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Tale of two QBs

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by ivo610, Dec 2, 2010.

  1. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    Green Bay — Former Packer general manager Ron Wolf used to have a simple motto.

    "There's one thing about this league that's pretty simple," Wolf said. "If you don't have a quarterback, you don't have much of a chance."

    Back in April 2005, San Francisco 49ers general manager Scott McCloughan and head coach Mike Nolan understood this full well.

    The 49ers had the No. 1-overall pick in the NFL draft, and for weeks were torn between quarterbacks Alex Smith of Utah and Aaron Rodgers of California, as well as Michigan wide receiver Braylon Edwards.

    In the end, the 49ers thought Rodgers was too cocky and settled for too many checkdowns in a programmed offense at Cal. They felt Edwards was too scary in the attitude department.

    So San Francisco chose Smith.

    Twenty-three picks later, with Rodgers stunningly still on the board, Packer general manager Ted Thompson made the overlooked quarterback his first-ever pick. In just those few short hours, the future of both franchises was shaped - even though no one knew it at the time.

    Smith has been given every opportunity to win the starting job in San Francisco but has failed miserably. The 49ers are still looking for a starting quarterback, Smith comes off the bench now, and he's likely to be in a different uniform or out of the league in 2011.

    Rodgers, meanwhile, stands a good chance to reach his second Pro Bowl this season. He's playing at an elite level, and despite not having a running game, has the Packers in playoff contention.

    With the Packers set to host the 49ers on Sunday, it seemed a good time to ponder where these organizations would be if the two quarterbacks had been switched five years ago.

    "It's tough to say because Smith had to play right away," one NFC scout said Monday. "And I certainly don't think that Rodgers was ready to help (the 49ers) back in '05.

    "But if both players would have progressed like they have, it's very fair to say San Francisco would be an elite team with Rodgers, and the Packers would be struggling with Alex (Smith). Aside from the quarterback position, there's not substantially more talent right now in Green Bay than in San Francisco."

    Smith was thrown into the fire from Day 1 and in 2005 was asked to lead a dreadful offense that was coordinated by current Packer head coach Mike McCarthy.

    In his rookie season, Smith threw one touchdown pass, 11 interceptions and had a miserable passer rating of 40.8.

    Smith improved gradually over the next two years, suffered a broken bone in his right (passing) shoulder in 2008 and then had somewhat of a breakout season in 2009 with 18 touchdowns and 12 picks.

    The 49ers committed to Smith this season and were the pick to win the NFC West for the first time since 2002, which was the last time San Francisco reached the postseason.

    But Smith struggled immensely and feuded with head coach Mike Singletary as the 49ers started 1-6.

    Smith suffered a shoulder injury in Week 7 and has since been passed by undersized Troy Smith. Not surprisingly, the 49ers remain one of the NFL's most disappointing teams and a housecleaning is likely forthcoming.

    "That's a mess out there," the scout said. "And it all starts because they don't have a quarterback."

    Green Bay doesn't have that problem thanks to Rodgers. Call it dumb luck if you will, but the Packers were certainly fortuitous that Rodgers fell in their lap five years ago.

    When the 49ers decided on Alex Smith that April morning, it sent Rodgers into a free fall. Only Cleveland, Tennessee and Arizona were teams with top 10 picks that had a possible need at quarterback, and when they went in different directions, Rodgers kept spiraling.

    And even though Green Bay had more pressing needs on the defensive side of the ball, Rodgers was far and away the highest remaining player on Thompson's board.

    "Did we think he was going to be there when we were watching tape? No," Thompson said that day. "But over the course of the last week or so there was a couple of, I don't know, websites that said maybe he might get there.

    "So, I went back and did a little more work just to make sure. But I feel very comfortable that this kid warranted being picked where we were at."

    Rodgers certainly benefited from sitting behind future Hall of Famer Brett Favre for three years. As Rodgers showed his first two summers in Green Bay, he wasn't close to being ready to play.

    Rodgers also has learned from terrific teachers in McCarthy, quarterbacks coach Tom Clements and offensive coordinator Joe Philbin. And the arrogance that Rodgers arrived with has been reduced dramatically - at least publicly.

    "I think it's about opportunity, and it's about performance and production, and he's answered the bell," McCarthy said of Rodgers.

    Rodgers is 24-20 as a starter and has never won a playoff game. But the way he's progressed, that's likely to come soon.

    Rodgers was the first quarterback in league history to eclipse more than 4,000 passing yards in each of his first two years as a starter. His 103.2 passer rating last season was the second best in team history.

    And Rodgers' career passer rating of 97.28 is currently the second-best in NFL history, trailing only San Diego's Philip Rivers (97.34).

    Smith has certainly endured more turnover than Rodgers, playing for a different offensive coordinator every year he's been in San Francisco. But by Year 6, Smith should have made far more gains than he has.

    Instead, Smith is 17-30 as a starter and has thrown more career interceptions (52) than touchdowns (46). Smith has a paltry 75.0 passer rating and has never had a winning record in any of his six seasons.
     
  2. FiercePierce6

    FiercePierce6 Cheesehead

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    I've always wondered what it would be like if Rodgers and Smith switched spots. Obviously they both had a tremendous amount of talent to merit being mentioned as a number 1 overall pick.

    I must say though, Smith has been dealt a bad hand over the years, as you said he's had a different offensive coordinator EVERY year. I probably am not the only one to say it'd be tough to integrate into a new system every single year of someone's career. But you are also correct in saying he should be better than he is after 6 seasons.

    At the end of the day would I change anything that happened on draft day 2005? Hell no!

    Go Pack Go!
     
  3. Wood Chipper

    Wood Chipper Fantasy Football Guru

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    as it shows right there that regardless of needs sometimes its smarter to take the best person available.
     
  4. SpartaChris

    SpartaChris Cheesehead

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    Unless you are the original author of the piece you just posted, you might want to post a link to the story so credit can be given where it's due. Otherwise someone could have a case for plagiarism.
     
  5. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    kind of pointless since you couldnt access it anyways.

    Do people want me to post links they cant access? I can do that if its something people want, but otherwise just figured people would get annoyed hitting links they cant go to.
     
  6. SpartaChris

    SpartaChris Cheesehead

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    Why couldn't we access it? Is it a subscription based service? If so, did you get permission to repost the article?

    I don't mean to harp, but there's potential liability involved for both the owner of this site and possibly for yourself.

    Either way, without giving credit, it looks like you are the original author. If the original author actually found out, they could sue the owner of the website for plagiarism or infringement or any number of other things. Plus, giving credit where it's due is just the right thing to do.
     
  7. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    Nope didnt email anyone to get permission. I think you should flag this post to alert the mods about the potential liability that this post causes them.
     
  8. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    try and post a couple nice articles and someone has to ruin it. i wont post any more articles that the masses cant see. Keep them all for myself, muahahaha (evil laugh)
     
  9. SpartaChris

    SpartaChris Cheesehead

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    For the record, I'm not trying to be a jerk. Just looking out is all.
     
  10. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    this is being looked into
     
  11. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    mods, please delete this post
     
  12. PFanCan

    PFanCan That's MISTER Cheesehead, to you.

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    Thanks for the article, ivo. It's a nice read from whomever wrote it.
     
  13. Green_Bay_Packers

    Green_Bay_Packers Cheesehead

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    What a great read, Very enjoyable :D as much I like Alex Smith I am glad we have Rodgers, Hope Smith stays in San Fran :D
     
  14. GreenGoldAngel

    GreenGoldAngel Banned Banned

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    In any event, it was the most intriguing story I have read since Dickens' "Tale of Two Cities".

    *I am 64 years old...could someone tell me what a "mod" is?:mellow:
     
  15. packerfan4ever

    packerfan4ever Cheesehead

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    It was a good read,but I think Smith had opportunity's look at Bradford he's coming along I don;t think Smith was that good as some others who came out in their rookie year and played well.I do think A-rod would have he would have had ups and downs but he has the brains to learn form mistakes I understand coaches change so plays get changed I guess I'm saying you have to have talent in the first place don't think Smith had that to transform into nfl q.b.
     
  16. Kitten

    Kitten Feline Cheesehead Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Great article, thanks Ivo! Just many of the "what ifs" in football. Unfortunately for San Fran, they are left with all the sad questions. Still you have to ask yourself what would of happened to Alex Smith if he had come to Green Bay? Would his fate be totally different with our offense and coaching staff? To be honest, I'm already long since sold on Rodgers but you have to wonder. Just because a player, in this case a QB sucks on one team doesn't me he will suck on other. It may not even be the QB's fault, crappy or non existent receiving corps, poor running game, poor coaching, poor pass protection, offensive line can't protect QB, there are many factors that could contribute but ultimately it lands up making the QB look bad or in the worst cases, incompetent. It will also affect the QB's trade value, also affecting the team trying to trade him.

    All things said and done, I and VERY happy with Rodgers, I am looking forward to many blessed and happy seasons maybe with a Superbowl or several too!!!!
     
  17. Aaron rodgers is god

    Aaron rodgers is god Cheesehead

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    I think the Rodgers might have been bad in San Fran. He would of been on a bad team and I don't think he was ready to start his rookie year. While the packers set him up and let him learn and practice his skills for 3 years.
     
  18. Kitten

    Kitten Feline Cheesehead Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Ivo, I did some recon for you, I love your articles and would hate to lose them!

    I found a couple of sites:

    Milwaukee Journal Sentinel has it posted but does not list an author.


    The tale of two quarterbacks - 12-02-2010

    If you click on the "click here for full article" link at the bottom, it sends you to JSonline, Packer Insider where you need a paid subscription to view the article. The article appears to have originated from JSonline.

    Packer Insider Login - Packer Insider - JSOnline

    I would list this ^ link as my source if I were posting it and mention to people they will need to subscribe to view the articles on there. It would also be giving JSonline a plug, as I am now seriously considering a membership. If they/ anyone gives you any crap, I'll contact them myself and subscribe and tell them to thank you for the plug!
     
  19. robdog

    robdog Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    Here is the deal. I like posting articles from other sites, but we do need to give credit to the original author. IF stories are from a paid service, say ESPN Insider, then we CAN NOT post that story on this forum. I will make an official post about articles right now.

    Please let us know where you got this story from.

    Thanks.
     
  20. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    They are from JS and I thought since everyone didnt have access to them I would be nice and post them. Obviously not taking credit for them. I figured posting the link to a pay site would cause someone to go and contact JS, so I didnt. Didnt figure someone would cry about it on here. Way to spoil it for everyone. Hope you feel like you did the world a favor. Sometimes people should just learn to mind their own business.
     
  21. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    And thank you kitten, I appreciate the effort.
     
  22. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    Regarding the article.

    To me it's simple. Coulda shoulda woulda.

    If they traded spots, Aaron probably wouldn't be as good as he is now, and Alex probably would be better than he is.

    But talent is talent. There's no way in hell that Alex Smith would be as good as Aaron Rodgers is now if the scenarios were traded, and there's no way that Rodgers would be as bad as Alex Smith.

    Smith has been in the same system for 3 offseasons now. He should have the grasp of the offense, but he simply doesn't have the arm strenght and the improvisational ability that Rodgers have to perform in the same level.
     
  23. SpartaChris

    SpartaChris Cheesehead

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    You do realize YOU copying and pasting a story from a paid subscription site could have had this forum shut down, right? At the very least a cease and desist could be issued, and then what?

    Don't blame me for doing the right thing when YOU did the wrong thing. Sorry, but I'm just not gonna feel bad about it.
     
  24. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Both have said their peace..I have been on BOTH sides of this issue at one point..IVO was trying to keep the entire board informed on things about the Packers

    Sparta was trying to make sure the board wouldnt get in trouble..

    No one was wrong if you ask me..

    Now I hope you two can make up :)

    and if you feel the need to continue this, please do it in pm's okay?
     
  25. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    (sigh) I dont think you realize thats why I didnt provide the link.

    and to answer your question about what would happen if someone issued a cease and desist letter? well its pretty self explanatory, they ask you to stop doing something and they ask you to not do it again. I assume what would happen is what already happened. Dont get your undies in a bunch, this isnt rapgodfathers, the feds arent going to shut down the site.

    I blame you for acting like a hall monitor and making a big fuss about it. A PM with a Mod would have been fine (which I am sure you did as well). No one likes a tattle tale.
     

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