentz goes down in week 5 like Rodgers did, Hundley gets that team to the playoffs.

So while Hundley is awful, and like you I believe the team would be better served spending a little money for a veteran backup, this supporting cast is awful. You and I, along with a group of others, already knew it, but it became apparent to everyone after AR went down.

 

[RicFlairoftheNFL]

Let the diva queen era begin!

 

[Mike McCarthy]

Let the diva queen era begin!

Woooooooooooooooo!

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

We aren't far off for sure. I'm not absolving Hundley, but having more support around him would have made his job a lot easier. Wentz went down, and what happens? They win the SB. Really good defense that can pressure, really good skill guys, really solid running game, one of the best TE threats in the game, etc. Yes, Foles is miles better than Hundley, but Hundley would have had .500+ record with that cast of players to support him. If Wentz goes down in week 5 like Rodgers did, Hundley gets that team to the playoffs.

So while Hundley is awful, and like you I believe the team would be better served spending a little money for a veteran backup, this supporting cast is awful. You and I, along with a group of others, already knew it, but it became apparent to everyone after AR went down.

I truly believe you could put both Gronk and Ertz on Hundley's team and he'd still be the NFL's biggest dud. And it doesn't matter how creative your offense is when your QB can barely execute a handoff.

 

[I asked LT to delete my acct]

Man you Hundley bumpers are really reaching to try and let him (Hundley) off the hook.

to quote a famous member here "SMH !"

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Foles isnt a a real backup...he is very capable starter amd has proven himself

Foles also has a very talented offensive coach that puts in plays to put his players in great position to succeed. Pederson basically forced Collinsworth to say "RPO" so many times during the Super Bowl that i wanted to punch my TV. I can't recall the last time someone looked at the Packers offense and mentioned something innovative.

 

[GleefulGary]

Let's not forget that Foles has had a year where he had a TD ratio of 27:2 and went to a Pro Bowl. He is not a typical backup QB.