2022 Draft #34 Christian Watson

[Heyjoe4]

Watson's a really intriguing player to me. I'm not so sure he's the WR1 going forward and I think I'd still draft a WR early especially if we're transitioning to Love at QB. Really happy we have Watson though, it's exciting watching him with the ball almost every time he makes the catch something cool happens.

Watson was a pleasant surprise. He played well, had a few drops and a lot more catches and TDs. I hope the Packers take ND TE Mike Mayer in round 1. He's NFL ready and is a real offensive threat. And at 6'5" and 265 lbs, he can block in-line as well.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Watson's a really intriguing player to me. I'm not so sure he's the WR1 going forward

Unless the Packers sign a decent FA WR, he is currently the #1 and Doubs the #2. Kind of a scary thought, but seems to be par for the course when it comes to the Packers receiver room.

 

[tynimiller]

Unless the Packers sign a decent FA WR, he is currently the #1 and Doubs the #2. Kind of a scary thought, but seems to be par for the course when it comes to the Packers receiver room.

Actually even you know this is not par for the course. It’s been a LONG time since GB had TWO guys that were just coming off their rookie seasons where both played WR1 level games at times.

You know I advocate for a FA, what kind depends on what #12 does. However, it’s been a long time since I’ve been as excited at what we might have in the WR room with actual measurable data points to justify it.

Very young and too unknown to not go get another potential WR that could compete out the gate for snaps with them but still.

Let’s not swing too far in the negative side of things.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Actually even you know this is not par for the course. It’s been a LONG time since GB had TWO guys that were just coming off their rookie seasons where both played WR1 level games at times.

You know I advocate for a FA, what kind depends on what #12 does. However, it’s been a long time since I’ve been as excited at what we might have in the WR room with actual measurable data points to justify it.

Very young and too unknown to not go get another potential WR that could compete out the gate for snaps with them but still.

Let’s not swing too far in the negative side of things.

While I agree that both rookies have the potential to be good, I was referring more to relying on potential VS relying on proven experience. Prior to Cobb coming back in 2021, Adams was really the only proven #1-3 on the team. Lazard might be in that conversation in 2022, but again, Adams was gone.

 

[tynimiller]

While I agree that both rookies have the potential to be good, I was referring more to relying on potential VS relying on proven experience. Prior to Cobb coming back in 2021, Adams was really the only proven #1-3 on the team. Lazard might be in that conversation in 2022, but again, Adams was gone.

Lazard was a WR3 in 2021 IMO. Again I think you're too harsh on it, you just have to be honest which I don't think you are being dishonest, just too harsh.

 

[Voyageur]

From the beginning, I saw both Watson and Doubs as potential stars. It's just a matter of them getting up to speed with the NFL game. They're doing quite well already. Next year, they will be in the upper 1/3 of the league, in paired receivers. In two years, they could be the best combo out there.

Why do I say this? Even if Rodgers leaves? Because both know how to hang onto the ball, and put their bodies between defenders and the ball, in contested plays. Their route running is already more than adequate, and will improve tremendously by the start of the 2023 season.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Lazard was a WR3 in 2021 IMO. Again I think you're too harsh on it, you just have to be honest which I don't think you are being dishonest, just too harsh.

I don't think I'm being harsh at all, their receiving room has sucked since Jordy left. Obviously, talking in totality, not individually. Every season since, they have pinned their hopes on Adams and a collection of UDFA's, mid to late round rookies and a couple of washed up FA vets. Add that to the TE room...and that adds more to the harshness.

People love to talk about the defense as being the Packers issue and cause for no Super Bowl rings. However, had the Packers given Rodgers more weapons, I'm pretty confident they would have won at least 1-3 more SB's with Rodgers.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

From the beginning, I saw both Watson and Doubs as potential stars. It's just a matter of them getting up to speed with the NFL game. They're doing quite well already. Next year, they will be in the upper 1/3 of the league, in paired receivers. In two years, they could be the best combo out there.

While both Watson and Doubs definitely showed promise during their rookie campaigns the bold part is a huge reach in my opinion. I would be excited if they develop into decent #1 and #2 receivers but at this point I'm not convinced that will happen.

 

[Voyageur]

While both Watson and Doubs definitely showed promise during their rookie campaigns the bold part is a huge reach in my opinion. I would be excited if they develop into decent #1 and #2 receivers but at this point I'm not convinced that will happen.

Please notice, I did not say they would become stars. I was referring to the things I could see them doing in the college game, that were indicators that they had the "potential" of becoming stars. That's not a reach, it's my personal analysis of their skills.

Now, what is a star? I believe that any player who can be projected as a starter in the NFL over a period of years as being star quality. It starts with the fact that both of these players projected that potential, or the Packers would have chosen someone else over them, when it was their turn to pick.

As to "which round" they were chosen in, we all know that depending on what position a player plays, and the team needs, quality players can be drafted in every round, and in fact can even be signed as free agents, passed over in the draft.

Look no further than Tom Brady, who was a 6th round pick. There were a lot of people that saw him as raw talent, but it was only the Patriots who decided to draft him. He was the 199th pick that year.

It's like the famous line from Forrest Gump, delivered by Sally Fields. "It's like a box of chocolates. You never know what you're going to get." So goes the story of drafting players.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Actually even you know this is not par for the course. It’s been a LONG time since GB had TWO guys that were just coming off their rookie seasons where both played WR1 level games at times.

You know I advocate for a FA, what kind depends on what #12 does. However, it’s been a long time since I’ve been as excited at what we might have in the WR room with actual measurable data points to justify it.

Very young and too unknown to not go get another potential WR that could compete out the gate for snaps with them but still.

Let’s not swing too far in the negative side of things.

I agree and I want it all - meaning a solid FA WR (I don't know who is available) and Mike Mayer in round 1. IMO, Mayer is NFL ready, and it's clear what a great TE can mean to a team - Kelce, Kittle, Hockenson, and on. I don't know if they can afford a decent FA WR though.

On D they need an iDL and a S. If Branch was there at 15 it would be tempting. I'm just sick of round 1 defensive picks. There's still a lot of talent on D IMO, they need a new coaching staff.

 

[Magooch]

I agree and I want it all - meaning a solid FA WR (I don't know who is available) and Mike Mayer in round 1. IMO, Mayer is NFL ready, and it's clear what a great TE can mean to a team - Kelce, Kittle, Hockenson, and on. I don't know if they can afford a decent FA WR though.

On D they need an iDL and a S. If Branch was there at 15 it would be tempting. I'm just sick of round 1 defensive picks. There's still a lot of talent on D IMO, they need a new coaching staff.

I'm with you there.

This season we had perhaps the most "expensive" defense in the league in terms of total investment (money spent and draft capital invested) and that cost is only going up for next season. And it's clear to me that this amount of talent and cash investment still is not enough to overcome Barry's deficiencies. So frankly...until we are willing to cut ties with Barry I don't see much point in spending high draft capital on defense for the time being; it's just throwing good money after bad at this point.

As it stands I'd much rather see us invest more in our offense and more or less hope to outscore opponents than I would want to see us continue to give Joe Barry more talent and draft capital to waste.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I'm with you there.

This season we had perhaps the most "expensive" defense in the league in terms of total investment (money spent and draft capital invested) and that cost is only going up for next season. And it's clear to me that this amount of talent and cash investment still is not enough to overcome Barry's deficiencies. So frankly...until we are willing to cut ties with Barry I don't see much point in spending high draft capital on defense for the time being; it's just throwing good money after bad at this point.

As it stands I'd much rather see us invest more in our offense and more or less hope to outscore opponents than I would want to see us continue to give Joe Barry more talent and draft capital to waste.

Yeah I'm shocked that MLF didn't dump Barry. Maybe he will but at this point, I doubt it. The one thing that bugged me for most of the season was playing soft zone with athletic corners. The CBs were giving the opponents' WRs a free release on most plays. And it's becoming a 4-down league, so giving up 8 or 9 yards on 3rd and 10 is not acceptable.

So yeah, go back to the old Packers where the focus was offense. I don't really like to depend on that to win games. I think superior D wins championships. But a DC is needed who will develop a scheme based on the talent available. I think there are like 7 first round picks on D. It's inexcusable and has me wondering if MLF is cut out for HC. Far too soon to tell but it's a concern IMO.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Please notice, I did not say they would become stars. I was referring to the things I could see them doing in the college game, that were indicators that they had the "potential" of becoming stars. That's not a reach, it's my personal analysis of their skills.

Well, you suggested Watson and Doubs could be the best combo in the NFL in two years. That strongly indicates you believe both of them will develop into star players.

I think superior D wins championships.

The Chiefs just proved it's possible to win a Lombardi Trophy without an elite defense as well. I agree having one makes it much more easier though.

 

[Voyageur]

Well, you suggested Watson and Doubs could be the best combo in the NFL in two years. That strongly indicates you believe both of them will develop into star players.



The Chiefs just proved it's possible to win a Lombardi Trophy without an elite defense as well. I agree having one makes it much more easier though.

My words were "could be." I didn't say "they will be." If you feel otherwise, that's your opinion, just like mine. I see enough in them that if things fall into place, both could be in the top 1/3 of the WRs next year, and could move up a bit further in the following year.

I think you need to read what I said, not misinterpret what I said.

And, by the way, stats can be interesting. Did you know that analytically, Watson is already "better" than Adams? In fact, he was ranked #21, and Adams #22 according to ESPN Analytics. Doubs, with his limited play, due to injury, ranked #104.

The Best NFL Receivers, According To ESPN Analytics

Receiver ratings from ESPN Analytics use player-tracking data to evaluate every route a pass catcher runs and scores his performance in three phases of the game.

projects.fivethirtyeight.com

 

[Mondio]

Doubs left me pretty much where I started with him. Seems to have all the tools, needs to make the catch. Heard about him having it, saw something different, then saw him kind of come on, then ended how he started. everything is great until he had to catch it. I'm hoping a year and some growth fix that. or he will never be what this team needs.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Well, you suggested Watson and Doubs could be the best combo in the NFL in two years. That strongly indicates you believe both of them will develop into star players.



The Chiefs just proved it's possible to win a Lombardi Trophy without an elite defense as well. I agree having one makes it much more easier though.

Yeah Sunday was an exception to the superior D winning championships. And it made for an entertaining game. It seemed clear the last team to possess the ball would win (not counting the last Eagles 4-second "drive").

What amazed me was how easily the Chiefs cut through the Eagles D in the 2H. I think TOP for the Eagles in the 1H was 21 minutes, so their D was rested, and certainly superior. But the chiefs went TD, TD, TD, FG in the 2H. All theories have exceptions!

 

[Heyjoe4]

My words were "could be." I didn't say "they will be." If you feel otherwise, that's your opinion, just like mine. I see enough in them that if things fall into place, both could be in the top 1/3 of the WRs next year, and could move up a bit further in the following year.

I think you need to read what I said, not misinterpret what I said.

And, by the way, stats can be interesting. Did you know that analytically, Watson is already "better" than Adams? In fact, he was ranked #21, and Adams #22 according to ESPN Analytics. Doubs, with his limited play, due to injury, ranked #104.

The Best NFL Receivers, According To ESPN Analytics

Receiver ratings from ESPN Analytics use player-tracking data to evaluate every route a pass catcher runs and scores his performance in three phases of the game.

projects.fivethirtyeight.com

V, I truly hate stats. They are certainly facts in the strict sense, but they are used inappropriately many times to "prove" a point. This is an opinion page for the most part. I respect your opinion, and trying to "disprove" it with facts is a fool's errand.

Twain said it, there are three kinds of lies - lies, damned lies, and statistics.

 

[tynimiller]

Doubs left me pretty much where I started with him. Seems to have all the tools, needs to make the catch. Heard about him having it, saw something different, then saw him kind of come on, then ended how he started. everything is great until he had to catch it. I'm hoping a year and some growth fix that. or he will never be what this team needs.

Doubs nor Watson can be singled out as having catch issues without mentioning the other. Both were rookies with major rookie struggles. Adams and James Jones I remember constantly shaking my head at, arguably more than I did with either of these two personally.

Shoot James Jones at one time dropped just shy of 15% of his targets and became a very surehanded person later in his career.

As many know too, more targets typically for most WRs allows for a lower drop percentage...as Jones became a bigger target receiver his numbers slowly at first but did get better.

They didn't do advance stats back then on the sites I have access too so no specific drop number for Jones his rookie year but he did only catch 58.8% of his targets, which isn't terrible but is not the numbers you'd want from a guy that wasn't a pure deep threat/target type.

Romeo had odd bursts of issues, in games he was targeted 7 or more times he only had 2 drops...but on the whole he had 9 total in this season, which was under 14%.

While guys like Wes Welker and Brandon Marshall are the two guys I remember serving as teams WR1s but still having high number of drops exist it is rare a guy stays with that amount of drops percentage wise as targets go up usually...as example Davante has some years of advanced statistics in Pro Football Reference 2018 and onward. He has had in seasons 2018 onward; 5, 7, 1, 3 and 7 drops....sounds like a lot but his % through those years are 3.0%, 5.5%, .7%, 1.8%, 3.9%

Here's a tidbit of information for comparison between Romeo and Watson

Doubs - while having 9 drops, put up a catch percentage of 62.7% going 42 receptions on 67 targets.
Watson - while having 4 drops, put up a catch percentage of 62.1% going 41 receptions on 66 targets.

No doubt both of them will want to improve on their reliability in two capacities...I heard it said Romeo will definitely be working on his hands because between the two he is almost always in the right place and at the right time...Watson didn't exhibit the same level of hands issues but will work on it, but he still needs to find that route spacing and knowing where to be more so. Both are pivotal for each of these guys and their next steps.

 

[Voyageur]

Doubs nor Watson can be singled out as having catch issues without mentioning the other. Both were rookies with major rookie struggles. Adams and James Jones I remember constantly shaking my head at, arguably more than I did with either of these two personally.

Shoot James Jones at one time dropped just shy of 15% of his targets and became a very surehanded person later in his career.

As many know too, more targets typically for most WRs allows for a lower drop percentage...as Jones became a bigger target receiver his numbers slowly at first but did get better.

They didn't do advance stats back then on the sites I have access too so no specific drop number for Jones his rookie year but he did only catch 58.8% of his targets, which isn't terrible but is not the numbers you'd want from a guy that wasn't a pure deep threat/target type.

Romeo had odd bursts of issues, in games he was targeted 7 or more times he only had 2 drops...but on the whole he had 9 total in this season, which was under 14%.

While guys like Wes Welker and Brandon Marshall are the two guys I remember serving as teams WR1s but still having high number of drops exist it is rare a guy stays with that amount of drops percentage wise as targets go up usually...as example Davante has some years of advanced statistics in Pro Football Reference 2018 and onward. He has had in seasons 2018 onward; 5, 7, 1, 3 and 7 drops....sounds like a lot but his % through those years are 3.0%, 5.5%, .7%, 1.8%, 3.9%

Here's a tidbit of information for comparison between Romeo and Watson

Doubs - while having 9 drops, put up a catch percentage of 62.7% going 42 receptions on 67 targets.
Watson - while having 4 drops, put up a catch percentage of 62.1% going 41 receptions on 66 targets.

No doubt both of them will want to improve on their reliability in two capacities...I heard it said Romeo will definitely be working on his hands because between the two he is almost always in the right place and at the right time...Watson didn't exhibit the same level of hands issues but will work on it, but he still needs to find that route spacing and knowing where to be more so. Both are pivotal for each of these guys and their next steps.

Lots of room for growth, with both players. Enough shown in their first year to say that their high side could be pretty good. When I compared them to Lazard, with his years of experience, I could see that they can easily surpass him next year.

I agree on the comparison to Jones. The same comparison could be made with Donald Driver. They demonstrated skills in their first year, but took time to develop. It's a huge adjustment from the college game to the NFL.

On stats? I too believe it's not always the whole story as to where a player's career will go. It might give some indications of what might be expected, but nothing is guaranteed. It's just like you mentioned with drops. Sometimes the statistics do nothing more than give you a road map for where improvements can/should be made, nothing more.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Lots of room for growth, with both players. Enough shown in their first year to say that their high side could be pretty good. When I compared them to Lazard, with his years of experience, I could see that they can easily surpass him next year.

I agree on the comparison to Jones. The same comparison could be made with Donald Driver. They demonstrated skills in their first year, but took time to develop. It's a huge adjustment from the college game to the NFL.

On stats? I too believe it's not always the whole story as to where a player's career will go. It might give some indications of what might be expected, but nothing is guaranteed. It's just like you mentioned with drops. Sometimes the statistics do nothing more than give you a road map for where improvements can/should be made, nothing more.

I loved it when the Packers drafted Adams. I liked his college film, he seemed sure handed.

But the first two years were not good. He had drops, and was frequently arguing with the refs about phantom PI calls. And then in year 3, he just adapted.

 

[Voyageur]

I loved it when the Packers drafted Adams. I liked his college film, he seemed sure handed.

But the first two years were not good. He had drops, and was frequently arguing with the refs about phantom PI calls. And then in year 3, he just adapted.

Exactly. There are things that players like Adams showed, even when they made mistakes. The potential was there. It just had to be cultivated. I see that in both Watson and Doubs. Both have potential.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Exactly. There are things that players like Adams showed, even when they made mistakes. The potential was there. It just had to be cultivated. I see that in both Watson and Doubs. Both have potential.

I think the future is bright for both of these guys. Rather than chase a pricey FA WR, I'd rather see GB take a guy like TE Mike Mayer from ND. It's possible 4 TEs will go in round 1, so there's plenty of talent. Most of these guys are NFL ready, all are good to great receivers, and most can handle blocking assignments.

And instead of drafting for defense in round 1, how about GB fires the inept Joe Barry and hires someone who can coach the talent already on the roster?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

My words were "could be." I didn't say "they will be." If you feel otherwise, that's your opinion, just like mine. I see enough in them that if things fall into place, both could be in the top 1/3 of the WRs next year, and could move up a bit further in the following year.

I agree that both Watson and Doubs showed promise during their rookie seasons. But they have a long, long way to go to end up being the best combo in the league. I definitely don't expect that to happen.

And, by the way, stats can be interesting. Did you know that analytically, Watson is already "better" than Adams? In fact, he was ranked #21, and Adams #22 according to ESPN Analytics. Doubs, with his limited play, due to injury, ranked #104.

The Best NFL Receivers, According To ESPN Analytics

Receiver ratings from ESPN Analytics use player-tracking data to evaluate every route a pass catcher runs and scores his performance in three phases of the game.

projects.fivethirtyeight.com

I think they should take a hard look at their metric if Watson came in ahead of Adams last season.

What amazed me was how easily the Chiefs cut through the Eagles D in the 2H. I think TOP for the Eagles in the 1H was 21 minutes, so their D was rested, and certainly superior. But the chiefs went TD, TD, TD, FG in the 2H. All theories have exceptions!

The Chiefs offensive line played amazing. Getting a punt return to the Eagles 5 helped as well.

Shoot James Jones at one time dropped just shy of 15% of his targets and became a very surehanded person later in his career.

They didn't do advance stats back then on the sites I have access too so no specific drop number for Jones his rookie year but he did only catch 58.8% of his targets, which isn't terrible but is not the numbers you'd want from a guy that wasn't a pure deep threat/target type.

According to PFF Jones dropped 34 of 239 catchable balls for a drop percentage of 14.2% over his first five years in the league.

It's possible 4 TEs will go in round 1, so there's plenty of talent.

I would be extremely surprised if that ends up happening.

 

[Schultz]

Doubs biggest issue as a rookie was making the contested catch. Improvement is needed in that department.

 

[gopkrs]

Well, you suggested Watson and Doubs could be the best combo in the NFL in two years. That strongly indicates you believe both of them will develop into star players.



The Chiefs just proved it's possible to win a Lombardi Trophy without an elite defense as well. I agree having one makes it much more easier though.

The Chiefs have more of an elite D than you would like to think imho.