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Our Safeties

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by BorderRivals.com, Jan 6, 2014.

  1. BorderRivals.com

    BorderRivals.com Cheesehead

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    Just saw this on twitter:

    M.D. Jennings had the third highest QB rating against amongst all safeties: 148.8.
    Burnett was eighth highest: 138.0.

    Zero INTs all season. Proof they can't cover. Burnett was slow to react and/or get to VD on the TD in the 4Q. And neither are good tacklers. Just about as bad of safety play as you could get.

    This position is our number 1 priority to improve next season. And it's not close anymore in my opinion.
     
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  2. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    They're horrible.

    Losing Nick Collins was devastating.

    Not getting one of the many real good safeties in the past 2 drafts was, perhaps, a mistake.

    At least Teddy locked up Burnett with a nice new rich long contract before this season. So he's here to stay for awhile.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. raj34

    raj34 Cheesehead

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    Yes, safety is a gigantic hole, but so is ILB. We also have needs at DL, TE, OLB (clay can't stay healthy, Perry is injury prone and ineffective), and possibly OL and WR. This team has lots of needs.

    Priority number one must be to draft a useful player regardless of position in the first round. Its been a long drought now going back all the way back to Raji. Those four straight losses to the niners begin and end with poor decisions on draft day (and injuries).

    Draft someone that can actually help us in his rookie year instead of 'developing' for years and years, sign somebody useful for the defense in free agency, and can the strength and conditioning staff. That would be a good off season. My fingers are crossed.
     
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  4. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

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    Raji was most definitely drafted for position and probably wasn't the best on the board at the time.

    I agree with most of your offseason plans and that we need an immediate impact, just not necessarily the needs. We are deep at WR, especially if Jones comes back. A project WR wouldn't hurt, but it's not a need.

    I feel the same about OL. I think the O-line made big strides this year, and we get Bulaga and Tretter for (presumably) full seasons next year.

    I think safety is far and away the most pressing need, but we'll see if they choose to address it at all in free agency first.
     
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  5. HyponGrey

    HyponGrey Caseus Locutus Est

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    Or, Zero INT because they can't catch. Is what I'd say if I didn't already know the Passes Defended #s
     
  6. GoPGo

    GoPGo Cheesehead

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    Kevin Dorsey is next year's Jarrett Boykin.
     
  7. BorderRivals.com

    BorderRivals.com Cheesehead

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    There's more:

    Zach Kruse ‏@zachkruse227m
    Morgan Burnett and MD Jennings were targeted 60 times in 2013. Allowed 46 catches, 612 yards, 9 TDs and a passer rating of 148.1.

    Eff.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  8. TCHickman24

    TCHickman24 Cheesehead

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    Correct me if I am wrong but I thought Morgan Burnett was rated the #1 safety in the league last year. If so, what the hell happened?
     
  9. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    Well, anybody can rate anybody anything, but I don't believe any informed opinion would have placed his 2012 season anywhere near the top. Some of us found his new contract surprising...they were paying for what they expected him to do, paying for more upside to be realized. It could work out, but right now that deal is looking like a disappointment akin to Hawk's 2010 deal.

    In both the Hawk and Burnett cases, Capers valued them as the QBs of his complex defense. I'll just leave it at that.
     
  10. rodell330

    rodell330 Cheesehead

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    Burnett hasn't been good this year at all and MD Jennings is the worse safety i've ever seen. Combine that with no pass rush and yea this is what you get. Even if we were to go to the SB and play the Broncos Manning would have a career day against us no doubt about it. I'd rather lose in the first round instead of going to the SB and getting embarassed anyways so....
     
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  11. BorderRivals.com

    BorderRivals.com Cheesehead

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    Yup. TT gambled on paying now at what would have been a below-market rate for what he expected Burnett to become. It has backfired in this and Hawk's case - though TT just has this affinity to Hawk regardless. But, this strategy paid off when extending Rodgers and Jordy before they broke out. So, it's hit and miss - as with anything.
     
  12. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    Neither Hawk in 2010 nor Burnett in 2013 were paid at below market rates.

    Working from memory, I believe Hawk's 2010 deal was for about $6.5 mil per year for 5 years with an $8 mil signing bonus. That's alot for an ILB who never saw a Pro Bowl-type season, and by that I mean would not be considered one of the 4 best ILBs in the league in any one season.

    Hawk was paid commensurate with the expectations that many years of 2010-type performance were forthcoming...consistent, second-tier, not-quite-Pro Bowl play while being a steadying force in the seemingly ever-young draft-and-develop cycle we seemed to have adopted after the uncapped year. We did not get that from him. Should we have expected it? One very good year following 4 years of underachievement? It was a risk to say the least.

    For perspective, Tulluck signed with Detroit in 2011 for 2 years/$4 mil total. He far outplayed that contract (and anything Hawk ever did over any 2 year period) and was rewarded with a $5 mil per year 5 year deal, not Hawk's $6.5 mil per year.

    Burnett got 5 years, $26 million, $8 mil guaranteed. That's a lot for a safety, among the lower paid positions in the NFL, especially for a guy who had not been consistent over a full season. For perspective, the safety franchise tag in 2013 was $6.9 million. I think the loss of Woodson, Shields on a one year deal, Williams struggling since the shoulder injury, and a lot of youth (Bush doesn't count), they wanted to lock down a guy who would be a cornerstone of the backfield for the next few years. It seemed then, and seemed now, like a bit of a stretch even if progression was expected.
     
  13. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    Crabtree was the highest player on teds overall board that year but he passed bc of lack of need in that position.
     
  14. brandon2348

    brandon2348 GO PACK GO!

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  15. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    I'd not heard that before, but it doesn't surprise me. The supposed "best player available" TT approach is a myth not supported by the facts. In this case we were retooling to 3-4 and needed a NT badly...you cannot run a 3-4 without a big body in the middle and Raji was the best NT in the draft.
     
  16. brandon2348

    brandon2348 GO PACK GO!

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    Deone Bucannon (SS) Washington State. I think this guy could fix the SS problem or at least stop the bleeding
     
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  17. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    We didn't need a 1st WR IMO. He made a good call, Raji very much contributed to the trophy coming home. Now he's just another guy.
     
  18. 7thFloorRA

    7thFloorRA Cheesehead

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    It is going to be critical to fix burnett this offseason. He may never be smart enough to know the secondary calls but he can go to tackling camp this off season.

    Ideally I would like TT to find a way to pry RFA TJ Ward away from the Browns. He can play the strong safety and then Burnett can be moved back to free safety. They want him back pretty bad so it wont be easy but I think he is a good young safety who finds the ball and can actually tackle and hit with ferocity. I dont know how smart ward is with the calls out there but I also would like Ray Horton to be running the defense so maybe his calls aren't as elaborate as Capers.
     
  19. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

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    No, he was never rated that high. He graded out #16, I believe.

    I think Burnett would be fine as your second safety. For whatever reason I think Burnett seems to struggle worse when he has to be relied on as the man rather than not carry the weight of being the top safety.

    I think if we had Collins and Burnett we would be fine.
     
  20. brandon2348

    brandon2348 GO PACK GO!

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    Packers are almost married to Burnett(with dead money) so they need a Strong Safety.
     
  21. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

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    So what's the problem with Raji? Lazy? Peaked very early in his career? Just played over his head in 2010?

    I'm not a fan of Raji at all anymore, but I thought he would have a really good year this year for no other reason than it being a contract year.
     
  22. 7thFloorRA

    7thFloorRA Cheesehead

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    That was the plan. That is why I want TT to replace Collins (which is really absurd to say now since he was injured 3 seasons ago) and put Burnett back where he was. He has proven he can't be the guy and for the 3rd season now he cant figure out the coverage calls 100 percent of the time.
     
  23. BorderRivals.com

    BorderRivals.com Cheesehead

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    FWIW... I meant that the deal was a gamble in that TT was paying "below market rate" if they turned out to be the player the thought they'd be. So, pay now, but save later if they pan out. Kind of like the Jordy deal. Jordy looked like a great option, but wasn't elite yet. So, pay less now and hope he pans out. He did, making his deal a below market rate.
     
  24. 7thFloorRA

    7thFloorRA Cheesehead

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    I've been all over him for being a dead *** this year but I think if he had a new DC that lit a fire under him he is still plenty talented to be a force.
    I still love how the Bears payed Earl Bennett more money than him in the same off season.
     
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  25. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

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    Right, because BPA is mostly a farce. I think teams generally have a board but have a few positions in mind and if the actual BPA doesn't fall into one of those categories, they trade down (2008) or pass (Crabtree in 2009).

    Rodgers was the last true BPA pick which passed on all immediate needs for a BPA. Although I do think TT actually did think he was taking BPA with Harrell in 2007, because it wasn't a need.
     

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