1. Welcome to Green Bay Packers NFL Football Forum & Community!
    Packer Forum is one of the largest online communities for the Green Bay Packers.

    You are currently viewing our community forums as a guest user.

    Sign Up or

    Having an account grants you additional privileges, such as creating and participating in discussions. Furthermore, we hide most of the ads once you register as a member!
  2. Big Announcement Coming for 2015 Football Season!!

    Be on the look out for a big Packer Forum announcement when the schedule is released. Full details coming soon...

Are the Pack really going to be that bad??

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by JbShell, Apr 22, 2006.

  1. JbShell

    JbShell Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2005
    Messages:
    796
    Ratings:
    +0
    Doom and Gloom

    The Sky is Falling.

    Was last years Pack really that bad? Personally I dont think they were. Not as bad as many people think and 3 reasons I think they will be markedly improved.

    1. Loss of the Old O-Line. While lossing Wahle and Rivera did not Help the cause I think poor play calling and an inept running game lead by a hurt A. Green did nothing but make D coordinators slavatate at the thought of picking and keying on GB lone O star Brett Favre. This year will be different no matter who is under center. MM philosiphy is to not place the QB on an Island. Ball control offense with 5 to six yard plays. a back to the WC approach.

    2. D. Improved while not the best in the league they did get better from the previous year. They were still not able to keep the scores low enough to allow the Offense to go to work. D has gotten alot of work this offseason and looks to get better through the draft. While some bemoaned Bretts and TT's inaction in getting Lavar Arrington. Woodson is still out there and never know stranger things have happened. I look for the D to be quickers and more productive this year.

    3. Special Teams. This has been the area that has lacked any real spark for the last 4 years. Returns were agreegious and coverage was well like wtching the French defend Paris. a whole lot of just running around. While Field goals may be a premium this year Cundiff cannot really do worse than longwell last year. The new Punter also looks like a good pickup so we will see.

    Now I am not usaully one on predictions but I think the Pack will finish a solid 10-6. If Javon gets his head out of his *** and becomes a man and Brett comes back with good weapons we could see a great year.
     
  2. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2005
    Messages:
    3,904
    Ratings:
    +1
    If Brett doesn't come back...yea!
     
  3. Vikeman

    Vikeman Guest

    Ratings:
    +0
  4. JeezusJuice

    JeezusJuice Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2006
    Messages:
    257
    Ratings:
    +0
    Who cares? I'm still a Reds fan. The Arizona Cardinals still have fans; so do the Saints and the Vikings. I'm still going to watch. You aren't going to if they suck?

    Yeah.
     
  5. The_Gray_Ghost_of_Gonzaga

    The_Gray_Ghost_of_Gonzaga Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2006
    Messages:
    80
    Ratings:
    +0
    We'll be better than a whole load of teams if Brett comes back :wink:
     
  6. 4packgirl

    4packgirl Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2005
    Messages:
    2,415
    Ratings:
    +0
    all i can say is it will be an interesting season. will brett play again? will the off-season moves TT made/makes pan out? how will MM's coaching style work?...lots to think about & hopefully look forward to. :D
     
  7. Chamuko

    Chamuko Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    Messages:
    1,067
    Ratings:
    +0
    This is easy and simple math... we need to add at leat 5 guys to our defense and 5 to our ofense, I will say at leat 3 new starters on defense, two LB one CB and one DE and 3-4 new starters on ofense, one WR two guards and one RB,we only have 7 picks and we have a cheap, tighwad, stubborn and arrogant gm who only likes to build via draft.... And dont forget we need a decent punter plus a decent kicker.

    So if he is a geniuos far beyond Bohr and Einstein together we might get 2 starters from the draft, if he is also reall lucky we might get 3, I will say the real issue is we will get one instant starter and maybe one guy that we will rush as starter...

    Why in hell didnt he signed a couple of decent FA´s at least, that way we will be only looking for 5 or 6 hits in the draft, plus a kicker and a punter, instead of looking for 10 hits in the draft with only 7 picks... instead he let the kicker go..

    10 players needd, plus a punter and a kicker, only 7 picks.... mmm I just cant get 12 quality guys from 7 picks, this worries me more as I see Teddy trading down to get more picks even when we get lesser quality players.

    o yeas we will have a very bad season..
     
  8. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2005
    Messages:
    1,000
    Ratings:
    +3
    If the pieces fall into place, they will be fine. I will be there (if i'm still alive) watching them, cheering them on. There are so many "ifs" right now, i can't say how i think they will do. But of course i'm hoping for them to retake the division title!
     
  9. HatestheEagles084

    HatestheEagles084 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,423
    Ratings:
    +1
    I'd like to see us add Ahmad Plummer or Charles Woodson...we need an impact player, we lost so many games by less than ten points and i dont think anyone on either side of the ball can really make an impact.

    -Javon Walker is coming back but he probably won't be in our colors
    -Ahman Green and Najeh Davenport coming back should help, but how long can they stay healthy
    -The offensive line is still porous, but there was really no one out there on the market to get...Junius Coston start? will he perform?
    -We're heading into the draft and still have a few holes on both sides of the ball
    -Ryan Pickett = Grady Jackson more or less
    -Linebacking core is still "Barnett plus also-rans"...I like Ben Taylor over Robert Thomas, but that isn't exactly saying a lot--and it isn't even a given we're drafting AJ Hawk anymore
    -Marquand Manuel has zero interceptions or something like that...I still see this team getting killed in the turnover ratio simply because no one can pcik off passes
    -Our punter has never kicked in America
    -We have two kickers on our roster, neither one is any good
    -Our dependable return man (who still wasnt that good, but could handle the ball) was inexplicably cut to make way for these "taller recievers" none of whom have signed with us other than boeritger
    -^We have no return man right now

    I'm not writing this team off yet, not at all...but I'm saying it doesnt look good...We play a last place schedule, some pleasant surprises could lead us to 9-7...but as I see it now I see a lot of frustrating 17-13 losses a la last season because we lack guys who can help us win games in the fourth quarter. Either side of the ball.
     
  10. PackinSteel

    PackinSteel Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,086
    Ratings:
    +0
    Good points JavonWalker. This team is IMO a ways off from being able to compete at a level that will prevent a season similar to the last one. I think someone in Miss. thinks similarly - at least for now.
     
  11. HatestheEagles084

    HatestheEagles084 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,423
    Ratings:
    +1
    no i dont even think we're a ways off...we need one or two more guys to bring it all together (other than a draft pick)...Vernon Davis or AJ Hawk is a start...but I still wish we could get Plummer or Woodson--missing out on Arrington hurt

    Maybe we can wrangle away Ashley Lelie and/or some picks from Denver for Javon, maybe (hopefully) we take advantage or our cap space by signing some big name june 1st cuts.

    Right now we're good enough to "stay in" a lot of close games, but not much else--i think we're a 7-9 team right now
     
  12. SuperRat

    SuperRat Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2005
    Messages:
    617
    Ratings:
    +0
    I agree with most of those points but Ryan Pickett is a upgrade over Grady Jackson because he is an every down player, isn't overweight, and is fairly young. Also Marquand Manuel has one interception return for a touchdown in the playoffs, and every Seahawks fan I talked to didn't want him to leave so I trust the fan's opinions of him. And that track star reciever, I don't remember his name, will hopefully be a solid kick returner, but yeah he isn't proven yet and kick returners can always be found in late rounds of the draft or after.
     
  13. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2005
    Messages:
    3,904
    Ratings:
    +1
    Manuel's one int for a TD in the playoffs may have been the only int he has had in his 5 year career. He is not an upgrade. Hopefully he won't be a starter. I do like Pickett though.
     
  14. SuperRat

    SuperRat Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2005
    Messages:
    617
    Ratings:
    +0
    I see him as an upgrade over Roman. He seemed to click really well last year and I think he can come in and make some kind of impact. I don't think he is a game changer or anything of that nature, but I could see him as a decent starter. I wasn't impressed with Roman at all.
     
  15. HatestheEagles084

    HatestheEagles084 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,423
    Ratings:
    +1
    The one thing i heard about manuel that i like is that he is a solid tackler...and thats the same thing that can be said about ben taylor...I just don't picture this defense being athletic enough to hold its own against good offenses...
     
  16. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 30, 2005
    Messages:
    2,391
    Ratings:
    +0
    I think you guys are underestimating this Def.

    Our D-Line could be better but Kamp is an all out effort guy and KGB can get pressure on the QB. With Pickett being a big run stuffer in the middle the unit is pretty good. I would like to see someone else who really gets after the QB however.

    The LB's assuming we get Hawk look very very good. I live in Ohio and am familiar with Taylor. The guy is all out Effort and tough as nails. With Hawk,Barnett,Taylor you have a great group that can compsensate for KGB's lack of run stopping. I absolutely love this group because we added toughness to go along with Barnett's speed. Now, just draft Hawk.

    The Secondary with Collins getting a year under his belt could be a force. Assuming Carroll continues to improve and Al Harris has is normal year. Manual IS slightly an upgrade over Roman, though Mark played alot better last year. One of these guys playiing solid ball is the key.

    Overall, it's an abover average unit IMO. It is starting to get a nice mix of Toughness,Speed, and overall skill. I think most are selling this unit short.
     
  17. HatestheEagles084

    HatestheEagles084 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,423
    Ratings:
    +1
    I see where you're going...I respect this defense's ability--it will be better than last season...but we're not talking a Ravens '00 Defense here that can just win the games themselves...this defense will shut teams down, but not shut them out--we'll give up points thru turnovers, special teams, and face it this defense isn't the liability it once was--but it's human. Still no pass rush to force QB's into making mistakes
     
  18. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 30, 2005
    Messages:
    2,391
    Ratings:
    +0
    Yeah, but it's came along ways. I think the lack of pass rushing is a problem. Hopefully one of the young guys on the roster can step up and get to the QB. Gocong could be a nice addition as he seems to constantly be in the other teams backfield though he would probably be somewhat of a liability to the run game.
     
  19. HatestheEagles084

    HatestheEagles084 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,423
    Ratings:
    +1
    We already have one guy who can 'just rush the passer' and cant play the run...and right now kgb isnt even hitting the QB. Pickett is an upgrade over Grady Jackson in a sense that Pickett can play passing downs...Kampman fights for every inch and can chip in 5-7 sacks, I hope they find a rotation that works, and also some blitz packages, Poppinga woulda been solid off the edge had he not gotten hurt, either way, find something--our secondary overachieved to the max last season--if we find a pass rush we could really have something on D
     
  20. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 30, 2005
    Messages:
    2,391
    Ratings:
    +0
    Great assessment Javon. That was my point with Gocong. I think he could definitely get to the QB but that does not help the run game, though if the LB's can make the plays that they have not the last few years, it could work.
     
  21. HatestheEagles084

    HatestheEagles084 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,423
    Ratings:
    +1
    To be honest, I'd rather draft a guy like Gocong--we could probably get a 3rd round pick for KGB, just trade him--I don't like having that much money tied up in a situational player/running game liability. Gocong could just come in on passing downs and i'd be alright with Mike Montgomery (or Cullen Jenkins) starting as strongside DE
     
  22. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2005
    Messages:
    1,000
    Ratings:
    +3
    thats ture, KGB is very very much overpaid. Im sure tightwad ted loves that fact.
     
  23. HatestheEagles084

    HatestheEagles084 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,423
    Ratings:
    +1
    you have a point...i say trading kgb would create some cap space...but we dont use all of the cap space we have already...so why bother...
     
  24. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 30, 2005
    Messages:
    2,391
    Ratings:
    +0
    I don't know about Trading KGB just yet. First you would have to get Gocong and see if he can actually do it at this level. Trading KGB before this year would be suicide. He is the ONLY guy that can get pressure on thje QB on a semi-regular basis.
     
  25. PWT36

    PWT36 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2005
    Messages:
    895
    Ratings:
    +0
    Chumuko _ Your assessment of the Green Bay Packers for 2006 is far too critical. Chumuko in the last week in April you can't accurately forecast
    "o yeas we will have a very bad season"

    Just like this early in the year I cannot accurately forecast if Packers will have a winning team this early in the year.

    At this time, we don't know who will be drafted, and if any of '06 draftees will contribute greatly to the Packers improvement in '06.


    We don't know if the Packers will make any type of deals during the draft. We don't know if the Packer will pick up any FAs after June 1st or make any trades during the trading period.

    We don't know, as of now, if Brett Favre is coming back or retire, in that is the case Aaron Rodgers will be QB. Favre is the Packer best chance to win this year.

    We don't know if any of the Rookies on the '05 squad, most had one year of valuable NFL game experience, could improve enough this year and become effective starters at their positions in '06.

    We have no idea if Packer players on IR in '05 will return to the pre injury form like Green, Davenport, , Popinga ,Gado, & Walker if Walker returns (doesn't hold out or get traded)

    There are some Packers in '05 that were hampered by injuries who played in '05, but not way they played before their injuries. Will they return to play to their preinjury form in '06?

    We don't have any idea if one of the kickers competing for kicker position for the Packers will be a good NFL kicker. In the case of our last great Field Goal kicker Ryan Longwell. Ryan came to Green Bay as Free Agent came to GB after being cut from 49ers training camp. And out kicked the Veteran GB kicker, I believe, Conway.


    We don't do not know if BJ Sander, who was on IR for part year of '05 , will be the GB punter again in '06 or if is one of the the other punters being brought into Training Camp will be the Packer punter '06.

    There are so many "ifs" to make any kind of forecast on this '06 Packer team this eary in the year, especially in this era of Salary Cap and Free Agency, When a team can go 4-12 one year and 12-4 the next year or 6-10 one year and the next year 15-1 Etc. in the NFL.

    We do know the Packers have about $`16M under the '06 salary cap unlike last year when the Packers had "very little wiggly room" under the '05 salary cap to make any kind of a deal. Packer GM Ted Thompson will use most of salary cap money this year but you can be sure he will try to use it wisely on the right players.

    I know it is hard for some of these poster to be patient until they are able to accurately see results of the Packer plans are for '06 , but patience s,which seems to be in short supply with some posters, are what they need to have this year.

    But if you have that kind of opinion of this Packer team , The USA has freedom of speech . "Be my guest". I reserve my right to come up with a forecast much later in the year, perhaps after training camp in August. But we still might not have accurate a "read" on this team until it get some actual NFL games played that count.

    As old saying goes "that's why they play the games"
     

Share This Page