1. Welcome to Green Bay Packers NFL Football Forum & Community!

    Packer Forum is one of the largest online communities for the Green Bay Packers. You are currently viewing our community forums as a guest user.

    Sign Up or

    Having an account grants you additional privileges, such as creating and participating in discussions. Furthermore, we hide most of the ads once you register as a member!
    Dismiss Notice

Green Remains # 1

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by WinnipegPackFan, Oct 11, 2006.

  1. WinnipegPackFan

    WinnipegPackFan Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    Messages:
    1,943
    Ratings:
    +0
    Green remains No. 1

    by Tom Silverstein
    Source: Milwaukee Journal Sentinel

    Oct. 10, 2006

    Coach Mike McCarthy and offensive coordinator Jeff Jagodzinski both praised Herron for getting every yard he could in his 20-carry, 106-yard performance but they also wondered how many more yards Green would have gained on a day when the run blocking finally came together.

    Herron navigated well through the holes the line created, but he managed only two rushes of more than 10 yards and had a long carry of 19. It was the first time this season that the zone blocking system the Packers are employing worked close to the way it is supposed to.

    Missing from Herron's performance were the big gainers that break a defense's back and force it to start employing more defenders near the line of scrimmage.

    "Some of those 12-yard runs could be 40-yard runs," offensive coordinator Jeff Jagodzinski said. "He (Herron) ran really hard and got everything he could. But we left some yards out there."

    It's no secret that Herron isn't the same athlete Green is, so it's not surprising the Packers feel that way. What is somewhat surprising is that they feel as if Green could make people miss the way he once did even though he really hasn't done that all season long.

    The last two games, Green has sat on the sideline nursing a pulled hamstring and before that he averaged just 3.7 yards per carry. No one knows for sure if he would have made a difference in the Packers' crushing 23-20 loss to the Rams, especially given he's coming off a torn thigh tendon suffered last year and hasn't really had his speed tested in a game yet.

    But it's clear the Packers want him to be the one navigating those holes that suddenly appeared Sunday.

    "We have to get Ahman back on the field," Jagodzinski said. "That's going to be the key. I believe that once he gets back on the field when he's healthy, he will be fine because now these guys (the offensive linemen) are starting to see it. They're starting to get it."

    The Packers went into the game ranked 26th in the National Football League in rushing. Despite their 127-yard performance, they didn't move up, which is a pretty good indication they're still not keeping pace with the rest of the league in the running game. On two series - one in the second quarter and one in the fourth - they had excellent field position but weren't able to get any points, in part because they lacked a big play.

    In this system, the payoff is supposed to come every 10 carries or so when the defense gets tired of picking itself up off the ground from the cut blocks the linemen use and a lane opens up that leads straight to the secondary. Jagodzinski has remained patient waiting for backside cut blocks to occur and linemen sliding off double teams at the just the precise moment to pick off a linebacker.

    "It's going to get faster and it's going to get more fundamentally sound," Jagodzinski said. "There were some nice holes that guys did a nice job up front of run-blocking yesterday.

    "But that's what we do. I've (said) it's going to come along and it's starting to (but) we left some yards out on the field again, some giant holes in there, and we've got to break out to that secondary."

    It just so happened the offensive line was responsible for quarterback Brett Favre fumbling as the Packers were marching in for the tying or winning score in the final minute. But before that, especially when rookie Jason Spitz was in the lineup - he did not play in the second half for medical reasons - the Packers were opening holes they hadn't before.

    Not being able to take advantage of their newfound ability deepened the hurt the Packers felt and left them 1-4 going into the bye week. But McCarthy and Jagodzinski think there might have been a breakthrough in the running game and want to see if Green can make an even bigger difference.

    Provided, that is, that he can get back on the field.

    "He's got a lot of football left in him," McCarthy said. "I believe he's a difference-maker when he's in there. We need to be real about what's going on here. Are we talking about accountability and availability? And right now, his availability hasn't existed the last two weeks.

    "So with that the other guys have had opportunities and have done well. So the combination of the three is, as we move forward, something we'll look at."

    McCarthy couldn't say for sure whether Green would be available after the bye week when the Packers travel to Miami, but he'll have all of this week and part of next to heal and the assumption is he'll be ready. If he isn't on top of his game, then Herron might take some of his snaps.

    "I don't think you can look past Noah's performance yesterday," McCarthy said. "My thing with Ahman is more his health because if it's going to be 20, 25 carries a game, and we have to go through this process (not having him for two weeks), then that's probably not that smart.

    "So if we have to cut that (snaps) to 10 or 15, we will. But time will answer that question."
     
  2. gopackgo

    gopackgo Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2006
    Messages:
    730
    Ratings:
    +0
    No surprise. But it is awfully nice to know we have one backup that is decent. Hopefully Ahman can heal enough during the bye week. (crossed fingers)
     
  3. musccy

    musccy Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2005
    Messages:
    1,854
    Ratings:
    +1
    man is Ahman injury prone! Good article though. It really seems like the Oline has been coming along in a hurry this year!
     
  4. agopackgo4

    agopackgo4 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2005
    Messages:
    1,365
    Ratings:
    +0
    I agree, now im not a guy that thinks that green doesnt have anything left. But Noah H. showed more quickness and speed last week than i think Green has. Do you think its the O line that is imporving or the RB's that are in the game?
     
  5. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2005
    Messages:
    3,904
    Ratings:
    +1
    ago, I watched the game again last night and focused on the O-line for the running plays and they seem to really be picking up the zone blocking scheme. They were cut blocking nice and cutting off the backside defensive linemen, allowing Herron to cut back through the open lane. There were alot of big holes. Hopefully this improvement will continue. It will be interesting to watch the next couple games.

    Saying all this I think this type of blocking should be illegal. It has to take a toll on the defensive linemen's legs. Bu then again the NFL doesn't really care about the health of linemen. They just care about protecting the QB's. As long as it's legal and effective, keep doing it!
     
  6. agopackgo4

    agopackgo4 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2005
    Messages:
    1,365
    Ratings:
    +0
    Heck yeah! if it works lets do it. Thanks for clearing that up. Im curious to see what happens in the game in a couple weeks with Green. Hopefully he can do what Herron did.
     
  7. retiredgrampa

    retiredgrampa Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2005
    Messages:
    804
    Ratings:
    +0
    I know I'm in the minority here but I'm getting tired of Green (and others) who can't play for one reason or another. I can't help but wonder how much is pain and how much is lack of desire. There can be no doubt that some pro players get rich, fat, and happy (Woodson) and lose that competitiveness that made them great players in the past. I know I'll get flamed here but I can't help but wonder.
     
  8. cyoung

    cyoung Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    1,276
    Ratings:
    +2
    I think Green is more talented but I also want to praise Noah Herron.
     
  9. gopackgo

    gopackgo Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2006
    Messages:
    730
    Ratings:
    +0
    You would like to think it wouldn't. It doesn't really help when the team you play for is considered to be one of the worst. I really don't think the players are suffering because of wanting to be rich and just rest, though.
     
  10. warhawk

    warhawk Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2005
    Messages:
    1,922
    Ratings:
    +38
    Next wee will be a tougher test against the Dolphins. Another team we face that is pretty good against the run. We will need Green healthy for that one.

    Having said that we will need to find another answer at RB next year to see the run game reach it's full potential. I did like what little I saw from this Beech kid. He looked to be faster and more powerful than Herron.

    It's a shame he got hurt. I think he would be giving us some quality PT. Coming from Kentucky it's hard to know what potential he may have. Certainly the "0" line he was behind in the SEC was not equal to most of the competition in that league. He may be a sleeper.
     
  11. flapackfan

    flapackfan Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2006
    Messages:
    379
    Ratings:
    +0
    Green is fast for sure. He is the most talented rb we have had since ive been a packer fan over the last 15 years. That being said. If he fumbles, he needs to sit. I can live with Noah Herron doing what he did last weekend on a consistent basis as long as he holds on to the ball. Herron got like 115 yards. Green with the same carries would have probably had around 150 or so. But more than likely, he would have fumbled the ball away at least once giving up an easy score for the opposing team. Give Green another shot. But just one more. Fumbles happen, its a part of the game. But a two fumble game? Or two 2 fumble games in a row, and we need to cut his but like we did Caroll and just move on. Good luck Ahman and go Packers vs the Dolphins in 2 weeks. Im in south Florida and it will be my first live Packers game ever in 15 years of being a die hard Packer fan.
     
  12. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2006
    Messages:
    3,991
    Ratings:
    +0
    I think Green's done. I think he can a 3rd down RB and that's it for the rest of his career. I think Herron plays in the scheme better and because he's younger I think he'll give us that big play more often. Green I think is now way past his prime.
     
  13. agopackgo4

    agopackgo4 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2005
    Messages:
    1,365
    Ratings:
    +0
    Well he does have two bad hamstings. If you have ever had a hamstinrg injury(i have) it is not pleasent. it is impossibile to run. it truely is. if it is bad enough.
     
  14. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2005
    Messages:
    3,904
    Ratings:
    +1
    So porky, I'm not saying I disagree with you but why is our coaching staff still insisting he is the starting RB, especially when we are obviously trying to build for the future. Do you think they really feel Green has some football in him or do you think they have just pigeonholed Herron as a third down back?
     
  15. GakkofNorway

    GakkofNorway Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2005
    Messages:
    2,249
    Ratings:
    +0
    It's funny Depack,

    how you trust the coaching staff in this case but question them in almost every other.
     
  16. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2005
    Messages:
    3,904
    Ratings:
    +1
    Gakk why are you starting with me? I've criticized Schottenheimer and Sanders. I haven't ripped MM. It was a legit question and not directed at you.
     
  17. agopackgo4

    agopackgo4 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2005
    Messages:
    1,365
    Ratings:
    +0
    I personally think Green is not past his prime. I do think Herron is better though and gives us a better chance to win. He is quicker(or at least it seems) than Green. And thank god, someone actually went through a game without fumbleing!
     
  18. gopackgo

    gopackgo Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2006
    Messages:
    730
    Ratings:
    +0
    I somewhat agree. He has definitely peaked, but not past his prime. If he keeps up this injury rate, though, he might not be starting next year. Anywhere.
     
  19. cyoung

    cyoung Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    1,276
    Ratings:
    +2
    I want to see Green, Healthy and ready to play. I dont always get what I want, but I still think that we should make sure Green is 100% done its bad to waste his talent by benching him if he has some juice lft in him.
     
  20. umair

    umair Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2006
    Messages:
    923
    Ratings:
    +0
    herron did play good but he didnt play against a great run d. if green played against the rams. he would have had a much better game that harron.
     
  21. Cdnfavrefan

    Cdnfavrefan Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2006
    Messages:
    1,624
    Ratings:
    +0
    Just give me someone who can hang on to the ball. I don't care if a guy has 4.4 speed and can cut like Barry Sanders and gain 100 yards a game. If he loses the ball all that yardage is negated. Herron played great last game and most importantly didn't put us in a hole by losing the rock
     
  22. yooperfan

    yooperfan Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2004
    Messages:
    1,900
    Ratings:
    +0
    I agree, I think Green would have had an enormous day if he was totally healthy.
    But then in the back of my mind I think about the fumbling issue.

    I don't think Green should be considered #1 until he is absolutely healthy.
     

Share This Page