FA DT Options

[Vrill]

Someone will scoop McDaniel up pretty fast.

 

[Joe Nor Cal Packer]

This whole run D thing is overblown if you ask me. Yes the Pack ended the season 23rd or something like that but once Clay moved to ILB the run D improved in a major way. I would like to see what their ranking was from the time CMIII moved inside to seasons end. I would venture to guess it was somewhere around 15 or so. We had a 4 game stretch after the move where we didn't allow over 90 yards nor a single rush for more than 13 yards. When you throw in Raji and a more seasoned Pennel I can't help but think we will improve in this area. For the most part they did a nice job against Lynch in the NFCC game until the later stages. Now I know those later stages still count but you can't overlook the entire picture. I am not saying we will be a top 10 run D unit but I do believe once we have all hands on deck teams won't gash us as was the case early in '14. Am I along in this thinking?

G P G!!

No Sooner you're not alone. It looks like CMIII is ok with playing more inside. That helped later in the year. 2014 was a tale of two seasons with the run game. Big improvement when they moved CMIII over.

I'm encouraged by Raji's return, and seemingly in good shape. He'll be back to NT where he plays best.

With this O a top 5 D, while nice to have, isn't necessary. But they will need to be around the top third in terms of ranking. That's doable.

 

[HardRightEdge]

McDaniel´s play dropped off significantly in 2014. During his career he has mostly been a good run defender but at 6-7 and only 305 pounds I don´t know if he´s a fit playing defensive end in a 3-4 base defense.

Without commenting on McDaniel's play quality or Packer fit, 6'7" / 305 lbs. is actually pretty close to the favored prototype these days. Everybody likes these guys with long arms to keep all of the tall, long-armed OTs from engaging, along with their ability to block passing lanes, block QB vision, and bat down passes.

Calais Campbell, for example, is listed at 6'8" / 300 lbs. J.J. Watt is 6'5" / 285 lbs.

While Chris Canty is listed at 6'7" / 320 lbs, he's an interesting case vis a vis the Packers. Canty weighed in at 279 lbs. at the Combine and has added weight with age. He started in Dallas' 3-4 in 2006 in his second season, and then Thompson brought him in for a chat when he was a free agent after 2008 as the Packers were transitioning to 3-4. Canty still looked fairly lean at the time. Thompson brought him in for another chat after 2012, but ended up drafting Datone Jones, who at 6'4" / 285 lbs. is past the mid-point on the long-and-lean specturm.

Peppers is 6'7"; Adrian Hubbard is 6'6". While they are LBs, the pursuit of length is fairly obvious if the coaches' stated desire going back a couple of years isn't enough.

McDaniels is a 9 year vet and known quantity. He's not being "projected" off an unknown 21 year old base. If he can run stop as a 4-3 DT or stong side 4-3 DE as the case may be, he can do the same as a 3-4 DE.

But "no", the Packers will not pursue him assuming nobody blows out a knee before he signs elsewhere.

 

[HardRightEdge]

No Sooner you're not alone. It looks like CMIII is ok with playing more inside.

To quote him directly, it is his "duty". It does not sound like his preference.

On the other hand, there are a lot of star players who would resist this move. To his credit, when a player gets this kind of money, he should view himself as "partner" as much as "player". It's an opportunity to assume leadership and expand his impact beyond solo artist. He also has an opportunity to redefine how the position is played. We'll see.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Without commenting on McDaniels' play quality or Packer fit, 6'7" / 305 lbs. is actually pretty close to the favored prototype these days. Everybody likes these guys with long arms to keep all of the tall, long-armed OTs from engaging, along with their ability to block passing lanes, block QB vision, and bat down passes.

Calais Campbell, for example, is listed at 6'8" / 300 lbs. J.J. Watt is 6'5" / 285 lbs.

While Chris Canty is listed at 6'7" / 320 lbs, he's an interesting case vis a vis the Packers. Canty weighed in at 279 lbs. at the Combine and has added weight with age. He started in Dallas' 3-4 in 2006 in his second season, and then Thompson brought him in for a chat when he was a free agent after 2008 as the Packers were transitioning to 3-4. Canty still looked fairly lean at the time. Thompson brought him in for another chat after 2012, but ended up drafting Datone Jones, who at 6'4" / 285 lbs. is past the mid-point on the long-and-lean specturm.

Peppers is 6'7"; Adrian Hubbard is 6'6". While they are LBs, the pursuit of length is fairly obvious if the coaches' stated desire going back a couple of years isn't enough.

McDaniels is a 9 year vet and known quantity. He's not being "projected" off an unknown 21 year old base. If he can run stop as a 4-3 DT, he can do the same as a 3-4 DE.

But "no", the Packers will not pursue him assuming nobody blows out a knee before he signs elsewhere.

With Watt and Campbell you picked two exceptionally talented 3-4 defensive ends. While I agree that weight isn't that important for the position thr combination of him being lean and with his production dropping off significantly during last season I don't see him as a good fit for the Packers defense.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

I sometimes wonder how much of the Packer's improved run defense after the bye week was the result of Matthews moving inside vs the opponents the Packers faced.

• Bears - wasn't a great game to judge the run defense because the Bears turned it over 3 times and were down 42-0 by halftime!
• Eagles - much better against the run in the first half but the Eagles never had the chance to really get going in the second half as the Eagles turned the ball over on four of their first six second half possessions.
• Vikings - run D not great, though it also wasn't bad, allowing 4.5 yards per attempt on the ground (note though that Football Outsiders ranked the Viking's rush offense as fourth best in the NFL after adjusting for opponent).
• Pats - run D not very good, allowed 4.7 yards per attempt
• Falcons - good run D but Atlanta was terrible at rushing the ball (FO rated as 22nd best rush offense)
• Bills - see above (FO rated Bills 28th at rushing)...also, this game still ticks me off because the Packers should have had home field in NFC Champ game if the coach/QB had set their egos aside and just RAN THE BALL
• Bucs - terrible run offense but I don't care how bad the offense, when you can hold a team to 1.1 YPC, that's a good day
• Lions - terrible against the run. Allowed 4.8 YPC against FO's 29th ranked rushing offense.

I know you could do this kind of analysis for lots of things and I do think that the run defense improved markedly after Matthews moved inside. I just worry if the improvement was as significant as it really looks at first glance. The only really good day the defense had stopping the run was against the Bucs. Otherwise it was mainly our defense forcing turnovers and the offense forcing the other team to abandon the run.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I sometimes wonder how much of the Packer's improved run defense after the bye week was the result of Matthews moving inside vs the opponents the Packers faced.

• Bears - wasn't a great game to judge the run defense because the Bears turned it over 3 times and were down 42-0 by halftime!
• Eagles - much better against the run in the first half but the Eagles never had the chance to really get going in the second half as the Eagles turned the ball over on four of their first six second half possessions.
• Vikings - run D not great, though it also wasn't bad, allowing 4.5 yards per attempt on the ground (note though that Football Outsiders ranked the Viking's rush offense as fourth best in the NFL after adjusting for opponent).
• Pats - run D not very good, allowed 4.7 yards per attempt
• Falcons - good run D but Atlanta was terrible at rushing the ball (FO rated as 22nd best rush offense)
• Bills - see above (FO rated Bills 28th at rushing)...also, this game still ticks me off because the Packers should have had home field in NFC Champ game if the coach/QB had set their egos aside and just RAN THE BALL
• Bucs - terrible run offense but I don't care how bad the offense, when you can hold a team to 1.1 YPC, that's a good day
• Lions - terrible against the run. Allowed 4.8 YPC against FO's 29th ranked rushing offense.

I know you could do this kind of analysis for lots of things and I do think that the run defense improved markedly after Matthews moved inside. I just worry if the improvement was as significant as it really looks at first glance. The only really good day the defense had stopping the run was against the Bucs. Otherwise it was mainly our defense forcing turnovers and the offense forcing the other team to abandon the run.

I've tried to make other posters realize that the improved run defense in the second half of last season had as much to do with the opponents the Packers faced during these games than with moving Matthews inside.

The Packers will face two of the best rushing attacks within the first three weeks of the season, so we'll should get answers about the ability to stop the run pretty soon.

 

[HardRightEdge]

With Watt and Campbell you picked two exceptionally talented 3-4 defensive ends. While I agree that weight isn't that important for the position thr combination of him being lean and with his production dropping off significantly during last season I don't see him as a good fit for the Packers defense.

And if I had listed 6'7" / 305 lb. players who were not good players I suppose you might have take than as proof of your point. That height and weight is perfectly appropriate for a 3-4 DE. Note that I had no comment on McDaniel's fit with the Packers.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I've tried to make other posters realize that the improved run defense in the second half of last season had as much to do with the opponents the Packers faced during these games than with moving Matthews inside.

It's also overlooked that Barrington being installed at ILB was nearly coincident with Matthews being moved inside.