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Packers Managment

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Zero2Cool, May 9, 2007.

  1. PackerGeek

    PackerGeek Cheesehead

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    Re: Packers & Oannes

    Being critical of a team does not equate to not loving the team. If you don't like the direction the team is going going it doesn't mean you should blindly follow them (Not that I am implying that you are doing that
    ). I mean I love my kids but when they make bad choices I make sure they know about my displeasure, that's how I get them to learn BEFORE they destroy their lives instead of waiting for them to learn soley by the results of their actions.
     
  2. Oannes

    Oannes Cheesehead

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    No apology necessary for me Z2C.

    That you love them line... works for my children and things that are actually important in life. Football is a hobby. It used to dominate my thinking, and frankly, I still spend far too much time on it. I read about the Packers every day without fail.

    I understand your question about why I follow them. If I got to know you in real life and we became friends, and all of a sudden you were stricken with an illness that every medical person on earth said was terminal, I'd be the one guy believing in your recovery. Why? In matters of importance I'll be extremely faithful because that serves a positive purpose.

    My lack of faith in this team hurts no one self included. Football is entertainment.

    Knowing that football isn't life or death I'm free to sit back and look at it objectively and come to realistic conclusions. I concluded back in the mid 90's that we had a pretty good shot of winning it all. Why? The team's performance justified that type of faith. The current team doesn't.

    I'm hoping and wishing that I'm wrong. I'm no different than any of you in most of my wishes for this team. (The one I'm in major minority is that I want Favre to retire) I hope we win the North, NFC Championsip and the SuperBowl.

    If you really look at it... You're no different than me. Huh? Yes. There are some Packer fans who honestly think we're going to send Brett off with a SuperBowl championship this season. If you, not me, tried telling them that you thought that just wasn't going to happen, they'd be writing you the exact same type of post you directed at me asking where's your faith?

    You know in your mind this Packers team is not wining the SuperBowl or appearing in it. Why? The team doesn't justify that type of faith. I'm no different except I've completely removed emotion from my thinking in regards to how this team will do this season.

    I want to be pleasantly surprised by this team. My logic tells me otherwise.


    Oh...and off topic on the point that not all teams are improving. Every team in this league has young players. Some will improve and some won't and that applies to us. There's nothing that says ANY of our rookies are going to take a step forward, or a step back. It just seems that Packer fans think the rest of the NFL is going to stand still, or regress, while the only option for us is improvement. That is naive. The improvement that we might make isn't enough to erase the gap between us and teams like the Pats and Jets who throttled us on our home field. Do you honestly believe we've closed any ground on either of those teams? I don't. Now, the Bears might be a different story with Briggs issue, their QB situation, and the issue with their DT's. There is some potential big regression from them. There's a decent chance we could catch them but I find it unlikely. Lovie Smith kind of owns us. He owned us with the Rams and he owns us with the Bears.
     
  3. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    Re: Packers & Oannes

    But you have CONTROL and are RESPONSIBLE for your children. We have no control over what the Packer front office does. I don't mean you have to agree with everything they do. But to publicly attack them in every thread makes me wonder WHY waste the time, if they make you that unhappy with every move they make?
    If i disliked the management that much, i'd just stay away, as to not get an ulcer over it.
    It IS just entertainment. And if it's NOT enterteining you, then why not just go find some other team or sport to follow, until the time comes that they please you.
     
  4. bozz_2006

    bozz_2006 Cheesehead

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    Re: Packers & Oannes

    not to quibble but you say you are being objective and you are not. to say that this team hasn't improved based on the direction you think they are headed is a value judgment. you can't be objective about a value judgment. and you say that all teams have young players, some improve some don't. true, but our young players have played almost a full season together and logically by playing that time together they will gel and improve. this, a matter of logic, you can be objective about. so, objectively, it is illogical to say that this young core of players will not improve.
     
  5. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    Packers & Oannes

    Anyone read that post and think of Spock immediately?
     
  6. Oannes

    Oannes Cheesehead

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    I disagree. It's unknown if they will improve, and if so, how much? Other teams have the same ability to improve or not improve. Packer fans seem to think our team is special and is the only one improving, or the one that will improve the most. I know we have a lot more young guys than most teams.

    I'm not objective? Where exactly did I say that we did NOT improve, or won't ?

    As for why I bother. I think it's fun to watch a bad team become good. I think that's more fun that being good all the time. It was great watching an unknown like Favre take the world by storm and then add Reggie White and go on and win it all. I'm hoping for that type of thing again. It won't be this year, but I will always hope for the next star, and great team outta Green Bay.

    This team is BAD. You don't get SHUT OUT, TWICE, in your own stadium if you're a good, or even a decent team. We were spanked every which way you could be. The Jets and Pats games came later in the season so there's none of this we just hadn't improved yet. I think we're not a good team. So. If I made dinner for you and it tasted terrible, I'm not going to try and sell you that it's good just because I made it. Crap is crap. The Packer is closer to Crap than being a legitimate contending football team.

    The beauty of all this is that we all get to witness the season. Hopefully, we're all still here and you'll all recall what we talked about because I'm afraid you're going to be disappointed this season.
     
  7. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    Packers & Oannes

    Yeah those two shut outs really hurt. Every team has its ups and downs though. I'd put more stock into the shut outs if it was the last two games of the season, or last two of four games. Regardless though, it happened.
     
  8. Packnic

    Packnic Cheesehead

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    Packers & Oannes

    i disagree with the last chicago game. i think they tried. i think we were hyped up, and i think we beat them because we had improved greatly from the first game.

    i do think that we were not a GREAT team last year... but mediocre and getting better. beginning of the season and against the great teams... we were awful... rookie coach and young players you can expect that.

    i just happen to see a brighter future for this team than you do i guess.
     
  9. bozz_2006

    bozz_2006 Cheesehead

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    Oannes, saying you weren't being objective wasn't an insult. i'm just saying ou can't be objective about a value statement, that's all. like, if i came to your place and you cooked a ****** meal, but i liked it that too would be subjective, because it's a value judgment. i don't think we sucked last year generally. there were games and specific times when we were awful. like the jets game (which i attended. ouch!), they beat us really bad. THAT is an objective statement.
     
  10. Packnic

    Packnic Cheesehead

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    Packers & Oannes

    your not allowed to go to home games anymore bozz. i blame you for the jet beatdown
     
  11. Oannes

    Oannes Cheesehead

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    Thanks for the clarification. What I'm filtering my opinions through is objectivity. I don't want to turn my brain off and my brain honestly came to the conclusions that have been oh so popular here.

    I actually like this issue of the Bears victory. That is the single most engine driving this unfounded "optimism" for next season.

    Here's a question for you for objectivity and balance's sake...

    Let's assume Green Bay is 13-2 going into the final game of the regular season and has home field sewn up for the playoffs. Earlier in the year we destroyed the Bears every way imaginable. The Bears come to Lambeau for the last game of the season and beat us pretty good.

    What are your honest thoughts on why we would've lost that game? It certainly wouldn't be because you thought the Bears were better and that you should look out for them next season. Do you think because of that loss the Bears are now worried the Packers are going to dethrone them? I don't think so.

    My goodness I hope you can all see how wrong you are about thinking that win over the Bears meant much of anything. Cripes the week before we barely beat a team AT HOME who is every bit the rival Chicago is by a score of 9-7. That Viking team started a guy from Div II who never started a game in his career. By your logic, the Vikings are going to run roughshod over us because that was only his first game and he will IMPROVE. My goodness. This is bizarre. We beat the Bears in a totally meaningless game and our fans are acting like it's some great predictor for 2007? Look at the JETS AND PATS and VIKING game and then reassess the situation.
     
  12. bozz_2006

    bozz_2006 Cheesehead

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    ****, i knew that was coming! should have kept my mouth shut. although, in my defense, that's the first packers game i've been to that we've lost. objectively speaking, i think i'm kind of a good luck charm. hahaha.
     
  13. bozz_2006

    bozz_2006 Cheesehead

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    Re: Packers & Oannes

    we outplayed the bears in that game. there were many reasons for that, one of the more important ones being that the bears had "nothing to play for". i'm not against you, man. i don't think we're gonna win the super bowl this season but i also don't think that any optimism is unfounded.
     
  14. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    Re: Packers & Oannes


    Yeah except every Sherman season. Dude, you are so inconsistent it laughable
     
  15. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    I don't know why you have a hard time understanding this Cheesey.

    Just because you don't think your team is the FRIGGIN 85' Bears doesn't mean you are any more of a fan than me.

    We don't have to like the GM, we don't have to like anybody. When TT wins my opinion of him will change. Until then, I will be critical, and like it or not, it's my right to do so.

    In the end my fandom is what drives me. I feel like TT is a disaster, right or wrong, and I want someone in there who is better suited for the job.
     
  16. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

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    Re: Packers & Oannes

    how many times do we have to tell you that those teams....ya know. no. im not getting into it with you. It doesnt matter how many times people explain things to you, you refuse to listen. NOW THAT is whats laughable.

    [​IMG]
     
  17. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    I thought it was reality? Make up your mind flip-flopper
     
  18. Lare

    Lare Cheesehead

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    Re: Packers & Oannes

    One thing I think leads to a lot of the differing opinions in any forum is the general outlook of what people think a fan is.

    Some people think a true fan is someone who cheers on his/her beloved team no matter what, regardless of their success. These people are generally the eternal optimists who feel that those in charge must be doing the right things and that the Super Bowl is only a year or two away.

    Others think a true fan is one who expects his/her team to be a winner and doesn't accept anything less than success. These people come across as pessimists because they are generally critical of moves which don't seem to add to the chances of success any time soon, and as a result the Super Bowl is nowhere in sight.

    Me, I'm a realist and I generally listen more to what others in the industry are saying and doing than what fans are saying and doing. And lately, I don't see many others in the industry saying and doing things that indicate the Packers are a team on the brink of success.

    JMHO
     
  19. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    Very good point.
     
  20. Oannes

    Oannes Cheesehead

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    I totally agree with Lare. That is a line of demarcation. I happen to be on the side you stand on.

    Pyle... I hate to even say this, but I was relieved to see YOUR MONIKER in the WHEEL OF FORTUNE boxes and not mine. I'm sure it won't be too much longer before ole Vanna is turning my letters. Don't anyone kick in $250 to buy a vowel. :)

    I gotta admit Tromadz is the most unique Packer poster I've ever seen. (psst. don't tell him that I'm only saying that so he won't roast me)
     
  21. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

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    Packers & Oannes

    [​IMG]
     
  22. Oannes

    Oannes Cheesehead

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    I really do consider you the most unique I've seen on a board. Still, he ROASTS me!

    Can I ask a favor now that you've roasted me? What on earth is that picture of Dendy doing on all of your posts? Are you serious? Love to know the story behind it.
     
  23. gopackgo

    gopackgo Cheesehead

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    Re: Packers & Oannes

    I'm sure 99% will say they're in the third group when 90% are not.
     
  24. Oannes

    Oannes Cheesehead

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    I'm clearly the ONE percent, and you know I'm speaking OBJECTIVELY, bay bay!
     
  25. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    You let Ryan have access to your email to post on this forum. You have to be fan to let yourself be subjected to the kind of porn lists he adds your email to.
     

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