The 2019 Dantés Draft Thread

[Dantés]

4-3 vs 3-4 is almost always overblown, but in this case I do think we're talking about a 4-3 only player. As a strong side DE in a 43 who never stands up or drops, there's a place in the league for Ferguson. In our defense, no way.

 

[GleefulGary]

Hakeem Butler could/should be considered at 30 if he's there. He's a stud. Probably my favorite WR this draft.

 

[Dantés]

One of the biggest issues on the roster (again) that doesn't get discussed much is punt returner.

Kick returning has become a marginalized skill set with the KO moved up and touchbacks being so prevalent. However, punt returning is still a huge benefit to any team.

The Packers were one of the worst PR teams in the league in 2018-- and it wasn't all on Ron Zook. The best guy on the roster for the job was Tramon Williams. Trevor Davis, when healthy, is a decent option. But he's brittle and little help on offense. If they paint themselves into a corner and end up having to use a roster spot on him... that's a bummer.

So who are the proven punt returners in this class? I haven't found a better way to track that information down than to look through the college stat sheets of the likely suspects. This is what I've come up with:

• Mecole Hardman, WR, UGA: 16/321/1 (20.06/return) in 2018
• Diontae Johnson, WR, TOL: 13/241/1 (18.54) in 2018
• Penny Hart, WR, GSU: 9/158/1 (17.6) in 2018
• Ugo Amadi, S, OR: 14/223/1 (15.93) in 2018
• Greg Dortch, WR, WF: 25/276/2 (11.04) in 2018
• Ryan Davis, WR, AUB: 22/217 (9.86) in 2018
• Dillon Mitchell, WR, OR: 11/89 (8.09) in 2017
• Andy Isabella, WR, UMASS: 7/55 (7.86) in 2018

Interestingly, I could only find one non-WR punt returner as I sifted through the roster. I would definitely like to see the Packers invest here at some point in the draft.

 

[HardRightEdge]

One of the biggest issues on the roster (again) that doesn't get discussed much is punt returner.

Kick returning has become a marginalized skill set with the KO moved up and touchbacks being so prevalent. However, punt returning is still a huge benefit to any team.

The Packers were one of the worst PR teams in the league in 2018-- and it wasn't all on Ron Zook. The best guy on the roster for the job was Tramon Williams. Trevor Davis, when healthy, is a decent option. But he's brittle and little help on offense. If they paint themselves into a corner and end up having to use a roster spot on him... that's a bummer.

So who are the proven punt returners in this class? I haven't found a better way to track that information down than to look through the college stat sheets of the likely suspects. This is what I've come up with:

• Mecole Hardman, WR, UGA: 16/321/1 (20.06/return) in 2018
• Diontae Johnson, WR, TOL: 13/241/1 (18.54) in 2018
• Penny Hart, WR, GSU: 9/158/1 (17.6) in 2018
• Ugo Amadi, S, OR: 14/223/1 (15.93) in 2018
• Greg Dortch, WR, WF: 25/276/2 (11.04) in 2018
• Ryan Davis, WR, AUB: 22/217 (9.86) in 2018
• Dillon Mitchell, WR, OR: 11/89 (8.09) in 2017
• Andy Isabella, WR, UMASS: 7/55 (7.86) in 2018

Interestingly, I could only find one non-WR punt returner as I sifted through the roster. I would definitely like to see the Packers invest here at some point in the draft.

Penny Hart is an interesting prospect. Strangely no Combine invite, but he was at the Senior Bowl. Check out the clips in the link below from the Senior Bowl practices particularly the second one against Adderly:

https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/penny-hart-completes-week-of-dark-horse-dominance

Small at an 5'8", 180 lbs. but the guy is a sudden ankle breaker with cagy moves in the small slot mold.

Georgia State's Pro Day was March 15 but I can't find the results anywhere other than a video where some clown covering it said he did 18 lifts. 8 7/8" hands from the Senior Bowl measurments which is very good for a guy that size. 11 teams were at that Pro Day...dunno if the Packers bothered.

I'd bet his agility drill numbers are pretty darn good. Looks like he'd post a 40 time in the vicinity of 4.5, maybe lower hand timed at the Pro Day.

I think the Packers are going big slot with the guys on hand, but you never know.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

One of the biggest issues on the roster (again) that doesn't get discussed much is punt returner.

Kick returning has become a marginalized skill set with the KO moved up and touchbacks being so prevalent. However, punt returning is still a huge benefit to any team.

I was thinking this same thought the other day and knowing that it might be tough for a rookie to make an immediate impact as a WR or DB, one could be drafted for their punt return skills and slowly be worked into his position.

You left off Paris Campbell Now Paris only returned kick offs his Sophmore and Junior year, but he was pretty damn good doing it. 27.8 ave in 2016 and 36.6 in 2017. Could he return punts? I think he will be a decent WR.

I like Penny Hart, but would question his college level of competition.

I really like Greg Dortch, his stats and his pro day numbers are impressive. I think because of his size (5' 7") he will be available 6th round on. Only thing I would question is that it looks like his stats are a bit padded by some of the weaker opponents that Wake Forest faced.

Another guy I would consider is Amani Hooker. S out of Iowa. I would draft him strictly as a safety mid rounds, but might give him a try at Punt returner as well, he did return one punt last year.

 

[Dantés]

I was thinking this same thought the other day and knowing that it might be tough for a rookie to make an immediate impact as a WR or DB, one could be drafted for their punt return skills and slowly be worked into his position.

You left off Paris Campbell Now Paris only returned kick offs his Sophmore and Junior year, but he was pretty damn good doing it. 27.8 ave in 2016 and 36.6 in 2017. Could he return punts? I think he will be a decent WR.

I like Penny Hart, but would question his college level of competition.

I really like Greg Dortch, his stats and his pro day numbers are impressive. I think because of his size (5' 7") he will be available 6th round on. Only thing I would question is that it looks like his stats are a bit padded by some of the weaker opponents that Wake Forest faced.

Another guy I would consider is Amani Hooker. S out of Iowa. I would draft him strictly as a safety mid rounds, but might give him a try at Punt returner as well, he did return one punt last year.

Yeah, I left out everyone who doesn't have legit PR production in college. Some of these other guys (Campbell, Deebo, etc) might be able to do it, but I'd only be guessing.

I would be fine if they took someone without those skills early and then came back around late to scoop up a Penny Hart or Greg Dortch.

Mecole Hardman is probably my favorite option. Skillset wise, he's a smaller Parris Campbell. He's similarly raw and similarly explosive. He could find a niche role on offense and be a big upgrade at PR right away.

 

[Pkrjones]

When Cobb was doing PR's and working his way into lineup early on I didn't want GB to wear him out or get him banged-up & lose his WR production. With Hart or Dortch they wouldn't have a huge role in the offense but would possibly take 15-20 snaps/game to mix things up a little AND handle return duties.

I could very easily see GB running a lot more 2-TE sets than in the McCarthy-era... a better-blocker & a better-receiver. Would take away the need for an every-down slot WR which would (hopefully) help the run game but still give inside-receiving threat w/ a faster TE over the middle or up the seam.

 

[morango]

Somebody please tell us more about Dortch. He seems like the kind of guy the patriots would grab in the 6th round and turn into a solid contributor.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Somebody please tell us more about Dortch. He seems like the kind of guy the patriots would grab in the 6th round and turn into a solid contributor.

I read a bunch about him a few weeks ago and then again yesterday. He might be one of those guys that most think is "under the radar" and then gets grabbed earlier than expected because of his potential. He actually reminds me a bit of a smaller Randall Cobb and like Cobb, he will enter the NFL at the age of 20.

I think he could be a decent pick and give us the return guy we want, as he slowly works his way into the offense. Durability might be the biggest concern and despite some of the measurements out there you see, he came in at only 5' 7" at his pro day.

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[Dantés]

Somebody please tell us more about Dortch. He seems like the kind of guy the patriots would grab in the 6th round and turn into a solid contributor.

He's a slot only type of receiver who is tough over the middle despite being undersized (5'7" ~175 lbs). He will need to win with separation at the next level, because he isn't going to overpower anyone. He was on fire in 2017, but got hurt 8 games in (his full season pace was 86/1173/15 in 13 games). He came back in 2018 89/1078/8. Across both seasons, he logged 45 punt returns for 438 yards and 2 touchdowns (9.7/return) and 36 kick returns for 773 yards (21.5/return). His pro day workout was reportedly good, despite coming off of injury, but I haven't seen any numbers other than the forty (which has ranged from 4.45-4.49 depending on the outlet).

I think he could be a good target because of the return skills, but when you consider that he's under 180 lbs and has struggled with durability, I kind of doubt that someone will overdraft him.

If they were to draft a receiver earlier on who lacked return ability, I wouldn't mind seeing them double dip and come back for a guy like this. They have to get the PR thing figured out. They ignored it in 2018 and, shocker, that didn't work out.

 

[Dantés]

Parris Campbell is an elite athlete, but it's notable that he only had 2 receptions his entire career at OSU that travelled 20 yards in the air. 2... I knew he was a gadget guy but even still that's a shocking number. His average depth of target was 4.5 yards. That's crazy low. I think the Packers have a role for his skill set, but I'm not spending a 1st round pick on that.

 

[morango]

Thanks brat and Dantes for that info on Dortch. He is even smaller than I thought. He would have to be unbelievably talented to carve out a successful nfl career at that size.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I could very easily see GB running a lot more 2-TE sets than in the McCarthy-era... a better-blocker & a better-receiver. Would take away the need for an every-down slot WR which would (hopefully) help the run game but still give inside-receiving threat w/ a faster TE over the middle or up the seam.

The Packers might use two tight end sets more often this season but that doesn't negate the need for a slot receiver.

 

[PackFan2]

The more I watch Mack Wilson, I start to like him less and less.. Hot and cold player. One play he would just blow up the play and the next he would totally wiff on a tackle. Additionally he has one of the worst grades against the run. When hes hot , hes great. Factoring in the talent around him... late 2nd or 3rd ..

The more I watch Taylor Rapp, the more I like the kid. Fundamentally sound tackler (i believe he only had two miss tackles- one he missed on a blitz and then got the sack). Not the fastest, but fast enough to play deep safety (55% of snaps). Fastest cone drill for safeties at the combine. Intelligent kid, no red flags off field. Wont be suprised if packers pick him up 30.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The more I watch Mack Wilson, I start to like him less and less.. Hot and cold player. One play he would just blow up the play and the next he would totally wiff on a tackle. Additionally he has one of the worst grades against the run. When hes hot , hes great. Factoring in the talent around him... late 2nd or 3rd ..

The more I watch Taylor Rapp, the more I like the kid. Fundamentally sound tackler (i believe he only had two miss tackles- one he missed on a blitz and then got the sack). Not the fastest, but fast enough to play deep safety (55% of snaps). Fastest cone drill for safeties at the combine. Intelligent kid, no red flags off field. Wont be suprised if packers pick him up 30.

Players like Wilson, who play while surrounded by really talented players, always make me a bit nervous in trying to figure them out. Were they good because of the guys around them or were the guys around them good because of them?

On the flip side, guys who put up big numbers playing against lower level talent, scare me for the opposite reason.

Glad I am not a scout.

 

[GleefulGary]

Players like Wilson, who play while surrounded by really talented players, always make me a bit nervous in trying to figure them out. Were they good because of the guys around them or were the guys around them good because of them?

On the flip side, guys who put up big numbers playing against lower level talent, scare me for the opposite reason.

Glad I am not a scout.

I think it's why Alabama players often get overdrafted.

They have such a dominant iDL that the other positions have it much easier. Don't have to guard as long, can gamble more, don't have to take on blockers...etc etc.

Playing behind Q Williams hides a lot of weaknesses, that's for sure.

 

[PackFan2]

Penny Hart, WR, GSU: 9/158/1 (17.6) in 2018

I think packers had a personal interview with him at the senior bowl. I mocked Penny as day three pick for packers on Amish's thread. Good to know Hart has some return game.

 

[PackFan2]

Glad I am not a scout.

Id like to think im a pretty good armchair scout lol. Especially at ILB, RB and Safety positions having played those positions in high school. Im horrible at evaluating OL, WRs and EDGE talent lol

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Id like to think im a pretty good armchair scout lol. Especially at ILB, RB and Safety positions having played those positions in high school. Im horrible at evaluating OL, WRs and EDGE talent lol

I will be sure to keep an eye on your suggestions at these positions when it comes to my entering of the 53rd Annual Amish Draft Contest. I don't want to miss out on that first prize this year, which is an all expense paid trip to Australia for 2 weeks with Erin Andrews.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

5 GM's in Arizona today for ASU's Pro Day. Included in that group is Gute.

• Vikings GM Rick Spielman
• 49ers GM John Lynch
• Broncos GM John Elway
• Lions GM Bob Quinn

He is either looking at WR N’Keal Harry, DT Renell Wren or both. Or the maybe just playing golf.

 

[OldSchool101]

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/20...her-montez-sweat-on-official-pre-draft-visit/
Wouldnt it be interesting if the Pack snatches him

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think Ed Oliver just solidified Top 10, damn it.

Ran a 4.75 40 and one Scout had him at 4.71. A guy that size, running that fast, WOW!

https://www.cbssports.com/fantasy/football/news/ed-oliver-turning-heads-at-houstons-pro-day/

 

[GleefulGary]

Maybe because Oliver is a big baby and isn't close to his listed 290 pounds. He lacks strength and is undersized.

Geez, I wonder what this cry baby would do at Lambeau in the freezing cold.

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Since you think bench reps signifies how strong somebody is, Ed Oliver putting up 32 reps should change your thinking.

Lacks strength. Lol.

 

[GleefulGary]

Ed Oliver.

Ran a 4.7 at 280.
4.22 SS at 280.
7.15 3-cone at 280.

32 reps at 287.
36" vert at 287.
120" broad at 287.

I do not care what he weighs, bring him to GB. Play him at 3T. Play him on the edge. Play him wherever the hell you want to. Just play him.

 

[brandon2348]

Since you think bench reps signifies how strong somebody is, Ed Oliver putting up 32 reps should change your thinking.

Lacks strength. Lol.

Sorry, I don't communicate through this thread.

I can only take so much INSANITY!