Another lost season in Rodgers prime

[Delsin Rowe]

As long as we have #12 I'll always have confidence.

 

[G0P4ckG0]

As long as we have #12 I'll always have confidence.

...when he's healthy.

 

[Delsin Rowe]

...when he's healthy.

Hey, as long as he's playing we have a shot.

 

[G0P4ckG0]

Hey, as long as he's playing we have a shot.

I disagree...I'll take a healthy Tolzien or Hundley over a really banged-up Rodgers, but to each his own. Rodgers is the best QB in the game when healthy, but he isn't Superman.

 

[ExpatPacker]

I disagree...I'll take a healthy Tolzien or Hundley over a really banged-up Rodgers, but to each his own. Rodgers is the best QB in the game when healthy, but he isn't Superman.

Rodgers is not without his flaws, and he's not always the best QB in the game. This year Brady and Carson Palmer are better -- so far. When things aren't going right it may be time to change a few things about how you approach the game. That may be the hurdle Rodgers needs to overcome. All QBs have their sacred cows, habits and ways of doing things, but sometimes you need a change.

Just thinking out loud. No serious evidence for what I'm saying naturally.

 

[OldSchool101]

I love Aaron, but sometimes if a QB isn't throwing accurately and is playing with an injured shoulder a week off is the best medicine both mentally and physically

 

[Poppa San]

I love Aaron, but sometimes if a QB isn't throwing accurately and is playing with an injured shoulder a week off is the best medicine both mentally and physically

I think they're looking towards the extra time off after the next game.

 

[Half Empty]

Hey, as long as he's playing we have a shot.

Have you watched the last few games?

 

[PackerDNA]

It was the same mantra during the Favre era; "A s long as they have Favre".....

 

[XPack]

Not quite agree with the OP, but I do get his frustration on 2 points;

Another season lost in Rodgers prime - Yes, I fully agree with 'grow and develop' tactics but right now with the league's most talented QB in his prime, we need some instant "big play" names. Something like what Reggie White did to Favre. If there was ever a time to go big on FA this and maybe next season is it.

Tight End - Sigh, yes. Nuff said.

 

[aristotle]

2nd and 10 runs on Thursday:
2nd and 10 at GB 15
(14:48 - 1st) (No Huddle) E.Lacy right tackle pushed ob at GB 44 for 29 yards (K.Fuller)
2nd and 10 at GB 12
(10:55 - 2nd) (No Huddle) E.Lacy right end to GB 27 for 15 yards (C.Prosinski). FUMBLES (C.Prosinski), RECOVERED by CHI-L.Houston at GB 34. L.Houston to GB 34 for no gain (J.Tretter)

Two big runs on 2nd and 10. Not sure where you are getting that running on 2nd and 10 is a bad thing. Yeah Lacy fumbled, but that doesn't mean the play call didn't work.

It is a league wide thing I cannot stand. It worked twice, that doesn't mean it's the right call. Many times they get stuffed and you are face with 3 rd and long

 

[aristotle]

What a HUGE disappointing loss.. No way we should have lost to the Bears on Favre's night. That team should have been above fired-up!! Not sure what's going on but they sure don't resemble the Packers that I have come to know. At least were still alive in the playoffs and maybe we can get it going down the stretch. I am always optimistic but the loss on Thanksgiving Night certainly reduced that optimism...

I totally agree with you. On Favre's night you would think this team would honor him with an *** whipping. Sure Aaron and MM say they are honored to play for the Packers, but I don't see that dedication in their play of sense of urgency here.
This team is not built to win on the road, and letting the top seed slip away in the last 5 weeks is why they will be an early exit in this years playoffs. Tick, tick, tick.....the years of Rodgers are slipping away

 

[Mondio]

It is a league wide thing I cannot stand. It worked twice, that doesn't mean it's the right call. Many times they get stuffed and you are face with 3 rd and long

and they got stuffed on 3rd and 1, more than once too. Maybe they should just try for 1st downs on 1st and 2nd to avoid 3rd down all together. Why can't they do that? They must suck

 

[TJV]

This is the worst year for this thread because I think it's obvious to almost all of us Rodgers himself is contributing to this "lost" season more than any other.

 

[ThePerfectBeard]

I'm still hopeful because like another poster said, "once you make the playoffs, all bet are off." This was certainly true of the 2010 team. A few things do need to change though. I agree that we don't seem to be playing with a fire lit under us. I don't know what it's all about, but it's noticeable.

Second, and I'm going to get flamed for this, but when a team is a draft and develop team, we need to draft better. We've had some pretty decent drafts and if you look at the defense, some of those that we thought were bust are now coming along. Datone and Perry are finally coming along. That being said, we can't have drafts like 2014. I know it's still early, but Bradford, Thorton, Goodson, and Richard Rodgers were bad picks. Granted it's early for **** Rod, but he's unbelievably slow. What's with the tight end screens to this guy anyway? Anyway, when most of your team is built through the draft you can't have a draft like 2014.

I know people are tired of me saying it and I know it's early in Davante's career, but this team would be in a completely different position if we selected Allen Robinson over him. Maybe it'll even out in the long run. I get that even professional scouts and the front office can't be perfect when drafting, but we need to do better.

 

[Ogsponge]

And IMO too many fans were Favre fans more than they were/are Packers fans and if that's the case IMO they aren't true Packers fans. And I did appreciate Favre until he became what I consider a traitor to the Packers organization - so I am no longer a Favre fan, because I'm a Packers fan.

I think your comment, "I like to debate about the team especially when there are such glaring problems" is a common theme with Favre fans. The Packers can go on a 10 game winning streak and they never show up here. But as soon as the team struggles they're here calling for Thompson's and McCarthy's jobs.

As to the rest of your post: I missed the part where McCarthy said the play calling was perfect.
Using terms like the holy trinity is another example of your bias, in spite of your protestations.
And who said Wolf and Holmgren weren't great? Looks like a straw man to me.

Since I don't want to debate about Favre (and never did as you were the one that brought it up which by the way is the very definition of a straw man argument). Did you actually want to discuss the information you asked for and I gave you or are you going to ignore that? Which for the record is a straw man argument, the very thing you accuse me of doing.

Yes McCarthy did not say he was perfect. He did however put every last bit of the blame on the players. You don't even have to read between the lines. He does not believe that himself nor the coaching staff are the problem at all. There is nothing wrong with scheme or play calling, it is all about the players execution.

So again, that is pretty arrogant even if he did not say he was perfect.

Could you explain to me how blaming everyone but yourself is not by definition, arrogant? I mean that is what you disagree with yes?

 

[LarrysCrookedFinger]

This team is not built to win on the road....

So what is the difference in a team that is built to win on the road and a team that isn't?

the years of Rodgers are slipping away

Top tier quarterbacks pretty routinely play well until they're about 40. Aaron is 31. He didn't start until he was almost 25. He probably has more than half of his career as a starter left barring something very unusual.

 

[FredR]

you can kiss this season goodbye. Sure, the Packers will make the playoffs but have no chance against the Panthers, Cardinals and maybe even the Giants. They have no passion right now. Until they get a legitimate TE who Aaron can use as a safety net, a possession receiver similar to the Patriots Edelman, they will not compete for a championship. Why are they not considering bringing back Joe Philbin. He was the offensive coordinator when they won the super bowl. Clements is awful and needs to go back to a position coach.
Devante Adams has regressed in his 2nd year and needs to be demoted behind Janis. This kid Janis is electric and could become a no. 3 receiver next year.
As far as the play calling goes, they need to establish a rhythm early with short high percentage plays such as screens and short passes. Also running on 2nd and 10 is a recipe for disaster.
Now to Rodgers....he is clearly not happy right now with his teammates and the play calling. He needs to step up and lead this team, which means telling MM what he wants and what he thinks will work.

Packers are in serious trouble!

Going into the season everyone knew the Packers achilles heel was their defense. But - the defense is tied for 6th in scoring defense (the most important defensive statistic) and the defense has allowed 18, 17 and 17 points in their last three games. This despite the offensive struggles and the defense on the field way too long.

Two of the Packers last three games have been losses - why - the offense has scored 16 (loss), 30 (win) and 13 (loss) points. A team quarterbacked by Aaron Rodgers cannot score!!!!!!!!!! And only the Vikings had a winning record in the last three games. Not being able to score against Detroit and Chicago is very disconcerting as these teams do not have power house defenses.

Some observations:

Even before the first loss to Denver, the offense has been struggling - struggling to run the ball and struggling to complete passes.

The loss of Jordy Nelson has been much bigger than anyone thought. The reason - speed. The remaining Packer receivers are (relatively) slow. This in itself is not necessarily crippling but as Denver has showed - these receivers cannot break past a tough man-on-man tight coverage. Any quarterback - including Rogers - is going to have a difficult time completing passes to receivers who are not get open on a consistent basis. And this is with Rogers being an outstanding quarterback for buying time and accuracy.

Packers do have a couple of wide receivers with speed (Ty Montgomery and Jared Abbrederis) but both are missing significant time due to injury. Their other speed receiver Jeff Janis (2nd yr player) still isn't consistent enough to have Roger's confidence. Also their tight end Richard Rogers has not yet demonstrated any consistent or clutch receiving.

Add to this the inconsistent running game and you have a team that struggles to put together long consistent scoring drives. A team that averaged 30 points a game last year. A team that if they could have hung on to the ball on a on-side kick would have gone to the Super Bowl.

Packers are at Detroit next Thursday night. Based upon these two teams performances Thursday, who is more likely to win next week?

Dark times in Packerland right now.

 

[Carl]

It is a league wide thing I cannot stand. It worked twice, that doesn't mean it's the right call. Many times they get stuffed and you are face with 3 rd and long

2nd and 10 at CHI 46
(9:13 - 1st) (No Huddle) A.Rodgers pass short right to R.Cobb to CHI 47 for -1 yards (B.Callahan)

2nd and 10 at GB 42
(8:45 - 4th) (No Huddle, Shotgun) A.Rodgers pass incomplete short left to R.Rodgers

Many time a pass results in nothing either. Can't guarantee a good play just by passing.

To say they should never run on 2nd and 10 just doesn't make sense.

 

[LarrysCrookedFinger]

He does not believe that himself nor the coaching staff are the problem at all. There is nothing wrong with scheme or play calling, it is all about the players execution.

Receivers have been open. Coaches can't throw the ball accurately. Coaches can't catch the ball. Players do, or "execute" those things. Those things haven't happened consistently since the bye week. If they did, we'd probably be about 9-2 right now. Coaches aren't wizards.

 

[captnroger]

Ain't nothing over till it's over, and playoff runs are often made in December.

 

[Ogsponge]

Receivers have been open. Coaches can't throw the ball accurately. Coaches can't catch the ball. Players do, or "execute" those things. Those things haven't happened consistently since the bye week. If they did, we'd probably be about 9-2 right now. Coaches aren't wizards.

And I have a agree with that sentiment but this coaching staff is not without flaws, they keep trotting out the same isolation routes week after week, they keep trotting out the same failing players week after week. This coaching staff is a big part of the problem as well, it is not all on the players.

 

[Carl]

Since I don't want to debate about Favre (and never did as you were the one that brought it up which by the way is the very definition of a straw man argument). Did you actually want to discuss the information you asked for and I gave you or are you going to ignore that? Which for the record is a straw man argument, the very thing you accuse me of doing.

Yes McCarthy did not say he was perfect. He did however put every last bit of the blame on the players. You don't even have to read between the lines. He does not believe that himself nor the coaching staff are the problem at all. There is nothing wrong with scheme or play calling, it is all about the players execution.

So again, that is pretty arrogant even if he did not say he was perfect.

Could you explain to me how blaming everyone but yourself is not by definition, arrogant? I mean that is what you disagree with yes?

What exactly is wrong with the scheme and play calling? Or what was wrong vs. the Bears that MM should have taken blame for?

 

[LarrysCrookedFinger]

Packers do have a couple of wide receivers with speed (Ty Montgomery and Jared Abbrederis) but both are missing significant time due to injury.

Abbrederis isn't fast. Cobb is faster and he's only slightly faster than Adams, who is slow. What Abbrederis has is fluidity. But injured is his norm and he's simply not a realistic part of the equation. I doubt he ever will be. Montgomery isn't fast either but he's built and runs like a running back.

Their other speed receiver Jeff Janis (2nd yr player) still isn't consistent enough to have Roger's confidence.

I'm buying this "trust" and "confidence" angle less and less. If Rodgers is so adamant about being able to trust his receivers, why the HELL does he keep throwing it at Adams?!

Also their tight end Richard Rogers has not yet demonstrated any consistent or clutch receiving.

I know a lot of people don't like him or think much of him, but Quarless helps this position immensely in the passing game.

 

[TJV]

Did you actually want to discuss the information you asked for and I gave you or are you going to ignore that? Which for the record is a straw man argument, the very thing you accuse me of doing.

Ignoring something is not a straw man argument; not commenting on something is no argument at all. (Perhaps you could post the definition of “straw man” in bolded large font? Of course that’d only be helpful to you.) I brought up your Favre-fandom because it shows your bias.

Yes McCarthy did not say he was perfect.

So you admit you exaggerated. Just like your “Holy Trinity” comment. And do you know which word’s definition those two things fit into? Yep, “exaggerating” (perfect) and “exaggerate one's own worth or importance often by an overbearing manner” (Holy Trinity) are parts of the definition of arrogant you posted. You look more arrogant to me than Thompson, McCarthy, or Rodgers.

Mondio detailed mistakes made by players, which reinforces what McCarthy said and you quote his post and write, “For the record I don't completely disagree with it either…” So you accuse McCarthy for being arrogant in saying something you don’t “completely disagree with”. You go on to say he shouldn’t trot out the same players that aren’t getting it done but that a “great coach does not throw his players under the bus in anyway, shape or form in public”. If he demotes Adams (as I wish he would) that is the most public rebuke of a player a coach can make, so again you seem confused IMO. And BTW, Mondio wrote a very reasoned response to that post of yours and you haven’t answered each and every point he made. Why not?! If you insist every point you make is worthy of being answered, why doesn’t that standard apply to others?

After the Bears game McCarthy said, "We're not getting it done in the classroom, we have to demand more as coaches, we have to make changes". After the 49ers game, regarding Barclay’s struggles in pass protection he said, “That’s something as a staff we can do a better job of.” If you watch his show or listen to his press conferences without an agenda you would know he frequently says the coaching staff has to do a better job. And, for example, if he thought the play calling was perfect, why would he and his staff do a self-scout?