Is it Thompson or is it Wolf?

[HardRightEdge]

The off season free agent pickups, signing Brooks at the 11th. hour, bringing in Dial in for a workout at the 12th. hour...all very uncharacteristic of Thompson.

I can't help but think Wolf is having a hand in this.

It might be time to recalibrate expectations going forward.

 

[Mondio]

I think you're trying to read too much into things. I don't think much has changed other than our roster is now in a position where it needs more help. I said it in another thread 2014 we were stacked all the way around. Choked. and '15 and '16 had largely the same roster and we failed to reach the Super Bowl for similar, yet different reasons in those years as well. This season has been different, but not because Ted just discovered a new way to be GM or because an understudy is running the show. We had more holes to fill because of departures and after giving guys a chance to perform and grow, they haven't.

UNLIKE last year, we've had injuries to our OLB's in the preseason, while there are actually other choices that can be available. Unlike last year, people aren't clammoring for Ted to get a DB in week 6 of the regular season saying, "he should have signed a vet". I think if Jayrone Elliot had a preseason like he did a few years ago, things would be different, or if Fackrell actually looked like he belonged on the field, maybe Brooks gets added. But as it stands, Elliot has done nothing in a couple seasons but play special teams. Fackrell had 1 game where he looked marginally ok in the preseason, Matthews has a "mystery" illness and Perry sprained his ankle. Earlier, there weren't exactly bodies to fill those spots. Brooks just became available, and was signed. Fair offer. Nothing outlandish for a guy of his experience and past production, not exactly cheap either.

I think it's also different this year in that some of the young guys we usually see at least shine a bit in the preseason, haven't. Nobody on the OLine has looked that good except for starters. If they can upgrade DL, fine, but I like what we have there. Even in seasons past we had guys like Boykin make people notice every game in the preseason. This year? what an underwhelming bunch of WR's buried on the depth chart.

anyway, i'm going to get even more long winded than need be. Simply put, I think this year instead of having guys shine in the preseason, they dudded out. I think we lost more in FA and had more positions to fill. I think guys became available at contracts that made sense that we could use so we signed them. a combination of a lot of things make this offseason seem so different, but I do not think Ted is just some figure head for the organization.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I think you're trying to read too much into things. I don't think much has changed other than our roster is now in a position where it needs more help. I said it in another thread 2014 we were stacked all the way around. Choked. and '15 and '16 had largely the same roster and we failed to reach the Super Bowl for similar, yet different reasons in those years as well. This season has been different, but not because Ted just discovered a new way to be GM or because an understudy is running the show. We had more holes to fill because of departures and after giving guys a chance to perform and grow, they haven't.

UNLIKE last year, we've had injuries to our OLB's in the preseason, while there are actually other choices that can be available. Unlike last year, people aren't clammoring for Ted to get a DB in week 6 of the regular season saying, "he should have signed a vet". I think if Jayrone Elliot had a preseason like he did a few years ago, things would be different, or if Fackrell actually looked like he belonged on the field, maybe Brooks gets added. But as it stands, Elliot has done nothing in a couple seasons but play special teams. Fackrell had 1 game where he looked marginally ok in the preseason, Matthews has a "mystery" illness and Perry sprained his ankle. Earlier, there weren't exactly bodies to fill those spots. Brooks just became available, and was signed. Fair offer. Nothing outlandish for a guy of his experience and past production, not exactly cheap either.

I think it's also different this year in that some of the young guys we usually see at least shine a bit in the preseason, haven't. Nobody on the OLine has looked that good except for starters. If they can upgrade DL, fine, but I like what we have there. Even in seasons past we had guys like Boykin make people notice every game in the preseason. This year? what an underwhelming bunch of WR's buried on the depth chart.

anyway, i'm going to get even more long winded than need be. Simply put, I think this year instead of having guys shine in the preseason, they dudded out. I think we lost more in FA and had more positions to fill. I think guys became available at contracts that made sense that we could use so we signed them. a combination of a lot of things make this offseason seem so different, but I do not think Ted is just some figure head for the organization.

I don't believe Wolf is running the show this offseason either but there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that Thompson has changed his approach building a roster over the past few months for whatever reasons as he definitely ignored obvious positions in need of an upgrade in the past even if there were possible improvements available at the time.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

The off season free agent pickups, signing Brooks at the 11th. hour, bringing in Dial in for a workout at the 12th. hour...all very uncharacteristic of Thompson.

I can't help but think Wolf is having a hand in this.

It might be time to recalibrate expectations going forward.

It's Thompson. He's in charge, Wolf is not.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I don't believe Wolf is running the show this offseason either but there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that Thompson has changed his approach building a roster over the past few months for whatever reasons as he definitely ignored obvious positions in need of an upgrade in the past even if there were possible improvements available at the time.

It's Thompson. He's in charge, Wolf is not.

There's a difference between "running the show" or "being in charge" and having increased influence.

 

[brandon2348]

Maybe Dorsey is secretively acting as and advisor to Thompson.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

There's a difference between "running the show" or "being in charge" and having increased influence.

You're definitely right about that. As mentioned in another thread the Packers won't reveal any information about Wolf's role possible having increased though, therefore we're left to speculate on if that happened over the past few months.

 

[Mondio]

I think Thompson has always taken into consideration the opinions of his scouts and team around him. I don't think now is any different. but you did ask, is it Thompson or is it Wolf?

Even when I look at Oline this year over last at this point. We had 5 healthy starters, Barclay who they seem to love and I can't understand why and Spriggs who played decently in the preseason and had lots of upside coming out of the draft. They also had JC Tretter and he and Linsley seemed to just swap out when one or the other would get hurt. This year, we've had Bulaga out for a couple weeks, Barclay is on IR and Spriggs looked to have regressed and Murphy isn't much better than he was last year. Those other 2 guys they kept didn't do much more than barely stand in the way at times and got ran over in others. They looked a lot like Murphy did to me last year, although inside, instead of out, but still not up to the challenge by a long shot.

I don't think anything is changing Ted other than the situation we find ourselves in now, vs other years.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Even when I look at Oline this year over last at this point. We had 5 healthy starters, Barclay who they seem to love and I can't understand why and Spriggs who played decently in the preseason and had lots of upside coming out of the draft. They also had JC Tretter and he and Linsley seemed to just swap out when one or the other would get hurt. This year, we've had Bulaga out for a couple weeks, Barclay is on IR and Spriggs looked to have regressed and Murphy isn't much better than he was last year. Those other 2 guys they kept didn't do much more than barely stand in the way at times and got ran over in others. They looked a lot like Murphy did to me last year, although inside, instead of out, but still not up to the challenge by a long shot.

That doesn't bear any relevance in regard to Wolf possibly having received additional influence.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I think Thompson has always taken into consideration the opinions of his scouts and team around him. I don't think now is any different. but you did ask, is it Thompson or is it Wolf?

Of course any GM listens to his scouts otherwise why have any. Wolf is not just a "scout". Wolf is the Director of Football Operations a title he shares with one of Thompson's (Executive Vice President, General Manager & Director of Football Operations).

As for Thompson considering the team around him, the concerns expressed in these pages over depth at the OL and OLB are not a little interesting. Turn back the clock a couple of years prior to Peppers arrival. Where was the OLB depth then? Or how about starting the season with 7 OL on the roster with the backups of questionable value?

If it is not Wolf's influence then it's Thompson feeling the heat over playoff performance.

Brooks is only one piece of the puzzle. That could be yet another instance of rosy injury recovery scenarios for the starters that are not playing out. That of course might have little to do with Wolf or Thompson feeling heat. But the FA off season and the current scramble for depth is definitely a new look.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

It's Thompson. He's in charge, Wolf is not.

I think Murphy has been telling Thompson that he needs to use all avenues to make the team better... and GB is developing that.

I like it.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I think Murphy has been telling Thompson that he needs to use all avenues to make the team better.

Murphy doesn't strike me as someone that would approach Thompson about the way to build the roster. Maybe other members of the executive committee put some pressure on the president to do so though.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think Murphy has been telling Thompson that he needs to use all avenues to make the team better... and GB is developing that.

I like it.

Nahhhh.......only people TT listens to are Packer fans!

 

[HardRightEdge]

...not because Ted just discovered a new way to be GM or because an understudy is running the show...

I have to conclude you do not understand executive dynamics. There is a broad range of possible possible influence between "understudy" and "running the show". Then there's the matter of succession planning which requires increasing authority.

You may have noticed when GMs are hired, they typically get 5 year contracts with the expectation they will tear down a struggling team and recreate it their own image. So long as progress is made on that path and philosophical head butting with the owner is avoided, they get their 5 year time line.

If Thompson's departure is 2 or 3 years away, with a smooth transition being the obvious desired outcome, it would make sense to allow Wolf more authority.

I suggest the possibility only because it makes sense. At the same time, there is an evident tilt toward vet FAs , and the late pick up of a guy like Brooks for some decent money are uncharacteristic. We'll see if Dial reinforces that picture.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Murphy doesn't strike me as someone that would approach Thompson about the way to build the roster. Maybe other members of the executive committee put some pressure on the president to do so though.

I'd bet there are members of the Executive Committee who are not happy about the playoff performance. We aren't. Why wouldn't they share that concern? Murphy's more business side. Sh*t does tend to flow downhill and that would flow through Murphy.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I'd bet there are members of the Executive Committee are not happy about the playoff performance. We aren't. Why wouldn't they share that concern? Murphy's more business side. Sh*t does tend to flow downhill and that would flow through Murphy.

Profits....all about the almighty dollar. Us fans don't get satisfaction when the Packers make boatloads of money, but the Packer front office does. Now I am not saying that they are all fat, sassy and complacent.....but success, as measured by the organization, isn't just another Lombardi Trophy in the showcase, its a big fat bank account.

 

[Dantés]

I've wondered for a while if Thompson would become more aggressive as Rodgers got older. The nearer they get to a QB transition, he less it makes sense to prioritize long term stability over short term improvement.

 

[gbgary]

tt's "moves" have been out of necessity/@ss-covering. not out of any bold change in philosophy.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I've wondered for a while if Thompson would become more aggressive as Rodgers got older. The nearer they get to a QB transition, he less it makes sense to prioritize long term stability over short term improvement.

I doubt we'll ever see TT go "all in" for one shot at a Lombardi. He probably won't still be around when #12 hangs up his cleats, so he doesn't have to worry about securing another HOF QB in his time. However, I get a sneaky feeling, TT wants his own legacy to live on, well beyond the time he hangs up his stopwatch, pencil, paper and handwritten spreadsheets. TT will leave GB in good shape when his time is up.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

tt's "moves" have been out of necessity/@ss-covering. not out of any bold change in philosophy.

I gave you an agree, because for the most part I have been saying the same thing. However, I do think TT is possibly seeing the light and hopefully the advantage of having a little bit more of an experienced roster.

 

[Mondio]

I have to conclude you do not understand executive dynamics. There is a broad range of possible possible influence between "understudy" and "running the show". Then there's the matter of succession planning which requires increasing authority.

You may have noticed when GMs are hired, they typically get 5 year contracts with the expectation they will tear down a struggling team and recreate it their own image. So long as progress is made on that path and philosophical head butting with the owner is avoided, they get their 5 year time line.

If Thompson's departure is 2 or 3 years away, with a smooth transition being the obvious desired outcome, it would make sense to allow Wolf more authority.

I suggest the possibility only because it makes sense. At the same time, there is an evident tilt toward vet FAs , and the late pick up of a guy like Brooks for some decent money are uncharacteristic. We'll see if Dial reinforces that picture.

conclude whatever you need to.

 

[HardRightEdge]

conclude whatever you need to.

That bit of advice certainly was not required. Sounds a lot like "we have to agree to disagree", which of course is never a necessity.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Profits....all about the almighty dollar. Us fans don't get satisfaction when the Packers make boatloads of money, but the Packer front office does. Now I am not saying that they are all fat, sassy and complacent.....but success, as measured by the organization, isn't just another Lombardi Trophy in the showcase, its a big fat bank account.

The money relies on winning.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The money relies on winning.

You fully believe that? How much additional money does the Packer organization make by winning a Lombardi in a given year? I'm not talking about going back to the dark ages of the 80's, but is there really that much difference (money wise) between being a successful organization with or without a Lombardi Trophy?

 

[HardRightEdge]

You fully believe that? How much additional money does the Packer organization make by winning a Lombardi in a given year? I'm not talking about going back to the dark ages of the 80's, but is there really that much difference (money wise) between being a successful organization with or without a Lombardi Trophy?

Well, 25,000 seats have been added over the recent decades, the season ticket waiting list is populated with no small number of folks looking to sell in the aftermarket to out-of-towners, and I've noticed the prices on those aftermarket tickets have been slipping. Wasn't it just last year it was touch and go whether the Giants playoff game would sell out? This "always the bridesmaid, never the bride" routine is starting to wear a little thin. Like I said before, the Packers are not losing in the Super Bowl on a last second pick on the goal line. They get historically embarrassed at least every other year. Going 10-6 and getting squeezed out of the playoffs, or getting blown out again before going deep, would not be a good look.

Then there's the merchandise sales.

And then there's Executive Committee egos.

And then there's the "Titletown" brand that could use a refresh.

I would find it hard to believe that "get to the playoffs and see what happens" isn't wearing thin among at least some of the principals.