Randall Cobb is...

[Pkrjones]

Sometimes I wonder if some of you guys realize the season is about to start.

So is your stance that it's too late into preseason for meaningful player or roster transactions? 3 weeks before the season starts isn't enough time to teach a guy, who's outstanding at rushing the passer, to rush the passer? LA wasn't bothered by the timing when they traded for a new #1 WR last week.

Behind CM3 & Perry there doesn't appear to be a starting-caliber OLB ready to go if (when) injury occurs... so why not consider bolstering a suspect position?

Lawson was a mid-first round pick so I'm guessing that a player-for-player trade would need to be sweetened with a draft pick.

 

[Candidate for Deletion]

differently talented

new favorite football term lol

 

[gopkrs]

No, not my stance. You always need to be ready to improve the team. It just aint gonna happen with Cobb. And one of the reasons is that he is a very important cogg in our offensive machine. So I have had my say about what I think about this line of speculation.

 

[Dantés]

In my opinion it´s far from a given that Cobb´s loss is impending.

You think he gets extended again?

 

[XPack]

Since that time, his YPR has dropped under 10.5 and he's scoring every 13.9 catches. I believe those stats are illustrative of what I actually see on the field, a guy who just isn't as dynamic as he once was. I don't think you explain away a 4 yard drop in YPR and his TD % virtually being cut in half.

In 2015 with Nelson injured we were pretty unidimensional and opponents were able to plan doubles for Cobb and he was consistently suffering from niggling injuries all through 2016. I wouldn't be surprised if be bounced back to his peak this season.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Cobb seems to be a well liked player in the Packers system, both by fans, coaches and teammates. While that won't be the only factor in determining what to do with him, it might be one. Also, unless the Packers have someone else who can step right into the slot receiver position without much of a talent drop off, Cobbs value in GB goes up.

I don't see Cobb going anywhere anytime soon. Almost certain he is a Packer for all of 2017 and if they either can't find an adequate replacement or can restructure the last year of his contract into a new one, he may be a Packer for a long time to come. Is he worth his current contract? No.....but he definitely has legitimate value to the Packers, it's just a matter of finding that price.

 

[Dantés]

In 2015 with Nelson injured we were pretty unidimensional and opponents were able to plan doubles for Cobb and he was consistently suffering from niggling injuries all through 2016. I wouldn't be surprised if be bounced back to his peak this season.

Obviously I would be elated to see that come to fruition. I just don't really buy it.

 

[XPack]

Obviously I would be elated to see that come to fruition. I just don't really buy it.

Jordy is 32. he probably has 1 or 2 more seasons at this level.

Unless we get a FA signing, who would be equally expensive if not more, I expect Cobb to step up to that place with Davante as his #2.

 

[Candidate for Deletion]

Jordy is 32. he probably has 1 or 2 more seasons at this level.

Unless we get a FA signing, who would be equally expensive if not more, I expect Cobb to step up to that place with Davante as his #2.

Nah, Cobb is in no way a #1 WR, even at his top. He's too small, he is a perfectly designed slot guy. Adams would be the natural #1 to follow up behind Nelson simply because he has the size to fight with the boundary corners which Cobb lacks. Not attempting to make a direct skill or ceiling comparison (though I think Adams has got Cobb edged in both categories, personally), simply a usage and role equation.

 

[Dantés]

Jordy is 32. he probably has 1 or 2 more seasons at this level.

Unless we get a FA signing, who would be equally expensive if not more, I expect Cobb to step up to that place with Davante as his #2.

I generally try to keep an open mind, but I feel pretty good in saying that that ain't happening. Not by a long shot.

Jordy may or may not be done after this contract is up. But Adams has already surpassed Cobb. And the latter may be kept through his contract, but he isn't getting a 3rd deal in Green Bay.

My opinion is that Adams is clearly one of the three starters moving forward, hopefully a second emerges from the cluster of young guys on the team, and the 3rd probably isn't on the roster right now unless Jordy lasts a while longer.

 

[gbgary]

Secondly, I have never said I simply want him gone.

my comments in that regard were directed at those that do want him gone. trades seldom happen in the nfl so that's a long shot. he'll start this year and maybe restructure his deal going forward in the off-season. if he's unwilling to do that them he's probably gone (depending on the situation at the time).

 

[sschind]

The thought of Cobb not being on this team this season would have me very concerned about our WRs. Nelson, Adams and who? It seems to be this way every year. So many fans thinking we have such an abundance of talent at WR that we could get rid of one of our top three and be just fine. Yes Aaron Rodgers make his receivers look better but in an offense like ours you really need at least three very good WRs. Right now we have exactly three.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

100% agreed....and in all honesty depending how comfortable they are with the future I'd entertaining a trade or cut. But I feel team must do this with ARs blessing..

There´s no reason for the front office to feel comfortable about trading Cobb because some of the young receivers made some nice catches during practice and against third stringers in preseason games.

A few of us have been kicking the idea of restructuring Cobb as well as some of us have said the same should happen with Clay. I am trying to remember the last time a Packer player was restructured for less money than he was currently set to be paid. You see the reverse happen when a player is on a rookie or lower end contract and deserves more, they get a restructured deal for more money.

How often has it happened in the NFL in general?

If I remember correctly A.J. Hawk was the last Packer that had his contract restructured in 2013. I don´t have any numbers on how often it happens around the NFL but it seems to me that other teams use that option more often.

It would also potentially address a weakness while opening up room to keep an extra young receiver, as the Packers currently have more guys worth rostering there than they have room for.

It´s completely uncertain if any of the young receivers currently battling for a roster spot is truly worth keeping around.

You think he gets extended again?

I definitely believe Cobb will remain with the Packers until his contract expires after the 2018 season. In my opinion there´s a possibility he receives another, albeit more reasonable, contract at that point.

Cobb seems to be a well liked player in the Packers system, both by fans, coaches and teammates.

A lot of fans have been critical of Cobb over the past two seasons though.

 

[PikeBadger]

At this point, I don't see an adequate replacement for Cobb on this team. I think McCarthy and Rodgers place a higher value on Cobb than the fans do (especially the fantasy football crowd).

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

If I remember correctly A.J. Hawk was the last Packer that had his contract restructured in 2013. I don´t have any numbers on how often it happens around the NFL but it seems to me that other teams use that option more often.

Thanks Captain. That did ring a bell with Hawk and I looked it up. $7.25M pay cut over 3 years. A move that most definitely kept him in Green Bay and one that I wish they could pull off with both CM III and Cobb.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The thought of Cobb not being on this team this season would have me very concerned about our WRs. Nelson, Adams and who? It seems to be this way every year. So many fans thinking we have such an abundance of talent at WR that we could get rid of one of our top three and be just fine. Yes Aaron Rodgers make his receivers look better but in an offense like ours you really need at least three very good WRs. Right now we have exactly three.

Very true and backed up by what has happened in the past, when one or more of those starters goes down, a pretty substantial drop off in play.

I wasn't too excited about the overall group of WR's we had at this time last year and said basically what you just said then. Last year we had Abby, Davis, Monty and Janis as the 4-7 WR's. This years group has me a bit more excited on a development front as well as a guy like McCaffrey, who appears he could step right in and play. I think both him and Allison will be our quality #4 and #5 depth and whoever else makes the team will either be due to their abilities on special teams or great potential.

 

[PackAttack12]

The thought of Cobb not being on this team this season would have me very concerned about our WRs. Nelson, Adams and who? It seems to be this way every year. So many fans thinking we have such an abundance of talent at WR that we could get rid of one of our top three and be just fine. Yes Aaron Rodgers make his receivers look better but in an offense like ours you really need at least three very good WRs. Right now we have exactly three.

Not only that, three that AR has full confidence in. That's key.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Not only that, three that AR has full confidence in. That's key.

Good point as well and one backed up also by history. I am hoping to see McCaffrey play a bit with AR and the starters this next game. From what it sounds like out of Camp, Aaron and the other 3 QB's are very impressed by what he does in practices, so it would be nice to see how that translates on the field during a game. Give Jordy the night off or only a few plays and let both McCaffrey and Allison see some starter's reps.

 

[Candidate for Deletion]

The thought of Cobb not being on this team this season would have me very concerned about our WRs. Nelson, Adams and who? It seems to be this way every year. So many fans thinking we have such an abundance of talent at WR that we could get rid of one of our top three and be just fine. Yes Aaron Rodgers make his receivers look better but in an offense like ours you really need at least three very good WRs. Right now we have exactly three.

If you're taking this conversation as wanting him gone for the ascendance of another player, you (and those agreeing) have utterly failed to understand the point of this entire line of reasoning. Nobody here wants him gone, especially just for shiggles. He is one of our top three guys. REGARDLESS, he is MASSIVELY overpaid at his current performance level, and that makes it at least SOMEWHAT likely that the team will decide to part ways with him at some point. How people have taken that analysis of the situation to mean "gosh golly, I really want that guy gone" is beyond me - but this would not be the internet if people didn't respond to what they wanted to read, instead of what was written.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

If you're taking this conversation as wanting him gone for the ascendance of another player, you (and those agreeing) have utterly failed to understand the point of this entire line of reasoning. Nobody here wants him gone, especially just for shiggles. He is one of our top three guys. REGARDLESS, he is MASSIVELY overpaid at his current performance level, and that makes it at least SOMEWHAT likely that the team will decide to part ways with him at some point. How people have taken that analysis of the situation to mean "gosh golly, I really want that guy gone" is beyond me - but this would not be the internet if people didn't respond to what they wanted to read, instead of what was written.

What NFL player isn't "MASSIVELY" overpaid? But that is another debate.

I think most everyone, probably even Cobb himself, knows that his contract isn't meeting his numbers, but you have to ask yourself...."Who do you replace him with and how much will that cost you?" If that guy you replace him with turns out to be a bust, was it worth the savings? I am in full agreement that Cobb is being overpaid, but that is an obvious fact, but I don't think it's as "Massive" as some think. If the Packers had a replacement and were 100% confident that they don't lose much in performance, versaitlity, field and locker room presence, then he is expendable. At this point, overpaying him seems to be the most logical option. Much like CMIII, the Packers know what they have and don't currently have a better replacement.

What happens when, god forbid, AR's play starts declining, but he is still the best option on the team? Do you say "He is being overpaid, get rid of him"? Or do you accept that he is your best option and take the hit?

 

[gopkrs]

I am curious about Michael Clark. A lot of people have been so high on him and now that we are playing games I don't see much of him. Are we trying to stash him? I would like to see him play great and beat out Rodgers but have had no opportunity to watch him play.

 

[Mondio]

like I was always told, "wish in one hand and start ******** in the other, see which one fills up first"

Cobb's issue lately has been health. It doesn't get easier as you get older to stay healthy. I think if he stays mostly healthy, he is to this team what they need. I don't think his numbers reflect his true value. I'm not arguing he's earned his money the past 2 seasons, but I don't think he's as far off as some think he is. I can see him easily earning his paycheck with a healthy season.

Clay on the other hand...

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I am curious about Michael Clark. A lot of people have been so high on him and now that we are playing games I don't see much of him. Are we trying to stash him? I would like to see him play great and beat out Rodgers but have had no opportunity to watch him play.

My take on Clark......raw talent. With only 1 year of playing college ball at Marshall, he still has a lot to learn about the game. I too was hoping to see more of him and it could be we aren't because as you said, the Packers don't want to draw any attention to him and be able to stash him on the PS. But if he is THAT good, I doubt other teams don't know about him. I think he will be safe on the Packers PS, since any team that would try to "steal" him would be required to put him on their active 53 and it appears he is still too raw for that.

 

[Candidate for Deletion]

What NFL player isn't "MASSIVELY" overpaid? But that is another debate.

touche, lol

I think most everyone, probably even Cobb himself, knows that his contract isn't meeting his numbers, but you have to ask yourself...."Who do you replace him with and how much will that cost you?" If that guy you replace him with turns out to be a bust, was it worth the savings? I am in full agreement that Cobb is being overpaid, but that is an obvious fact, but I don't think it's as "Massive" as some think. If the Packers had a replacement and were 100% confident that they don't lose much in performance, versaitlity, field and locker room presence, then he is expendable. At this point, overpaying him seems to be the most logical option. Much like CMIII, the Packers know what they have and don't currently have a better replacement.

A few things there - your opening logic is bulletproof, yet still in this league cap casualties happen all of the time. This is why the possibility has to be recognized as at least, well, possible (and thus, worth discussing). If the team feels so poorly about all of the guys behind Cobb (meaning all WRs except Nelson and Adams) that they feel trapped into the contract, that in and of itself is almost a worse thing than the contract numbers themselves. Which, on that topic, are really bad. Cobb is one of the 15 highest paid WRs in the NFL, coming in at number 14 (just before Nelson at 15) with a 10 million per year average. That means that he is a #3 WR making not just #1 money, but more money than many #1s. I recognize that the Slot position has become more and more valuable to teams, and that overall the contract numbers for most slot receivers has not caught up to this, but even in those contexts - possibly especially in them - Cobb is overpaid. Doug Baldwin is both a #1 and a Slot receiver - the highest paid Slot guy - and his contract comes in at 11.5 million per year. (You can technically say Hilton is a Slot guy too based upon his usage, but I still consider him more of an outside guy). Granted, I do believe that at the time the contract was given, with his ascendant path of play projected before the team, that the contract was, while a bit high, quite warranted. It is only the last few years that he has gone from "expensive but worth it" to "so overpaid he could be a cap casualty."

What happens when, god forbid, AR's play starts declining, but he is still the best option on the team? Do you say "He is being overpaid, get rid of him"? Or do you accept that he is your best option and take the hit?

Luckily, that is a totally different topic - one which we wont have to address for years (fingers crossed)

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

touche, lol


A few things there - your opening logic is bulletproof, yet still in this league cap casualties happen all of the time.

That statement on my part was meant to be tongue in cheek and of course you are correct, cap and pay has to be looked at in the NFL bubble that it exists.

Granted, I do believe that at the time the contract was given, with his ascendant path of play projected before the team, that the contract was, while a bit high, quite warranted. It is only the last few years that he has gone from "expensive but worth it" to "so overpaid he could be a cap casualty."

Here in lies the answer to the Cobb question. Contracts are signed based on projected performance, which is based off of previous performances. At the time Cobb was given that contract, he was very young and just had an outstanding year. The only crystal ball available to the Packers at that time was using that knowledge at the time to secure a WR who was a perfect fit for the Packers. I think most of us at the time were saying that although the number seemed a tad high, it was necessary to keep a key piece in the Packer offense. Fast forward to now, injuries and other circumstances have brought Cobb's stats down under that guaranteed contract, yet he is still a key piece to the offense, with nobody behind him playing better. So do you bale, take the cap hit and try to replace every player that may be underperforming a contract but is a starter and a contributor?

There are times to bale from a contract, but IMO that time isn't now for Cobb and won't be until they have a cheaper suitable replacement. May have been why they drafted Davis, but so far, that hasn't borne fruit.