Fant or Hockenson?

brandon2348

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The only TE that deserves or to be talked about being drafted in the 1st round is Fant. His potential projection = 1st round grade.

The NFL is a whole different level of speed then college and the rest of the TE's project to average

Overall this TE class isn't as strong as some thought.
 
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The only TE that deserves or to be talked about being drafted in the 1st round is Fant. His potential projection = 1st round grade.

The NFL is a whole different level of speed then college and the rest of the TE's project to average

Overall this TE class isn't as strong as some thought.
I hope your not basing this off of combine results...
 

brandon2348

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I hope your not basing this off of combine results...

Yes. I am. If you can't run and can't bench then how the hell are you gonna compete in the NFL at a high level? Sure, he is a good football player but marginal athlete. You don't draft those guys in the 1st round. You definitely don't overlook the facts just because he is a FAN FAVORiTE and REACH.

This whole Hokenson thing was a fairy tale to begin with.

I'm happy with Graham and Tonyan(who is working out with Kittle) and maybe drafting a guy like Sternberger in the 3rd.

We don't need Hockenson.
 

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Yes. I am. If you can't run and can't bench then how the hell are you gonna compete in the NFL at a high level? Sure, he is a good football player but marginal athlete. You don't draft those guys in the 1st round. You definitely don't overlook the facts just because he is a FAN FAVORiTE and REACH.

This whole Hokenson thing was a fairy tale to begin with.

I'm happy with Graham and Tonyan(who is working out with Kittle) and maybe drafting a guy like Sternberger in the 3rd.

We don't need Hockenson.
My God, you know more than EVERY evaluator, which NFL team do you work for?
 
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Yes. I am. If you can't run and can't bench then how the hell are you gonna compete in the NFL at a high level? Sure, he is a good football player but marginal athlete. You don't draft those guys in the 1st round. You definitely don't overlook the facts just because he is a FAN FAVORiTE and REACH.

This whole Hokenson thing was a fairy tale to begin with.

I'm happy with Graham and Tonyan(who is working out with Kittle) and maybe drafting a guy like Sternberger in the 3rd.

We don't need Hockenson.
I never disagreed with your assessment, but something I don’t agree with is how much value you put into combine results. There have been hundreds of great players that had a terrible combine and hundreds of terrible players that had a great combine. When assessing a player, you have to look at them from many facets.
 

brandon2348

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My God, you know more than EVERY evaluator, which NFL team do you work for?

Here is the deal. At 4.70 he wont stretch the seam in the NFL. He doesn't have a top gear. I'm not gonna drop a 1st round pick on a great blocker with good hands. Sorry.
 

brandon2348

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I never disagreed with your assessment, but something I don’t agree with is how much value you put into combine results. There have been hundreds of great players that had a terrible combine and hundreds of terrible players that had a great combine. When assessing a player, you have to look at them from many facets.

Let me be clear. Im all about tape but when you start talking about drafting a guy in the first round he needs to check all the boxes and Hokenson didn't. Not saying he isn't a good player but with his combine results I don't know how he is a first round graded player.

He repped 17 times and ran a 4.7. Thats not first round stuff for a TE
 
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HardRightEdge

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Here is the deal. At 4.70 he wont stretch the seam in the NFL. He doesn't have a top gear. I'm not gonna drop a 1st round pick on a great blocker with good hands. Sorry.
Yeah, that time together with the other measurables, would knock him out of the first round. Some guys go back to work, bump their numbers at their Pro Day, and get back in the conversation.
 

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avg. NFL TE is 4.74, he is the first Mackey award winner as a sophomore. As a blocker he is a mauler for a TE, brings a run the ball attitude, which we need. A sophomore with a double degree, smart as hell and will understand game situations, another area we are lacking. The Pats win with as much smarts as athletic ability. He gives us the ability to do multiple things with the same personnel group. We play in Green Bay, to reach the SB we need to run the ball in Jan., short throws to move the chains, and play defense. All the teams that run 3 and 4 WR sets sure are **** in Sept. and get their *** kicked in Jan. Every player in the NFL is an athlete, give us athletes that are also smart. As for the hype you claim, it just shows me you never saw him play.
 
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Skimming through the numbers, the "top freak" so far might be Justice Hill.

5' 9 1/2", 198 lbs.

4.4
21 lifts
40" vertical
130" broad
 

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Forty means very little for a TE. You want them to be sub 4.8. Beyond that, there's little correlation. Knocking Hock out of the 1st over a 4.70 would be crazy.
 

brandon2348

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avg. NFL TE is 4.74, he is the first Mackey award winner as a sophomore. As a blocker he is a mauler for a TE, brings a run the ball attitude, which we need. A sophomore with a double degree, smart as hell and will understand game situations, another area we are lacking. The Pats win with as much smarts as athletic ability. He gives us the ability to do multiple things with the same personnel group. We play in Green Bay, to reach the SB we need to run the ball in Jan., short throws to move the chains, and play defense. All the teams that run 3 and 4 WR sets sure are **** in Sept. and get their *** kicked in Jan. Every player in the NFL is an athlete, give us athletes that are also smart. As for the hype you claim, it just shows me you never saw him play.

I'm a Badger fan so I saw him play. He is a good player. My point is I don't see how you can still give him a 1st round grade after today.

As you said 4 74 is AVERAGE SPEED for a TE in the NFL. YOU DON'T DRAFT TE's WITH AVERAGE SPEED IN THE 1ST ROUND. MACKEY AWARD WINNER OR NOT. PERIOD!
 

brandon2348

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Forty means very little for a TE. You want them to be sub 4.8. Beyond that, there's little correlation. Knocking Hock out of the 1st over a 4.70 would be crazy.

Add the 17 reps?

Marginal performance. Fant proved he is the only TE worthy of a 1st round grade.
 

brandon2348

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Forty means very little for a TE. You want them to be sub 4.8. Beyond that, there's little correlation. Knocking Hock out of the 1st over a 4.70 would be crazy.

He don't have a top gear. It was obvious in plain site.

Go sell your Fairy Tale to someone else.
 

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Everyone knew that Fant is super fast and Hockenson isn't. Hock has been super highly regarded all along for being a stud, not a track star. I don't see why their meeting speed expectations should change anything.

Irv Smith Jr would fit very nicely into the H Back role that features prominently in the Shanahan offense. He's one to watch. Same idea as Jusczyk in SF, but a bigger factor in the passing game.
 
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HardRightEdge

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Forty means very little for a TE. You want them to be sub 4.8. Beyond that, there's little correlation. Knocking Hock out of the 1st over a 4.70 would be crazy.
4.70 is a speed that does not give today's faster LBs much trouble. You want at least low 4.6s. He's got relatively short arms and small hands, and his lifts were not impressive. He may have 1st. round techniques but mid-round measurables so far which makes the projection difficult. Let's see what he does with the rest of the measurables and drills.
 

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4.70 is a speed that does not give today's faster LBs much trouble. You want at least low 4.6s. He's got relatively short arms and small hands, and his lifts were not impressive. He may have 1st. round techniques but mid-round measurables so far which makes the projection difficult. Let's see what he does with the rest of the measurables and drills.

Straight line speed has very little to do with TE'S giving linebackers problems. Ertz was slower. He separates laterally.
 

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