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Multi-part series: A look at the Bates' new look DEFENSE

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Bruce, Jun 5, 2005.

  1. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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  2. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    Maybe a quick (simplified) overview of Bates
     
  3. ArizonaPackerFan

    ArizonaPackerFan Cheesehead

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    I'm more excited about this upcoming season because of Bates than I am for any other reason. He's got me pumped up as much as some of his players. I just thought the players lost respect for Slowik last year. It's sometimes hard to work for someone you don't respect. That shouldn't happen with a guy like Bates.
     
  4. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    Bates will command respect...

    You're right as rain, Arizona. Bates will make an HUGE difference -- not only in scheme, but in coaching ability. Slowik lost this team early and did not have the skill to reel them in. It not only should not happen with Bates, it will not happen with Bates -- he has earned respect around the NFL and he commands it.

    [/b]
     
  5. Steel Wheels

    Steel Wheels Cheesehead

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    There is not much in the cupboard! This Packer defense was #28 in the NFL in 2004. The defense should improve in 2005 but Jim Bates can only do so much with limited talent on defense.

    Ted Thompson has to clean up Sherman's incompetent salary cap nightmare before he can bring in any quality FA's to straighten out the defensive mess.

    The Packers are 2 or 3 years away from a quality defense. Don't expect anymore than an 8-8 season.
     
  6. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    Why do I believe that the Packers defense will be improved??

    Why do I believe that the Packers defense will be improved???
     
  7. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    Packers D 2004

    BTW -- 2004
     
  8. JBlood

    JBlood Cheesehead

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    I agree APF. Slowik seemed completely confused, so its difficult for the players to figure out what he was thinking. Bates says that we have the talent to play good defense, and all the players need is coaching. Either he's a complete idiot or he knows something--I think he knows something. On to #13.
     
  9. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

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    Bruce...I agree with you. We will be much improved on defense. We will definitely have a better pass rush which will make our DB's much better.

    You put alot of time and effort into your analysis and I appreciate it. Don't let chase get to you.
     
  10. IPBprez

    IPBprez Cheesehead

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    Interesting line on this guy.....

    Biggest issue (IMHO) --- making sure Ahmad Carroll isn't handing out free yardage when the QB never had any openings to begin with. Several of these listed have the makings of replacing Gravy when and/or if he gets injured. They can get low under the pads and maintain blocking pressure where it's needed most.

    The train wreck for the opposition needs to be those linemen causing havoc across the line while trying to grab the ball or the QB ala Reggie White.

    And to think - if Hunt had applied some smarts - he could have excelled almost as well as Reggie did... Such a shame!
     
  11. NDPackerFan

    NDPackerFan Cheesehead

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    DePack - you hit the nail on the head! Our lack of pass rush was an underrated problem. It seemed like most wanted to knock the secondary (although they didn't play well); however, I think what the Packers need is constant pressure on the QB. DB's look awfully good when the quarterback has to get rid of the ball before he wants to.

    The Packers will be much improved because of the things mentioned earlier including a bunch of hungry, young, and talented players on defense. Coach Bates will have them ready to play and I say 10-6 and on to the playoffs again! :lol:
     
  12. Greg C.

    Greg C. Cheesehead

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    Thanks as always for the analysis, Bruce. Your comments reinforce what I've been thinking all along, which is that one of Bates' biggest reasons for coming to Green Bay is that the personnel match his system pretty well. Big guys up front and fast guys behind. I think the defensive line and the linebackers will be at least okay. The biggest question marks are in the secondary, particularly that second corner spot opposite Al Harris. I think the success of the defense will hinge on that player (Carroll, Thomas, or whoever) more than anyone else.

    A slight correction: Diggs had TWO wasted seasons at weak-side linebacker, not one. Not that Diggs played badly. But he was shifted to that side so he would make more big plays, and he didn't. So he may as well be on the strong side.
     
  13. Steel Wheels

    Steel Wheels Cheesehead

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    What defensive linemen are going to improve our pass rush? The player personnel is just not there at DL.
     
  14. NDPackerFan

    NDPackerFan Cheesehead

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    Steel Wheels, look at the above mentioned players (you know, with the huge pics attached)! Some will pan out, some won't. The scheme alone will improve a stagnant pass rush, trust Jim Bates. Are you sure you're not posting as Mike Tice, only using an alias? :lol:
     
  15. Steel Wheels

    Steel Wheels Cheesehead

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    That's why Mike Sherman was replaced at GM with Ted Thompson.

    Waiting for players to pan out on a hope and a prayer.

    The Packers are 2-3 years away from a quality defense.
     
  16. NDPackerFan

    NDPackerFan Cheesehead

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    The way I see it, the defense can't get much worse than last year. Bates will have them overachieving this year and they will gain respectability. Will they be a top 10 defense? Probably not. The offense is still loaded and the defense will improve to allow them to stay competitive. I think people need to remember that this team is the BACKtoBACKtoBACK defending NFC North Champion! Sherman is no Bill Walsh but the team has done well with him as HC. Slowik is gone, that's what matters right about now. What an embarrassment! :oops: :oops: :oops:
     
  17. kuston

    kuston Cheesehead

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    Personally, I expect this defense to end up in the top 10. Here's why: Jackson, Lee, Peterson, Williams & Edwards are all 2 gap DTs. Last year they were all asked to play in a 1 gap system. KGB is a specialist and very good at it, this year that is all they will ask him to do, on every down. Barrnet just isn't big enough to play in a 1 gap system. He'll dominate in Bate's system. Thompson is really good, wait until you see him play. The DB? Who can name the safeties the Dolphins played with for the last 3 years? I think one of them was named Edwards and he couldn't cut it in GB. Whoever we line up there is going to be better. The CBs? I'm going to bank on Bates picking the right ones for his D, if I remember right, Bates was the guy to let Troy Vincent go. Just to summarize how screwed up last year's D was, they had an all-american NT from College playing rush end; Corey Williams. Bates will figure out what each player can do and put them in the right position to do it.

    I also think the defense can get better by playing with a lead. How many games last year did the Packer's jump out in the front in the 1st quarter and give the D a nice lead? Dallas was the only one I can think of. Why do I think the offense will be better this year? The skill positions will be better, Green & Davenport are in their contract year. I expect Ferggy and Walker to step it up a notch. Chapman and Murphy add quality depth to the WR which we didn't have last year. I expect the supporting cast to Favre/Driver to be better, which will help the D.

    I expect the recipe to success is Bate's new sytem, better leadership, an offense that scores early to help the D out will get a top 10 D.
     
  18. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    Brother JBlood GREAT TO HEAR FROM YOU. Your post is right on, but then again your posts have always been right on.



     
  19. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    DePack

    Hail, Hail the gangs all here. Great to see you Bro. Even Digger was missing you and asking us to find you :D Hey do you know how to find Danno? Looking forward to seeing more of you here in the forum.

     
  20. Steel Wheels

    Steel Wheels Cheesehead

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    ...........and a 1-3 playoff record!!!!!
     
  21. NDPackerFan

    NDPackerFan Cheesehead

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    Steel Wheels,

    Dude, it sounds to me after reading all your posts that the Packers are too much of a burden for you to cheer for! I went to last year's GB-Dallas game and I sat in front of the most negative fan. I mean, the Packers could do nothing right while they were kicking the Cowgirls a$$. You didn't go to that game, did you? You sound just like him, seriously. With Packer fans like you, we don't even need Viking fans in here bashing the team, you do it just fine.

    GO PACKERS!!!
     
  22. Steel Wheels

    Steel Wheels Cheesehead

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    NDPacker Fan wrote:

    "Dude, it sounds to me after reading all your posts that the Packers are too much of a burden for you to cheer for! I went to last year's GB-Dallas game and I sat in front of the most negative fan. I mean, the Packers could do nothing right while they were kicking the Cowgirls a$$. You didn't go to that game, did you? You sound just like him, seriously. With Packer fans like you, we don't even need Viking fans in here bashing the team, you do it just fine."

    "GO PACKERS!!!"

    The 2004 season was my 50th year as a Packer Fan. I see no reason to pretend that it is smooth sailing in Green Bay when it is not.

    The Packers made a huge mistake in bringing Mike Sherman to Green Bay which is becoming more and more evident. Bob Harlan allowed the senile Ron Wolf make that decision, even after the Ray Rhodes debacle.

    How long do you plan to keep up the charade? Mike Sherman will be gone after the 2005 season and you will have to learn to live with the hard facts.

    Why don't some of you guy's back off your cheerleader rolls and face up to the fact that there are problems in Green Bay. Then we can all discuss Packer football intelligently on a common ground.
     
  23. NDPackerFan

    NDPackerFan Cheesehead

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    You mean it's your 50th year complaining about everything that goes on with the Packers. Remember that GB has had 12 straight non-losing seasons and in comparisons with other teams, it is almost unprecedented. The reason there is no common ground with you is that you see nothing good coming out of GB right now. The players suck, coaching sucks, GM sucks, it gets old. I'll talk intelligent about Packer football with realism when you step back from all your negativity. I'm fairly new here and I know this isn't the place to talk smack, it's a place to talk Packer Football. If you want to do that with me, fine. If not, so be it. Have a good one and GO PACK! :nono:
     
  24. Steel Wheels

    Steel Wheels Cheesehead

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    :puke:
     
  25. NDPackerFan

    NDPackerFan Cheesehead

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    Smartest post you've had since you joined - NO WORDS WITH IT! :comp:
     

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