Fire Matt LaFleur

[OldSchool101]

That just makes it all the more aggravating that we weren't able to break through since the 2010 season. Over ten years of Aaron Rodgers while other teams came and went. But there was always one team ahead of us.

I understand Young Jordan is not Young Aaron, but I’m kind of excited to see what we can do to plug some needed holes in 2026, knowing that Parsons, Wyatt of Kraft will work their way back as the season professes.

There’s really only 4-5 players that singularly have a noticeable impact. We dodged a bullet with Love remaining healthy. But losing Parsons and Kraft and Wyatt was our best players at DE, TE, DT and then losing Watson and Reed for 1/2 season set us back some. Tom playing with a back injury on the side didn’t help matters much. I’m not even sure Jacobs has been normal for 3 straight games this year. That’s losing or playing hurt with our best players at nearly every position group but DB and LB. We couldn’t even keep our Placekicker healthy all season.

 

[rmontro]

There’s really only 4-5 players that singularly have a noticeable impact. We dodged a bullet with Love remaining healthy. But losing Parsons and Kraft and Wyatt was our best players at DE, TE, DT and then losing Watson and Reed for 1/2 season set us back some. Tom playing with a back injury on the side didn’t help matters much. I’m not even sure Jacobs has been normal for 3 straight games this year. That’s losing or playing hurt with our best players at nearly every position group but DB and LB. We couldn’t even keep our Placekicker healthy all season.

I'm not sure how much faith I have in MLF as a coach, but it's hard to blame him completely for GB's post-Rodgers shortcomings. The first year was Love's first year, and was pretty successful, as they won a playoff game on the road. Last year Love was never really healthy, and this year of course has been an injured mess.

 

[tynimiller]

I understand Young Jordan is not Young Aaron, but I’m kind of excited to see what we can do to plug some needed holes in 2026, knowing that Parsons, Wyatt of Kraft will work their way back as the season professes.

There’s really only 4-5 players that singularly have a noticeable impact. We dodged a bullet with Love remaining healthy. But losing Parsons and Kraft and Wyatt was our best players at DE, TE, DT and then losing Watson and Reed for 1/2 season set us back some. Tom playing with a back injury on the side didn’t help matters much. I’m not even sure Jacobs has been normal for 3 straight games this year. That’s losing or playing hurt with our best players at nearly every position group but DB and LB. We couldn’t even keep our Placekicker healthy all season.

I have zero hesitation saying that if Kraft and Parsons alone weren't injured we win the North easily.

 

[milani]

I have zero hesitation saying that if Kraft and Parsons alone weren't injured we win the North easily.

Well, we likely get 1 more and maybe 2 more wins.

 

[tynimiller]

Well, we likely get 1 more and maybe 2 more wins.

Which also likely means week 18 might mean more for seeding and we don't rest everyone.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I have zero hesitation saying that if Kraft and Parsons alone weren't injured we win the North easily.

So you're saying that in that case, the Packers might be the #2 seed and we would have a few weeks delay on some calling for Gute and MLF to be fired?

 

[tynimiller]

So you're saying that in that case, the Packers might be the #2 seed and we would have a few weeks delay on some calling for Gute and MLF to be fired?

Oh quite reasonable for sure to say we'd been playing for the #2 seed, whether we got it or not is of course not known.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Oh quite reasonable for sure to say we'd been playing for the #2 seed, whether we got it or not is of course not known.

Butterfly Effect. For every event that you change, how does that change every other event in the future?

Total sidenote. I am watching a Netflix Mini-Series (8 episodes) called "11.23.63". The Butterfly Effect is in full play with this one. Really good series from a Stephan King book. Stars James Franco and is really worth a watch.

 

[Pkrjones]

John Harbaugh not interviewing for HC jobs until next week. Apparently there are at least 2 teams currently in playoffs that are in-play for possible HC change (GB & Buffalo)? Pretty volatile carousel, with 1/4 of teams potentially making a HC change.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

John Harbaugh not interviewing for HC jobs until next week. Apparently there are at least 2 teams currently in playoffs that are in-play for possible HC change (GB & Buffalo)? Pretty volatile carousel, with 1/4 of teams potentially making a HC change.

Miami just fired McDaniel. Would love him as an OC.

 

[Magooch]

I'd agree that we'd likely be the #2 seed had Kraft and Parsons stayed healthy.

But I also believe we had every chance to be challenging for that position too had we taken care of business better when one or both of those guys were healthy. Been over this a few times already but we didn't lose to Cleveland or Carolina or tie with Dallas due to Parsons/Kraft injuries (or other injuries IMO). I don't think we lost to Philly due to being without Kraft. Would we have beat Chicago with those guys? Probably, but at the same time I don't think we lost *because* we didn't have them.

Flip those first three (Cleveland, Carolina, Dallas) to W's and we're a 12-win team and right in the thick of the hunt for the #2 seed. (#2 Bears - 11-6, #3 Eagles - 11-6, #5 Rams - 12-5, #6 49ers - 12-5). In that case we likely do actually try and play in week 18 vs Minnesota and that very well pushes us to 13 wins. Take care of business vs Chicago and we're pushing for 14 wins and a shot at the top seed.

And all of that was very much possible regardless of injuries. So to be fair there are two ways of looking at it. On one hand you could say "we had all these crucial injuries and were still a few plays here or there away from being a 12, 13-win team. On the other hand you can look at it and say "Yes we had all these injuries but in spite of that we were in a position to win these games and didn't see it through"

Miami just fired McDaniel. Would love him as an OC.

Same here. Although I'm not sure exactly how that would shake out with LaFleur. Truthfully as many have mentioned I'd rather have LaFleur as a dedicated OC with someone else making more of the in-game "head coach" decisions. I'm not sure exactly what it would look like (or how effective it would be) to have LaFleur giving up OC duties and presumably playcalling just to focus on the head coach stuff... part of me says that would be giving up his strength to focus more on his weakness. I dunno if that helps or hurts.

John Harbaugh not interviewing for HC jobs until next week. Apparently there are at least 2 teams currently in playoffs that are in-play for possible HC change (GB & Buffalo)? Pretty volatile carousel, with 1/4 of teams potentially making a HC change.

It was being reported shortly after he was fired...His agent claimed that they had calls from 7 teams within 45 minutes of news breaking. At that time there were only 7 head coach openings...one of which was the Ravens themselves, meaning even then there was at least one team who hadn't fired their coach yet who was inquiring as to availability...

 

[OldSchool101]

I'm not sure how much faith I have in MLF as a coach, but it's hard to blame him completely for GB's post-Rodgers shortcomings. The first year was Love's first year, and was pretty successful, as they won a playoff game on the road. Last year Love was never really healthy, and this year of course has been an injured mess.

Yes it’s ok to speak to injuries as it’s a part of the game. That said we have capable depth it just takes a couple games to rebound and recalibrate.

Really other than interior DL I don’t have too many concerns. Yet even then. I’m pretty sure we keep another DT active and we should have a better rotation. That = we can play some more 3 DT, 2 Edge players upfront
5-3-3, instead of our Softer, Thin like 4-3-4 and 4-2-5 approach to start with Baltimore. I’d even pull a Vikings move wherever line up 6 players upfront and then drop 1-2 from different sides with the snap or blitz a Safety off one side immediately.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Same here. Although I'm not sure exactly how that would shake out with LaFleur. Truthfully as many have mentioned I'd rather have LaFleur as a dedicated OC with someone else making more of the in-game "head coach" decisions. I'm not sure exactly what it would look like (or how effective it would be) to have LaFleur giving up OC duties and presumably playcalling just to focus on the head coach stuff... part of me says that would be giving up his strength to focus more on his weakness. I dunno if that helps or hurts.

Agree. I have been talking about this for awhile now and sadly, I do not think MLF will give up his bread and butter, which is offense. Now one could tell him "Matt, you will still have a huge say in the offensive game plan, coaching etc. but you just won't be the guy calling the plays on Sunday. We feel you need to just stay focused on the HC duties during games." Which is basically what I think would be best for the Packers. Sometimes egos get in the way of what is best and I just don't see Matt agreeing to hand over his play sheet.

 

[Magooch]

John Harbaugh not interviewing for HC jobs until next week. Apparently there are at least 2 teams currently in playoffs that are in-play for possible HC change (GB & Buffalo)? Pretty volatile carousel, with 1/4 of teams potentially making a HC change.

It was being reported shortly after he was fired...His agent claimed that they had calls from 7 teams within 45 minutes of news breaking. At that time there were only 7 head coach openings...one of which was the Ravens themselves, meaning even then there was at least one team who hadn't fired their coach yet who was inquiring as to availability...

More on this, just thinking through it. Here are the coaches who are left in playoffs...

Sean Payton Denver paid handsomely to bring him in as coach, and he's had them improving every year. Now they're the AFC's top seed and AFC betting favorites for the Super Bowl. 100% safe.
Mike Vrabel His first year with the Patriots and they've won the AFC East, tied for best overall record in the league, and just missed out on the AFC #1 seed. And made Drake Maye into arguably the MVP front-runner. Yeah, he's not going anywhere.
Liam Coen Completely turned them around. 4-13 last year, 13-4 this year. And he might've "fixed" Trevor Lawrence, who's playing like a total superstar right now and I believe is up to #3 in MVP odds.
Mike Tomlin Someone posted a meme of it over in the Black Monday firings thread how it was basically "made FG=Tomlin fired, missed FG=Harbaugh fired" and there's probably some truth to that. He might've saved his job by making the playoffs. Even if still on the hot seat I would be SHOCKED if they tried to make a play at Harbaugh given the context.
DeMeco Ryans I don't think there's any indication that the Texans are anything other than totally happy with DeMeco. Two AFC South titles in a row, and 2nd place this year, but still a 12-5 record. They've got the #1 defense in the league. His seat's ice cold.
Jim Harbaugh Yeah I think it probably goes without saying that the Chargers won't be firing Jim to bring in John LOL
Mike McDonald His second season as head coach, improved on last season (10-7 to 14-3) and earned the NFC's #1 seed. 100% safe.
Ben Johnson Chicago just paid huge money to make him their coach and all he did was take them from worst to first in the division and the NFC's #2 seed. Obviously won't be going anywhere now.
Nick Sirianni He's got the defending Super Bowl champs back in the playoffs after winning their division. He's safe.
Sean McVay McVay will probably be coaching the Rams until he decides he's ready to move on. Super Bowl win, Super Bowl appearance, 12-5 finish this year, and basically everyone wants to hire someone connected to his "tree"... Totally safe.
Kyle Shanahan He's already been to two Super Bowls and two NFCCGs on top of that. Played this season in arguably the toughest division in the league, also faced a ton of injuries, and still managed a 12-5 record. 100% safe.

And so that leaves just three names.
Dave Canales I've not heard any serious rumors here, but David Tepper is kind of a wild card and he certainly isn't afraid to swing for the fences. Canales won the NFC South this year, albeit with a losing record (8-9). That was an improvement on 5-12 last year. I get the sense that the Panthers feel like they're building something good with him and would like to continue, but he arguably has the worst "resume" of playoff coaches at the moment.
Sean McDermott He's been super successful in Buffalo, with a 0.662 win percentage in the regular season. And he DOES have 7 playoff wins, too....but also 7 playoff losses. He has yet to make it to the Super Bowl. This year, with no Mahomes, Burrow, or Jackson, you have to think there's a sense of "now or never". Would an early loss be enough to do it?
Matt LaFleur and finally, here we are. Another coach who has been wildly successful in the regular season (0.654) but less so in the postseason (3-5, 0.375). At the moment it seems like most indications are that he's safe but at the same time many league sources would suggest he needs a wild-card win this weekend to be "totally safe". You have to wonder if watching the Harbaugh-led Ravens come in to Lambeau and absolutely steamroll us would carry any sort of influence as well.

(I would also note that Harbaugh's next contract - assuming it is not with us - will weigh on Matt's possible contract negotiations, too)

 

[tynimiller]

What I'm about to write is going to shock many that think I'm like conjoined to MLF somehow...so fair warning given:

If you are Policy, and IF you are thinking parting ways with MLF is even on the table right now OR in the immediate future I would argue the most crucial thing is NOT how you feel about Matt LaFluer but Jeff Hafley.

Again operate under the assumption that Policy is even considering parting with Matt...how does he feel about Hafley. We've seen many franchises wipe out their HC only to see such a massive turnover in personnel on staff that good aspects of the culture created are severed. Jeff Hafley to me, is honestly the defensive version of Matt LaFluer. Both are articulate, they adore their players, they constantly are trying to be the consumet professional....

I think Matt's job potentially or one could make a solid case is tied as much to what Policy thinks of MLF as it is what he thinks the future of Hafley is.

I've already said I'd not let MLF walk, BUT I also am not intimately close with staff - the question I have is IF Policy is in that boat....that is a crazy walk on eggshells scenario he has to try and figure out....

 

[adambr2]

What I'm about to write is going to shock many that think I'm like conjoined to MLF somehow...so fair warning given:

If you are Policy, and IF you are thinking parting ways with MLF is even on the table right now OR in the immediate future I would argue the most crucial thing is NOT how you feel about Matt LaFluer but Jeff Hafley.

Again operate under the assumption that Policy is even considering parting with Matt...how does he feel about Hafley. We've seen many franchises wipe out their HC only to see such a massive turnover in personnel on staff that good aspects of the culture created are severed. Jeff Hafley to me, is honestly the defensive version of Matt LaFluer. Both are articulate, they adore their players, they constantly are trying to be the consumet professional....

I think Matt's job potentially or one could make a solid case is tied as much to what Policy thinks of MLF as it is what he thinks the future of Hafley is.

I've already said I'd not let MLF walk, BUT I also am not intimately close with staff - the question I have is IF Policy is in that boat....that is a crazy walk on eggshells scenario he has to try and figure out....

Good thought, I like Hafley and I think he may indeed make a good HC.

My response would be that I see the Packers as a highly conservative organization, and even if they internally believe that Hafley might make a better HC than MLF, they will err on the side of not rocking the boat.

With that being said I would have assumed based on the same logic that they would never in a million years trade for Micah Parsons.

 

[Magooch]

I've thought about this a little bit too.

From kind of another angle, I am assuming (please) that Bisaccia is gone. And unfortunately it sounds like Hafley may well be leaving too. If that's the case I could see that working in LaFleur's favor. I think they would probably prefer to avoid replacing ALL their high level coaching staff... Right or wrong there is probably some calculation where you conclude that keeping LaFleur (even if you are less than perfectly happy about it) and just having to replace your DC and ST coordinator is preferable to having to replace ST, DC, HC, and possibly OC too

 

[Pkrjones]

With 7+ HC openings you'd think Hafley would be in strong consideration, somewhere. IF Hafley leaves this would be the ideal time to "start over", IMHO.

Interesting thought, however, to consider Hafley as HC assuming he agrees to hire a DC to run the D (with his system & mindset?) AND an OC to run the O.

Don't know intimate details on mentality & personality, but would be ironic to consider weakening a North opponent by considering Bear's Al Harris for DC & Bienemy for OC?

 

[milani]

I've thought about this a little bit too.

From kind of another angle, I am assuming (please) that Bisaccia is gone. And unfortunately it sounds like Hafley may well be leaving too. If that's the case I could see that working in LaFleur's favor. I think they would probably prefer to avoid replacing ALL their high level coaching staff... Right or wrong there is probably some calculation where you conclude that keeping LaFleur (even if you are less than perfectly happy about it) and just having to replace your DC and ST coordinator is preferable to having to replace ST, DC, HC, and possibly OC too

Other than Hafley acquiring a job elsewhere I have this feeling that everything will remain as it is now.

 

[SudsMcBucky]

I can't remember where I read it, but I saw somewhere that an MLF extension is waitiing more on the MLF side (maybe more money???) rather than the Packers not trying to extend him.

 

[Magooch]

Agree. I have been talking about this for awhile now and sadly, I do not think MLF will give up his bread and butter, which is offense. Now one could tell him "Matt, you will still have a huge say in the offensive game plan, coaching etc. but you just won't be the guy calling the plays on Sunday. We feel you need to just stay focused on the HC duties during games." Which is basically what I think would be best for the Packers. Sometimes egos get in the way of what is best and I just don't see Matt agreeing to hand over his play sheet.

Yeah pretty much the short of it for me too is like.... If you have Matt give up his play calling or even further his offensive scheming...what exactly does he bring to the table at that point? Not even hating but I feel like that's by far his biggest asset right now, the rest is somewhat unremarkable IMO...

 

[milani]

I can't remember where I read it, but I saw somewhere that an MLF extension is waitiing more on the MLF side (maybe more money???) rather than the Packers not trying to extend him.

Could be.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Yeah pretty much the short of it for me too is like.... If you have Matt give up his play calling or even further his offensive scheming...what exactly does he bring to the table at that point? Not even hating but I feel like that's by far his biggest asset right now, the rest is somewhat unremarkable IMO...

True.

Matt's best asset is his offensive mind. I often question his HC abilities when I am seeing them on display, which is during games. My hope would be that if he wasn't busy play calling, he would become a better game time HC.

 

[tynimiller]

Good thought, I like Hafley and I think he may indeed make a good HC.

My response would be that I see the Packers as a highly conservative organization, and even if they internally believe that Hafley might make a better HC than MLF, they will err on the side of not rocking the boat.

With that being said I would have assumed based on the same logic that they would never in a million years trade for Micah Parsons.

I will say Packers could keep MLF, cut Rich entirely and then offer Hafley more money and give him the position as assistant head coach...truthfully it likely buys you just one year...but keeps Hafley here "maybe"

 

[Magooch]

I can't remember where I read it, but I saw somewhere that an MLF extension is waitiing more on the MLF side (maybe more money???) rather than the Packers not trying to extend him.

Could be.

That's what Schefter was reporting, good article here