Fire Matt LaFleur

[adambr2]

Thats not something an experienced varsity HS football player should have to be “coached” on.

And yet the experienced NFL player player still did it.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

A little more from Schefter:

“There’s no deal right now, and it’s a negotiation. When there’s a negotiation and there’s no deal, there could be a breakthrough at any moment. I think both sides would like to make that happen, but... they’ve been trying to do this for a little while and still have not gotten it figured out. The longer it lingers, the more you wonder where it’s going to go and how it’s going to result. The way I would interpret it right now is that it’s up in the air."

"I do believe there’s a time limit, absolutely, because there are all these openings. I firmly believe most places would have a high level of interest in Matt LaFleur. Now you’re saying the Packers part ways. I don’t know whether they wouldn’t hold him up and say, ‘OK, Team X, you want him, give us a third-round pick or a second-round pick.’"

I just think that Matt is trying to figure out what he wants to do and he won't get the call in on time for Packer Management to do anything but to call a timeout.

 

[milani]

Again, mostly just rhetoric on your part, seemingly to try and fit your narrative that:



I will address what you said.

The most important thing that you need to keep in mind is this. Players in all major sports work with doctors and medical people outside of the team. This is the case with surgeries, reoccurring injuries, rehab and training. That isn't just something that a small town football team like the Packers do.

"Christian Watson sought outside help for recurrent hamstring issues"

After the 2023 season Watson, Stokes and some of the Packer training staff visited the University of Wisconsin's Badger Athletic Performance Center. A facility that the NFL gave a $4M grant to, for further research on identifying modifiable risk factors for hamstring strains, the most common NFL injury. It was determined that Watson has asymmetry in his 2 legs. Meaning, he had a little less strength in his right leg compared to his left, which can put more strain on the left side. Given that information, he worked with both the Packers and Badgers trainers to address it.

"David Bahktiari's recovery was completely botched leading to his retirement. That's highly unusual."

Bahktiari's 5 surgeries on his knee were more the problem, surgeries performed by 3 different doctors. I don't really what happened to Bahk as a reflection of the Packer training staff not knowing how to prevent injuries.

As far as your conversation about the Packers weekly injury report and how it compares to other teams injury reports, I would ask you to break down all the injuries, designations (LP, DNP, FP). As you probably know, each team has their own strategy with who practices and how it is reported. Some of that is medical and some of that is strategic.

"In 2025, the Packers averaged 15.2 players each week on the injury report. That must interfere with getting enough practice as well as conditioning."

I can' find any source for that, can you point me to it? Are you including players on IR since the beginning of the season?

"Nearly all the Packers best young players are injury prone or get a season ending injury."

Is that statistically speaking or just an observation on your part?

I suppose we could all have an honest discussion about the Packers training staff, medical team and overall conditioning of the team. However, I am still wondering why you want to blame MLF for a problem, if one exists. Hiring and firing for the Packers' medical staff generally falls under the purview of the Team Physician leadership, currently led by Head Physician Dr. Michael K. Ryan and Senior Medical Advisor Dr. Patrick McKenzie, working in coordination with the team's overall football operations and executive leadership.

If Watson keeps trying to leap tall buildings like he did last week he will have plenty of HARD tissue injuries as well as soft ones.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Yeah, true enough... although playing devil's advocate (and this ties in to the remark regarding QB development/individual performance), that might be a chicken vs egg thing to some degree. Rodgers had some fairly "down" years (by his standards) before seemingly having it click with LaFleur's offense and stringing together those two MVP years. He wasn't playing at an MVP-level when LaFleur "inherited" him. It's hard for me to say exactly how to split the credit there but I do think LaFleur still has to get at least SOME credit for those 13-3 years. (And we did go 13-3 when Rodgers went for "just" 4000 yards and 26TD....Compared to his MVP-seasons with 4300/4100 and 48/37 TD)

Toss in Rodgers record with the Jets and even this season with the Steelers, yes an older Rodgers, but not the ONLY reason Matt was successful while Rodgers was on the team.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

If Watson keeps trying to leap tall buildings like he did last week he will have plenty of HARD tissue injuries as well as soft ones.

Agree. Always a "fun" thing for fans to see, but probably not the best thing for a players body.

I would also love to know how many players are injured during "celebrations". There was a star IU player that ended his season after injuring his leg celebrating with fans after the Big10 Championship game in Dec. I believe I saw a Miami Hurricane player do the same thing while coming off the field and chest bumping with a teammate.

Notable Examples of NFL Celebration Injuries:

• Bill Gramatica (Kicker): Tore his ACL jumping after kicking a field goal, before anyone touched him.
• Gus Frerotte (Quarterback): Headbutted a concrete wall after a touchdown, spraining his neck.
• Lamar Houston (Defensive End): Tore his ACL celebrating a sack, ending his season.
• Stephen Tulloch (Linebacker): Suffered a torn ACL during a sack dance.
• Ted Ginn Jr. (Wide Receiver): Sprained his foot after a teammate tackled him in celebration after a kickoff return touchdown.
• Tyrell Shavers & Gabe Davis (Wide Receivers): Both suffered torn ACLs during the same playoff game in January 2026, with Shavers' injury occurring during a celebration.

 

[gopkrs]

Thats not something an experienced varsity HS football player should have to be “coached” on.

Evidently it is. And in general, basics should always be part of practicing. Like when to go out of bounds and not. There are a million things.

 

[JoePack]

Evidently it is. And in general, basics should always be part of practicing. Like when to go out bounds and not. There are a million

It's hard to believe when our def back intercepted a 4th down pass instead of just knocking it down. They've played their whole life and should at least have instincts of what to do in those type of plays.

 

[rmontro]

Evidently it is. And in general, basics should always be part of practicing. Like when to go out of bounds and not. There are a million things.

That ball was thrown right at him, I almost wonder if he just kind of inadvertently caught it out of instinct, and by that time it was too late to do anything about it. But anyway, it's always helpful to practice or review the fundamentals.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

It's hard to believe when our def back intercepted a 4th down pass instead of just knocking it down. They've played their whole life and should at least have instincts of what to do in those type of plays.

"Individual accomplishments over team accomplishments"

"Money over Winning"

Now I am sure that Valentine and others will say it was just "muscle memory and instinct". Unfortunately, those are the kinds of mistakes that can cost your team a game.

 

[mradtke66]

Now I am sure that Valentine and others will say it was just "muscle memory and instinct". Unfortunately, those are the kinds of mistakes that can cost your team a game.

I yelled at the TV myself. Defensive scores are so valuable, it wouldn't surprise me if he thought he had a return lane.

I'm decidedly neutral on this one.

 

[rmontro]

I yelled at the TV myself. Defensive scores are so valuable, it wouldn't surprise me if he thought he had a return lane.

That's possible.

 

[Magooch]

I yelled at the TV myself. Defensive scores are so valuable, it wouldn't surprise me if he thought he had a return lane.

I'm decidedly neutral on this one.

That's my thinking too. He had a LOT of green in front of him and was probably anticipating a return. The bigger "issue" in that case is just that he seems to adjust ever-so-slightly too late and ends up slipping a bit to make the catch.

 

[Magooch]

I do also think, if nothing else, we can probably safely rule out Matt being straight-up fired at this point. If that was their intention, that would've happened by now IMO. I can't see any advantage to drawing it out. Either they are still trying to hash out terms (and think they are close enough that an agreement will ultimately be reached) or they really are shopping a possible trade.

Further, I would add... if the organization was happy and willing to pay Matt his "market rate" (which I am sure he is asking for), it would already be done by now.

So we can likely say with some degree of confidence:

1. The team doesn't intend to just fire him outright
2. The team doesn't intend to pay him market rate / without reservations

And as such we should be able to reasonably conclude that:

1. The team wants to ultimately extend LaFleur, but with reservations - they will need him to come down from his desired deal before they're willing to continue
2. The team is intending to trade and is either actively shopping for offers, playing it slow and waiting for offers to arrive, or in the process of working out a deal

It does *seem* at least that there is some degree of hesitation on the team's part. One would think that if the team were absolutely convinced LaFleur was the guy to lead them to the Super Bowl they would not have much to quibble over with regards to salary. If you want to pay 10m and LaFleur wants 12m, 15m...wouldn't you be okay with paying an extra 2-5m/yr if you were convinced it would bring home the Lombardi?

I do also note that there's still been relatively little activity yet from anyone else (besides firings, I mean). Harbaugh seems to be the "big prize" for many but he is being rather slow and selective. I do wonder if other teams aren't in any rush to get anything done as they're first keeping an eye on the "LaFleur-situation"?

Ironically, Hafley is probably a factor too. If he leaves for a HC job, we will obviously need a new DC. But it's tough to convince a coordinator to join when your HC is on the tail end of his contract. So we would need clarity at HC in all likelihood before replacing our DC, too.

 

[AKCheese]

Isn’t it correct that no team can talk to MLF w/o GB’s permission… but GB can talk to any of the available coaches?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I yelled at the TV myself. Defensive scores are so valuable, it wouldn't surprise me if he thought he had a return lane.

I'm decidedly neutral on this one.

Burden was right there and tackled him before he could even get up and get his balance to try and return the ball. Wasn't much different than when Nixon intercepted the ball in the EZ against the Bears on 4th down in their first game. The smarter play, just knock the ball safely out of bounds.

I don't get too upset over too many of the physical mistakes that we see, like dropped passes, slipping, etc. but the mental ones like Valentines irritate me. Maybe it is because I don't have the physicality to even be a H.S. football player right now, yet alone, a player in the NFL. However, I have the mental acuity to know "boneheaded mistakes" when I see them.

I don't know much about Valentine and his mental fitness and lets face it, there are really football smart players and there are ones that made it due mostly to their physical talents.

That was one thing I did appreciate about Aaron Rodgers, possibly one of the smarter players, when it comes to football, to ever play the game.

It does remind me of something I heard Bulaga, Tausch and Wild talk about earleir today. That of the team possibly lacking real team leaders, guys that take charge and players respect. Guys that talk a lot on the field to motivate teammates. Love is a talented QB, but I don't see him really as a team leader. He kind of just does his thing and then goes and sits on the sideline. On defense? I mean even when Parsons was healthy, he just lead by example, which is a start.

 

[rmontro]

It does remind me of something I heard Bulaga, Tausch and Wild talk about earleir today. That of the team possibly lacking real team leaders, guys that take charge and players respect.

Comes with being the youngest team in the league, most likely.

 

[El Guapo]

It does remind me of something I heard Bulaga, Tausch and Wild talk about earleir today. That of the team possibly lacking real team leaders, guys that take charge and players respect. Guys that talk a lot on the field to motivate teammates. Love is a talented QB, but I don't see him really as a team leader. He kind of just does his thing and then goes and sits on the sideline. On defense? I mean even when Parsons was healthy, he just lead by example, which is a start.

I just finished listening to a podcast, which was really just Mike Daniels venting about his love for a coach like Ben Johnson (fire and attitude) and disdain that his the Packers don't have that fire. He talked about all of the "dogs" that we have from Georgia that have 'had their fangs dulled' by the culture in Green Bay / Wisconsin. Our players are expected to act classy. An early personal foul is criticized as stupidity versus setting the tone for a game. IDK - interesting takes from Daniels on how he actually really likes LaFleur and knows that LaFleur understands that you need dogs on your team. However, they aren't there except for Micah.

Ron Wolf changed the culture in the Green Bay organization from the coaching to the locker room to the janitorial staff. Policy could do the same thing if he understands what the organization lacks. Gutekunst can keep drafting the right players, but somebody has to coax that attitude out of players during games.

 

[BrokenArrow]

One of the real weaknesses is that one yard pickup. And partly because we do not have a line made for bulldozing or tge Tush push. Allen with Buffalo gets just about all the 4th and 1s or 3rd and 1s. To get it the Packers have to throw the ball. And we do not carry a FB like Frisco or Minny. So if you put a TE back there defenses automatically see him as a blocker because he is a fish out of water. With a FB he can carry the ball, block or even hit the flat for a pass.

I miss William Henderson

 

[rick1255]

This from Wikipedia:
Despite owning the best winning percentage of any NFL head coach in the league's history, 49ers management did not offer an extension on Seifert's contract. 49ers team president Carmen Policy desired to hire California head coach Steve Mariucci to the same position in the 49ers organization. Policy offered Seifert the opportunity to remain head coach for the final year of his contract, with Mariucci serving as offensive coordinator and head coach-in-waiting. Seifert then resigned. His 98 wins are still the most in franchise history.

I know that my previous post was poo pooed, but I don't see Ed PolICY as a paper tiger as some here do. (ie Mark Murphy)
But we will see, no problem eating crow with lots of hot sause.

 

[gopkrs]

This from Wikipedia:
Despite owning the best winning percentage of any NFL head coach in the league's history, 49ers management did not offer an extension on Seifert's contract. 49ers team president Carmen Policy desired to hire California head coach Steve Mariucci to the same position in the 49ers organization. Policy offered Seifert the opportunity to remain head coach for the final year of his contract, with Mariucci serving as offensive coordinator and head coach-in-waiting. Seifert then resigned. His 98 wins are still the most in franchise history.

I know that my previous post was poo pooed, but I don't see Ed PolICY as a paper tiger as some here do. (ie Mark Murphy)
But we will see, no problem eating crow with lots of hot sause.

That didn't sound like a good move

 

[Sanguine camper]

I'd say both have been replaced and done so effectively. Yes, we have to re-sign Jenkins' replacement (Rhyan) but he should be very affordable.

While Ryhan was shifted over to replace Jenkins, doing so reduces depth. To replenish depth with a quality player, Gute will need to expend a very precious draft picks. In that regard, replacing a starter even with a current player on the roster usually means you need to devote precious resources to the position group.

 

[gopkrs]

While Ryhan was shifted over to replace Jenkins, doing so reduces depth. To replenish depth with a quality player, Gute will need to expend a very precious draft picks. In that regard, replacing a starter even with a current player on the roster usually means you need to devote precious resources to the position group.

Well, the O line needs improvement. We can't continue with 3rd and 4 being an easier pickup than 3rd and 1.

 

[Sanguine camper]

I guess I have to ask you 2 things.

First, if you look at 4 of the most impactful injuries for the Packers this season, Kraft, Parsons, Wyatt and Jenkins , what is your recommendation(s) to the Packers medical staff to do, to prevent these types of injuries?

Which NFL teams do you think have the best medical staffs and what are they doing differently?

What I would do in a position of a manager in the front office like Gute is turn over every stone to see if somebody else has a better track record on injuries and why. There are probably sports medicine experts on other franchises or perhaps even other contact sports with some good ideas as to what works. Better to deal with the experts on the subject.

I would also develop some type of durability rating system when scouting players. Players who are hurt a lot in college don't tend to become more durable. Injury prone players usually don't become stars because they're hurt so often but their unavailability hurts depth and takes up valuable draft picks.

I would also like to see a study that compares injuries with cumulative changes in the schedule from the one week between games standard. Are teams that have more Thursday, Saturday and Monday games getting more injuries due to insufficient recovery?

While that's ultimately a league issue, if that would prove to be the case, teams like Detroit (3 Thursday games this year) and Green Bay whose schedule is a complete cluster*** seem to be getting plenty of injuries.

 

[Sanguine camper]

Well, the O line needs improvement. We can't continue with 3rd and 4 being an easier pickup than 3rd and 1.

Due to a lack of cap space, both Jenkins and Rasheed Walker could very well be gone. That would leave the Packets with little or no depth on the O line. Gute would need to spend draft picks on O linemen. That makes a ton of sense but there's an opportunity cost in that those picks can't be devoted to other places on the roster.

 

[OldSchool101]

One of the real weaknesses is that one yard pickup. And partly because we do not have a line made for bulldozing or tge Tush push. Allen with Buffalo gets just about all the 4th and 1s or 3rd and 1s. To get it the Packers have to throw the ball. And we do not carry a FB like Frisco or Minny. So if you put a TE back there defenses automatically see him as a blocker because he is a fish out of water. With a FB he can carry the ball, block or even hit the flat for a pass.

Where I was surprised is we had used Tucker one direct snap early season. We then went away from that over the remaining weeks until he was hurt. Tucker was 3/3 for 6 yards on 4th down tries this year. 100%.

Now I realize Tucker is a stud but I’m pretty sure one of our TE’s (including Tucker) could’ve been repeating that. We went away from that successful play and I’m curious why?