Expectations for 2020

[Sunshinepacker]

Lazard still has to prove he's able to contribute against a decent secondary.

Lazard has shown he can contribute, he just needs to show whether or not he can contribute at a high level. His ceiling is probably a good third receiver. MVS becoming reliable would help a LOT since nobody else at receiver forces safeties deep and the defense can sit on the short/intermediate stuff that Lazard does.

 

[Mondio]

MVS is running routes better, keep those hands consistent and he is going to be a really tough cover for teams. He could be a hugely important piece if he keeps his hands in the game. People had a hard time running with him before. He starts applying what he’s learning o his route running etc and he could be unstoppable

 

[bigbubbatd]

I want to the see the wrs produced for 2 or 3 more weeks before I get too excited. The Vikings cbs are trash. Seriously awful. Detroit's are not great either and Atlanta is terrible. It could really help build chemistry and confidence.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Has EQ found a home on special teams yet? I recall him not playing them his rookie year. Makes a difference on game day actives.

That's true, still EQ not being active is a strong hint he hasn't made significant improvements as a receiver.

Lazard has shown he can contribute, he just needs to show whether or not he can contribute at a high level.

Once again, Lazard has only put up decent numbers against terrible secondaries. He needs to prove himself against better competition to be trusted moving forward.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Has EQ found a home on special teams yet? I recall him not playing them his rookie year. Makes a difference on game day actives.

Considering he was game day inactive without having appeared on the injury report while a couple of temp elevations from the PS were getting snaps, I think it is fair to say not.

I can't speak to the 2018 preseason, but in that regular season he took a total of 15 special teams snaps. The second issue I had when he came in is the reports that daddy told the Notre Dame coaches that his son would not be playing special teams. If that pertained in high school he may have never taken a special teams snap in his life when he arrived in Green Bay.

Malik Taylor took 14 special teams snaps this past week which probably tells you what you need to know.

The first issue I've had with St. Brown since day 1 is he rounds off his route breaks. While you don't expect a tall long strider to have the wiggle of a waterbug slot receiver, he does not have the crispness in his route running of the other tall guys, Lazard and the clearly improved MVS. He's a fluid runner who looks good on posts and corners but he's not going to get the consistent separation you want against man D snapping off the short in-breaking and out-breaking routes, the meat and potatoes of any passing offense. Without that corners can play off and still close on the short routes. That problem is exacerbated by the fact he doesn't exactly play to his size. I suppose he might develop some compensating technique but having missed all of last season and no preseason this year with nothing to look at I'm presuming that has not happened.

I've noted in the past that he does seem to have a knack for reading zone defenses and finding space. Same in the scramble drill. cheeseheadtv.com did a piece on this, a link I can't find at the moment. You might see him getting play time against D's playing a lot of zone. Or maybe not if Lazard and MVS keep doing what they're doing.

While the book is not closed for a guy at the start of what amounts to his second season, you have to consider the possibility that he's a fine athlete and a good college player who reached his limits. The fact his development was overly controlled by his father remains a concern for his mental game at the next level.

You have give MVS his due. For all the crap he took last year he kept plugging. There's mental toughness there. In the microcosm of one game we saw that, drops not phasing him, snapping right back.

 

[gopkrs]

Once again, Lazard has only put up decent numbers against terrible secondaries. He needs to prove himself against better competition to be trusted moving forward.

Well, I trust his hands.

 

[GleefulGary]

MVS made some nice plays but had a terrible drop and should have come up with another long catch. EQ not even being active was a surprise and definitely not a good sign moving forward.

The last two years MVS shuts down after the drops.

The drops aren't good, and I'm not excusing them, but they happen. MVS was able to get open, consistently, and provides a vertical presence we don't have otherwise. His route running is much improved. LaFleur has praised him. Rodgers has praised him. He put up 4/95/1...it's okay to be critical, but you're nitpicking. He had a good game against a secondary with two recent first round CB's. They're not untalented. Not forget Smith and Harris are very good too.

 

[GleefulGary]

Lazard still has to prove he's able to contribute against a decent secondary.

The Vikings have young CB's, but their secondary is definitely decent.

Gladney is talented, Hughes is talented, Dantzler is talented, albeit slow. Smith and Harris are excellent. They ain't bad.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

Nitpicking is what he does best lol jk.

Anyway, it's possible the slower development by MVS was due to GMo and Kumerow taking up reps he possibly could have used to better get on the same page as Rodgers. But whether sooner or later in that kind of development, if he gets it then that's all that matters.

I don't blame anyone who was upset that we didn't go spending free agent money or big draft capital on WRs. I myself didn't like it. But it could be Gute knew something we didn't, though I do wish he would have spent the first round pick on an ILB instead then.

And it doesn't mean it's time to go drinking gallons of koolaid on MVS and Laz yet. There's a lot of football left to go this year before they get the final grade. But optimism and being encouraged is warranted I'd say, and if Rodgers keeps hitting those strikes, this offense is looking to be once again striking fear in its opponents.

 

[bigbubbatd]

The Vikings have young CB's, but their secondary is definitely decent.

Gladney is talented, Hughes is talented, Dantzler is talented, albeit slow. Smith and Harris are excellent. They ain't bad.

Their secondary at safety is great. Their corners are really bad as of right now. Hughes and hill were bad when they played last year and looked bad again Sunday. They are banking on rookies who maybe will get it but calling nfl guys talented is funny. All nfl players for the most part are talented. The question is if they can play. A lot of talent cbs never amount to much - Rollins, Jackson, randall, etc. The Vikings don't have a cb nearly as good as kevin king let alone alexander

 

[gbgary]

9-7. i don't expect the injury luck they had last year to repeat itself. the O will be better (if you-know-what happens) but the middle of the D is still a concern (as of this date). i think injuries and minn's improvement will bump them down to 2nd. hope i'm wrong about injuries. if so everything else will fall into place for a playoff seed...which will only mess up next years draft position...dang it.

well...4 months later, with lots of water under the bridge, and the Packers turned an L prediction into a W. off the top of my head minn had a key player opt out but signed another impact player. the Packers O was totally different and much improved. the D was about the same. hopefully it doesn't get worse. raven green should be back soon but clark's out now. hopefully not for long (saying this not knowing the latest info if any). it's one game but it's encouraging...not for a SB but the division for sure.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

The drops aren't good, and I'm not excusing them, but they happen. MVS was able to get open, consistently, and provides a vertical presence we don't have otherwise. His route running is much improved. LaFleur has praised him. Rodgers has praised him. He put up 4/95/1...it's okay to be critical, but you're nitpicking. He had a good game against a secondary with two recent first round CB's. They're not untalented. Not forget Smith and Harris are very good too.

I mentioned that MVS made some plays, one of them being a great touchdown catch. That doesn't change the fact his drop was terrible and that he should have come up with another long reception. Hopefully he will make those catches moving forward as it could come back and haunt us against a better opponent.

The Vikings have young CB's, but their secondary is definitely decent.

Gladney is talented, Hughes is talented, Dantzler is talented, albeit slow. Smith and Harris are excellent. They ain't bad.

Their cornerbacks were awful against the Packers. While Smith and Harris are elite none of them made an impact play on Sunday.

Anyway, it's possible the slower development by MVS was due to GMo and Kumerow taking up reps he possibly could have used to better get on the same page as Rodgers.

MVS received significant playing time early last season but failed to earn the trust of Rodgers and the coaching staff while been given every opportunity to do so. That seems to have changed this year.

 

[Mondio]

a couple things about MVS after 1 game. You can see he's been working on the little things that make a person an NFL receiver. It's not just run fast anymore. My eyes tell me he's doing the little things better which tells me he's been doing real work and not just showing up for practice.

My eyes and ears also tell me that from Rodgers. He's been commenting on his work ethic this year rather than saying how other guys were working hard. and when he dropped an easy one, he gave him more chances. He does that with guys he knows have been working at their craft. He's never minded the mistakes if you were putting in the work during the week. All seemed apparent to me on Sunday.

I have hope for the kid. He could be a huge weapon.

 

[PikeBadger]

a couple things about MVS after 1 game. You can see he's been working on the little things that make a person an NFL receiver. It's not just run fast anymore. My eyes tell me he's doing the little things better which tells me he's been doing real work and not just showing up for practice.

My eyes and ears also tell me that from Rodgers. He's been commenting on his work ethic this year rather than saying how other guys were working hard. and when he dropped an easy one, he gave him more chances. He does that with guys he knows have been working at their craft. He's never minded the mistakes if you were putting in the work during the week. All seemed apparent to me on Sunday.

I have hope for the kid. He could be a huge weapon.

He appears to be developing nicely. Lazard as well appears comfortable and confident. I think we may be ahead of many other teams in terms of execution which doesn’t surprise me seeing that we have so many returning starters from last year.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Once again, Lazard has only put up decent numbers against terrible secondaries. He needs to prove himself against better competition to be trusted moving forward.

Please show me the 3rd option receivers in this league that consistently perform well against elite defenses. I think you're asking more of him than he can probably give. At best Lazard is a low-end #2 possession receiver. Those guys don't put up great numbers against great defenses.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Please show me the 3rd option receivers in this league that consistently perform well against elite defenses. I think you're asking more of him than he can probably give. At best Lazard is a low-end #2 possession receiver. Those guys don't put up great numbers against great defenses.

First of all Lazard was the Packers' #2 receiver last season. In addition I wasn't talking about him performing well against elite defenses but that he should put up decent numbers at least against one mediocre secondary before we appoint him to being a legit threat in this offense.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

First of all Lazard was the Packers' #2 receiver last season. In addition I wasn't talking about him performing well against elite defenses but that he should put up decent numbers at least against one mediocre secondary before we appoint him to being a legit threat in this offense.

In my post I stated that Lazard is probably only a good #3 WR. Just because the Packers have a terrible WR group outside of Adams doesn't magically make Lazard better. I think ppl are expecting more from him than he can probably give.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

In my post I stated that Lazard is probably only a good #3 WR. Just because the Packers have a terrible WR group outside of Adams doesn't magically make Lazard better. I think ppl are expecting more from him than he can probably give.

It seems we agree on Lazard's potential. My point was that a lot of Packers fans get too excited about him based on his performances against terrible secondaries.

 

[PikeBadger]

It seems we agree on Lazard's potential. My point was that a lot of Packers fans get too excited about him based on his performances against terrible secondaries.

I think you’re confusing excitement with satisfaction. Lazard has clearly proven that he has the trust of Rodgers and his coaches in relatively short time period. Some of us think he will continue to grow and develop. His growth and development has certainly exceeded Scantling’s and St. Brown’s. Now he’s shown he can be called upon to take an end around for 19 yards. The guy isn’t exactly a schlup. He’s making important contributions to the team’s winning effort just like Jamaal Williams does. Like Williams, he doesn’t hurt us with costly mistakes.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I think you’re confusing excitement with satisfaction. Lazard has clearly proven that he has the trust of Rodgers and his coaches in relatively short time period. Some of us think he will continue to grow and develop. His growth and development has certainly exceeded Scantling’s and St. Brown’s. Now he’s shown he can be called upon to take an end around for 19 yards. The guy isn’t exactly a schlup. He’s making important contributions to the team’s winning effort just like Jamaal Williams does. Like Williams, he doesn’t hurt us with costly mistakes.

Don't get me wrong, I agree that Lazard has developed nicely since arriving in Green Bay. I'm not as optimistic as others about him ever becoming a legit #2 receiver.

As a side note, while it seems he has moved past EQ on the depth chart he's still behind MVS on it.

 

[PikeBadger]

Don't get me wrong, I agree that Lazard has developed nicely since arriving in Green Bay. I'm not as optimistic as others about him ever becoming a legit #2 receiver.

As a side note, while it seems he has moved past EQ on the depth chart he's still behind MVS on it.

I consider that good news. We’re all hoping that Scantling has a great year.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I consider that good news. We’re all hoping that Scantling has a great year.

That would be extremely important to the success of the offense.

 

[PackAttack12]

The last two years MVS shuts down after the drops.

The drops aren't good, and I'm not excusing them, but they happen. MVS was able to get open, consistently, and provides a vertical presence we don't have otherwise. His route running is much improved. LaFleur has praised him. Rodgers has praised him. He put up 4/95/1...it's okay to be critical, but you're nitpicking. He had a good game against a secondary with two recent first round CB's. They're not untalented. Not forget Smith and Harris are very good too.

If teams have to consistently respect MVS over the top, I cannot emphasize enough how much that will open up the rest of the field. Very critical that MVS continue to produce.

 

[gopkrs]

If teams have to consistently respect MVS over the top, I cannot emphasize enough how much that will open up the rest of the field. Very critical that MVS continue to produce.

It still seems like Arod does not take advantage of that. He threw to MVS last week with two guys on him. I wish he would look quickly for an easy 15 yards.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

It still seems like Arod does not take advantage of that. He threw to MVS last week with two guys on him. I wish he would look quickly for an easy 15 yards.

Rodgers threw some great passes to MVS last week. I have a hard time understanding someone complaining about it at this point.