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Has Ted Thompson gone off course?

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by FrankRizzo, May 12, 2010.

  1. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    Packers on the cusp of greatness - JSOnline

    GOOD HISTORICAL article, here's part of it.

    Green Bay — It was February 1996.

    The Green Bay Packers had just finished an 11-5 regular season that included an NFC Central Division crown and a trip to the NFC Championship Game. Those Packers ranked seventh in the NFL in offense and 14th in defense.

    General manager Ron Wolf and head coach Mike Holmgren both were a little more than four years into their jobs of turning around a moribund franchise. Quarterback Brett Favre was in his football prime, having just turned 26 years old.

    Now, fast forward to today.
    Again, the Packers are coming off an 11-5 regular season, although this one didn't include a division title and featured a first-round playoff loss. The 2009 Packers, though, ranked sixth in total offense and No. 2 in total defense.

    General manager Ted Thompson just completed his fifth year on the job, while McCarthy - like Holmgren - wrapped up Year 4. Quarterback Aaron Rodgers - like Favre - is 26.

    In so many ways, there are enormous parallels between where the Packers are today and where the organization was 14 years ago. But there's also one enormous difference.

    In 1996, Wolf sensed just how close his team was to an NFL title.
    He used free agency to sign defensive tackle Santana Dotson, kick returner Desmond Howard, wideout Don Beebe, left tackle Bruce Wilkerson, linebacker Ron Cox and traded for safety Eugene Robinson.

    That group all played huge roles the following season as the Packers won their first Super Bowl in 29 years.

    Thompson has had four months to improve his roster since the Packers' 51-45 overtime loss to Arizona in the NFC wild-card round. His scorecard currently reads: zero free agent signings, zero trades.

    With such little activity these past four months, the question begs: Can Thompson get this team over the hump, as his mentor Wolf did 14 years ago?

    Much more.... click the link above.
    I want to say this: There are numerous paths a team can take. And TT can get us to the title without copying Wolf. Would it have been smarter though, to follow the path a little closer?
     
  2. Cardsmc25

    Cardsmc25 Cheesehead

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    As much as I would love to agree with you that he has done squat with free agency... Is there really those free agents out there like there was for Wolf? I think that the prices out weigh a majority of the talent. That Robinson from Houston was going to get PAID, and I don't know if he was worth it.

    I don't know why but praising Thompson is like swallowing a poison pill for me... buuut he has done an alright job protecting the "G".
     
  3. zimbabwe

    zimbabwe Cheesehead

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    Lets be honest we are literally 3 free agents away from the superbowl.... NFC this year is set for us and the saints.........

    Adalius Thomas, Derrick Burgess, and even Alan Faneca before he signed with Arizona.....

    We could of used Ernie Sims and now with the Atogwe looking for a new home are you serious?

    Even bringing a troubled Cromartie would of sufficed......Yeah hes troubled but he would be in a role where he is held accountable..... Woodson, Harris, Collins, KAPERs would get him straight.....

    TT is the draft guru but we have to open up the piggie bank and go for it..... Every team in our division are stocking up for long run.... Vikings are a young QB away from it.... Bears a #1 WR/Oline and a healthy Urlacher..... The baby lions have made crazy leaps these last drafts and free agency killed it...... wHERE ARE WE?????


    OPEN THE PIGGIE BANK!!!!!
     
  4. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    I personally am okay with Ted not being active in this FA class. Besides Feneca there was really no one I wanted to see on the packers.
     
  5. TheGiftedApe

    TheGiftedApe TheGiftedApe

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    You have to look at the price you have to pay for the product that you will recieve. Everyone trys to say oh the packers are just 1 piece away and they would be super bowl champions. I just dont buy into that philosophy. Are you gonna tell me that the saints won the super bowl because they signed Darren Sharper? Do the Colts compete for championships ever-year because they trade for big name WR's in the offseason? no, the team is way more than any 1 player or any free agent....I dont think you can put tom brady on the 49ers and make them super bowl champions. Theres something to be said about a player that is drafted by a team, plays for that same team, gets paid by that team, and wins for that team. You think if ray lewis got traded today to the rams, you think he would show up and play still? or do you think he would retire. These are human beings, real life is not a "Madden 10 Franchise" and you cant just trade players here and there and pay people whatever they want and expect your team to flourish, the redskins and the raiders are some of the perfect examples, these teams make money, play in big cities, have HUGE fan base's but they sign huge free agents and pay players ridiculous money, but they cant win anygames. Draft is always going to be the best way to build your team, Whats the last big draft pick that the raiders or the Redskins have made that they really hit on, and that player became a stud.The raiders? maybe kirk morrison, the skins had sean taylor, and he was a great pick, but laron landry is no sean taylor. Skins also had arrington, but he was a couple season wonder. If you cant produce players through your draft system, your team will SUFFER, and SUFFER horribly. Free agents should be a suppliment to your draft, if you rely on a free agent to come in and fill holes on your team, what does that say about your organization, says your not getting it done.
     
  6. Green_Bay_Packers

    Green_Bay_Packers Cheesehead

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    HAHAHA Bush LMAO!
     
  7. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    To the crowd who tried to defend TT every time, and says there were/are no FA's out there that can help us: Please, stop kidding yourself.

    One of the biggest reasons we lost last year was because our depth at CB included dogschit after Tramon. That's not rocket science. That's depending on guys who have either proven they suck (Bush), or proven nothing (Bell, Underwood, Lee). Many seasoned Packer fans wanted a veteran brought in last stretch drive there such as a Ty Law, Mike McKenzie, or Chris McCallister. In the end, we were doomed with Bush, Bell, Underwood allowing us to get torched like the nighttime sky on the 4th of July.

    Antonio Cromartie was a gift on a silver platter, that was not accepted, just as Randy Moss was in 2007. Both have them were clear ultra talents for cheap bargain prices, but as with everything (including all 1st round draft picks), it came with some risk.

    It's ironic that we will play the Jets this year, a team who has built thru the draft (Sanchez, Greene, Cottchery, DBrickawshaw, Keller, Mangold, Revis Island), but also has been aggressive in FA and trades (Kris Jenkins, Cromartie, Braylon Edwards, Santonio Holmes, LaDainian Tomlinson).
     
  8. turbo69

    turbo69 Cheesehead

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    Whoever thinks that the gap between the Vikings and Packers.......is Huge, they need to put down their crack pipe and SLOWLY BACK AWAY!
     
  9. DTown SBrown

    DTown SBrown Cheesehead

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    But then you list off 6 players. Im not disagreeing with you, but the Bears are stocking up the WRONG way, with aging talent and one Talented, but unsuccessful, young QB. They are nowhere near talented enough for an extended run into the playoffs, and you list the need for an Oline like they grow on trees.
    The same goes for the Vikings. With Favre they are 12-1 SB odds(As are the Packers) Without, they are closer to 20-1. If they dont win with him there, they will be hurting for a while when he does stop for good.
    The team I am worried about in the next few seasons is the Lions. They are getting talented and young, and if they hit on some of the picks they have made, these guys can be scary soon.
     
  10. DTown SBrown

    DTown SBrown Cheesehead

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    Again, like the earlier poster stated, this isnt Madden 10. Just due to a player being available for trade doesnt mean that they available to be traded to us. Its funny you bring up Moss, because he fits exactly the premise I am going to make: Players dont want to come here. Moss stated that GB was NEVER an option for him when he got traded. He said he wouldnt do it. We think that everyone would want to play for a "legendary team", and that may have been the case when the players all made relatively no money to play, but this isnt the case anymore. Money talks, and perks talk. What does GB have to offer these young stars? Many dont play for titles anymore, they play for $$$ and fame. Titles are just an added perk if they can get it in the right city.

    Players today have so much say in their contract negotiations that if they dont want to go somewhere, they usually get what they want. For better or worse, GB is still considered one of the last stops for players, due to the perceived non ethnic surroundings, location, weather, etc. Star players who are coming in from a place like SD are not going to willingly trade away 80 degree weather year round, popping nightlife, and beautiful women for 60 degree summers and -25 winters, nightlife that consists of Mackinaws Grill and Spirits and an Olive Garden, and the average Northern WI women of breeding age (sorry, no offense intended but lets be real).

    Honestly, if we werent fans of the Packers, would we blame them? I am sure we havent made a ton of inquiries, but at the same time, Im sure TT phone hasnt been ringing off the hook with talented players who want to come to GB to play. He just isnt going to come out and have a presser to let all the detractors know that is the case. Hes not that type of GM.

    Im not defending him, but again, good players dont grow on trees, and those willing to come here definitely arent a dime a dozen. We typically wind up getting players on the back end of their careers and want to prove they still have it, or we breed talent and then keep it.

    Its what we are, what we have always been, and will have to be in the future if the cap disappears like many believe it will.
     
  11. NYPacker

    NYPacker Cheesehead

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    TheGiftedApe and and DTown SBrown make the best points here. This isn't a virtual world where you just get a player and somehow they automatically make your team better. This is why a lot of teams look for the intangibles: character, work ethic, team player etc. etc. Without them they have no way to fit with the other guys in the locker room. If you ask me TT doesn't act in FA because he looks for guys like that. Not only does he look for good character guys in the draft but also in FA as well. The truth is, there are more good character guys in the draft than in FA.

    Another pet peeve of mine is that although we discourage TT for the FA that he doesn't sign, we don't give credit to the ones he does. Tramon Williams, Charles Woodson and Ryan Pickett were solid pickups off the street. We always mention these guys' names bet never put the words "good job TT" in the same sentence. A lot of people say TT didn't participate that much in this year's FA but I believe that's totally bogus. Yes he resigned his own guys but to tell you the truth they were probably the BPAs left in FA anyway. Pickett was the best NT left after Hampton's resigning, Nick Collins was arguably the best safety not to hit the open market and Chad Clifton was hands down the best LT in FA this year.

    I don't mean to offend anyone but I think it's ignorant to keep mentioning Cromartie's name and bashing TT for not getting him. Read this and it'll all be clear to you: Cromartie has complained about the Chargers playing too much zone | ProFootballTalk.com Cromartie absolutely HATED the chargers' new defense because it played cover-2, cover-3 zones all the time. What makes you so sure he would've liked it here where we do the same thing? I know Capers can adjust to your skillset in this defense but that only does so much. Like I've said before on another forum about Nnamdi Asomuga, it'd be great to get him but like Cromartie he is better off in another scheme. Just because the player looks great on another team doesn't mean he'll necessarily be one on ours despite how it looks like on paper.
     
  12. SpartaChris

    SpartaChris Cheesehead

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    Frankly, I was glad we didn't get Randy Moss. While he still has talent, he had a chance to be a real leader and game changer in Oakland yet decided to just throw in the towel. Yeah, he had a breakout season in 2007, but you look at 2008 and even last season, he quit on some plays. He even got called out (I think by the Panthers, IIRC) for quitting on some plays. The guy is a proven malcontent. Thanks but no thanks.
     
  13. Pugger

    Pugger Cheesehead

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    I understand folks grouse about our secondary situation last year and lack of depth so that we had to trot out the likes of Bush and Bell in the nickel and dime packages and got shredded by vet QBs. But any team is going to have problems when it is hit by numerous injuries at one position. In the end we lost Harris, Lee, Blackmon and Peprah to IR. Underwood and Bigby had injury issues too.
     
  14. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    Very well said. I agree 100%.
     
  15. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    The bottom line is we lost last year because our pass defense killed us.
    Now even the most loyal Ted-supporters must admit that.

    Now, there are 2 trains of thought:
    #1- There were too many injuries to the DBs so we had no chance.
    #2- All teams suffered many injuries but our depth at CB sucked and when they had to play, we got torched.
    #2A- Our pass rush sucked so even when Harris was in there, we still got torched (See Minnesota. Twice.)

    It's essentially that simple.
     
  16. NYPacker

    NYPacker Cheesehead

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    Nobody's denying any of this. The question here is, can you GUARANTEE that all these problems would've been fixed with free agents??
     
  17. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    So what grade would everyone give TT?

    I say a B, he has drafted very well, brought in bargin FAs and done wonders with the cap. I cant go above a B until we reach the SuperBowl.
     
  18. NYPacker

    NYPacker Cheesehead

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    Yup I'd say that's fair. Like I've said before TT is a jeckyl-n-hide GM. For every good move he makes there are bad ones to complement them. Therefore he deserves an average grade. But maybe a bit higher than average since we did go to the playoffs at least twice and he drafted a couple of pro bowlers. B is fine with me.
     
  19. Pugger

    Pugger Cheesehead

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    Our secondary was decimated by injuries and so we had to use the bottom of the barrel in passing situations. I'm sure no one on the Packers staff in week one thought we'd eventually have to use the 6th guy on the depth chart in the nickel and dime. We had no push up the middle from our D line so all teams had to do was double team CM3 and QBs had all day to throw. TT addressed that with drafting Neal and Wilson. Now we will have enough guys in the rotation so our big guys up front won't be gassed in the fourth quarter. Plus this past season was the first year with a new defensive scheme. All of this should help make our defense better this year than last.
     
  20. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    I am not sure if the Favre thing impacts my grade of him. He made the right long term choice for the packers, in the face of alot of heat from the press and fans. I think he could have handled it better and I think he wavered on it when he shouldnt have.

    I hope TT writes a book someday on his days in GB. I would love to hear his true feelings and thoughts on alot of situations.
     
  21. TheGiftedApe

    TheGiftedApe TheGiftedApe

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    I'd have to agree with giving him a B for this offseason so far, But you can't really fairly judge it until next offseason. TT didnt let anyof our big FA's get away, and he picked up some solid posistions in the draft. If 3+ of these guys from the draft pan out and become starters you'd have to give TT an A to A+ I mean, anytime you can pick up potential starters in the draft, it's a good offseason in my book. btw its looking like bulaga, burnett, neal, newhouse, and I'd have to say I've been impressed with the general quality of talent that TT has added in the past 2 months, especially at the prices he's paying :).
     
  22. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    We are a good team.
    Much of the reason that we are a good team is:

    Aaron Rodgers, drafted by TT
    Greg Jennings, drafted by TT
    Jermichael Finley, drafted by TT
    Jordyzzz, drafted by TT
    James Jones, drafted by TT
    Ryan Grant, traded for by TT
    Clay Matthews, drafted by TT
    Nicky Collins, drafted by TT
    Chuck Woodson, signed by TT, lucky
    Ryan Pickett, signed by TT
    Mike McCarthy, signed by TT... should have had Sean Peyton? Maybe not, maybe.

    So TT-haters even have to give TT is due for all the above, plus more.

    But Wolf got is to this point too. But then what did he do?
     
  23. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    I actually like Josh Bell, and feel the guy has character. He does need to gain 20 pounds though, but I honestly like the dude's attitude and resolve.
    He manned up for the Steelers loss, instead of making excuses like a lot of punks do.
    Even thought that loss was painful as hell, he accepted the blame. Jarrett Bush wouldn't have. That bastard always deflects and denies. I hate that guy.

    Nobody is counting on Bell, but I like him better than Bush for sure, and I still have never seen Pat Lee do anything yet either.
     
  24. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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  25. Ghost of Billy Mays

    Ghost of Billy Mays Cheesehead

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    I for one am grateful we have Ted as our GM. Could he do a better job? Sure, who couldn't? IMO, Bill Polian is the best GM in the NFL, and I'm sure if I looked at the gnat's *** I could find plenty of fault in how he does his job. USA Today recently had a article on ranking the GM's of the NFL. I believe Ted was 13th or 14th. Now do I agree with that? Now way. But is he top 5? Doubt it. My point is I guess is it could be a lot worse, like Jerry Angleo worse, or Al Davis. I like what Ted did this off-season in free agency and with the draft, I believe he knows more than I do, and time will tell. I'll admit I wasn't crazy about him drafting ARodg, I knew we needed a QB, but everything you read about him before the draft was he was a Tedford product, and them QB's don't amount to **** in the NFL. He was right and I was dead wrong, thankfully. I think we are built for a nice long stretch of successful seasons, and I'm grateful for that.
     

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