Adams Traded to Las Vegas

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
27,215
Reaction score
4,930
Location
Madison, WI
That doesn't happen on defense; there's nobody out there to make a good corner into an great corner, you just need to make sure you keep the great corner.
A great defense doesn't just start at CB. IF you have no pressure or ability to stop the run, from the front 7, it doesn't matter who you have playing in the secondary, you are goingt to get beat. I would rather have 3 above average to average CB's, than pay one $20M/year and not have money to spend on the rest of the position.

The Packers are lucky to have had Alexander, Stokes and Savage on rookie deals, as well as Douglas on a cheap FA deal in 2021. Unlike the QB position, where you are only paying the 1 player, overloading on the CB position on 1 of 3 CB's, may not be the smartest thing to do IMO. Now if the Packers weren't already paying Rodgers, Bahk, Jones, Clark, Campbell, Smith and Amos a large share of the cap money, this would be a no brainer.

The Packers may decide JA is worth paying and keeping, but I hope they are 100% sure about his shoulder, his desire to play in GB and even more importantly, what that does to the cap down the road.
 

Sunshinepacker

Cheesehead
Joined
Jul 29, 2013
Messages
5,138
Reaction score
470
A great defense doesn't just start at CB. IF you have no pressure or ability to stop the run, from the front 7, it doesn't matter who you have playing in the secondary, you are goingt to get beat. I would rather have 3 above average to average CB's, than pay one $20M/year and not have money to spend on the rest of the position.

The Packers are lucky to have had Alexander, Stokes and Savage on rookie deals, as well as Douglas on a cheap FA deal in 2021. Unlike the QB position, where you are only paying the 1 player, overloading on the CB position on 1 of 3 CB's, may not be the smartest thing to do IMO. Now if the Packers weren't already paying Rodgers, Bahk, Jones, Clark, Campbell, Smith and Amos a large share of the cap money, this would be a no brainer.

The Packers may decide JA is worth paying and keeping, but I hope they are 100% sure about his shoulder, his desire to play in GB and even more importantly, what that does to the cap down the road.

I'm not singling out corner as the ONLY position that needs to be great, although in today's NFL I think it is the most important position on defense (so many QBs throw the ball so quickly that pass rushers can be somewhat curtailed). My point is that a team can have an absolute elite pass rush and terrific linebackers but without good corners it won't matter against a good offense. Sure, if a team has the best dline in the league and an elite safety they can get away with just having good corners, but then you're relying on gettting 2-3 elite pass rushers, great linebackers, and an elite safety. Point is that great defenses need multiple great players and letting, perhaps, your best defensive player walk isn't a great way to build a great defense.

I will say this as flatly as possible; no team gets better by letting a top-10 corner go. The Packers should pay Jaire whatever they must to keep him. Having a top-10 corner on the team's defense is a major part of creating a great defense.
 

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
27,215
Reaction score
4,930
Location
Madison, WI
I'm not singling out corner as the ONLY position that needs to be great, although in today's NFL I think it is the most important position on defense (so many QBs throw the ball so quickly that pass rushers can be somewhat curtailed). My point is that a team can have an absolute elite pass rush and terrific linebackers but without good corners it won't matter against a good offense. Sure, if a team has the best dline in the league and an elite safety they can get away with just having good corners, but then you're relying on gettting 2-3 elite pass rushers, great linebackers, and an elite safety. Point is that great defenses need multiple great players and letting, perhaps, your best defensive player walk isn't a great way to build a great defense.

I will say this as flatly as possible; no team gets better by letting a top-10 corner go. The Packers should pay Jaire whatever they must to keep him. Having a top-10 corner on the team's defense is a major part of creating a great defense.
Yet the Packers defense played pretty well at times, even with no Jaire. I understand your point of view, but I don't necessarily agree with it. Each case and each team is different. If the Packers decided they didnt want to risk a big contract on Jaire due to his injury or he was an expensive luxury that they could survive without, I'd be fine seeing them trade him. The Seahawks gave up 2 firsts and a 3rd for Jamaal Adams, Jaire might bring more, if he is as important as you say he is.
 

Sunshinepacker

Cheesehead
Joined
Jul 29, 2013
Messages
5,138
Reaction score
470
Yet the Packers defense played pretty well at times, even with no Jaire. I understand your point of view, but I don't necessarily agree with it. Each case and each team is different. If the Packers decided they didnt want to risk a big contract on Jaire due to his injury or he was an expensive luxury that they could survive without, I'd be fine seeing them trade him. The Seahawks gave up 2 firsts and a 3rd for Jamaal Adams, Jaire might bring more, if he is as important as you say he is.

Packers go the route of trading Jaire, they're right back to hoping they can find a decent third corner. Douglas was a great find last season but I don't think the Packers can rely on that every season. Now, the argument I can understand (I don't agree with but I could understand) is that the NFC North is not exactly loaded with great passing offenses and so the Packers don't necessarily need a dominant secondary to win the Division. However, against the Bucs or the Rams in the playoffs, having three good corners is invaluable. Sure, if the Packers can find a team as stupid as the Seahawks I might be swayed by how much the Packers can get but I don't see that happening. If the Packers were going to trade anyone I would prefer Bakh; I love him as a player but elite QBs don't need best-in-the-league LTs to do well. If you're worried about contracts then I would be spending more on the defense and less on the oline/RB.
 

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
27,215
Reaction score
4,930
Location
Madison, WI
If the Packers were going to trade anyone I would prefer Bakh; I love him as a player but elite QBs don't need best-in-the-league LTs to do well. If you're worried about contracts then I would be spending more on the defense and less on the oline/RB.
It's funny, because I had this same discussion with a few posters before Bahk got his huge contract. I was told you never trade the best LT in the NFL. Yet he doesn't play a whole season and the Packers still win 13 games.

Right now the Packers couldn't afford to trade Bahk, since it would bring a dead cap hit of almost $36 Million. 1 player, a great player yes, but taking a large chunk of the cap.

Again, I'm not saying they should 100% trade Jaire, but I think it's worth discussing the merits of doing so.
 

Sunshinepacker

Cheesehead
Joined
Jul 29, 2013
Messages
5,138
Reaction score
470
It's funny, because I had this same discussion with a few posters before Bahk got his huge contract. I was told you never trade the best LT in the NFL. Yet he doesn't play a whole season and the Packers still win 13 games.

Right now the Packers couldn't afford to trade Bahk, since it would bring a dead cap hit of almost $36 Million. 1 player, a great player yes, but taking a large chunk of the cap.

Again, I'm not saying they should 100% trade Jaire, but I think it's worth discussing the merits of doing so.

No doubt, I've enjoyed the discussion already. Hopefully Ball can figure it out OR the Packers can find some idiot team to offer an insane deal.
 

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
27,215
Reaction score
4,930
Location
Madison, WI

Sunshinepacker

Cheesehead
Joined
Jul 29, 2013
Messages
5,138
Reaction score
470
If true, add this to our discussion on Alexander.


That's not surprising. Every elite corner that comes up for contract extension is going to demand to be the highest paid. His agent would be a moron to not start the negotiation from that point.
 

tynimiller

Cheesehead
Joined
May 2, 2012
Messages
8,986
Reaction score
2,103
That's not surprising. Every elite corner that comes up for contract extension is going to demand to be the highest paid. His agent would be a moron to not start the negotiation from that point.

I’ve said it before and a few hated it, but IF Gute thinks Jaire and GB is never going to come together I’d turn him into a WR1 asap or get trade equity higher than the comp that would come back. It SUCKS and you sign him if able and you try all you can, but if it simply isn’t gonna happen now is the time to do it
 

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
27,215
Reaction score
4,930
Location
Madison, WI
I’ve said it before and a few hated it, but IF Gute thinks Jaire and GB is never going to come together I’d turn him into a WR1 asap or get trade equity higher than the comp that would come back. It SUCKS and you sign him if able and you try all you can, but if it simply isn’t gonna happen now is the time to do it
Talk to Sunshine. :roflmao:

They could also keep him on his 5th year in 2022, then tag and trade him next year. Might lose a little, but you get a year of a top CB at $13M.

If he wants out now, find a team that has a WR in a similar situation and work out a deal now.
 

Sunshinepacker

Cheesehead
Joined
Jul 29, 2013
Messages
5,138
Reaction score
470
I’ve said it before and a few hated it, but IF Gute thinks Jaire and GB is never going to come together I’d turn him into a WR1 asap or get trade equity higher than the comp that would come back. It SUCKS and you sign him if able and you try all you can, but if it simply isn’t gonna happen now is the time to do it

Of course you trade him if he won't sign. Letting him walk for a 3rd round comp pick would be terrible. I completely agree that it's better to turn him into an asset rather than see him walk. It's generally not an issue so hopefully the Packers don't get two consecutive elite players wanting to leave the team.
 

kevans74

Cheesehead
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Messages
859
Reaction score
153
Location
Texas
I'm pretty sure, like 99.9% sure that they WILL work a deal with J'aire...

My thought process, which I hope aligns with Gute and the FO, is that you let Adams, who will turn 30 later this year (and never was an athletic freak to begin with) walk so that you have cap space to sign J'aire, a 25 year old ASCENDING stud CB, who is already Top 5 or Top 3 at the position.

I wouldn't be suprised if in 1-2 years, J'aire is arguably the BEST cornerback in all of the NFL. That's how good he is.

But there was literally like 0.001% chance you could do that if you resigned Adams.
 

kevans74

Cheesehead
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Messages
859
Reaction score
153
Location
Texas
*To add, I believe the only hiccup with J'aire is how well and when will he back to his normal self, playing speed, etc. off his 2021 injury.

I can't blame Gute or the FO if that is the case... you just have to be pragmatic. Although obviously we want to believe J'aire will be 100% for 2022

But look at hindsight with the Bahktiari signing LOL. So my guess is they're being precarious and pragmatic regarding his injury.
 

captainWIMM

Cheesehead
Joined
Jul 23, 2012
Messages
27,376
Reaction score
2,278
Again, I don't think that you are not taking in the big picture. What was Rodgers doing and saying last Spring/Summer? You don't think Rodgers waffling on being a Packer, as well airing all his grievances with the Front office, had any effect on what other players thought or did? All of that happened well BEFORE Adams apparently made up his mind to move on. I don't blame him for not wanting to look like his decision was going to be based on Rodgers decision and I really don't blame him for wanting out of GB given its best player was uncertain of whether he wanted to be there either.

Let me get this straight. Rodgers decided he wanted to stay with the Packers while Adams made up his mind that he didn't want to play on the franchise tag and asked to be traded to the Raiders. Yet somehow Rodgers is the one to blame while you support Adams' decision??? :rolleyes:

Does paying top 5 money at any position, automatically assure you of a top 5 player? Can you afford to pay top 5 money at every position? What happens to those positions and your depth when most of your money is tied up in 5-8 key players? I can find many instances where teams paid guys top 5 money and didn't get top 5 performance.

No, signing a player to a top 5 contract doesn't guarantee that he performs up to it. But I definitely prefer holding on to a player who has proven to be capable of playing at an elite level than receiving draft picks in return as you don't have any idea of how that will work out. You might want to read Dougherty's story about it here:


In general, successful teams hold on to blue-chip players especially as long as they're young. There's definitely a way to re-sign Alexander and fit the contract under the cap.
 

swhitset

Cheesehead
Joined
Oct 28, 2015
Messages
3,897
Reaction score
868
Quit building strawmen!!!

I never said he was one of the worst QB's in the league! I said he was one of the most stubborn and slow to adapt I've ever seen. Can't you read?!?!

You just appear to want to refute and ridicule every opportunity you get! You're completely hopeless WIMM!
You first paragraph is true. The second is literally a personal insult and unbecoming for a moderator.
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
13,996
Reaction score
2,184
If he did, then maybe he should have been in on decisions a long time ago. Getting what we got for a wr going on the wrong side of 30 and avoiding that contract was a pretty good move by most fan, media, and league accounts.
 

captainWIMM

Cheesehead
Joined
Jul 23, 2012
Messages
27,376
Reaction score
2,278
If he did, then maybe he should have been in on decisions a long time ago. Getting what we got for a wr going on the wrong side of 30 and avoiding that contract was a pretty good move by most fan, media, and league accounts.

I guess it wasn't Poker's intention to applaud Rodgers for the move though.
 

Schultz

Cheesehead
Joined
Mar 8, 2021
Messages
1,185
Reaction score
530
This is going to give Old School a brain freeze. The traitor Davante Adams was helped by his idle the great Aaron Rodgers to comit this act of treason.
 

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
27,215
Reaction score
4,930
Location
Madison, WI
I hope you're not being serious.
Listen to the whole clip. Rodgers appears to be serious when he says he helped him to get to Vegas.

You must be logged in to see this image or video!


I guess it wasn't Poker's intention to applaud Rodgers for the move though.
Why would I applaud him for helping the best WR in the NFL jump ship? For all we know, this is why Rodgers seemed pretty intent on throwing to him, wanted to drive his value up. Which helps the Packers in what they get for Davante, but not so much if he was over forcing the ball to his friend. If Davante was set on going to Vegas and nowhere else, which it does sound like he decided in 2017 was what he wanted, I can't imagine the Packers were able to shop him around and if the Raiders knew this, they weren't going to overpay the Packers for him.
 

kevans74

Cheesehead
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Messages
859
Reaction score
153
Location
Texas
Interesting insight on Davante.

But can you blame him? You will only live once, maybe Davante liked the climate and lower taxes of Nevada? Maybe he likes being near mountains. Football isn't "life"

I don't see someone like Davante, or AR for that matter, being the type of person to "live to work"

So whether it was personal preference, weather, lower taxes, geography, playing with Carr, etc. It doesn't really matter honestly

Good for Davante. Everyone sort of won in the end
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
13,996
Reaction score
2,184
"Oh my" is about all that is left to say LOL

He sounds like a guy talking about someone he cares for very much as a teammate and a friend. A teammate most guys would want to have on their side, and you turn it into, "he was forcing the ball " to Devante to drive up his stats for the past 5 years so someone would trade for him LOL and hurt the Packers because of it and then got rid of the 2nd best player on the roster.

Sometimes people want to be somewhere else, I truly believe that was the case with Adams. I'm not hurt by it. I think the resolution of him not wanting to be here and what GB go was absolutely a case of win/win all the way around. anybody thinking differently I think is living in a fantasy world.
 

Curly Calhoun

Cheesehead
Joined
Feb 23, 2015
Messages
1,856
Reaction score
314
This is going to give Old School a brain freeze. The traitor Davante Adams was helped by his idle the great Aaron Rodgers to comit this act of treason.

Adams is not a traitor - He is a very good NFL receiver who was productive here, got a chance to play for the team he grew up rooting for, and took it. I wish him all the best, as I am sure many others do.

Aaron Rodgers is not anyone's idle, although some may see him as an idol, which is a different word.
 

Members online

Top