House vs Williams...easy/tough/doesn't matter...

tynimiller

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Okay, so we all know Cobb is priority #1 and than likely Bulaga is #2...but the #1 FA decision on the Defensive side of the ball is House or Williams. I don't see a scenario outside of Williams taking an incredible cut in pay to stay, and House getting paid like a #2 CB on a team to play #2/#3 for another year with Williams still present....but that is like a 0.001% chance of happening in my book.

So House or Williams? To be fair both offer good things, House the upcoming guy young enough to still have a ceiling a ways off but comes with no true full season experience being called on week in and week out. Williams is coming to the end of his prime...perhaps you get a year or two of great play (similar to what we are getting from Peppers) but at some point the drop is gonna happen and with CBs at times it can seemingly come at any minute and be incredible.

I say go House, he's still gonna be cheaper than some out in FA and although not outside type guys Hyde/Hayward and either a new draftee/Demetri/Tay can still flourish into something alongside Shields possibly.

I say thank you to Tramon, but it is time to say goodbye.
 
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Okay, so we all know Cobb is priority #1 and than likely Bulaga is #2...but the #1 FA decision on the Defensive side of the ball is House or Williams. I don't see a scenario outside of Williams taking an incredible cut in pay to stay, and House getting paid like a #2 CB on a team to play #2/#3 for another year with Williams still present....but that is like a 0.001% chance of happening in my book.

So House or Williams? To be fair both offer good things, House the upcoming guy young enough to still have a ceiling a ways off but comes with no true full season experience being called on week in and week out. Williams is coming to the end of his prime...perhaps you get a year or two of great play (similar to what we are getting from Peppers) but at some point the drop is gonna happen and with CBs at times it can seemingly come at any minute and be incredible.

I say go House, he's still gonna be cheaper than some out in FA and although not outside type guys Hyde/Hayward and either a new draftee/Demetri/Tay can still flourish into something alongside Shields possibly.

I say thank you to Tramon, but it is time to say goodbye.

I would prefer to keep House as well but as I´ve said in another thread if he´s asking for at least $5 million per season I would let him test free agency and let the market decide if he´s worth that kind of money. If House leaves I would be fine with re-signing Tramon as well.
 
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tynimiller

tynimiller

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I would prefer to keep House as well but as I´ve said in another thread if he´s asking for at least $5 million per season I would let him test free agency and let the market decide if he´s worth that kind of money. If House leaves I would be fine with re-signing Tramon as well.

I do feel this is exactly what we are heading towards. Sad thing is I do believe if this happens it probably means both will be allowed to put feelers....potentially risking the loss of both. I have a lot of faith in Hayward/Hyde...but I don't like the idea of trying to absorb the loss of both of them. TT could look like a genius (even more so) in 2 or 3 years if it plays out accordingly and House can't locate the money he wants and we sign him in the 3-4 range. :)
 

RepStar15

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Williams is currently the better player, but I believe House has potential to fill his shoes. I felt very comfortable when House was in the game and he made some big plays. I think we overshot Sam Shield's contract too high and could have potentially had all 3, had we not given him so much money.
 

Pokerbrat2000

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This is a tough one for me. House isn't only looking for money, he wants to start. This being said, I doubt both with be back in Green and Gold.

Tramon has slowed down a bit, but IMO is still much better then House. But not worth the kind of money he is making now.

House while a decent option at CB hasn't jumped out at me as someone worth the kind of money he is looking for (reported $5 M+/year).

My guess is TT lets both of them test FA, signing whichever one seems to be the best financially for the Packers.
 
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I do feel this is exactly what we are heading towards. Sad thing is I do believe if this happens it probably means both will be allowed to put feelers....potentially risking the loss of both. I have a lot of faith in Hayward/Hyde...but I don't like the idea of trying to absorb the loss of both of them. TT could look like a genius (even more so) in 2 or 3 years if it plays out accordingly and House can't locate the money he wants and we sign him in the 3-4 range. :)

Well, if we don't re-sign any of them before March 7 they will be allowed to test the market. I don't want to lose both either as an outside CB would become an immediate need if that happens.
 
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tynimiller

tynimiller

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Williams is currently the better player, but I believe House has potential to fill his shoes. I felt very comfortable when House was in the game and he made some big plays. I think we overshot Sam Shield's contract too high and could have potentially had all 3, had we not given him so much money.

I can't remember off hand...what are we paying Shield? He has rare speed at CB and I still think he's got potential to be a Pro-Bowl level defender...I do however concur depending on what we sent his way money wise.
 
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tynimiller

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Oh my word if (HERE) is right we did in fact over pay for Shield in my opinion too....but if he reaches his potential that figure actually is a great one if he grows into a top tier #1 CB we suspect he is.
 

PikeBadger

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I'd prefer House at this point. If Shields continues improving, his contract will have looked very good for the Packers in two years with the way the Salary Cap keeps rising. It could very well be 150M in 2016. That would put the Packers in much better position than almost everyone else in the league.
 

7thFloorRA

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Its a very tough call.

House
Young
Great Man coverage skills
Great Size
Can not stay healthy in a part time role...how can he be expected to start every game
Seems lost in Zone

Tramon
Has done it before and done it well
Can play Man and Zone
Good history of health

It really depends on Capers opinion of House being able to know his playbook and being able to react correctly in zone.....and his injury history and risk invovled. I would rather have them both...but I would prefer tramon all year than House for 2 games before he blows his shoulder again.
 
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tynimiller

tynimiller

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^^You do remember the near career ending nerve issue with Tramon? Could that flare up with just one hit that connects just perfect? I see and agree with all you said for him though no doubt.
 

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I can't remember off hand...what are we paying Shield? He has rare speed at CB and I still think he's got potential to be a Pro-Bowl level defender...I do however concur depending on what we sent his way money wise.

4 year 39 million dollar contract with 12.5 million signing bonus
 

7thFloorRA

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He has only missed 1 regular season game in his career. Now....he sucked at any type of physicality that year that he was hurt but he did play through it. I am not concerned with the nerve issue going forward after seeing him play physical last year and surviving.

I think Tramon's deal would be half the length of House's though. I think he gets a 2 year deal and House will hold out for 4.
 
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HardRightEdge

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Oh my word if (HERE) is right we did in fact over pay for Shield in my opinion too....but if he reaches his potential that figure actually is a great one if he grows into a top tier #1 CB we suspect he is.
Shields has been a starter for 5 years now. At this point, what you see is close to what you can expect to get. Overpaid? Somewhat perhaps. I had him pegged for a $6-$8 mil per year contract before he was signed.

As for the topic at hand, Williams gave up 8 TDs this past season. That's a lot.
 

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Shields has been a starter for 5 years now. At this point, what you see is close to what you can expect to get. Overpaid? Somewhat perhaps. I had him pegged for a $6-$8 mil per year contract before he was signed.

As for the topic at hand, Williams gave up 8 TDs this past season. That's a lot.

Including the back breaker in the NFC Championship game. Either it was a defensive snafoo by having no safety help or there was no communication as to what Richardson was going to do but Tramon allowing the WR to get inside was a huge mistake.
 
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Including the back breaker in the NFC Championship game. Either it was a defensive snafoo by having no safety help or there was no communication as to what Richardson was going to do but Tramon allowing the WR to get inside was a huge mistake.

HRE won't like that someone is agreeing with me on that. ;)
 

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If you can sign House for half of what Williams would get, then sign House. Otherwise keep Williams. Williams is the better corner, the "over-30" thing has no bearing on corners (maybe "over-35"?), he's not as injury prone.
 

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I agree that you're correct in thinking that I disagree. :tup:

I watched that play over and over and over again because I was so pissed off that Williams blew that. But that being said, the only failure on that play is that there was no over the top safety help. I just watched it again and honestly, Tramon was in nearly perfect position. In fact his left arm was in front of the ball and wrapping around the receiver before the ball got there.

Unfortunately it was a perfect throw, a perfect catch with 99.9% perfect man coverage. There was 0% chance of stopping that exact sequence of events without over the top safety play.
 

Ace

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I watched that play over and over and over again because I was so pissed off that Williams blew that. But that being said, the only failure on that play is that there was no over the top safety help. I just watched it again and honestly, Tramon was in nearly perfect position. In fact his left arm was in front of the ball and wrapping around the receiver before the ball got there.

Unfortunately it was a perfect throw, a perfect catch with 99.9% perfect man coverage. There was 0% chance of stopping that exact sequence of events without over the top safety play.

Yea he made a great recovery on the play, doesn't mean he or the call wasn't screwed up from the snap though. Allowing him to get inside with no safety and the middle of the field wide open is inexcusable. It's not like he was up against Calvin and there was nothing he could do for crying out loud.
 
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I watched that play over and over and over again because I was so pissed off that Williams blew that. But that being said, the only failure on that play is that there was no over the top safety help. I just watched it again and honestly, Tramon was in nearly perfect position. In fact his left arm was in front of the ball and wrapping around the receiver before the ball got there.

Unfortunately it was a perfect throw, a perfect catch with 99.9% perfect man coverage. There was 0% chance of stopping that exact sequence of events without over the top safety play.

Williams had no chance defending that play because he allowed Kearse to release to the inside. If he had redirected him to the outside that would have been a way tougher throw for Wilson to complete.
 

Ace

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I watched that play over and over and over again because I was so pissed off that Williams blew that. But that being said, the only failure on that play is that there was no over the top safety help. I just watched it again and honestly, Tramon was in nearly perfect position. In fact his left arm was in front of the ball and wrapping around the receiver before the ball got there.

Unfortunately it was a perfect throw, a perfect catch with 99.9% perfect man coverage. There was 0% chance of stopping that exact sequence of events without over the top safety play.

That being said, he isn't a bad player and I hate to bash the guy because he has been a solid Packers his entire career but that cannot happen.
 
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HardRightEdge

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HRE won't like that someone is agreeing with me on that. ;)
I agree about the disagreeing
I watched that play over and over and over again because I was so pissed off that Williams blew that. But that being said, the only failure on that play is that there was no over the top safety help. I just watched it again and honestly, Tramon was in nearly perfect position. In fact his left arm was in front of the ball and wrapping around the receiver before the ball got there.

Unfortunately it was a perfect throw, a perfect catch with 99.9% perfect man coverage. There was 0% chance of stopping that exact sequence of events without over the top safety play.
The Captain will be resolutely and stoically indifferent to someone agreeing with me. :cool:
 

ivo610

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I wouldnt be opposed to resigning Tramon and drafting a corner from the early rounds
 
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The Captain will be resolutely and stoically indifferent to someone agreeing with me. :cool:

I agree that you´re absolutely correct in thinking that I´m resolutely indifferent to someone agreeing with you. ;)

This is limited to this topic only though.
 

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