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TT the Team Builder despite the average drafts?

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Pack93z, Apr 14, 2008.

  1. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

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    It is an interesting take on Ted's three year window so far.. can't say I disagree with the viewpoint. Ted has built a team with depth.. but the crown jewel of the drafts has yet to be judged fairly.

    http://www.packerupdate.com/packer_update/2008/04/draft-only-a-pa.html

     
  2. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    It's really hard to judge that though, as it only has been 3 years. Who knows what some of these guys might do? So far, to me at least, it looks pretty promising. Of course until we "win it all", its all speculation.
    And of course all it takes is an injury to an important player or 2 on your team, and a promising season can go down the drain.
     
  3. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

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    He hasn't produced any Pro Bowl players yet. Anyone doubt that Hawk and Jennings aren't going to the Pro Bowl in the future?

    You look at the past 3 drafts.

    2005 right now is very average but if Aaron Rodgers turns out like we hope that Draft becomes instantly an A graded Draft. Any time you fine a franchise QB, your draft is a success. I said a while back that Rodgers is the key to that draft and I'm more certain than I ever was about that.

    2006 is an A in my opinion but I firmly believe that Hawk and Jennings are All Pro caliber players. I like Johnny Jolley a lot too. Colledge is still a work in progress but Spitz seems to be the starter at right guard for the next few years. So far 06 looks like the best class we've seen in a long time.

    2007 is average so far. Nothing special about it but nothing bad either. Still a to be determine type of grade. It has potential. I think Rouse can and will end up starting and I know a lot of people like Barbe to start one day too.

    His drafts are solid with the potential of becoming outstanding in my opinion.
     
  4. Bobby Roberts

    Bobby Roberts Cheesehead

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    The Packers did well last year because of having some great depth. That depth came from the draft.

    Yes, most of the key players were already there or acquired outside the draft, but there's no denying that TT's drafted players were a key part of the team's success.

    The majority of those players drafted by TT last year had a year or less of experience. To expect those players to be the leaders is just foolish. Therefore to blast TT's drafting because those players aren't the team leaders yet is also foolish.

    TT's done a great job of building this team in several ways - drafting, picking up key FAs, trades and picking a good HC - but there's no question that the biggest factor in building this team has been the draft. Heck, the only FA last year was Walker and the only player picked up via trading of note was Grant. One could argue that rookies Jones and Harrell had a bigger impact than those guys on our success.

    You can't go to the NFC Championship game as the youngest team in the NFL without having some great drafts.
     
  5. millertime

    millertime Cheesehead

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    Any draft class that includes Tony Moll = A+

    IMO.
     
  6. Bobby Roberts

    Bobby Roberts Cheesehead

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    I'll take an average year when you have players such as Jones, Harrell, Rouse, Crosby, Bishop, Hall and Jackson.

    Jones stepped up big time as a rookie WR last year. Harrell stepped up when Pickett went down and added great depth to the rotation with the loss of key players to injury. Now he'll have to do more as Williams is gone. Rouse showed some great ability and will be pushing to be a starter. Crosby earned the kicking job and should get better with experience. Bishop added strong depth to our LB corps, which really needed the depth. Jackson came on at the end of the year, after learning the system, to show he can be a great runner in this league. Hall stepped up as the starting FB and did well, even being a rookie and changing positions.

    That group has 5 potential starters: Jones, Harrell, Rouse, Crosby and Hall. Along with adding some solid depth. That's without even mentioning Barbe's potential. TT can keep coming up with these "weak" drafts and I think we'll be just fine.

    GO PACK GO!!!
     
  7. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

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    I think he has done a solid job in the drafts, but they aren't the only reason for our accent on the NFL standings..

    One could argue, an probably very effectively that his picking up players off the "waiver wire" type moves has been just about as effective as his drafts.

    Ryan Grant
    Donald Lee
    Kuhn
    Bigby
    Jarrett Bush
    Tramon Williams
    Koren Robinson
    Ruvell Martin


    Where are some of the weakest parts of the team?

    Guards in general.. almost exclusively draft picks.
    Running back depth... Jackson, Wynn..
    Strong Side Linebacker.. Poppinga
    FS.. Inconsistent Collins

    Now I don't think his drafts have been subpar by any means, I am just impressed with how well Ted has done using multiple facets to achieve the success we have seen to date.

    The article made me stop an really think about it, Ted isn't just using the draft to build this team, he is using whatever means he can to build this team. And seems pretty open to anything that achieves that goal, even if it is something the media may scuff at.
     
  8. Bobby Roberts

    Bobby Roberts Cheesehead

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    I'm just pointing out the article is crap. It states that the only players of note to come from TT's drafts are Jennings and Hawk. Everything else in teh article is based on that assumption, which I think is incorrect.

    Yes, TT has also done a great job of acquiring some good players through cheap trades or waiver pick-ups. He's also picked up some very key players as FAs -- there's no question that Pickett and Woodson had a major impact. He's also done well at adding a very good HC.

    The article argues that TT has built a great team dispite having average to below average drafts. IMHO, he has built the team with the draft as the center piece, along with also acquiring key players in other ways. 23 of the 34 players selected by TT are still on the youngest team in the NFL, and that's not counting the ones that will be added in a couple of weeks. That's why I label them as the key piece of TT's work thusfar.
     
  9. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

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    Oh I agree and I didn't really like the article to much either. The positions of need are obviously going to be on Thompson. He's picked like 30 players in the draft so of course you can nitpick and pin the needs on him. He's no longer a 1st or 2nd year GM.

    I think the 07 draft has outstanding potential. Right now it looks average because well it is but that's in large part due to these guys only playing for one season like you said.
     
  10. Zombieslayer

    Zombieslayer Cheesehead

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    Crosby led the NFL in scoring. No small feat.

    I'm predicting Bigby makes the Pro Bowl this year. Was he drafted or a FA pickup? Don't remember.

    Jones is good enough to be a solid #2 WR right now. I think he was drafted to replace Driver when Driver decides to call it quits.
     
  11. Packnic

    Packnic Cheesehead

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    i havent read the article yet... im gonna.

    but before i do... i just wanna say. The draft picks need to be judged by their value on THIS team. not their overall ranking in the NFL.

    would you rather Ted draft one pro bowler or 10 guys that make this team better?


    No draft will ever be perfect... but to be honest id rather have our run the last three years... than the three before that.
     
  12. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

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    Isn't 3 years a good enough window to see how a GM does his thing? The team will always be a little young, always have a majority of character guys, always reward hard work,etc.
     
  13. Since69

    Since69 Cheesehead

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    Bigby is a scrap-heap succcess story. Undrafted out of college and cut by the Dolphins and the Jets before we picked him up.

    I think it's really, really hard to criticize the job TT has done. Going from 4-12 to the NFC Championship game in two years is a phenomenal accomplishment. His drafts are, really, only a small part of that so far. His greatest accomplishment, IMO, is realizing the strengths of the team he already had. He didn't panic and go on a quick-fix free-agent scavenger hunt. Once he got rid of the dead wood, he was smart enough to realize that there was still plenty of talent to work with - given the right coaching. Selecting MM was just another great move by a great GM.
     
  14. Zombieslayer

    Zombieslayer Cheesehead

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    I think I get what you're saying and a perfect example would be Nick Barnett. yeah, I know he wasn't drafted by TT, but I'm using him as an example.

    Barnett is not a Pro Bowler and has never been one, but I wouldn't trade him for any MLB in the NFL right now. He brings too much value to the TEAM.

    TT is good at recognizing talent and builds a team around what he has. He inherited Kampman, Driver, Harris, and Barnett, four very solid contributors, and built talent around them. We still have a few weaknesses, but he did a good job at patching them up so far.

    This team is solid. I can't wait for '08 to start.
     
  15. Zombieslayer

    Zombieslayer Cheesehead

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    Thanks for answering.

    Yes, he gets credit for MM, but one more thing I'd like to give him credit for is not overspending. Green Bay isn't the biggest market in the NFL and not being close to the salary cap has maintained GB as a profitable team. Whether we like to admit it or not, the NFL is a business and you can't lose money every year and stay in business. Staying under the salary cap and maintaining profitability is very important, something that I don't think a lot of fans realize. Of course, winning helps profitability as well, and he helped us go 13-3 last year.
     

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