Studs and duds lions

[Pokerbrat2000]

The clock stops on a penalty.

They do restart it, after the penalty has been marked off and the ball ready for play. But definitely not a way for a defense to chew up time, since ultimately the offense is still in control of when they snap the ball.

Actually, a case could be made for the clock starting up after a penalty favors an offense with a lead. If the Packers are up by 9 or more (2 score lead) and want to run some additional clock, they could "intentionally" commit some pre-snap penalties on offense. I think there is an unsportsman like rule/penalty that kicks in if the referees feel a team is doing it intentionally to run the clock. I remember the Badgers using this clock rule to their advantage, I believe Bret Bielema was the coach. Smart and sneaky.

I could be wrong, but when the clock is under 5 minutes in the 2nd or 4th Q, then it stops after a penalty and doesn't restart until the next snap.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The two biggest culprits in my mind appear to be St. Brown and Crosby. If St. Brown doesnt just play patty cake with his blocker and then get tossed to the sideline he probably forces Agnew more towards the middle and towards other defenders. Still probably a 30-35 yard return even if St. Brown did play that one adequately.

So I went back and looked at the play closer, here is a snap shot and what I think is the issue. Look at all the Packer players lined up vertically to Agnew's right. This was the same problem with one of the punt returns earlier in the year, "creating a wide open running lane". It was either LeRoy Butler or Silverstein that pointed this out.

So in this situation EQ and Henry Black are the only 2 players in any kind of position to make a tackle, both of them get well blocked/held up. The Lions set up a perfect wall and the Packer players played right into it by approaching in a line and not staying in their lanes.

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[gopkrs]

So I went back and looked at the play closer, here is a snap shot and what I think is the issue. Look at all the Packer players lined up vertically to Agnew's right. This was the same problem with one of the punt returns earlier in the year, "creating a wide open running lane". It was either LeRoy Butler or Silverstein that pointed this out.

So in this situation EQ and Henry Black are the only 2 players in any kind of position to make a tackle, both of them get well blocked/held up. The Lions set up a perfect wall and the Packer players played right into it by approaching in a line and not staying in their lanes.

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Sounds like one coach beating another coach

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Sounds like one coach beating another coach

Well said. This was a case where I am guessing that Lions Special Teams coach 34 year old Brayden Coombs studied film and totally outcoached the soon to be fired 49 year old Enigma. Coombs had his players set up a perfect wall to easily takeout what I would call a less than well organized group of guys running in a line in an attempt to converge on the return man.

 

[Ceodore]

Here's to hoping MVS had a bit of a breakthrough yesterday and big props to Mason on that field goal. I'll be the first to admit I was pleading to my TV (and the chat) for them to punt there.

 

[easyk83]

Well said. This was a case where I am guessing that Lions Special Teams coach 34 year old Brayden Coombs studied film and totally outcoached the soon to be fired 49 year old Enigma. Coombs had his players set up a perfect wall to easily takeout what I would call a less than well organized group of guys running in a line in an attempt to converge on the return man.

If EQ plays his man better he probably squeezes Agnew towards the sideline leaving the defender in the lower left of the screen with a chance to squeeze him out. I would like to see numbers on the hangtime because IMO that was a factor. Typically with a coverage breakdown you're looking at more than just one failure.

 

[Pugger]

Half of the coverage has to do with the kick or punt. If a kicker boots a line drive without hang time odds are likely that the return man will have some big holes to run through which well he did. I didn't use a stop watch but if the average NFL hangtime for kickoffs is 4.4 seconds I'd say that Crosby's was about a second less.

The first Packer defender to even get close to Agnew didnt occur until the 20 yard line at which point Agnew was pretty much at full speed with a big hole ahead of him. St. Brown didn't help with his lackluster engagement of a return team blocker and then managed to get turned aside opening an even bigger gap. Go watch the highlight if you dont believe me.

I believe you. The coverage wasn't good there. When your kicker has to make the stop you have major issues. All I can say is if of all of our problems on ST Mason Crosby is the least of them.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I would like to see numbers on the hangtime because IMO that was a factor. Typically with a coverage breakdown you're looking at more than just one failure.

I don't think it was as line drive of a kick as you think it might have been. I put my crude phone stop watch on it, twice. I came up with 3.97 seconds. Online the average says 4.4. It was also 5 yards deep into the endzone. Did the Packer players "let up" thinking it wouldn't be returned? Packer players had made it to the Lions 20 yard line before Agnew hit the 10 yard line. Without better angles, I'm still concluding our ST group sucked on the play.

 

[Fredrik87]

Studs

MVS (had in my opinion easily his best game of the season possibly his career)

Aaron Rodgers

Davante Adams

Jaire

Vernon Scott

Crosby

Kenny Clark

Tonyan

Eagles and Jalen Hurts

Duds

Kickoff coverage

 

[PackAttack12]

Impossible. We don't have a round 1-3 rookie WR on the team.
But I am glad to see AR12 finally has some completions to a first round WR on his resume.

The vast majority of fans didn't care all that much that a rookie wide receiver wasn't taken in rounds 1-3. Rather, they were pissed that the Packers took a quarterback that they hope to God doesn't hit the field for at least 2 years, a 3rd string running back, and an h-back.

How can this possibly be? We don’t have that highly coveted #2 WR and outside of Adams we have without a doubt the worst receiving corps in the history of the NFL! ........... or so I’ve read countless times this fall.

This has to be the most extreme case of hyberbole I've ever read. Congrats.

 

[Poppa San]

Can't imagine it would be on purpose.

My biggest gripe about Pettine's defense is that they don't play smart, disciplined, or fundamentally sound football. I don't think his staff are particularly good at teaching the game.

Maybe that is why AR12 played defense for one play. Per the snap counts at PFR.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/202012130det.htm#vis_snap_counts::none

 

[thisisnate]

you know who we need back to play ST?
yeah, you know
saginaw stallion

 

[easyk83]

Here's to hoping MVS had a bit of a breakthrough yesterday and big props to Mason on that field goal. I'll be the first to admit I was pleading to my TV (and the chat) for them to punt there.

He needs to keep wearing them yellow gloves.

 

[Mondio]

you know who we need back to play ST?
yeah, you know
saginaw stallion

whatever his limitations were as a WR, he was a phenomenal Special teams coverage man.

 

[PikeBadger]

The vast majority of fans didn't care all that much that a rookie wide receiver wasn't taken in rounds 1-3. Rather, they were pissed that the Packers took a quarterback that they hope to God doesn't hit the field for at least 2 years, a 3rd string running back, and an h-back.

This has to be the most extreme case of hyberbole I've ever read. Congrats.

Go back and look at the threads two and three months ago. Everybody in the organizational hierarchy needed to be fired.
So here we sit with the division wrapped up and on pace for our offense to looking like it compares only with the 1962 and 2011 offensive juggernauts.

 

[easyk83]

Go back and look at the threads two and three months ago. Everybody in the organizational hierarchy needed to be fired.
So here we sit with the division wrapped up and on pace for our offense to looking like it compares only with the 1962 and 2011 offensive juggernauts.

Well yeah but if not for rushed reactions what would we talk about?

 

[PackAttack12]

Go back and look at the threads two and three months ago. Everybody in the organizational hierarchy needed to be fired.
So here we sit with the division wrapped up and on pace for our offense to looking like it compares only with the 1962 and 2011 offensive juggernauts.

No level minded person advocated for anyone to be fired.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Go back and look at the threads two and three months ago. Everybody in the organizational hierarchy needed to be fired.

I think that was a very small subset of people screaming that. Much like those screaming to dump Rodgers over the last few years. I got the sense that most here felt the Packers had a good team, but yes, there was just some questions as to just how good. I will admit that they have exceeded my expectations, but I didn't expect the jump in the offensive productivity that we have seen, mostly due to Rodgers fully embracing and thriving in MLF's offense.

I do think the Packers have some weaknesses (mainly on defense and special teams) that I hope aren't exposed in the playoffs and they definitely have some things they need to take care of in the offseason.

Besides the obvious questions on who they resign, Gute and MLF have to be looking at the following:

• Pettine and Mennenga both potentially being replaced.
• Defensive Personnel upgrades: DL, ILB, CB
• WR upgrades.

Packer fans have to be pretty happy at this stage of the season with the results, as well as the Packers not being among the teams that have a long list of offseason needs.

 

[GleefulGary]

No level minded person advocated for anyone to be fired.

Whomst among us is level minded?

 

[GleefulGary]

Studs

MVS (had in my opinion easily his best game of the season possibly his career)

Aaron Rodgers

Davante Adams

Jaire

Vernon Scott

Crosby

Kenny Clark

Tonyan

Eagles and Jalen Hurts

Duds

Kickoff coverage

Whoever taught Vernon Scott how to tackle needs to be hired in Green Bay, ASAP.

 

[PackAttack12]

@gopkrs

Instead of clicking a red 'x', why don't you go back and show me the level minded person that wanted someone fired over the 2020 draft.

But of course you'll probably red x this post too like a petulant child.

 

[Jerellh528]

Irritating how some can use Rodgers brilliance as a player as a cover for certain front office mistakes. “sEe wErE gOoD rIgHt nOw sO wE dIdNt nEeD tO tRy gEt aNy BeTtEr tHis yEar”.

 

[PikeBadger]

@gopkrs

Instead of clicking a red 'x', why don't you go back and show me the level minded person that wanted someone fired over the 2020 draft.

But of course you'll probably red x this post too like a petulant child.

Define level minded please and approximate percentage of forum posters that fit that definition in your opinion.

 

[tynimiller]

Whoever taught Vernon Scott how to tackle needs to be hired in Green Bay, ASAP.

I mean that kid was nailing it. I love how he made the ball carrier the one reacting to him at times. Was awesome!

But I am glad to see AR12 finally has some completions to a first round WR on his resume.

(Koren Robinson raises his hand proudly...)

 

[PikeBadger]

Irritating how some can use Rodgers brilliance as a player as a cover for certain front office mistakes. “sEe wErE gOoD rIgHt nOw sO wE dIdNt nEeD tO tRy gEt aNy BeTtEr tHis yEar”.

It isn’t Rodgers alone that has played well this year. We’re getting big time contributions from players all over this roster.