Packers vs Bengals: Preseason Game 1 Game Thread

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JK64

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Look around the NFL and every Sunday you have guys missing XP's and chip shot FG's.
Kickers are Weinnies.
Training Camp, practices and preseason is the time to work all the kinks out of the process of LS to holder to kicker, as well as line blocking. Lots of precision timing involved and I would guess lots of changes on moving parts for Anders (holder and snapper).
This is true.
Sure, bring in another kicker, if you think the competition will help push Anders to faster improvement. Could also do the opposite, get into his head and make things worse.
Oh man, another head case. Is it too much to ask to just be a Pro. He is getting paid plenty.
 

milani

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Oh I agree. I’m not sure who’s advocating for “throwing in the towel on a career” maybe I missed that or maybe you’re referring to his brothers scenario early in. I’m the exact opposite, I’d like to see us work with our new Kicker for a year and then activate him. That actually speaks to the exact opposite of giving up on him and just because Willingness to lose a season of Rookie contract and the expense of holding 2 Kickers.

I fully realize the Packers swallowing their Pride and paying another Kicker isn’t going to happen. They should’ve done this before Camp even amidst all the forum scrutiny and mutiny and insults and pitch forks fights. I’m dying to get Captains input I’m sure he’d agree with me! I know how he just lived for Mason :laugh:
We should know where the pieces fall in a couple weeks. There is nothing more disheartening than to lose games at this level exclusively due to not just average but poor place kicking. Lombardi lost a potential championship crown in 1964 because he stayed with the worst kicker in the league. #5.
 

Mondio

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I finally watched the game. It was better than sucking, that is true, but not much to really take from it. Good efforts, some nice plays, but very hard for me to take much away from it when familiar names are playing against a lot of unfamiliar ones. Saw lots of sloppy play too, which is completely expected and that allowed some of the "good" offensive and defensive plays I saw. Those won't happen very often against a set NFL roster.

The kicker can kick, now he just has to consistently kick them thru the uprights :). I've said since forever, replacing kickers isn't easy, which is why for so long I was perfectly happy paying Mason. I'm definitely not throwing in the towel on this kid, but i hope he figures it out quickly. My hope is they're trying to correct something in mechanics and it's taking a bit to work it out, but he'll be fine. But we'll see. If you want to be anything in this league, you need a kicker.
 

Pokerbrat2000

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Oh man, another head case. Is it too much to ask to just be a Pro. He is getting paid plenty.
Again, not sure if it's because of his head or not. I heard that he is now working on slowing down his rhythm. The point is, asking him to be a Pro and go out there and never miss again, isn't solving a thing.

If you have ever golfed or really played just about any sport that requires fine motor skills, you would understand what kickers go through. I could go weeks of playing great golf and then suddenly I start hooking every tee shot. Is it my mechanics or just in my head? One slight thing could be off, maybe that short fall off the ladder changed something physically? Did I overdue it in the weight room? Maybe that second drink last night just has me off, etc. Think of how often you have seen a QB throw a bad pass or even just a little off target. What happened? Why can't he throw a perfect pass every time?

I don't think that The Packers give up on Anders anytime soon. They invested a 5th round pick in him and they aren't just going to toss that away. If they do decide to cut Anders, it is because they have decided that scouting was completely wrong about the guy and he isn't NFL caliber. If that is the case, whomever suggested to Gute that Anders should be drafted with a relatively high pick for a kicker, shouldn't get a bonus this year.
 

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No humidity like Midwest... Today they said hot n muggy.. 108 high and 20 percent Humidty...lol!
I just got back to FL after 10 weeks in Green Bay. The humidity in the Midwest is nothing like the sultry air around here in the summer. The dew points here are in the mid-70s. You walk out the door and you are covered with sweat in no time at all. Folks in GB complain about the muggies if the dew point goes above 60°. lol
 

gopkrs

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I saw that Kraft play where the ball was intercepted again last night and I am pretty certain that ball was throw behind him and basically right to the defender. I don't think Kraft had much of a chance to break it up. Just not a good throw.
 
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Again, not sure if it's because of his head or not. I heard that he is now working on slowing down his rhythm. The point is, asking him to be a Pro and go out there and never miss again, isn't solving a thing.

If you have ever golfed or really played just about any sport that requires fine motor skills, you would understand what kickers go through. I could go weeks of playing great golf and then suddenly I start hooking every tee shot. Is it my mechanics or just in my head? One slight thing could be off, maybe that short fall off the ladder changed something physically? Did I overdue it in the weight room? Maybe that second drink last night just has me off, etc. Think of how often you have seen a QB throw a bad pass or even just a little off target. What happened? Why can't he throw a perfect pass every time?

I don't think that The Packers give up on Anders anytime soon. They invested a 5th round pick in him and they aren't just going to toss that away. If they do decide to cut Anders, it is because they have decided that scouting was completely wrong about the guy and he isn't NFL caliber. If that is the case, whomever suggested to Gute that Anders should be drafted with a relatively high pick for a kicker, shouldn't get a bonus this year.
He needs to do like I do when golfing to correct my slice. Aim like 15 feet to the left of the goalpost and go ahead and slice her like a pepperoni pizza :coffee:
 

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He needs to do like I do when golfing to correct my slice. Aim like 15 feet to the left of the goalpost and go ahead and slice her like a pepperoni pizza :coffee:
The bad part is that the more they tinker with what he's doing, the worse it gets. For some of these guys, even the kicking approach is different. Slowing his approach will get into his head. Like mentioned, you get the "yips" just like you do in most sports, and it spirals out of control.

This is not a good scenario right now. Unless it's resolved in the next 10 to 12 days, we could end up going into this season with a serious problem with kicking. That seems to be something this coaching staff and front office tends to have happen way too often.
 

Pokerbrat2000

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The bad part is that the more they tinker with what he's doing, the worse it gets. For some of these guys, even the kicking approach is different. Slowing his approach will get into his head. Like mentioned, you get the "yips" just like you do in most sports, and it spirals out of control.

This is not a good scenario right now. Unless it's resolved in the next 10 to 12 days, we could end up going into this season with a serious problem with kicking. That seems to be something this coaching staff and front office tends to have happen way too often.
Honestly, I think you can have this problem with any kicker at any point in time. Glad it is happening now and not 2 games into the season. It's probably more likely that a rookie either doesn't get a chance to work it out or it takes him longer to get out of the funk. Look at Crosby in 2012, people were screaming for his head on a platter. Had he been a rookie, I think he would have been gone midseason. Funny thing about that season, Crosby's FG% was a measly 63%, yet he was 100% on XP's (50 of 50). Of course XP's were kicked from 13 yards closer too.
 

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I like the optimism, but until Barry can prove that his defense is effective in keeping other teams off the board, I'm going to be very skeptical about the chances of this team doing well. I think that the offense is not even close to being in the top 1/4 of the league, and may not even be part of the top 1/2.

This year is going to be a turning point of sorts. If the defense is inadequate, and the offense sputters too much, we could be in the lower 4 to 7 teams in the league. If both click? We could win a little over half our games. This just isn't a team that's built to win championships, or compete for them, at this point.
Disagree with the bolded part of your post. If both the offense and defense "click" this year, we'll win 13 games imo. Very few NFL teams have both a clicking offense and defense.
 

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Disagree with the bolded part of your post. If both the offense and defense "click" this year, we'll win 13 games imo. Very few NFL teams have both a clicking offense and defense.
I wish I had your optimism. So many years of following football tells me that it's a process. Especially when you're going into a year where you've been so cash strapped that you couldn't effectively bring in higher level FAs to fill gaps. Every injury will be a disaster, and let's face it. The NFL is a source of a lot of them.

add to that, the fact that the defense has not shown it can control the game in the past. What has suddenly happened that makes them that good? I don't see it.

On offense, I don't think for a heartbeat that Love is going to set the world on fire. He has young receivers out there to throw to, and the offensive line is supect, again, because of the lack of money to bring in experienced vets to fill gaps. If anyone thinks you're going to win in the NFL by running the football, they're mistaken. If you reach nearly 50% runs, you're in the upper tier in that area, but you still need to throw the ball. If you aren't making 5 yards a pop with your running game, you're dead in the water. One 15 yard penalty and your running game disappears in a heart beat. With 1st and 25, you ain't getting it done on the ground.

Back to defense. Over the last few years, I've said repeatedly that to win games, the Packers offense has to score over 30 points a game consistently. If you look at the record, and the games, that's the reality. Love and company aren't going to do that.

Like the optimism, just can't jump on board. I'll be happy with 7 wins, if I see that there's some talent developing out there, and that Love has the makings of a decent signal caller.
 

Pokerbrat2000

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I wish I had your optimism. So many years of following football tells me that it's a process. Especially when you're going into a year where you've been so cash strapped that you couldn't effectively bring in higher level FAs to fill gaps. Every injury will be a disaster, and let's face it. The NFL is a source of a lot of them.

add to that, the fact that the defense has not shown it can control the game in the past. What has suddenly happened that makes them that good? I don't see it.

On offense, I don't think for a heartbeat that Love is going to set the world on fire. He has young receivers out there to throw to, and the offensive line is supect, again, because of the lack of money to bring in experienced vets to fill gaps. If anyone thinks you're going to win in the NFL by running the football, they're mistaken. If you reach nearly 50% runs, you're in the upper tier in that area, but you still need to throw the ball. If you aren't making 5 yards a pop with your running game, you're dead in the water. One 15 yard penalty and your running game disappears in a heart beat. With 1st and 25, you ain't getting it done on the ground.

Back to defense. Over the last few years, I've said repeatedly that to win games, the Packers offense has to score over 30 points a game consistently. If you look at the record, and the games, that's the reality. Love and company aren't going to do that.

Like the optimism, just can't jump on board. I'll be happy with 7 wins, if I see that there's some talent developing out there, and that Love has the makings of a decent signal caller.
Well stated and I agree.

The stars, the moon and the Bermuda triangle would all have to align for the Packers to be a 10+ game winner in 2023. As much as Packer fans want to see another winning season, I think some are setting themselves up for disappointment. Your 7 win benchmark is probably a good one. I think if they stay relatively healthy, that could be reached, but injuries to any key starters, might mean only a 4-5 win season.
 

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Disagree with the bolded part of your post. If both the offense and defense "click" this year, we'll win 13 games imo. Very few NFL teams have both a clicking offense and defense.
While I do think that if the defense plays up to its potential, it has the makings of what a 13 win team needs. However, the offense, even if clicking, is going to have to be clicking way beyond realistic expectations to achieve the 13 wins.
 

milani

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Again, not sure if it's because of his head or not. I heard that he is now working on slowing down his rhythm. The point is, asking him to be a Pro and go out there and never miss again, isn't solving a thing.

If you have ever golfed or really played just about any sport that requires fine motor skills, you would understand what kickers go through. I could go weeks of playing great golf and then suddenly I start hooking every tee shot. Is it my mechanics or just in my head? One slight thing could be off, maybe that short fall off the ladder changed something physically? Did I overdue it in the weight room? Maybe that second drink last night just has me off, etc. Think of how often you have seen a QB throw a bad pass or even just a little off target. What happened? Why can't he throw a perfect pass every time?

I don't think that The Packers give up on Anders anytime soon. They invested a 5th round pick in him and they aren't just going to toss that away. If they do decide to cut Anders, it is because they have decided that scouting was completely wrong about the guy and he isn't NFL caliber. If that is the case, whomever suggested to Gute that Anders should be drafted with a relatively high pick for a kicker, shouldn't get a bonus this year.
You are right about mechanics and motor skills. I think of the great Ted Williams as a baseball hitter. Even he went into an occasional slump. Recall Crosby missing those kicks in Cincy after setting a Packer streak then being given a fourth chance after the Bengal kicker returned the favor. None of us ever want to see a kicker miss chip shots like the Viking-Packer game that resulted in a tie. But it was not the first time.
 

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The way he stood at the line and his body type, I'm thinking Bosa brothers. One can hope. If the coaches are telling him not to bull rush and if it is a strength; he could be tough to contain.
Yeah physically he does look more like the Bosa bros and that guy TJ Watt from WI...... Ouch. Well the past is past. I'm optimistic Van Ness can be the real deal with the right coaching. He damn sure looks the part.
 

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I have no doubt that there are plenty of guys that are willing to kick for the Packers, but just how good are they? Why aren't they kicking for another team if they are good?

Again, I think people have unrealistic expectations on Kickers, they aren't just plug and play. Look around the NFL and every Sunday you have guys missing XP's and chip shot FG's. Training Camp, practices and preseason is the time to work all the kinks out of the process of LS to holder to kicker, as well as line blocking. Lots of precision timing involved and I would guess lots of changes on moving parts for Anders (holder and snapper).

I don't think Gute used a 5th round pick on a guy that they don't feel strongly about. Sure, bring in another kicker, if you think the competition will help push Anders to faster improvement. Could also do the opposite, get into his head and make things worse. Anyone remember Anders brother Daniel? He was selected by the Vikings in the 5th round of the 2018 draft. 2 games into his rookie season, he missed 3 critical kicks against.....the Packers and was waived the next day. Raiders picked him up and he's become a damn good kicker, especially after the Raiders moved to Vegas (CBSsports has him ranked #2). I'm not guaranteeing that Anders will turn out just like his brother, but it's way too early to throw-in the towel on his career.

yeah no towel...but make sure you have a bag when you go to lambeau later this fall..lol
 

Pokerbrat2000

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yeah no towel...but make sure you have a bag when you go to lambeau later this fall..lol
Maybe this woman will loan me her cheese bra?

One of the funnier moments from Kevin Harlan and John Kuhn during the Friday night broadcast.

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PikeBadger

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I wish I had your optimism. So many years of following football tells me that it's a process. Especially when you're going into a year where you've been so cash strapped that you couldn't effectively bring in higher level FAs to fill gaps. Every injury will be a disaster, and let's face it. The NFL is a source of a lot of them.

add to that, the fact that the defense has not shown it can control the game in the past. What has suddenly happened that makes them that good? I don't see it.

On offense, I don't think for a heartbeat that Love is going to set the world on fire. He has young receivers out there to throw to, and the offensive line is supect, again, because of the lack of money to bring in experienced vets to fill gaps. If anyone thinks you're going to win in the NFL by running the football, they're mistaken. If you reach nearly 50% runs, you're in the upper tier in that area, but you still need to throw the ball. If you aren't making 5 yards a pop with your running game, you're dead in the water. One 15 yard penalty and your running game disappears in a heart beat. With 1st and 25, you ain't getting it done on the ground.

Back to defense. Over the last few years, I've said repeatedly that to win games, the Packers offense has to score over 30 points a game consistently. If you look at the record, and the games, that's the reality. Love and company aren't going to do that.

Like the optimism, just can't jump on board. I'll be happy with 7 wins, if I see that there's some talent developing out there, and that Love has the makings of a decent signal caller.
Well, I was just saying that I disagreed with his premise that if both the offense and defense clicked we'd likely go 9-8. Most teams don't have an offense and defense clicking consistently. The ones that do are piling up big win totals, not going 9-8.
 

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While I do think that if the defense plays up to its potential, it has the makings of what a 13 win team needs. However, the offense, even if clicking, is going to have to be clicking way beyond realistic expectations to achieve the 13 wins.
Disagree. The schedule doesn't appear to be very difficult (though that's impossible to really know at this point). A consistently clicking offense and defense turns up 12-14 wins. I just don't see them consistently clicking on offense but not so much because of Love.
 

Pokerbrat2000

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Disagree. The schedule doesn't appear to be very difficult (though that's impossible to really know at this point). A consistently clicking offense and defense turns up 12-14 wins. I just don't see them consistently clicking on offense but not so much because of Love.
I guess it's a matter of defining "clicking" and expectations of what would result from it. You added the word "consistently" to your first statement and that changes things quite a bit. No doubt if an offense is "consistently clicking", it could help carry a team, especially if the defense is doing the same. But as you stated and I agree, I don't expect much consistency from the offense this season. First time starter, young WR and TE room and potentially some question marks on the OL, could make for a roller coaster ride.

Timing of this offense clicking, whether consistent or not, is also important to consider. I don't expect a lot of clicking to happen for at least half the season. Meaning after 8 or 9 games, the Packers could find themselves with only 2-4 wins. What they do in the 2nd half of this season, could go a long way towards improving in 2024.
 

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Well, I was just saying that I disagreed with his premise that if both the offense and defense clicked we'd likely go 9-8. Most teams don't have an offense and defense clicking consistently. The ones that do are piling up big win totals, not going 9-8.
The 1996 Packers comes to mind on both sides of the ball...And special teams.
 
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Honestly, I think you can have this problem with any kicker at any point in time. Glad it is happening now and not 2 games into the season. It's probably more likely that a rookie either doesn't get a chance to work it out or it takes him longer to get out of the funk. Look at Crosby in 2012, people were screaming for his head on a platter. Had he been a rookie, I think he would have been gone midseason. Funny thing about that season, Crosby's FG% was a measly 63%, yet he was 100% on XP's (50 of 50). Of course XP's were kicked from 13 yards closer too.
On a good note. One positive is he had 1 day recently where he went 9/10 and hit from 50, 55, 60. He’s got the leg and he has had complete days with stellar performance. It’s not like he’s never kicked consistent, he just needs to string more days together with 1 or 2 less misses.
He’s normally 1 XPM across a day away from us not even talking about him. He’s got Pedigree and conceivably he should get slightly better as he gets more continuity with the LS and place Holder.

The kid can hit a 57 yarder like it’s a 47 yarder it doesn’t phase him. It’s more consistency on the medium range stuff. The difference in this league between great and bad is just 1 miss every other week. He’s got the 3-point shot down, he needs some work on the jump-fade shot off the paint. Call Michael Jordan!
 
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Voyageur

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He's consistent when he gets to kick several in a row. That's called practicing to be good. That doesn't happen in games. You go in cold, and are expected to hit it the first time you swing your leg. The sideline practice into a net doesn't emulate accuracy, just loosens the leg.

If he's having any problems in practice, it will be worse in games. That's my biggest concern.

That said, I've gotten used to this batch of Packer leadership being tone deaf on how the kicking game should be handled.
 
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