Minnesota Vikings

[Heyjoe4]

Vikings fans need to be warned that a career day by McCarthy doesn't mean much in the long term. The Packers just have a way of making struggling QB's look great. Bryce Young as an example. I expect McCarthy to look like a completely different QB that has had trouble with accuracy so far.

Inexperienced QB's struggle with pressure even more so than veterans. Putting pressure on McCarthy is the ticket to a Packers win. The Packers pass rush, however, has been so anemic the past three weeks that McCarthy should have all day to throw.

Good point Sanguine - the pass rush really has been weak for some time. And I don't get it. The addition of Parsons made a world of difference in weeks one and two, and Gary was benefitting from double teams on Parsons.

I don't remember the last time Gary had a sack. I'm sure he has one recently, but the pass rush is not getting the job done. That's inexcusable with a talent like Parsons in the line up.

And yeah LVN has been out, but that's not a big hit. He's just not a good as we all expected.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I'm going to try and watch Morgan a bit. I've been seeing him get pushed into the backfield with not too much effort. On his heels. If that happens again; I'd say he isn't strong enough to play guard.

Yeah I'm starting to think Morgan works better as a backup rather than a starter. Then again, he should be playing LT, maybe LG. The Packers like their O linemen to be multi-functional. For some guys, that just doesn't work. Keep Morgan somewhere left of center.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Just listened to a radio discussion with "voice of the Vikings" Paul Allen. If I heard correctly he says this years O-line is the best Vikings O-line the Packers will have seen since the Favre era.

Interesting - but the Packers pass rush has been weak for the last few weeks. That's weird considering the talent on the DL and at LB.

As for the Vikings OL, I'm sure someone has stats re: the run game and number of pressures, sacks allowed.

 

[chemist]

You are correct about MLF - he has been lost in a "fog of ideas". I think that makes the case for having an OC who calls then plays, and a HC who oversees everything. MLF has been little more than an OC with an HC title. I don't think it works for him.

I hope your right and the Giants' game was a "get right" game. I didn't see as many downfield throws - I don't mind them, but it they need to be opportunity based, like no single-high safety on Golden or Watson. Take that match up all day. It just doesn't present itself often.

There are 5 games left in the conference, with the Vikings and Lions up next. Beating the Vikings at home is critical (well, I said the same about the Panthers.....).

We are at a boom or bust point. The team can probably stay relevant with a W against the Queens and a L against the Lions - but I think you're right, the Lions are beatable.

Yes, there has been much talk about MLF trying to call plays and manage everything else at the same time.
He recently stated in a interview he is not giving up calling plays instead he has challenged himself to become better at his job. I take from that he recognizes his short comings and is trying to address them.
Kind of like an alchoholic trying to stay sober. The first step is to admit you are an alcoholic.
By MLF challeging himself he is basically admitting he hasnt been very good with his decisions. First step taken! Now he has to follow thru, study harder, plan ahead better, do whatever it takes to become better at your job.
Nothing us fans can do about this. We can only standby and hope he is successful with his challenge.

 

[gopkrs]

I'm hoping he is unpredictable on 1st and 2nd downs. Basically more pass plays. And that Jordan takes more snaps under center.

 

[OldSchool101]

This is that “midseason form” game where various teams that have been inconsistent either choose to rise or fall.
The Vikings are still a very talented Roster, but they’ve lost 4 of 5 games since their Bye. This league has always come down to QB play, with rare exception. GB Wins in that that category and that’s not a slight to JJ as he’s really just a Rookie for all practical purposes.

A Home game Win would really give us momentum going into Thanksgiving with a Detroit team who also not firing on all cylinders.

Interesting Factoid:

The leading Tackler on the Vikings?

Eric Wilson’s 70 Tackles (9 TFL) lead all Vikings Defenders. The former Vikings player turned Packers turned Vikings is on a career high pace.

 

[Zartan]

Im very disappointed our resident Vikings Fan Raptorman hasnt posted yet.

 

[Pugger]

One good thing is we are getting the game down here.

 

[Pugger]

Im very disappointed our resident Vikings Fan Raptorman hasnt posted yet.

I saw him posting on another Packers online message board so he should appear here soon.

 

[milani]

You are correct about MLF - he has been lost in a "fog of ideas". I think that makes the case for having an OC who calls then plays, and a HC who oversees everything. MLF has been little more than an OC with an HC title. I don't think it works for him.

I hope your right and the Giants' game was a "get right" game. I didn't see as many downfield throws - I don't mind them, but it they need to be opportunity based, like no single-high safety on Golden or Watson. Take that match up all day. It just doesn't present itself often.

There are 5 games left in the conference, with the Vikings and Lions up next. Beating the Vikings at home is critical (well, I said the same about the Panthers.....).

We are at a boom or bust point. The team can probably stay relevant with a W against the Queens and a L against the Lions - but I think you're right, the Lions are beatable.

The Lions have shown they are beatable but you better be ready to go at them for 4 quarters. You must capitalize on any mistake or opportunity. One blink of an eye and they can be in the end zone.

 

[milani]

Good point Sanguine - the pass rush really has been weak for some time. And I don't get it. The addition of Parsons made a world of difference in weeks one and two, and Gary was benefitting from double teams on Parsons.

I don't remember the last time Gary had a sack. I'm sure he has one recently, but the pass rush is not getting the job done. That's inexcusable with a talent like Parsons in the line up.

And yeah LVN has been out, but that's not a big hit. He's just not a good as we all expected.

The last 3 games teams have literally tried to slow the game down by running the ball and passing short. They are moving the sticks one first down at a time. Getting them behind the sticks enough has not been happening enough. It is wearing our D down and keeping our offensive on the sideline. In the Arizona and Pittsburgh games our opponents had to throw more. Our offense put up points and forced them to be more aggressive on their end. Only Dallas was successful playing us in shootout mode.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Yes, there has been much talk about MLF trying to call plays and manage everything else at the same time.
He recently stated in a interview he is not giving up calling plays instead he has challenged himself to become better at his job. I take from that he recognizes his short comings and is trying to address them.
Kind of like an alchoholic trying to stay sober. The first step is to admit you are an alcoholic.
By MLF challeging himself he is basically admitting he hasnt been very good with his decisions. First step taken! Now he has to follow thru, study harder, plan ahead better, do whatever it takes to become better at your job.
Nothing us fans can do about this. We can only standby and hope he is successful with his challenge.

Good point - MLF sees his weaknesses and plans to address them.

It's too late this year to turn play calling over to a talented OC. But short of doing that, I see MLF failing even with renewed attention on his part.

His problem, like most of us, is time, or lack of it. He may just be an extremely good OC who is in over his head at HC. This is a matter to address in the off season, if he's really willing to address it.

The problem is most apparent in time management. When was the last time the Packers hit a two-minute warning with all three TOs intact?

Well he either succeeds or fails in these efforts. IMO if he misses the playoffs, or is one and done again, he won't be back next year. I don't think Policy will let this pass, and the Packers have too much talent to be losing to Cleveland and Carolina and tying with Dallas - all three teams having far less talent than GB.

I'd really like for MLF to stay. But he has to prove that his approach (calling all pays) will work, or try someone else. Despite the decent 6-3-1 record, it's not working. And when the season wraps, the decision to stay as HC is out of his hands.

Just win the SB Matt, or at least win the NFC. I think we'd all be happy with that.

 

[DoURant]

The Lions have shown they are beatable but you better be ready to go at them for 4 quarters. You must capitalize on any mistake or opportunity. One blink of an eye and they can be in the end zone.

They just lost TE Sam LaPorta, who had surgery on a back injury. That's a big piece of their offense to lose.

 

[milani]

They just lost TE Sam LaPorta, who had surgery on a back injury. That's a big piece of their offense to lose.

I read that. He had a couple big catches at Lambeau in WK 1. Lions never missed a beat at TE even after they parted with Hockenson several years ago. That can be a big factor in the playoffs against better teams.

 

[Raptorman]

I actually like listening to Paul Allen discuss football. He's very intelligent. I hate listening to him call a game. It's like listening to pestilent 13yr old get too emotionally high and low.

That said, one needs to factor in whom Paul Allen is talking to, because he freely spews garbage and says things to get rises out of people. Part of it is an act, but if PA said this is the best O-line then you can't believe it. Ask ANYBODY who is a Vikings fan (where's Raptorman??), this O-line has had a lot of trouble in pass protection.

I have no idea where PA got that crap about our O-line. I don't think we have had the same 5 players on the line from one game to the next so far this year. At one time, we had 4 backups and one starter playing. The O-line has been so decimated with injuries this year, I can't even tell you who will be starting tomorrow.

As for JJM. He has flashes of brilliance placed in spaces of WTF are you doing? His best playing? Down by one score with 4 minutes left in the game. Look at the second Bears game. One good drive at the beginning of the game, a bunch of crap in the middle, then he lights it up at the end. Had our Special teams not given up 56 56-yard kickoff return, we might have won that game.

 

[milani]

I have no idea where PA got that crap about our O-line. I don't think we have had the same 5 players on the line from one game to the next so far this year. At one time, we had 4 backups and one starter playing. The O-line has been so decimated with injuries this year, I can't even tell you who will be starting tomorrow.

As for JJM. He has flashes of brilliance placed in spaces of WTF are you doing? His best playing? Down by one score with 4 minutes left in the game. Look at the second Bears game. One good drive at the beginning of the game, a bunch of crap in the middle, then he lights it up at the end. Had our Special teams not given up 56 56-yard kickoff return, we might have won that game.

Just as the Bears found a way to lose the first game the Vikings found a way to lose this one.

 

[chemist]

Good point - MLF sees his weaknesses and plans to address them.

It's too late this year to turn play calling over to a talented OC. But short of doing that, I see MLF failing even with renewed attention on his part.

His problem, like most of us, is time, or lack of it. He may just be an extremely good OC who is in over his head at HC. This is a matter to address in the off season, if he's really willing to address it.

The problem is most apparent in time management. When was the last time the Packers hit a two-minute warning with all three TOs intact?

Well he either succeeds or fails in these efforts. IMO if he misses the playoffs, or is one and done again, he won't be back next year. I don't think Policy will let this pass, and the Packers have too much talent to be losing to Cleveland and Carolina and tying with Dallas - all three teams having far less talent than GB.

I'd really like for MLF to stay. But he has to prove that his approach (calling all pays) will work, or try someone else. Despite the decent 6-3-1 record, it's not working. And when the season wraps, the decision to stay as HC is out of his hands.

Just win the SB Matt, or at least win the NFC. I think we'd all be happy with that.

I hear you..

Ive been very tough on MLF in many of my past posts. It was mostly out of frustration that we were losing games we should win.
I felt we have a talented enough team to take on anyone but poor decisions by our HC was hurting us.
I soon realized my complaining and critcizing wasnt going to solve anything and I just didnt feel good about having that kind of attitude so I decided to stop, and go in the direction of giving MLF a second chance, especially since he seems to know it was his failures that have cost us games and he is now trying to turn that ship around.
The ball is in our court with all the division games coming up so this will be a good test of how MLF is progressing if at all.
We 've had enough frustraion to choke a horse thru the first half of the season so
I want to see improvement, in the form of winning most of these division games, reaching the top of the division making the playoffs and hopefully getting to the SB

 

[milani]

I hear you..

Ive been very tough on MLF in many of my past posts. It was mostly out of frustration that we were losing games we should win.
I felt we have a talented enough team to take on anyone but poor decisions by our HC was hurting us.
I soon realized my complaining and critcizing wasnt going to solve anything and I just didnt feel good about having that kind of attitude so I decided to stop, and go in the direction of giving MLF a second chance, especially since he seems to know it was his failures that have cost us games and he is now trying to turn that ship around.
The ball is in our court with all the division games coming up so this will be a good test of how MLF is progressing if at all.
We 've had enough frustraion to choke a horse thru the first half of the season so
I want to see improvement, in the form of winning most of these division games, reaching the top of the division making the playoffs and hopefully getting to the SB

Unfortunately, the final 7 games are the most difficult. If we had defeated Cleveland and Carolina or even slipped by Dallas we could go 3-4 and come out pretty well. But that is not the case now. The Packers will have to play at a higher level to win 4 or 5 of these games. And losing some of the stars on this roster makes that very difficult.

 

[gopkrs]

Well, we start tomorrow. GoPackGo!

 

[Voyageur]

Minnesota's Defense however is not as strong as normal some say but still pretty dang good, BUT as noted some of that might be better with guys returning from injury...

- They are currently allowing 65% completion rate through the air
- They like us are barely taking the ball away...they have 9 total TOs, but one fewer INT
- They are a top 10 team however in yards per play allowed at 5.1 (good for being tied for 8th) *we are top3 at 4.7
- Pro Football Reference has them listed as the highest percentage blitzing team at 43.9% (THEY LIVE FEAST OR FAMINE MENTALITY) - more than twice the rate given to the Packers
- Top pressure team despite not getting home alot for sacks.

We should be seeing a lot of shorter passes over the middle. The perfect routes for Doubs. Depending on who's in at RB we could see some throws to the outside to Josh Jacobs, if he is out there. He's shown he has good hands and can make tacklers miss.

We should win this game, but Minnesota always gets up for the Packer games, and it doesn't matter where we play them.

 

[milani]

We should be seeing a lot of shorter passes over the middle. The perfect routes for Doubs. Depending on who's in at RB we could see some throws to the outside to Josh Jacobs, if he is out there. He's shown he has good hands and can make tacklers miss.

We should win this game, but Minnesota always gets up for the Packer games, and it doesn't matter where we play them.

Both teams get fired up and are never intimidated by the mystique. The Vikings will be trying to load up more in the box. It will have to be short and quick. If we only had a TE.

 

[Voyageur]

Both teams get fired up and are never intimidated by the mystique. The Vikings will be trying to load up more in the box. It will have to be short and quick. If we only had a TE.

I kind of like Whyle. He may not be a speed merchant, but he appears to have good hands and instincts and is willing to throw blocks. With Musgrave, Whyle, and FitzPatrick, I think they can hold their own out there.

 

[chemist]

Unfortunately, the final 7 games are the most difficult. If we had defeated Cleveland and Carolina or even slipped by Dallas we could go 3-4 and come out pretty well. But that is not the case now. The Packers will have to play at a higher level to win 4 or 5 of these games. And losing some of the stars on this roster makes that very difficult.

Very true about the clev and carolina games, ashame .. but this is the hand we were dealt going forward.
I feel our D has been playing well enough, dont need to do much there.
On offense I want to see Love under center so its less likely the opponent will know if its run or pass. Shotgun just gives to many clues away to what GB is doing so I hope we dont see that setup very much.
Many times MLF has talked about players that have to step up because we lost someone to injury. Well now its time for MLF to step up. He has the tools in his tool box, the talent is there, so become the HC you challenged yourself to be and guide this team around any of the typical pitfalls that can occur in any game.

 

[Voyageur]

Very true about the clev and carolina games, ashame .. but this is the hand we were dealt going forward.
I feel our D has been playing well enough, dont need to do much there.
On offense I want to see Love under center so its less likely the opponent will know if its run or pass. Shotgun just gives to many clues away to what GB is doing so I hope we dont see that setup very much.
Many times MLF has talked about players that have to step up because we lost someone to injury. Well now its time for MLF to step up. He has the tools in his tool box, the talent is there, so become the HC you challenged yourself to be and guide this team around any of the typical pitfalls that can occur in any game.

It is a tough schedule to end this season but if the Packers are as good as we hope and believe they are, it's a good test going into the playoffs. If they do well through these next few weeks, they'll have proved to everyone, including themselves that they belong there and won't be counted out.

It's a great opportunity for the coaching staff to begin sorting out the players who will and won't make a difference when they get to the playoffs where it's win or go home.

I'd prefer the schedule like it is as opposed to going out of it with a bunch of walkovers. You just got to reach inside yourself and find what you're really made of.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Very true about the clev and carolina games, ashame .. but this is the hand we were dealt going forward.
I feel our D has been playing well enough, dont need to do much there.
On offense I want to see Love under center so its less likely the opponent will know if its run or pass. Shotgun just gives to many clues away to what GB is doing so I hope we dont see that setup very much.
Many times MLF has talked about players that have to step up because we lost someone to injury. Well now its time for MLF to step up. He has the tools in his tool box, the talent is there, so become the HC you challenged yourself to be and guide this team around any of the typical pitfalls that can occur in any game.

I'm surprised at how seldom Love is under center. It's so hard, maybe impossible, to run the RPO out of shotgun. Defenses know this and have been getting a lot of pressure on Love. To his credit, he throws very few INTs. Even so, running RPO from under center would be a great way to extend drives, move the sticks, all that.

And too frequently Love is taking unwise downfield shots and either not seeing or ignoring double or even triple coverage. Those should be saved for when a mismatch occurs, ala no safety present on a WR, especially Watson or Golden who can easily beat single coverage on a "go" route.

I kind of like Whyle. He may not be a speed merchant, but he appears to have good hands and instincts and is willing to throw blocks. With Musgrave, Whyle, and FitzPatrick, I think they can hold their own out there.

Whyle is an interesting TE. He may be a better pure TE than Musgrave. Musgrave looks and plays like a WR.