Another lost season in Rodgers prime

[Vrill]

Its not the play calling, its the personnel. Anyone with half a brain should be able to see that. Our WR core is mediocre, slow and can't get consistent separation. Rodgers needs better WR's and TE's. We need a guy on the outside who can "go and get it".

 

[brandon2348]

We lack outside weaponry and don't have a dominant TE to help make up for it. Our whole offensive premise has become Rodgers trying to draw the defense offsides and huck one downfield to get a PI call. Yawn.

 

[easyk83]

Tried to be fair (actually, based mostly on what I read), and I'd have to question 'stellar', maybe even 'good'

2013 DE Datone Jones D1 - Starting to make some noise, may turn out to be a #1
RB Eddie Lacy D2 - Had some ??? games, but obviously what the ground game needed
T David Bakhtiari D4a - Filled in adequately "for a 4th round rookie", not what's needed as a starter
C/G JC Tretter D4b - Came in nicely for a game, let's give him some time
CB Micah Hyde D5a - Would we miss him if he wasn't here?
LB Nate Palmer D6 - Would we miss him if he wasn't here?

2014 S Ha Ha Clinton-Dix D1 - Has problems occasionally, but still probably a good #1 pick
WR Davante Adams D2 - Really, really seems to suck
TE Richard Rodgers D3b - Really, really seems to suck
C Corey Linsley D5a - Looked like the answer last year, now see comments on Bak, above
WR Jared Abbrederis D5b - If he ever plays, we'll see
CB Demetri Goodson D6 - Yes, I guess he still is on the team
WR Jeff Janis D7 - His fault, or the coaching staff?

2015 DB Damarious Randall D1 - Doing well as a rookie at a very tough position, and one of need
CB Quinten Rollins D2 - Haven't heard as much about him, but no glaring weakness
WR Ty Montgomery D3 - See Abbrederis, above
LB Jake Ryan D4 - We want to see him, but we don't
QB Brett Hundley D5 - Great training camp, but we've seen that before. Hopefully will never be the starter.
FB Aaron Ripkowski D6a - Maybe special teamer, but a guy in a 'who cares?' position
TE Kennard Backman D6c - Well, this ought to fix our TE problems

2013

I think Datone Jones will not only become a starter but I think he'll be a difference maker too. I think he's starting to come into his own and he's looked very good when he's had the chance to rush outside the tackle. I think Eddie Lacy is an outstanding back, but like any running back he needs blocking. Bakhtiari is a serviceable left tackle, better player than we think, he doesn't get a lot of help. Hyde and Palmer are good depth guys. Bottom line I'm thinking we picked up 3 quality starters in this draft a serviceable starter and some nice depth. Sam Barrington could turn into a starter for us as well.

2014

HHCD looks like he'll become a plus player at the position, so a pretty good hit. Davante Adams is struggling but I think he turns into a good player, just not yet. RR he could be a role player, good red zone target but not worth a third rounder. Linsley is at a minimum a good depth guy. Thornton and Bradford look like misses while Abby could be a depth guy with starter talent if not the durability and Janis looks like a special teams stud who might give us more on offense. Love love love the pick up of Mike Pennell as a UFA.

2015

Randall looks like he'll turn into an outstanding cornerback. Love his blend of size speed quickness toughness and power, he also has some great instincts for the ball. Rollins looks like a player as well and I really like Montgomery. Jake Ryan looks like he'll be a player for us and Brett Hundley looks like he might turn into an upgrade at the number 2 quarterback spot and perhaps a higher draft pick in the future. Not sure what to make of Christian Ringo.

If Datone Jones continues his recent production as a full time player I would rate 2013 as an A. If HHCD continues to grow as a player and Adams and Pennell develop the way they should I see 2014 being a B-B+

I think 2015 is going to wind up being an A draft.

 

[brandon2348]

2013

I think Datone Jones will not only become a starter but I think he'll be a difference maker too. I think he's starting to come into his own and he's looked very good when he's had the chance to rush outside the tackle. I think Eddie Lacy is an outstanding back, but like any running back he needs blocking. Bakhtiari is a serviceable left tackle, better player than we think, he doesn't get a lot of help. Hyde and Palmer are good depth guys. Bottom line I'm thinking we picked up 3 quality starters in this draft a serviceable starter and some nice depth. Sam Barrington could turn into a starter for us as well.

2014

HHCD looks like he'll become a plus player at the position, so a pretty good hit. Davante Adams is struggling but I think he turns into a good player, just not yet. RR he could be a role player, good red zone target but not worth a third rounder. Linsley is at a minimum a good depth guy. Thornton and Bradford look like misses while Abby could be a depth guy with starter talent if not the durability and Janis looks like a special teams stud who might give us more on offense. Love love love the pick up of Mike Pennell as a UFA.

2015

Randall looks like he'll turn into an outstanding cornerback. Love his blend of size speed quickness toughness and power, he also has some great instincts for the ball. Rollins looks like a player as well and I really like Montgomery. Jake Ryan looks like he'll be a player for us and Brett Hundley looks like he might turn into an upgrade at the number 2 quarterback spot and perhaps a higher draft pick in the future. Not sure what to make of Christian Ringo.

If Datone Jones continues his recent production as a full time player I would rate 2013 as an A. If HHCD continues to grow as a player and Adams and Pennell develop the way they should I see 2014 being a B-B+

I think 2015 is going to wind up being an A draft.

That's all good and I like a lot of TT's draft picks as well. He does a great job there but wheres the rings? We have arguably the best QB in the NFL. He's made one big free agency move in the last 5 years "Peppers" and not one significant trade. How many of those years you listed above would we possibly have a championship by adding a key component? Well never know and we won't know this year cause he "cut us off at the knees" by putting a mediocre receiving corp out there combined with no real threat at TE. I mean Perillo? I like JJ but he doesn't have any real speed. Were running around out there with a bunch of "possession receivers. And these possession receivers are dropping balls. It's sad. Our best play is Rodgers drawing the defense offsides.

 

[Mondio]

Cut us off at the knees? Seriously? come on man, we're in a funk, maybe they never get out of it, but nobody in here or out there or expert or casual fan thought the GB passing attack was going to be such a weakness this year. Loss of Jordy or not. yeah some people wanted a TE, but nobody thought our passing targets were weak. Cut us off at the knees, please. Have criticism, don't be ridiculous. Last year, RR was on the upswing, had great hands, needed to work on blocking. Adams was on the verge of breaking out, Cobb was a must keep, Jordy was Jordy. Then this season comes around. Jordy goes down, we keep rolling. Everyone is talking about Rodgers being Michael Jordon. This offense is just in tune, then 5 weeks in we see signs of weakness and now even our best can't throw reliably and our best can't catch consistently either. I suppose the previous 4 seasons were just a mirage. These are all the "real" players that Thompson has cut us off at the knees with LOL

 

[brandon2348]

Cut us off at the knees? Seriously? come on man, we're in a funk, maybe they never get out of it, but nobody in here or out there or expert or casual fan thought the GB passing attack was going to be such a weakness this year. Loss of Jordy or not. yeah some people wanted a TE, but nobody thought our passing targets were weak. Cut us off at the knees, please. Have criticism, don't be ridiculous. Last year, RR was on the upswing, had great hands, needed to work on blocking. Adams was on the verge of breaking out, Cobb was a must keep, Jordy was Jordy. Then this season comes around. Jordy goes down, we keep rolling. Everyone is talking about Rodgers being Michael Jordon. This offense is just in tune, then 5 weeks in we see signs of weakness and now even our best can't throw reliably and our best can't catch consistently either. I suppose the previous 4 seasons were just a mirage. These are all the "real" players that Thompson has cut us off at the knees with LOL

Well I hope you keep that attitude when your watching "other teams" in the playoffs this year. A funk? This is pathetic and we didn't just "keep rolling" after Jordy got hurt. The defense was bailing us out early in the season so we didn't just "keep rolling". We just threw 13 up against the Bears at home. Yeah 13 and that's not a typo.

This was a Super Bowl or bust team and right now were busted. IMO our only chance is for a rookie "Monty" to get healthy and create some more personnel formations for the offense. I don't care what anybody says. It's not like these guys are just gonna wake up and all the sudden be faster. If TT would of made a trade and brought some speed in or a more dangerous TE option were probably not having this conversation right now. Instead he rolled the dice on a bunch of unproven young guys protecting his ever precious draft picks and No ring.

 

[NelsonsLongCatch]

Watson will be 35 years old next offseason and Gresham is struggling with the Cardinals for whatever reason. There are several tight ends who could be an upgrade for the Packers next season but let´s wait and see which one of them will actually hit the market in March.

Bring back Bubba Franks!

 

[easyk83]

That's all good and I like a lot of TT's draft picks as well. He does a great job there but wheres the rings? We have arguably the best QB in the NFL. He's made one big free agency move in the last 5 years "Peppers" and not one significant trade. How many of those years you listed above would we possibly have a championship by adding a key component? Well never know and we won't know this year cause he "cut us off at the knees" by putting a mediocre receiving corp out there combined with no real threat at TE. I mean Perillo? I like JJ but he doesn't have any real speed. Were running around out there with a bunch of "possession receivers. And these possession receivers are dropping balls. It's sad. Our best play is Rodgers drawing the defense offsides.

First only one team wins a Super Bowl in any given year. That TT's teams have won a Super Bowl and managed 3 NFC championship games speaks to the strength of the organization in Green Bay. Last year we had a perfect storm in the NFCG and managed to F away a golden opportunity at a win and a Super Bowl berth. The Defense mailed it in too early the Offense failed to capitalize on multiple scoring chances and finally Brandon Bostick's fateful leap. We were a special teamer's mistake from going to face NE in the Super Bowl. I think we had a couple lean years in the drafts and I think we're starting to see better results, I suspect this team will surprise people if they can get out of their funk and get hot at the right time. There isn't a team in the NFL that this team couldn't lose to, and not a team in the NFL that they couldn't beat.

 

[Mondio]

Well I hope you keep that attitude when your watching "other teams" in the playoffs this year. A funk? This is pathetic and we didn't just "keep rolling" after Jordy got hurt. The defense was bailing us out early in the season so we didn't just "keep rolling". We just threw 13 up against the Bears at home. Yeah 13 and that's not a typo.

This was a Super Bowl or bust team and right now were busted. IMO our only chance is for a rookie "Monty" to get healthy and create some more personnel formations for the offense. I don't care what anybody says. It's not like these guys are just gonna wake up and all the sudden be faster. If TT would of made a trade and brought some speed in or a more dangerous TE option were probably not having this conversation right now. Instead he rolled the dice on a bunch of unproven young guys protecting his ever precious draft picks and No ring.

If this team makes the plays that were right there in front of them to make, we're probably 9-2 at this point, so i don't want to hear about TT sucking at his job and being stubborn. But of course, EVERYBODY just knew our offense was going to perform like this so far this year. Everybody, LOL

 

[brandon2348]

Well I've been a TT supporter the whole time but this season there is just no excuse. The the trade deadline was just recently so it's not like there wasn't time to do anything about this problem at receiver and it's been an issue all season. The offense has never really clicked at all this year. Nobody can tell me that if we had a Rueben Randle or a Vernon Davis type player on our offense that it would not open things up more for everyone. You guys can sit there in denial but the fact is our offense has become '"mediocre."

I don't think TT is a bad GM and I like the "draft and develop" approach but to not make a move on someone to help this team win now when were a player short is ridiculous and its not fair to the fans. If there was ever a time for him to sway away from his conservative approach that I normally like it was "in season" this year.

 

[TJV]

Well never know and we won't know this year cause he "cut us off at the knees" by putting a mediocre receiving corp out there combined with no real threat at TE. I mean Perillo? I like JJ but he doesn't have any real speed. Were running around out there with a bunch of "possession receivers. And these possession receivers are dropping balls. It's sad.

You have a point about TE IMO but the rest of it is just hindsight. After Nelson went down he got the best fit for the O in Jones. And they'd be much better off if the Adams who played last year would show up. I don't think it was unreasonable for the staff to expect Adams would be improved from last season. R Rodgers has regressed too - again the expectation for second year players who see the field as rookies is that they build on their rookie season and improve. The only thing I fault Thompson for regarding the WR and TE positions is not acquiring Davis for what would be a 5th or 6th round pick (I believe he was traded for what netted out to be 6th). Of course that wouldn't solve all their problems but at that time he knew R Rodgers was under-performing expectations and probably knew Quarless wouldn't be back by the Bear game.

 

[Mondio]

I"m not in denial about our offense, they are sucking right now. Everyone of them at one point or another has been responsible for a negative play this year. I'm not sure Vernon Davis helps us. The Broncos have lost more than they've won since they signed him It's easy to say he'd help us, but then if Randall cobb didn't play for GB, it would be easy to say he'd help us too. But then again it doesn't when he's dropping TD's and 1st down passes. did you foresee this? I didn't.

 

[brandon2348]

You can't compare this situation to Denver. Denver has all kinds of weapons. We don't right now. We have a good offensive line and Aaron Rodgers. What we don't have is SPEED at WR or TE and its killing us. TT failed knowing going into the trade dead line that we lacked speed and did nothing about it. He stuck to his stubborn ways and now were gonna probably miss the playoffs. For those who say it might not of worked out trading for someone I say we didn't even try it. Teams are playing us "single high safety" and we used to tear that **** up.

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[Mondio]

I'd say going into this year a poll of most experts and fans would call Rodgers a weapon. Quite a few would say it doesn't matter who he's throwing to, they'll be better for it. A lot would have said Cobb is a major weapon. A lot considered Adams a weapon that was only going to get better. A lot would have considered Eddie Lacy a potent offensive weapon. They called our offensive line one of the best in the league. They said, it won't matter who's there because Rodgers is just going to sit back and find the open guy or give him time and he'll get it to someone. Toss in some high hopes for janis or Abbrederis and a rookie Montgomery, i don't think it was TT's stubbornness that put us in this situation. Lots of people thought this team had the line and the qb a couple WR's and the RB to go all the way. EVERYONE questioned the defense and special teams. Hardly a soul questioned the offense. I brought up Vernon and Denver because now he seems to be the one people are saying would turn this around, well he has about 10 catches over 3 games for a paltry average of yards and no TD's. It's easy to say he'd help because he's not here to prove it. I'd love to have a great TE here, but one isn't coming, and i'm not sure he is one anymore either. What I'd love even more is for the WR's to start catching balls that hit them in the hands. that requires nothing to happen except for them to do what they've done before.

maybe it was the opponents, but the Oline has been looking better the past 2-3 games. The running game is getting going, if they can maintain and move forward I'd bet the passing game won't be far behind. We haven't looked great lately, but I see improvements and signs of getting back on track. Close yet so far away comes to mind. Then I hope the defense doesn't fall off from where they've been, but I'lll worry about that later

 

[brandon2348]

You have a point about TE IMO but the rest of it is just hindsight. After Nelson went down he got the best fit for the O in Jones. And they'd be much better off if the Adams who played last year would show up. I don't think it was unreasonable for the staff to expect Adams would be improved from last season. R Rodgers has regressed too - again the expectation for second year players who see the field as rookies is that they build on their rookie season and improve. The only thing I fault Thompson for regarding the WR and TE positions is not acquiring Davis for what would be a 5th or 6th round pick (I believe he was traded for what netted out to be 6th). Of course that wouldn't solve all their problems but at that time he knew R Rodgers was under-performing expectations and probably knew Quarless wouldn't be back by the Bear game.

Well yeah. I mean since Jordy is down it really makes the lack of speed at TE even more eye opening. We just don't have the personnel to play 5 on 5 anymore. We needed another guy to stretch the field at WR or TE IMO to make it work with Jordy down. My only hope is Monty to get healthy and with him and Cobb they create some match up problems. It's a lot to ask from a rookie though.

 

[easyk83]

You can't compare this situation to Denver. Denver has all kinds of weapons. We don't right now. We have a good offensive line and Aaron Rodgers. What we don't have is SPEED at WR or TE and its killing us. TT failed knowing going into the trade dead line that we lacked speed and did nothing about it. He stuck to his stubborn ways and now were gonna probably miss the playoffs. For those who say it might not of worked out trading for someone I say we didn't even try it. Teams are playing us "single high safety" and we used to tear that **** up.

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How fast was Jerry Rice? Adams may or may not become a great wide receiver but he's very fluid and graceful, a very natural route runner with +length and a very good verticle. He could be an outstanding player if he maximizes his abilities.

 

[Mondio]

I'm also tired of the "speed" argument. Antonio brown is about the exact same in measurables as Randall Cobb, with Cobb being about 10lbs heavier and a slight tick faster according to posted 40 times. one guy is providing explosive plays week in and week out, and one used to. We have plenty of speed

 

[brandon2348]

Jerry Rice is a 1 in a million player and i'm tired of teams playing us "single high" and getting away with it because we cannot stretch the defense. Cobb is a slot receiver. Comparing him to Antonio Brown is fine but look what else Pittsburgh has. It's called Wheaton and Bryant. They also have a TE way better then ours in Miller so the whole Antonio Brown thing has to be compared in the correct context. Those guys make it much easier for Brown to get favorable matchups. We need either a TE that imposes some more attention that can stretch the field a little or another outside guy that can do similar to what we had with Jordy or ultimately both. It's not Janis and it's not Perillo. Yes, its not just speed but a combination of that with of course the right skill set.

I will say it one more time. The only guy I see that can help us out now to get back to playing 5 on 5 and pushing teams out of "single high safety" is Montgomery. IMO him and Cobb used correctly together can create match up problems with the other guys we have. That's are only hope. TT should of went and got somebody before the trade dead line.

 

[OldSchool101]

Todays NFL game is highly cerebral. I'll take a guy with good football instincts over speed any day. I'll take a guy with adequate speed and sticky hands over raw speed. I'll take a guy with superior playbook knowledge over speed. Finally, I'll take a guy who plays with his heart n soul over speed any day this week or next, twice on Sunday.
Jerry Rice was the epitome of these attributes but didn't possess elite speed, yet his name is household 30 years later
Speed is not our problem. Our talk about our lack of speed? just might be

 

[Carl]

That's all good and I like a lot of TT's draft picks as well. He does a great job there but wheres the rings? We have arguably the best QB in the NFL. He's made one big free agency move in the last 5 years "Peppers" and not one significant trade. How many of those years you listed above would we possibly have a championship by adding a key component? Well never know and we won't know this year cause he "cut us off at the knees" by putting a mediocre receiving corp out there combined with no real threat at TE. I mean Perillo? I like JJ but he doesn't have any real speed. Were running around out there with a bunch of "possession receivers. And these possession receivers are dropping balls. It's sad. Our best play is Rodgers drawing the defense offsides.

The very talented offense he has assembled the past few years has often underperformed in the playoffs and his defense decimated by injuries in the 2013 playoffs. Also, as another poster pointed out we were definitely talented enough to win it all last year and messed it up. It's not all on TT by any means there hasn't been more than one ring.

 

[brandon2348]

The very talented offense he has assembled the past few years has often underprformed in the playoffs and his defense decimated by injuries in the 2013 playoffs. Also, as another poster pointed out we were definitely talented enough to win it all last year and messed it up. It's not all on TT by any means there hasn't been more than one ring.

I'm not putting the NFC champ game on TT or the 2013 team that kind of backed into the playoffs although you could nit pick about lack of back up QB. This was the year he needed to make a move before the trade deadline. I mean it's kind of a no brainer IMO. I had wishful thinking that these young guys were gonna be ready but there not. At least not now. I'm just real frustrated after following this team for so long and this team really only being maybe a player away on offense.

The only saving grace is I don't see a real dominant team even though Carolina is undefeated but we gotta make the playoffs first which I'm not certain they will do.

 

[OldSchool101]

The thing that concerns me most is our attitude once we start winning. We let off the throttle and go into a shell (see 2014 NFC game)
Championship teams go for the throat once they smell blood. Playing "not to lose" has been our past years demise, particularly On Defense where Capers goes into a "prevent" shell.
We need to review the tape from earlier last year where we blew teams out so bad the FOX network repeatedly turned our game off in the 3rd quarter. Ticked me off because they were local games and so the NFL package on direct TV blacked them out those weeks.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Bakhtiari is a serviceable left tackle, better player than we think, he doesn't get a lot of help.

Bakhtiari stepped in admirably as a rookie when Bulaga was lost for the season but overall he´s a below average left tackle and the worst player on the offensive line on the most crucial position.

Thornton and Bradford look like misses.

The Packers released Thornton this year and he´s now on the Lions roster, so he´s for sure a miss. Bradford hasn´t played a single snap in nearly two years and has been on the practice squad all season, so it´s likely he´s a bust as well.

I'm also tired of the "speed" argument. Antonio brown is about the exact same in measurables as Randall Cobb, with Cobb being about 10lbs heavier and a slight tick faster according to posted 40 times. one guy is providing explosive plays week in and week out, and one used to. We have plenty of speed

The Steelers have three speedy receivers in Bryant, Heyward-Bey and Wheaton opening up short and intermediate routes for Brown though.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Well never know and we won't know this year cause he "cut us off at the knees" by putting a mediocre receiving corp out there combined with no real threat at TE. If TT would of made a trade and brought some speed in or a more dangerous TE option were probably not having this conversation right now.

Once again, the team entered training camp returning all starting receivers from the league leading scoring offense with promising youngsters in Montgomery, Janis and Abbrederis backing them up. There was absolutely no way Thompson could have known about Nelson being lost for the year in preseason as well as all other guys dealing with injuries at various points during the season. After Jordy went out TT signed Jones, a perfect fit for the Packers offense because of his knowledge of the playbook.

It´s fine advocating for a trade but the reality is that the other 31 teams aren´t out there waiting for Thompson to call them to send the Packers an impact receiver. Just take a look at how many receivers have been traded during the 2015 season. ZERO!!!

I´ve been critical of TT in the past but the receiving corps struggling this season isn´t on him. He should have addressed the tight end position with someone else than Backman and Henry this offseason though.

 

[Mondio]

Bakhtiari stepped in admirably as a rookie when Bulaga was lost for the season but overall he´s a below average left tackle and the worst player on the offensive line on the most crucial position.



The Packers released Thornton this year and he´s now on the Lions roster, so he´s for sure a miss. Bradford hasn´t played a single snap in nearly two years and has been on the practice squad all season, so it´s likely he´s a bust as well.



The Steelers have three speedy receivers in Bryant, Heyward-Bey and Wheaton opening up short and intermediate routes for Brown though.

You honestly expect me to believe that those 3 guys are opening things up for Brown? If they are, the steelers have been facing the dumbest DC's on earth. Just because a guy is fast doesn't mean he opens up anything. We never had receivers that fast on the field for years and lit up the league. I'd put my money down on the presence of Brown being one of the only reasons those guys are ever open enough to see the ball. Brown has caught plenty of balls down the field this year, last year and he's catching them at a clip of 3 or 4 to 1 compared to everyone else on that team

Jordy nelson and dez bryant run in the 4.5's and everyone thinks they're the deep threats and they are. I suppose it's because Cobb with his better speed, keeps everyone in for the short stuff? Or maybe it was the fact we had a legitimate running game for a while with Lacy. Which I see signs of returning, in which case, Cobb, Jones, Adams, etc are all fast enough to get deep provided the line keeps protection.

I don't buy the speed argument. We haven't been going downfield because nothing else is working. When you're going 3 and out NINE times in a game, you're not setting up any big plays. A defense isn't respecting anything. they don't have to. And previously we couldn't run and we couldn't pass protect, not a recipe for success, i don't care how much speed is on the field. Cobb Jones and Adams are all plenty fast to play WR in this league and go deep.