Hot Take Thread

[Sunshinepacker]

We always had worthy corners. Are you under the impression Hayward and hyde suck? They are probowlers after their stint with the packers. The reason for poor CB play has been poor coaching.

Did you see who was playing corner the past two years? Cause it wasn't Hayward.

 

[AmishMafia]

Did you see who was playing corner the past two years? Cause it wasn't Hayward.

Did you see who was coaching the Packers defense the last 2 years? The same guy who got little from Hayward and Hyde who later became probowlers. The same guy who has a history of DBs playing well early and then not improving. You dont see the trend? Seems pretty obvious to me.

At some point your analysis has to be deeper than, did they win? No? Then the players suck.

 

[PikeBadger]

Agreed and HHCD will probably be one of those guys who walks in Free Agency and has a great career elsewhere. I am hoping that with Pettine running the show, a lot of our younger guys come into their own this season.

He might have a long career in the NFL, I just don’t see him as ever being a great player though. Too many chinks in his skill set and he’s just average in natural athletic ability imo. I think he potentially has a lengthy career as a SS because he has been relatively injury free.

 

[gbgary]

Jackson and not Alexander?

no. he's taller, more physical.

 

[PikeBadger]

I think having NFL worthy corners will do far more to help HaHa than any coaching change. That and a potentially great interior pass rush.

Agree. It would help hide Dix’s flaws for sure. I think a good consistent pass rush fixes/hides a lot of deficiencies on the back end. That’s true with any team though. The rules of the game help the offense and hinders defense.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Did you see who was coaching the Packers defense the last 2 years? The same guy who got little from Hayward and Hyde who later became probowlers. The same guy who has a history of DBs playing well early and then not improving. You dont see the trend? Seems pretty obvious to me.

At some point your analysis has to be deeper than, did they win? No? Then the players suck.

Capers was responsible for two highly successful defensive units with the Packers as well with one being a major reason the team won the Super Bowl in 2010.

I think a large portion of Packers fans unjustifiably deny DC the ability to coordinator an above defense as long as given some decent talent. While Hayward and Hyde might work as evidence to the contrary there are a lot of players that left Green Bay without contributing with another team.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I think a good consistent pass rush fixes/hides a lot of deficiencies on the back end. That’s true with any team though. The rules of the game help the offense and hinders defense.

Unfortunately I'm not convinced the Packers have a good enough pass rush entering this season because of a lack of quality depth ok the edge.

 

[gbgary]

I get the impression that King is being a little underestimated here. Not only was he a rookie, but played with a long time shoulder injury that eventually cut short his season. There's a lot of youth in the secondary, so there'll be some bumps in the road this season, but I'm excited about the legit big time potential of these guys.

being the hot take thread i wanted to take one that wasn't so far out there as to be crazy. i like king but i think he's a little too reckless with his body. gets himself hurt. jackson weighs almost 20 lbs more than king...more sturdy.

 

[AmishMafia]

Capers was responsible for two highly successful defensive units with the Packers as well with one being a major reason the team won the Super Bowl in 2010.

I think a large portion of Packers fans unjustifiably deny DC the ability to coordinator an above defense as long as given some decent talent. While Hayward and Hyde might work as evidence to the contrary there are a lot of players that left Green Bay without contributing with another team.

All well and true. Not every player has what it takes to make it in the NFL. Clearly Hyde and Hayward had what it takes but they underachieved their potential under Capers. It is very unusual for a player to be average on one team and then suddenly become a stud for another team.

The fact remains there is a pattern with Capers. In all of his coaching tours he did very well in the first few years and then started getting progressively worse. Clearly he doesn't appear to develop players or utilize them to their strengths.

 

[Mike McCarthy]

Seems this thread is turning into a spin off of the infamous fire capers thread. What came first the bad talent or the bad coaching, it is almost as puzzling as the chicken or the egg.

 

[SUGAMAN44]

Hi Everyone,

My Predictions haha.

Defense:

-Matthews, Perry, Bulaga, Daniels will be hurt most of season.( don't with that on them, but expect it )
-Wilkerson only has a average year. Seems was always just about the money
-Williams will be number one corner, Alexander will beat out king for for 2nd spot.
-HaHa wont have a better season. cause what are the odds of that.
-Josh Jones has a good season.
-Linebackers will be average all year, Martinez probable get tons of tackles again.

Offense:

O-line will be beat up most of year, have to rotate guys non stop.
Running backs- I like Jones for rb1, Williams for rb2. Together they have ok season. probably both end up getting hurt for a couple games during season.
Montgomery- probably get hurt after first couple weeks.
I believe Graham will have a really good year. be one of top te in nfl again.
Lewis will be effective on o-line
Adams will make pro bowl
cobb wont have a super statistical season, but will catch 10 plus tds
Guessing Allison gets wr3 spot. Has a descent year.
Rogers- Makes it the whole season, but see's some decline.

biggest improvements:

Josh Jones
Blake Martinez
Alexander
Jimmy Graham

Don't improve

HaHa
Bulaga
Cobb
Perry
Matthews
Wilkerson

Rankings prediction;
Offense: 6th
Defense: 20th

 

[swhitset]

Clinton-Dix shouldn't been considered an All-Pro by any means but once again I truly believe he's criticized way too much among Packers fans.

I think it balances out ... personally I think he was given too much credit the year before due to a couple of gift interceptions.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

i like king but i think he's a little too reckless with his body. gets himself hurt. jackson weighs almost 20 lbs more than king...more sturdy.

King weighs 200 pounds while Jackson is listed at 196 on the Packers website.

The fact remains there is a pattern with Capers. In all of his coaching tours he did very well in the first few years and then started getting progressively worse. Clearly he doesn't appear to develop players or utilize them to their strengths.

It's definitely strange that Capers had success early during all of his tenures with teams in the NFL before the performance dropped off significantly. In my opinion it's a given that Thompson's draft and develop philosophy didn't work out well with DC's approach to coordinate a defense.

 

[swhitset]

I agree that Clinton-Dix struggled at times last season but there's no reason for a lot of Packers fans advocating to replace or even get rid of him.

no reason? How about he may not be worth the money he wants in free agency next year.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

personally I think he was given too much credit the year before due to a couple of gift interceptions.

I'm not gonna argue about that.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

no reason? How about he may not be worth the money he wants in free agency next year.

You have no idea about how much money Clinton-Dix is seeking in free agency next offseason.

 

[swhitset]

You have no idea about how much money Clinton-Dix is seeking in free agency next offseason.

I didn’t say I did... I’m just pointing out that you made a definitive statement with the same lack of knowledge....I was just offering a posssible counter.

 

[Mondio]

I didn’t say I did... I’m just pointing out that you made a definitive statement with the same lack of knowledge....I was just offering a posssible counter.

I have no idea what he's seeking either, but I will say if his production resembles last year, he can take a hike for any amount he's seeking. Including the vet minimum

He was slow, a step late often, out of position and an assured missed tackler. Then he sailed they the last couple weeks letting everyone down including teammates that were still trying to do their best while he went thru motions. I'm willing to let him atone for that misjudgement in his part.

But while here, tossing out last season, I still think he's been overrated by a bit for much of it. He seems to have the hype of a Super star and the production of a Packer version of Hyde or less.

 

[swhitset]

I have no idea what he's seeking either, but I will say if his production resembles last year, he can take a hike for any amount he's seeking. Including the vet minimum

He was slow, a step late often, out of position and an assured missed tackler. Then he sailed they the last couple weeks letting everyone down including teammates that were still trying to do their best while he went thru motions. I'm willing to let him atone for that misjudgement in his part.

But while here, tossing out last season, I still think he's been overrated by a bit for much of it. He seems to have the hype of a Super star and the production of a Packer version of Hyde or less.

I really don’t like talking negatively about Packer players, but I’ve never really been a fan of Clinton Dix.... However, as long as he is out there playing for the pack, I will root for him lol.

 

[906Fan]

[TWEET]https://mobile.twitter.com/Michael_Cohen13/status/1006956261051650055[/TWEET]

Whoops, looks like his fist slipped.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I didn’t say I did... I’m just pointing out that you made a definitive statement with the same lack of knowledge....I was just offering a posssible counter.

I was talking about that it would be a terrible idea to replace Clinton-Dix before the start of this season. The Packers should definitely be smart about how much to offer him in free agency next offseason.

I have no idea what he's seeking either, but I will say if his production resembles last year, he can take a hike for any amount he's seeking. Including the vet minimum

In my opinion it's ridiculous to suggest that the Packers shouldn't even offer Clinton-Dix the veteran minimum. It seems a lot of fans have forgotten about the play of Jennings and McMillian pretty fast.

 

[Mondio]

It would also be ridiculous to invest any amount of dollars in a guy that quits a season early and barely goes thru the motions the last month of the year. Have we forgotten what players like that offer a team, Martellus anyone? If he can't show me he can be a leader when it looks lost, he's nothing more than a guy, and if he quits when it all looks lost, then he can take a hike because he won't be there when you need him. There are other guys that can play safety on this team and others, and I'd be fine looking for one if Dix reaffirms he's a quitter. Even if all it would take was the vet minimum to keep him.

But like I said, he's young and has an opportunity to atone for that mistake.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

It would also be ridiculous to invest any amount of dollars in a guy that quits a season early and barely goes thru the motions the last month of the year. Have we forgotten what players like that offer a team, Martellus anyone? If he can't show me he can be a leader when it looks lost, he's nothing more than a guy, and if he quits when it all looks lost, then he can take a hike because he won't be there when you need him. There are other guys that can play safety on this team and others, and I'd be fine looking for one if Dix reaffirms he's a quitter. Even if all it would take was the vet minimum to keep him.

I'm not sure the front office and coaching staff agrees with your take on Clinton-Dix quitting late last season.

 

[Mondio]

I'm not sure the front office and coaching staff agrees with your take on Clinton-Dix quitting late last season.

They might not. Did he look like a player giving his all to you at the end of the year? I've seen him miss plays with effort. I've seen the best in the league miss plays with effort. He was going thru motions last year and not even making attempts by the time it was all said and done. I'm curious to see how he responds this year.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

They might not. Did he look like a player giving his all to you at the end of the year? I've seen him miss plays with effort. I've seen the best in the league miss plays with effort. He was going thru motions last year and not even making attempts by the time it was all said and done. I'm curious to see how he responds this year.

I admit that Clinton-Dix didn't have a great season by any means in 2017 but in my opinion it's close to impossible to evaluate if he quit sitting in front of a TV.