1. Welcome to Green Bay Packers NFL Football Forum & Community!
    Packer Forum is one of the largest online communities for the Green Bay Packers.

    You are currently viewing our community forums as a guest user.

    Sign Up or

    Having an account grants you additional privileges, such as creating and participating in discussions. Furthermore, we hide most of the ads once you register as a member!
  2. Big Announcement Coming for 2015 Football Season!!

    Be on the look out for a big Packer Forum announcement when the schedule is released. Full details coming soon...

Starting to get irritated with lack of free agency news..

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Brandon, Mar 12, 2014.

  1. rodell330

    rodell330 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2012
    Messages:
    2,928
    Ratings:
    +992
    It would tickle me to see Allen go to Chicago and Peppers to minnesota. Meanwhile the Packers bring in some guy from Pittsburgh. Lol amazing smh. The defense is already making huge strides.
     
  2. Carl

    Carl Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,622
    Ratings:
    +912
    I know Byrd did not want to stay, but every other free agent didn't like their current teams?

    I agree that money talks and business is business, which is why most players take the biggest contract they can get. There are examples every year of a player going to a worse team for more money. So why were the teams they were already on (The teams that know by far the most about the players) not want to pay them the most?

    There's some reason that teams didn't feel they were worth it. For the most part, not in Byrd's case, a free agent is a player that his current team didn't want anymore. I think that's why a big time expensive free agent rarely lives up to expectations.


    Enviado desde mi iPhone con Tapatalk
     
  3. rodell330

    rodell330 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2012
    Messages:
    2,928
    Ratings:
    +992
    Again they offered to make him the highest paid safety in the league. I'm not seeing your point here My man.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  4. Carl

    Carl Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,622
    Ratings:
    +912
    For the 3rd or 4th time, I know Byrd didn't want to stay in Buffalo.

    I'm asking about the rest of the free agents.


    Enviado desde mi iPhone con Tapatalk
     
  5. rodell330

    rodell330 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2012
    Messages:
    2,928
    Ratings:
    +992
    Gotcha. Sorry I misread it. Well sometimes the players can request to not be resigned . They want to test their worth on the open market... Some just want better opportunity to have a greater role. It's a two way street. It's not always just the team .
     
  6. Carl

    Carl Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,622
    Ratings:
    +912
    That is true. Not always the team, but I think it is in most cases. IMO money is the reason the majority of players pick a team, and I think there's got to be a reason their current team didn't want to give the most money.


    Enviado desde mi iPhone con Tapatalk
     
  7. Oshkoshpackfan

    Oshkoshpackfan YUT !!!

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2012
    Messages:
    3,286
    Ratings:
    +1,453
    sometimes the team want them, but canot afford to match what they would get on the open market. Dallas is in cap HELL and of course they wanted Ware, but they couldn't afford him any longer and cut their loses.
     
    • Useful Useful x 1
    • Old Old x 1
  8. Carl

    Carl Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,622
    Ratings:
    +912
    So why Ware and not restructure other contracts or cut other guys?

    To me, that says they did not think Ware was living up to his contract or wasn't going to compared to the rest of the roster.

    Of course, the Cowboys gave 22 million to a kicker, 10 million to a back up QB and don't understand the cap, so they aren't the best talent evaluators and could be totally wrong.
     
  9. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2012
    Messages:
    5,026
    Ratings:
    +2,154
    Ware was actually the only one on their roster that saved them more than $2 million in cap space.
     
    • Useful Useful x 1
  10. Carl

    Carl Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,622
    Ratings:
    +912
    Alright. So Ware and Byrd are example of guys the team wanted but ended up free agents anyway.

    That still doesn't explain the majority of free agents who IMO leave somewhere to get more money. There's some reason why their original team didn't want to pay them that much. A free agent, for the most part, is a guy another team did not want anymore.

    On a side note, anyone else look at the Cowboys' cap situation and find it hilarious? I have a friend who is a Cowboys fan and thoroughly enjoy discussing their cap situation with him.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  11. NelsonsLongCatch

    NelsonsLongCatch Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2008
    Messages:
    2,196
    Ratings:
    +622
    A lot of that has to do with Jerry Jones being too hands on. He should realize that he's the only owner/GM/head coach in the league. The Cowboys are a special kind of messed up.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2012
    Messages:
    5,026
    Ratings:
    +2,154
    I agree with that. But that doesn't mean a free agent can't have an ompact with another team though. There are a lot of reasons why one team doesn 't want to give a player another contract (money, cap situation, age, depth at the position...)
     
  13. Carl

    Carl Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,622
    Ratings:
    +912
    You're right. It doesn't mean a free agent can't have an impact, but IMO it explains why so many free agents don't live up to their new contracts.
     
  14. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2012
    Messages:
    5,026
    Ratings:
    +2,154
    I agree most of them don't live up to their contracts, especially those signed during the early part of free agency. There's nothing wrong with getting some help for reasonable deals though.
     
  15. Carl

    Carl Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,622
    Ratings:
    +912
    I'm totally for reasonable deals, which is why I'm not concerned TT hasn't signed any guys yet. There are very very few reasonable deals early in free agency.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  16. JacobInFlorida

    JacobInFlorida Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2011
    Messages:
    125
    Ratings:
    +34
    Actually there was a reason Byrd "wanted out of Buffalo" and it goes back to last year. The Bills did not show an urgency to resign him last offseason. They let it go into this year and then they didn't tag him or offer him anywhere close to what the Saints did. To me, that's not what a team does with a guy that has such an impact they can't live without.

    Is he a good player? Sure, but he's not going to be the kind of guy that impacts a defense such that it completely changes a defense, which is the kind of money he got. If you want to have a long term winning roster, you absolutely can't overpay for just an upgrade. It has to be a change at an elite level.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2012
    Messages:
    1,823
    Ratings:
    +1,339
    The "why are teams letting these players go if they're good" argument seems silly to me. Players depart in free agency because GM's have to compile a 53 man roster within the constraints of the salary cap. They have to make decisions about where to allocate the money. That's why we are letting James Jones go. Just because James Jones is a free agent doesn't mean he's a bad player. It means we have other needs that we need to address and do not feel that paying him market value price is in our best interests to winning the most games because it will create a hole elsewhere.

    I'd be very willing to bet that if Jairus Byrd had been a Packer his whole career with his production being exactly the same, Thompson would have had no problem offering him what he did. I'd be equally willing to bet that if Sam Shields had played for the Bills the last 6 years and his production had been exactly the same, Thompson wouldn't have even sniffed him in free agency and wouldn't have come close to offering him $39M.

    I'm not saying that to knock Shields. I'm glad he's back. I'm just saying there's a HUGE disparity in what Thompson is willing to pay for FA's, versus what he's willing to pay for his own guys. Some preference for your own guys seems pretty normal, but I do think he's taking it a bit far.

    If you want to keep overpaying your own guys, how about starting to draft some decent players on defense so you can actually keep a playmaker rather than a mediocre "guy" when they hit free agency?
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
  18. bubba

    bubba Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2013
    Messages:
    93
    Ratings:
    +40
    We signed 2 already. Our own guys nobody else wanted. Don't seem like a lot of teams interested in many of our guys. Don't worry TT will take you all back and we will field the same sorry defense as last year plus a few rookies. I expect Raji will be our next signing. Lucky MD Jennings signed with the Bears or he would be back also. Looks like TT is saying to Capers I gave you good players you need to coach them better. So the bad defense must be a coaching issue.
     
  19. JacobInFlorida

    JacobInFlorida Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2011
    Messages:
    125
    Ratings:
    +34
    My point is this: to overpay for someone like Byrd would IMO require him to be a Clay Matthews type impact player. Elite. Bottom line is in most cases teams find a way to fit those guys into the cap and do what it takes to keep him. The comparison to James Jones is exactly what I'm talking about. Good player that we'd be better with next year but not so much better that it's worth paying him.

    We need to improve the defense, not just go out and get the best player available in free agency at a need position. You just normally don't get bang for your buck in the top tier of free agency.
     
  20. PFanCan

    PFanCan That's MISTER Cheesehead, to you.

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,519
    Ratings:
    +868
    ^This!

    I have been thinking EXACTLY the same thing. I am glad that Shields is back, but just find it strange that the Packers are so willing to pay big money and often over-pay for our own guys, but so reluctant to pull the trigger on others. There is risk in both cases-- neither are guarantees.

    I don't buy the "they must be FAs because there is something amiss" theory.
     
  21. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2012
    Messages:
    1,823
    Ratings:
    +1,339
    He's the best player at his position in the NFL. I don't know how exactly you're defining impact player but Byrd certainly compares a heck of a lot more closely to Clay Matthews than he does to James Jones.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  22. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2005
    Messages:
    16,659
    Ratings:
    +2,966

    How many phone calls did Neal's agent, and Andrew Q's agent make starting Saturday when agents could call teams to start contract talks?

    How many teams gave a specific dollar amount, and were those #'s to low?
     
  23. raj34

    raj34 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2014
    Messages:
    51
    Ratings:
    +21
    Very well said.
     
  24. ExpatPacker

    ExpatPacker Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2011
    Messages:
    1,315
    Ratings:
    +515
    Nice post admabr2.

    The problem with TT' draft and develop strategy and paying (or over-paying) the hometown boys is that if you whiff on the draft then you damn well better search for some alternatives to plug the holes you haven't filled.

    Yes, TT drafted some real good ones, but what has he done lately?

    A tally:

    Good Picks:

    Lacy--best pick in the last 3 years. A plus for TT.
    Heyward--great rookie season, injured most of last season. A plus for TT.
    Bakhtiari--starting LT. A plus for TT.
    Mike Daniels--a breakout year last year. Plus for TT.
    Randall Cobb--TT's second best pick.
    Brian Bulaga--solid tackle. Injury issues. Plus for TT.

    OK Picks:

    Micah Hyde--situational, but promising.
    Davon House--ok, but that's it.
    Morgan Burnett--regressed badly last year.
    Andrew Quarless--injured, played decent last year.
    Jonathan Franklin--played little, looks good.

    Bad Picks:

    Sherrod--not.
    Perry--not.
    Datone Jones--not.
    Worthy--not.
    Jeron McMillan--not.
    Alex Green--not.
    Mike Neal--not really for a 2nd round pick.

    Three #1 picks are non-contributors. They *may* become such, but it means that TT has whiffed pretty bad on 1st rounder, who are supposed to be your major impact players.

    Overall, I'd give TT a "B" grade on drafting. over the last 3-4 years. Frankly, not good enough to keep a team SB competitive.
     
  25. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 2, 2010
    Messages:
    5,889
    Ratings:
    +1,679

Share This Page