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Packers Vs. Bills MNF 2014

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Ace, Apr 8, 2014.

  1. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    Not me. There's a quip from an NFL personnel man that I'm fond of quoting: when you have an elite QB you start at 8-8 and work up from there. Conversely, when you're a team like the Bills playing with their 5th. QB since the start of training camp (or the Packers for that matter with guys like Wallace or Tolzien), you start at 8-8 and work down from there.

    Protestations to the contrary, a thoughtful analysis would show the only position group where the Packers have a clear advantage over the Bills is at QB.

    I'd give the Packers an edge at WR, but the Bills group would look a lot better with a guy who could throw the ball. I'd say it's a wash at TE and RB and I'd give the Packers a slight advantage on the O-Line. On the other hand, I'd give the Bills the clear edge in the D-Line and safety groups, and even an edge in the LB groups, Matthews notwithstanding. The Pack gets a small edge at the CB position.

    I would trade our entire defense lock, stock and barrel for the Bills even with the loss of Byrd.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2014
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  2. OCBP

    OCBP Cheesehead

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    HRE--Refreshing that I am not being austrasized on this forum. Can't say that I would agree with a trading of rosters as I don't know the Bills that well. I stand by my comments concerning Rodgers. On a broader spectrum, and this has previously been expressed, I am baffled the GB management doesn't understand what they have in Rodgers and that they don't do more to support him via free agency in the short term, particularly when the drafting has been suspect. Many that post here think that TT is a genius. He might be good and is responsible for drafting Rodgers. However, careers in the NFL are generally short. There needs to better balance in short term and long term thinking when you have a talent like Rodgers.

    The facts, not opinion, point to a mediocre team without Rodgers. I would assume folks would agree based on the W/L performance last season when he was hurt.

    All that said, get ready for some hate.
     
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  3. yooperpackfan

    yooperpackfan Cheesehead

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    Anybody that didn't see what the Packers are without Rodgers must have been busy admiring their autographed picture of Ted Thompson.
     
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  4. Dan115

    Dan115 Cheesehead

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    looks to me many here do NOT care for TT
     
  5. yooperpackfan

    yooperpackfan Cheesehead

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    Ted has done alot for the Packers organization to be applauded for.
    By the same token he has done (or not done) things that he deserves criticism for.
    The back up QB thing last year was worth criticism.
    This year we could be in the same boat not only at QB but also at center and safety.
    Stay tuned for what he does.
    Just because someone is critical does not make them a hater.
    Being a critic is part of a fans job.
     
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  6. OCBP

    OCBP Cheesehead

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    Yooper--Well said! No TT hater or Brett Favre apologist here with OCBP. Just try and be objective and then, unfortunately, let the hate come my way!
     
  7. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    Some here dislike Thompson because they're Favre dead-enders who still hold a grudge.

    Others, such as myself, believe Thompson to be overrated.
     
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  8. OCBP

    OCBP Cheesehead

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    I'm on your side HRE. The thing that I don't understand about TT is apprehension of filling gaps. The Peppers deal is good both financially as well as his place to add value on the roster. Just would like to see more of this.

    He and McCarthy don't have the pressure that most NFL GM's and Head Coaches have. They have earned that. As a result, it just seems that TT looks out to far into the future--That's not bad if your drafts are consistently great. The issue is Rodgers is great now, let's do all possible to surround him with talent. For those who are going to hate, I do believe TT is attempting to do this. However, his desire to seemingly have the youngest roster and/or lowest payroll gets in the way sometimes.
     
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  9. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    As I´ve mentioned in another thread (although nobody seems to agree with me) the Packers don´t have as much cap room as some of the posters here might think, so it´s tough to fill some holes on the team through free agency.
     
  10. Ace

    Ace Cheesehead

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    100% agree. You can't look at this year and next and just assume we have money to spend. You have to look 3-4 years down the road to realize why TT doesn't go out and get the Byrds & Macks of the world. The money simply isnt there past 2015.
     
  11. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    Actually, I believe the way Thompson and Ball manage the cap is a check mark in the "pro" column. That the approach is value-seeking, relatively risk averse and oriented toward dead cap avoidance are virtues in my mind.

    "Lowest payroll", like drafting for the "best player available player", is a trait commonly assigned to Thompson that is an exaggeration not borne out by the facts. As recently as the uncapped year in 2010 the Packers carried the second highest player expense in the league; as recently as 2012 Thompson drafted all-defense through 6 rounds to try address a serious talent deficit. Again, I have little argument with these approaches as borne out by the facts as opposed to the popular misconceptions.

    Further, with cap being carried forward as of the new CBA as opposed to the old use-it-or-lose-it , the idea that over the long run cap will go unused is an obvious fallacy. Also, with the new CBA requiring a high average annual cash spend, over time there will be a small gap between the high-spending team and the low-spending one. In short, the rules prohibit Thompson from being the cheapskate some accuse him of being even if the facts don't bear out that accusation in the first place.

    And I have not mentioned to this point that signing Peppers goes some way toward debunking another Thompson myth, a topic for another post.

    My issue with Thompson, and the basis for my opinion that he is overrated, is that he has not, on balance, drafted well in recent years. I believe this is partially attributable to the brain drain in the scouting / player personnel departments, beginning with Schneider's departure. That Eliot Wolf is our highest ranking personnel man after Thompson gives me pause.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2014
  12. ThxJackVainisi

    ThxJackVainisi Lifelong Packers Fanatic

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    No question Thompson and company fumbled the backup QB position badly last season. But IMO talk that that failure proves Rodgers is the team is bogus. Flynn is back and he’ll have a full TC. I have a higher opinion of Tolzien than some here but I think he can become a very good backup QB too. I bet he’ll study his arse off and know the offense extremely well. Flynn’s advantage is he’s a ‘money’ player. Doesn’t practice all that well but excels when the real bullets fly. That’s the only question I have about Tolzien – once he’s completely up to speed with the offense, how will he react to the real bullets flying. And I don’t downplay Tolzien’s stronger arm – that’s an advantage in McCarthy’s offense.

    Like RB, backup QB has gone from a weakness to a strength (more a perceived weakness at times regarding RB in the past IMO). I think both positions are deep and talented. I hope we don’t find out about the backup QBs during the season but if we do, that will be the gauge of how good the team is without Rodgers; not what happened last season.

    I agree Thompson has to draft better and the brain drain that has taken place can’t help but hurt - three former front office people are now running their own front office. And to an extent he’s the victim of his success – this year’s pick at #21 is the lowest first rounder of the last five drafts, including this one. But he’s got to draft better and get luckier with injuries to first rounders – his last four have been affected by injury to one extent or another. And unlike Justin Harrell, I don’t remember any of them having injury concerns coming into the draft.
     
  13. Dan115

    Dan115 Cheesehead

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    Ok, some appear to be VERY CRITICAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  14. ReggieLombardi

    ReggieLombardi Cheesehead

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    I'm about 90% locked in for the Tampa game and 70% likelihood I'll be going to the Buffalo game too. Away days...hell ya!!!
     

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