Prospects You Love

[brandon2348]

I’m sure this has been mentioned but every receiver has weeknesses. Ridley is probably the most universally good in each category that’s true. Sutton has a great size advantage at 6’4”/216lbs and moves effortlessly more like he’s 6’1”/200lbs.​

His strength contesting catches makes him look more like a smaller TE and possesses enough speed that he can break away from a Corner or Safety that’s off balance contesting. Catch. He’s almost identical to Jordys rookie speed but a smidgen taller. While agreeably Ridley would be a better and more polished immediate fit. Sutton is good enough to start Year 1 as a third receiver and take focus off Jordy, Cobb, Davante etc.. . He’s easily an upgrade over Geronimo and his upside (improvement level) is strong. I see him as a valid #2 behind Davante in a year or two.
All that being said I’m concermed that unless we trade back He really fits smack dab between our pick at #14 and our pick at #45 (he’ll probably not make round 2) so we’re in a tight spot because he’s probably valued around top 35 overall.
I Do think we need to be thinking receiver before day 2 comes to close and will likely get EQ etc.. instead.

That's pretty good analysis. I think it's gonna come down to the combine where Sutton goes. I've seen him all over the board from top 10 to the Bears or Jets all the way to the back of first round. Unless he has very very poor combine he certainly won't make it to us in 2nd round.

 

[Dantés]

Maybe. But even Jordy only scored 6 TDs total in his first 3 formative years. It wasn’t until his 4th campaign when he had the likes of
Donald Driver
Randall Cobb
James Jones
Greg Jennings
Jermichael Finley (portion of season)

That’s a load to handle for any Defense and nobody even knew who he was so capitalized on it.

I’m not seeing the connection. I was just saying that I don’t think Sutton has the ability to challenge vertically like Jordy did.

 

[Dantés]

Or Tyus Bowser.

Repent on. You obviously didn't do your homework.

https://www.lockedondolphins.com/dolphins/harrisrookie/

Dude... think before you post. Bowser had a good rookie season for the Ravens. They used him as an off ball linebacker and situational pass rusher and he still had more sacks than Harris.

I was even super clear that I liked Harris. You were just too obsessive to deal with anyone liking other prospects more. You flipped out. This year it’s a rerun— just replace Harris with Sutton.

 

[GleefulGary]

Sutton is fine, but he is most definitely not a good option at #14.

I'm one who thinks the 40 is overrated by a lot of people, but I will eat my shorts if Sutton runs under a 4.5 40. To boot, he'll have a bad 3-cone and 10 yd shuttle.

He is a possession WR. A RZ WR. A far lesser version of Mike Evans. He's more Kelvin Benjamin than Jordy Nelson. And that's still a fine WR. It's not a WR you draft at 14.

 

[brandon2348]

Dude... think before you post. Bowser had a good rookie season for the Ravens. They used him as an off ball linebacker and situational pass rusher and he still had more sacks than Harris.

I was even super clear that I liked Harris. You were just too obsessive to deal with anyone liking other prospects more. You flipped out. This year it’s a rerun— just replace Harris with Sutton.

I simply stated "Bowser" cause you gushed all over him too. Never posted he had a terrible rookie year however he is no Charles Harris.

I nailed Harris so get over it. Whats scary is I feel even better about Sutton then I did Harris.

 

[brandon2348]

Sutton is fine, but he is most definitely not a good option at #14.

I'm one who thinks the 40 is overrated by a lot of people, but I will eat my shorts if Sutton runs under a 4.5 40. To boot, he'll have a bad 3-cone and 10 yd shuttle.

He is a possession WR. A RZ WR. A far lesser version of Mike Evans. He's more Kelvin Benjamin than Jordy Nelson. And that's still a fine WR. It's not a WR you draft at 14.

That's such an insult to Sutton to compare him to Benjamin. Sutton is much more fluid coming out then Benjamin will ever be. He has more quick twitch then Benjamin and faster. Good Grief.

 

[Dantés]

That's such an insult to Sutton to compare him to Benjamin. Sutton is much more fluid coming out then Benjamin will ever be. He has more quick twitch then Benjamin and faster. Good Grief.

Yeah, how dare he compare Sutton to a guy with similar traits who was similarly rated coming out of college?? The nerve of some people.

 

[Dantés]

I simply stated "Bowser" cause you gushed all over him too. Never posted he had a terrible rookie year however he is no Charles Harris.

I nailed Harris so get over it. Whats scary is I feel even better about Sutton then I did Harris.

We’re gonna have to work on what quotation marks mean, but that’s alright.

It is scary that you feel even better about Sutton, but not for the reason you mean.

 

[GleefulGary]

That's such an insult to Sutton to compare him to Benjamin. Sutton is much more fluid coming out then Benjamin will ever be. He has more quick twitch then Benjamin and faster. Good Grief.

"Rare size -- is a physical mismatch vs. defensive backs and linebackers. Eats cushion and separates with long strides. Strong approach to the ball -- is not easily knocked off course and will enter the middle on crossers. Outstanding jumpball catcher -- climbs the ladder, plucks the ball at its highest point and regularly snatches it out of the air with superb body control and the grace of a ballerina. Very good separation speed. Adjusts surprisingly well for the low ball and tracks it well over his shoulder. Energetic football demeanor. Confident and competitive. Strong-handed. Uses his body well to shield the defender from the ball and can beat double coverage. Good run strength after the catch."

Is that a scouting report for Benjamin or Sutton?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Not with AR12 slinging it. With that personnel someone is gonna be mismatched. Plus I can't wait until the combine when Sutton puts all this talk of him not being fast to bed. If people remember Jordy is a long strider and he was a viable deep threat weapon when he had wheels. I expect Sutton to run 4.50 or below and several scouts do as well.

The Packers definitely need some speed at wide receiver as the team once again had the slowest receiving corps in the entire league last season. The team won't achieve that by adding Sutton and Graham.

Speed is just one tangible of many (not including intangibles) for a NFL Receiver, but I’m beginning to think we overemphasize it way too much.

The Packers seem to underemphasize speed at wide receiver though.

I nailed Harris so get over it. Whats scary is I feel even better about Sutton then I did Harris.

Harris had a decent rookie season but wasn't dominant by any means. No reason to brag about wanting the Packers to draft him last season.

 

[Mondio]

Now playing right guard for the Chitcago Bears, Josh Sutton

 

[brandon2348]

"Rare size -- is a physical mismatch vs. defensive backs and linebackers. Eats cushion and separates with long strides. Strong approach to the ball -- is not easily knocked off course and will enter the middle on crossers. Outstanding jumpball catcher -- climbs the ladder, plucks the ball at its highest point and regularly snatches it out of the air with superb body control and the grace of a ballerina. Very good separation speed. Adjusts surprisingly well for the low ball and tracks it well over his shoulder. Energetic football demeanor. Confident and competitive. Strong-handed. Uses his body well to shield the defender from the ball and can beat double coverage. Good run strength after the catch."

Is that a scouting report for Benjamin or Sutton?

The difference is they forgot to add fat and lazy to Benjamin. Body types are completely different. Benjamin is robotic at times where Sutton isn't. This stuff makes a big difference. One thing I loved about Devante coming out is how fluid he was. Sutton has similar.

 

[brandon2348]

Harris had a decent rookie season but wasn't dominant by any means. No reason to brag about wanting the Packers to draft him last season.

First of all I didn't bring Harris up, Dante did.

Second, His pressure ratings were off the hook for a rookie and he is trending in the right direction. He showed the ability to hold up against run which some on here thought he would struggle at. He is gonna be a star with his combination of talent and work ethic. We don't have any emerging talent like that at the edge position. Just like we don't at the receiver position. Hmmm.

For the second time if a fast receiver is what you want then cut Cobb and go get Paul Richardson or John Brown. We can't afford to miss out on Courtland Sutton as an outside threat and weapon.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

First of all I didn't bring Harris up, Dante did.

Second, His pressure ratings were off the hook for a rookie and he is trending in the right direction. He showed the ability to hold up against run which some on here thought he would struggle at. He is gonna be a star with his combination of talent and work ethic. We don't have any emerging talent like that at the edge position. Just like we don't at the receiver position. Hmmm.

For the second tine if a fast receiver is what you want then cut Cobb and go get Paul Richardson or John Brown. We can't afford to miss out on Courtland Sutton as an outside threat and weapon.

PFF graded Harris (76.7) as an average edge defender ranked 49th in the league among qualifying players. While that's definitely decent for a rookie it's far from an elite performance. I would be interested in a link to a story mentioning he was great at pressuring opposing quarterbacks.

While Richardson and Brown are definitely fast wide receivers the Packers shouldn't bring in any of them to replace Cobb. Sutton is an intriguing prospect but in my opinion not the best wide receiver in this year's draft.

 

[brandon2348]

PFF graded Harris (76.7) as an average edge defender ranked 49th in the league among qualifying players. While that's definitely decent for a rookie it's far from an elite performance. I would be interested in a link to a story mentioning he was great at pressuring opposing quarterbacks.

While Richardson and Brown are definitely fast wide receivers the Packers shouldn't bring in any of them to replace Cobb. Sutton is an intriguing prospect but in my opinion not the best wide receiver in this year's draft.

I'm now providing this for the second time.

https://www.lockedondolphins.com/dolphins/harrisrookie/

There are other receivers I like too. I like Michael Gallup and James Washington but I believe Sutton will be the best one coming out of this draft when we look back.

Anthony Miller and Calvin Ridley are just to small for me body wise. I believe they will both struggle to stay on routes at the next level and will get pushed around.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I'm now providing this for the second time.

https://www.lockedondolphins.com/dolphins/harrisrookie/

There are other receivers I like too. I like Michael Gallup and James Washington but I believe Sutton will be the best one coming out of this draft when we look back.

Anthony Miller and Calvin Ridley are just to small for me body wise. I believe they will both struggle to stay on routes at the next level and will get pushed around.

Once again, Harris had a decent rookie season but he definitely wasn't one of the most impressive out of the 2017 draft.

It's fine if you believe that Sutton will be the best wide receiver out of this year's draft class. You should allow others to express a different opinion though.

 

[brandon2348]

Once again, Harris had a decent rookie season but he definitely wasn't one of the most impressive out of the 2017 draft.

It's fine if you believe that Sutton will be the best wide receiver out of this year's draft class. You should allow others to express a different opinion though.

I had actually let the Sutton talk stop for about a week and poster Old School made some posts regarding him and his potential value to Packers and I simply chimed in and I was the one attacked and thrown jabs at by the "Ridley Lovers". I simply responded but whatever.

 

[GleefulGary]

The difference is they forgot to add fat and lazy to Benjamin. Body types are completely different. Benjamin is robotic at times where Sutton isn't. This stuff makes a big difference. One thing I loved about Devante coming out is how fluid he was. Sutton has similar.

My man. You are reading things that aren't there.

I did not say that he is identical to KB. I said he is more similar to KB than Jordy. Can you see how that is different?

Sutton is fluid for his size. His 3-cone will show a lot. He's still more of a possession/RZ WR than a deep threat like Jordy was. He's going to win with his size, not his speed. He rarely blew the top off in college...he's not going to start doing it in the NFL. Comparing him to Evans is ludicrous. Evans dominated SEC competition. Sutton wasn't even the most productive WR on how own team in a mediocre conference. He had multiple games his SR year where he was invisible on the field.

I'm not a Ridley lover, btw. I think he's easily the best WR in the draft, but this is a WR draft that doesn't have any stars. Some good players for sure, but nobody that's great. I would rather take a guy like DJ Moore or James Washington in the 2nd than Ridley in the 1st.

I don't even think Sutton is bad. I just think he's a different type of WR than you do. He's not a #1, he's not a star. He's a #2/#3 guy. I'm not taking that at 14. In round 2, sure. He seems like a great kid. I hope he does well.

And nobody attacked you. It's ok to have a difference of opinion.

 

[brandon2348]

My man. You are reading things that aren't there.

I did not say that he is identical to KB. I said he is more similar to KB than Jordy. Can you see how that is different?

Sutton is fluid for his size. His 3-cone will show a lot. He's still more of a possession/RZ WR than a deep threat like Jordy was. He's going to win with his size, not his speed. He rarely blew the top off in college...he's not going to start doing it in the NFL. Comparing him to Evans is ludicrous. Evans dominated SEC competition. Sutton wasn't even the most productive WR on how own team in a mediocre conference. He had multiple games his SR year where he was invisible on the field.

I'm not a Ridley lover, btw. I think he's easily the best WR in the draft, but this is a WR draft that doesn't have any stars. Some good players for sure, but nobody that's great. I would rather take a guy like DJ Moore or James Washington in the 2nd than Ridley in the 1st.

I don't even think Sutton is bad. I just think he's a different type of WR than you do. He's not a #1, he's not a star. He's a #2/#3 guy. I'm not taking that at 14. In round 2, sure. He seems like a great kid. I hope he does well.

And nobody attacked you. It's ok to have a difference of opinion.

I just saw a mock today(Tanier's) that had Sutton going to Niners at 9 so your evaluation is far off from mine and others and that's fine. People don't see things the same and I understand that. I see huge upside and a potential no.1 receiver. Yes, he is gonna need some development but I believe it's well worth the wait as the ceiling is limitless with him.

I'm done talking about him until after the combine and I agree there is nothing wrong with people disagreeing.

 

[Dantés]

So what do you guys hear about this Courtland Sutton kid from SMU? Any good?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

So what do you guys hear about this Courtland Sutton kid from SMU? Any good?

Never heard of him, who is that?

 

[GleefulGary]

So what do you guys hear about this Courtland Sutton kid from SMU? Any good?

No no no. You're mixed up.

It's Calvin Sutton from Alabama Methodist and Courtland Ridley from

 

[PackFan2]

Fred Warner from BYU stock might increase after combine workouts. If he tests well and speed shows up, Id like him at round 3-4 will linebacker type player.

 

[thequick12]

First of all I didn't bring Harris up, Dante did.

Second, His pressure ratings were off the hook for a rookie and he is trending in the right direction. He showed the ability to hold up against run which some on here thought he would struggle at. He is gonna be a star with his combination of talent and work ethic. We don't have any emerging talent like that at the edge position. Just like we don't at the receiver position. Hmmm.

For the second time if a fast receiver is what you want then cut Cobb and go get Paul Richardson or John Brown. We can't afford to miss out on Courtland Sutton as an outside threat and weapon.

I'd say the chances of the Packers drafting Sutton are right next to zero. There's absolutely no way theyll consider him at #14 and you're probably right that he'll be gone by #46. I'm not sold on the Packers need for a big possession receiver. If he was 245 pounds and could move like that ala Finley I'd be all for it but he's 215 and moves like a really athletic te. I'd be shocked if he becomes a top 15 NFL receiver.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I'd say the chances of the Packers drafting Sutton are right next to zero. There's absolutely no way theyll consider him at #14 and you're probably right that he'll be gone by #46. I'm not sold on the Packers need for a big possession receiver. If he was 245 pounds and could move like that ala Finley I'd be all for it but he's 215 and moves like a really athletic te. I'd be shocked if he becomes a top 15 NFL receiver.

I agree that the Packers should rather add a speedy wide receiver capable of being a deep threat. Keke Coutee out of Texas Tech might present a decent option either in the third or fourth round.