Fire Matt LaFleur

[shockerx]

Today Kraft and Parsons gave total support to MLF, those two guys are the leaders on both side of the ball. So thats good enough for me. Sounds like the real breakdown in the second half was the OL could not adjust to the blitz. namely Walker missed his pickups over and over again. Wish we could get Mike Wahle as our OL coach.

 

[Sanguine camper]

Today Kraft and Parsons gave total support to MLF, those two guys are the leaders on both side of the ball. So thats good enough for me. Sounds like the real breakdown in the second half was the OL could not adjust to the blitz. namely Walker missed his pickups over and over again. Wish we could get Mike Wahle as our OL coach.

There aren't many situations where a player is going to throw their coach under the bus. I wouldn't put much emphasis on their support. If a new coach was hired, I would expect them to say something similar.

Both Kraft and Parsons have put huge efforts to lift their game to the highest level. I wouldn't expect anything else but support from hard workers like them.

 

[Wayne G]

In hindsight there is nothing better than lafleur and they don’t want to gamble on that with the current team in place. We can all agree it would be gamble to have a worse coach it’s not a “strong” group of candidates so they are going to try and keep him they have to try and bring in a new OC and likely a DC if Hafley leaves which brings me to his “friend” Morris as the new DC which is mehhh I would prefer to open up checkbook to Flores if he doesn’t get a HC position they need to try and bring in McDaniel as OC which is unlikely but worth a shot. Playcalling needs to get turned over. This is monumental decision and could back fire badly if they don’t win the division this year. Lafleurs seat has to be hotter than the sun itself his first move better be firing Rich and trying to get better he has to show a different side of him to win over the fan base This is wild

Than dnt hire a worse coach! Hire a better coach! Lafluer is a BUM! How in the hell do they extend this guy? Bears wont lise to Packers until he is gone!

 

[shockerx]

There aren't many situations where a player is going to throw their coach under the bus. I wouldn't put much emphasis on their support. If a new coach was hired, I would expect them to say something similar.

Both Kraft and Parsons have put huge efforts to lift their game to the highest level. I wouldn't expect anything else but support from hard workers like them.

They didnt need to say anything.

 

[AKCheese]

No no… MLF blew those protections and he also missed the XP and relatively short FG…

 

[Sanguine camper]

They didnt need to say anything.

True but they were probably asked to comment whether by an agent or somebody in the media or somebody in the Packer's front office.

If they were asked to comment, and declined, that would signal discontent in my opinion.

 

[Wayne G]

Ed Policys first, public gaffe.....extending Lafluer! Packers will continue to be a 9, 10 win team, with no real threat to win their division. Two more seansons and the outcry of the fanbase will guarantee a change at HC. However, it will cost Packers several million dollars......eating remaining years on contract.

If Packers were serious about winning a SB
they would find another coach!

 

[Wayne G]

No no… MLF blew those protections and he also missed the XP and relatively short FG…

Team is soft every year just like their coach.

 

[Magooch]

I would have to see the full context to be sure but it sure seemed like both Kraft and Parsons (and Love, Jacobs, etc) were asked for comment by the media, I don't think they were just coming out and saying these things completely unprompted.


And that kind of ends up being a no-win situation for the player.

If you say "no comment," that's effectively a comment on its own. Maybe it's unfair but in these situations if you can't give a positive and/or affirmative answer, it's interpreted as a negative. (if I ask "Do you want Matt back as coach next year?" and you say "no comment," that's going to 100% be interpreted as a no)

And if you say something negative, first of all it generally doesn't reflect well on the player. Deserved or not there's an unspoken rule that you keep those criticisms in-house. AND you run the risk of saying something negative...and still having Matt back as the coach. Nobody wants to be in that awkward situation.

Ultimately he probably WILL stay, but I don't put a ton of stock in "player endorsements" in cases like these. It's basically the bare minimum expectation from them and saying anything else publicly is usually a big faux pas

 

[mradtke66]

Who do you blame when a team looks like 2 different teams each half, like the Packers did on Saturday? Blame the coach, right? Everything going wrong must be his fault, right? Now I am quick to judge Matt sometimes, but I think fans really need to be more honest with themselves and dig a little deeper.

This article is a good place to start. I had to go back and look at the plays that he was talking about, but Zach Kruse nailed the narrative.

So I get it, blame MLF, but no matter who the coach is, Walker is probably making those same protection mistakes. The blame for Saturday and other loses, can be spread around pretty easily IMO. If Walker does his job, Packer fans might be talking what a great job Matt did coaching on Saturday, that he never took his foot off the gas and the Packers coasted to an easy win.

I've deliberately avoided commenting in the aftermath of the game, waiting for analysis like this. Tempers flaring, emotionally drained, and it's too easy to yell at the cloud rather than dig in.

I'm sad Walker flubbed on the big stage. I figured he was a sure departure in FA that would be missed.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

If your healthy guys aren't executing and you've suffered a lot of injuries, you're gonna struggle regardless of who the coach is

Personally, I think this is more the case. That isn't to say that MLF is the greatest coach ever, because he isn't. However, if you go back and look at our losses, I might if I have time, there were critical mistakes made by player(s) that cost us many of those games.

I think it is true to say that MLF needs to improve. Players need to improve. The healthy part is a crapshoot and a lot of good and bad luck. I do know that when the season started, even with Watson sitting out the first part, until injuries started piling up, Gute had put a pretty decent roster together.

 

[gopkrs]

Just from eyesight, you could see the bears changed their defensive formation from the getgo in the 2nd half. Yet LaFlower didn't change at all. He continued to try and run into a brick wall which only used up plays. He didn't use Golden like he should have. i.e., he didn't use him as a primary target. I just haven't seen evidence that he can changeup when his counterpart changes up on him. And he gets weird favorite players and doesn't use others that should be tried. And in crunch time, he gets lost. And doesn't teach Jordan how to handle the last 5 minutes either. And what gives with our O line coach? There needs to be some kind of quality control guy. Usually I would say that should be the head coach. But here in GB...?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Trading LaFleur is a pipe dream, who would want to trade for LaFleur that keeps choking in the playoffs?

The Browns?

Heck we might be able to get 2 first rounders and Myles Garrett for him.

 

[Magooch]

Personally, I think this is more the case. That isn't to say that MLF is the greatest coach ever, because he isn't. However, if you go back and look at our losses, I might if I have time, there were critical mistakes made by player(s) that cost us many of those games.

I think it is true to say that MLF needs to improve. Players need to improve. The healthy part is a crapshoot and a lot of good and bad luck. I do know that when the season started, even with Watson sitting out the first part, until injuries started piling up, Gute had put a pretty decent roster together.

I'm kind of coming around to this too.
I certainly don't think Matt got it perfect but at the end of the day in spite of injuries IF our guys had executed better, his coaching would've likely still been "enough" at bare minimum to see the win through.

I haven't watched the entirety of the game back again yet (and frankly I don't know if I will. I'm not a *********) but in the second half you can pretty clearly see some instances where Matt's dialed up pass plays that structurally are "working". We'd have guys running free but the OL's getting blown up and not able to pick up DA's blitzing and so Love doesn't have the time to get the ball to these guys. The playcalling itself wasn't "bad" or even "ultra-conservative" or whatnot, just on a lot of occasions we weren't able to execute those calls.

And I'm sure some will say something like "well, then he should've adjusted the protection" or whatnot. Sure, I guess. Easier said than done. Our OL was also hard hit by injury and sometimes regardless of protection shifts your guys just aren't getting it done. I don't know. It stinks and I'd like to have an easy scapegoat but watching back a little bit it doesn't feel so much like some sort of fundamental playcalling/coaching collapse is the sole explanation

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Just from eyesight, you could see the bears changed their defensive formation from the getgo in the 2nd half. Yet LaFlower didn't change at all. He continued to try and run into a brick wall which only used up plays. He didn't use Golden like he should have. i.e., he didn't use him as a primary target. I just haven't seen evidence that he can changeup when his counterpart changes up on him. And he gets weird favorite players and doesn't use others that should be tried. And in crunch time, he gets lost. And doesn't teach Jordan how to handle the last 5 minutes either. And what gives with our O line coach? There needs to be some kind of quality control guy. Usually I would say that should be the head coach. But here in GB...?

I kind of thought that too, but you should read that Zach Kruse article I posted (#1069)

 

[Firethorn1001]

If you don't think MLF wouldn't get another job you are just blindly hating on him.

John Harbaugh probably going to set himself up for what.. 20M a year? Last 10 years he has been I think 3-6 in the playoffs and p!ssed away MVP QB play. Sound familiar?

But he won a Super Bowl! Yes.. 13 years ago in a 'what have you done from me lately league'. And MLF has 17 years on him.

I'm pretty confident MLF would get a job right away.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Thank goodness someone intelligent is in charge of making HC decisions and not some of these fans that think elite coaches are just super easy to hire and want to get rid of a top 5-7 HC who’s managed to take the youngest team in football to the playoffs so consistently it’s not even a talking point anymore.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

The Browns?

Heck we might be able to get 2 first rounders and Myles Garrett for him.

The old Mavericks-Lakers trade concept, huh? I like it!!

 

[Pugger]

And for better or worse, it seems like the team is most likely leaning towards #4.

My preferences/stipulations for that to be the case:

1. Organizational hierarchy is restructured so that head coach reports direct to GM
2. Bisaccia is fired immediately
3. Provides clarity on the role of Stenavich as OC. If Matt is installing the offensive structure and calling the plays, what is the OC doing?
4. Hiring of additional analytics, support, and "game management" staff. Make one of your main focuses to "pre-script" late game situations and lean MUCH heavier on analytics and predefined scenario-scripts rather than emotional or "gut" calls

As it stands, it seems like we effectively have two core responsibilities that LaFleur is expected to fill.
First and foremost arguably is that of the offensive "architect". He is the guy who designs our offensive system, crafts our game planning week to week, sets the script, identifies the matchups to exploit, etc.
Second is that of "game manager" - where he is responsible for clock management, risk decisions (aggressive vs conservative), situational football, 4th down decisions, etc.
We tend to assume that both of these should be handled by one person but the reality is that IMO LaFleur excels at "offensive architect" but struggles mightily with "game manager". So IMO the way forward has to involve separating these two roles.

This was probably in large part the idea with Bisaccia, but either a.) He is inept; b.) his input is not being listened to; or c.) some combination of both - and it obviously has not worked. Our "game management" did not improve and our special teams got worse in making this transition. That has to be a huge topic to be addressed if we are to see any improvement going forward.

Why just Bisaccia? I'm hoping for a big turnover in this staff if MLF returns. Something has to change. What is that definition of insanity...?

 

[Magooch]

Why just Bisaccia? I'm hoping for a big turnover in this staff if MLF returns. Something has to change. What is that definition of insanity...?

Well, I would not consider that to be all-inclusive, but I'd also add that...I suspect there will be some turnover that is outside of our control, as well.

For instance Hafley seems to be a likely candidate to leave for a HC job. And I suspect he will take one of Covington/Ansley with him. So I would expect to see someone new at DC and at least one defensive position coach.
Bisaccia on the other hand, I don't think anyone is going to be eager to take him off our hands. That's one that we will have to decide on ourselves - some of the others, the decision will be made for us, ya know?

So yes...I'd expect significant turnover too. i was more trying just to address the most glaring issues that will probably be well within our own hands

 

[Pugger]

Who do you blame when a team looks like 2 different teams each half, like the Packers did on Saturday? Blame the coach, right? Everything going wrong must be his fault, right? Now I am quick to judge Matt sometimes, but I think fans really need to be more honest with themselves and dig a little deeper.

This article is a good place to start. I had to go back and look at the plays that he was talking about, but Zach Kruse nailed the narrative.

So I get it, blame MLF, but no matter who the coach is, Walker is probably making those same protection mistakes. The blame for Saturday and other loses, can be spread around pretty easily IMO. If Walker does his job, Packer fans might be talking what a great job Matt did coaching on Saturday, that he never took his foot off the gas and the Packers coasted to an easy win.

One play shows why Packers offense struggled in second half vs. Bears

One play helps demonstrate why the Packers struggled on offense during the second half against the Bears.

packerswire.usatoday.com

If your LT is having problems blocking edge rushers then why in the hell didn't MLF make the adjustment with a TE or RB helping Walker out? Why were the communication issues not fixed on the spot? These are examples of the in-game issues Matt has in games all season. It doesn't appear he has a plan B if things go south.

 

[DABIGZ]

Idk about y'all but the sound bites and videos that come out after a team beats us, especially this Bears playoff game, doesn't inspire change, then nothing will.

 

[Pugger]

Than dnt hire a worse coach! Hire a better coach! Lafluer is a BUM! How in the hell do they extend this guy? Bears wont lise to Packers until he is gone!

I'd love to make a change but is there anyone out there worth looking at? From all accounts John Harbaugh is demanding $20 million. I don't see us paying anybody that.

 

[gopkrs]

I kind of thought that too, but you should read that Zach Kruse article I posted (#1069)

So why didn't someone make adjustments on the O line? Or in protections? I'm not going deeper into this. I just know we got outcoached in the 2nd half and if we tried to adjust; we weren't good at it. And the adjustment should have started after the first 3 and out.

 

[scooter_1954]

No no… MLF blew those protections and he also missed the XP and relatively short FG…

Who has the job of preparing his team, so that protections and kicks, aren't missed? Who has the job, of determining necessary adjustments, when things start to go south?

Oh wait, that would be the head coach!

After seeing us waste a critical timeout, then take a delay of game coming out of the timeout, I just can't imagine anyone defending his competence!