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Why this draft made no sense at all

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Oannes, May 5, 2007.

  1. warhawk

    warhawk Cheesehead

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    Working hard is not nearly as important as being LUCKY enough to play next to ****** tacklers.

    I mean most of Jerry Rice's catches came after they bounced out of some other ****** receivers hands anyways. W all know that.

    I think if TT keeps it up and continues to put guys like Woodson, Jenkins, Harrell, and of course leave Barnett in the middle, Hawk will make All Pro this year EASY with all those ****** guys around him.
     
  2. MassPackersFan

    MassPackersFan Cheesehead

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    It's gonna help with his blitzing too. I'm pretty sure his 3.5 sacks came on plays where the O-line was busy chuckling at our down pass rushers.
     
  3. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    Me.......i only hope Hawk does good because he's a WHITE guy. And i was GLAD that he passed Barnett in tackles, cause he's black. :roll:
    (End sarcasm)
    To me, if he's a Packer player, who the hell CARES what color his skin is?
    I think Hawk had a very good rookie season, and met or passed the goals I set for him. Was he perfect? No. But for a rook, i think he handled himself VERY well.
    So TT has put a big man (Harrell) on the D line. You think that will HURT the LB's? I think it opens up LOTS of possibilities. Heck, if our D can improve alot, that should take the pressure off our O. They won't have to feel like that HAVE to score EVERY time in order to stay in the game.
    Would you say the Bears got where they did last year because of their great offense?
     
  4. Packnic

    Packnic Cheesehead

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    2006 SEASON LB Stats according to NFL.com

    AJ Hawk - Int 2, FF 1, FR 2, Pass Defl. 8, SACKS 3.5

    Brian Urlacher - Int 3, FF 1, FR 1 Pass Defl. 9 Sacks, 0


    what a crappy non game changing player. wish we would have drafted that defensive player that was better than him in that draft... it was a stupid move. We are a crappy organization and the players we have are garbage players and will never get better.. just worse.
     
  5. MassPackersFan

    MassPackersFan Cheesehead

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    We all know how Favre has played the last few years when the team is down and he feels he has to push. A really good defense is probably one of the best things we could do to improve Brett's play.
     
  6. MassPackersFan

    MassPackersFan Cheesehead

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    Seriously. Even for a rookie, you'd think AJ would know he should focus on one thing. I mean, do you want to be a blitzing LB or a ball hawking LB? Or a team leading tackling LB? Make up your mind!!! Mediocre at best... this "jack of all trades", "well balanced player" thing never works. Give me a workout warrior who shot up 2 rounds at the combine any day of the week.
     
  7. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

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    Agreed... Just hope the players in place at RB, TE, & WR (excluding Driver, he already has) step it up and stay Healthy. ... crossing 10 fingers and 5 toes :)
     
  8. Packnic

    Packnic Cheesehead

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    see what i did there... I made a statement that has no facts to back it up (in fact the stats above it prove it wrong) but then i stated it very condesending and stated it as fact... and now your supposed to be negative and believe me.
    see i can do it too.
     
  9. Bertram

    Bertram Cheesehead

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    I think Thompson's draft was really nice. The Packers organisation now consist of many people that were around when we were a really good team and won the Superbowl, and I see them trying to do many of the things we did back then.

    We had a great defense where the backbone of it was our defensive line. Thompson is building a very good defensive line with very good linebackers behind them and one of the top CB duos in the league. If our safeties could step up this could be one of the best defensive units in the league.

    I see some people here judge the performance of DTs on their sack count and that Corey Williams had only an average season because he "only" had 7 sacks. Well, Gilbert Brown had 7 sacks in his entire career.

    I've also heard some grumbling about us running a max protection scheme with only two wideouts and two blocking TEs. In the 90's we were doing that a lot too and it was very succesfull.

    Next season I think we will see a Packers team with a decent offense, able to move the chains and score more points than in the past two seasons with a great defense being the backbone of the team.

    However we lack some of that pivotal quality depth. Who's going to play DE if one of our starters go down, who's going to play LB if one of our starters go down, who's going to play CB if one of our starters go down. This is where I believe we should have struck some deals in the free agency.
     
  10. MassPackersFan

    MassPackersFan Cheesehead

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    Yeah. I'm not too worried about Jackson/Morency. They'll get their yards and catches out of the backfield. TE... eh... a little more worried. The wildcard I think is Jennings. It's his 2nd year and he needs to step up and show he is a dangerous #2 WR who was only slowed down last year by his ankle.
     
  11. Arles

    Arles Cheesehead

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    We currently have Kampman, KGB, Jenkins and Corey Williams all capable of playing DE. That's a pretty solid group.

    I'm guessing our backups will be Hodge, Tracy White and Bishop. That's solid and Hodge looks like he could develop into a solid pro.

    This all depends on the oft-injured young guys. If someone like Dendy could step up after Harris, Woodson and Walker - I think we will be OK. If not, we won't have much depth.

    I think our biggest issues are at safety, TE and 3rd WR. Maybe a healthy Underwood and Rouse can handle safety, but I wouldn't mind seeing 3 vets brought in for those spots. I like we are OK at DE (moving Jenkins fulltime) and LB after the draft.
     
  12. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    First......WELCOMR Bertram!
    I'm not worried yet. There still is time before the season starts to address some of those problems.
     
  13. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

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    Agreed, we have limited depth on D, especially at LB's. On the D line... Jenkins has proved he can hold his own on the DE, so you have three starter quality DE. Plus I think Williams could slide outside and fill in. Secondary, Walker is an underated move. Maybe a little too physical.. thinking the same thing, not another Carroll. Safety is a concern with starters let alone depth.

    The offense is the side where the concern lies. Let's say the combination of Morency and Jackson are effective. Can they stay healthy, neither has proven they can. Herron needs to develop. FB, again can he stay healthy as a starter, and the whom is a backup? Either rook or a TE?

    At WR, I think we have enough bodies if Krob can come back mid season. I would like another veteran out there, but carrying 6 or maybe 7 recievers, do we have room for another veteran assumming the Krob, Driver and Jennings have spots locked?

    TE, somehow I think we will see a more imvolved Bubba, will he stretch the field, probably not, but I expect a better year. Lee is under-rated in my book, and I think we will be surprised by the rookie Clark.

    On the line, we pray that the Tackles stay healthy, otherwise IMO we are in trouble. But overall I hope this unit makes the most improvement.

    But overall depth or the lack of proven depth is a concern, even at starters in some positions.
     
  14. Oannes

    Oannes Cheesehead

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    Nick Barnett's tackle numbers were the LOWEST of his NFL career with Hawk at Weakside LB. That's right...LOWEST. Nick Barnett should improve his numbers if a MLB is the focus of the defense with a great Weakside backer. Please, explain to me how MLB is the focus of our scheme and make it fit with the fact Barnett had 105 tackles last year...7 tackles lower than his rookie year. This D is set up for Hawk to make plays. We picked him 5th game him a ton of coin and expect him to tear it up. He did a nice job but not spectacular.

    If we added a stud like Randy Moss to the WR corps would you expect Favre's numbers to drop, or improve? With Randy they should've improved. The same applies to Barnett's numbers... With Hawk next to him his numbers should've improved...they dropped. Is it because Hawk is better, or because Hawk is in a taylored position to make the bulk of the plays. I think the answer is obvious but I'm sure I'll here strong rebuttals as to why AJ Hawk is the best thing going.

    Take off the green and gold glasses for one minute when comparing Hawk's rookie year to Urlacher's. Urlacher became an endorsement poster child because of his awesome impact as a rookie. Are people lining up to use Hawk in advertisements? No. Why? He was a solid, but not flashy, player like Urlacher was. Deal with reality of how each performed in their rookie seasons. If you really need to believe Hawk had the impact of Urlacher you're certainly entitled to it. Everyone who watches football outside of Packer fans will tell you the Brian Urlacher took the scene by storm. AJ Hawk did no such thing. It isn't even a debate but people will continue arguing. I'm waiting for the next argument about how Greg Jennings had a more impactful rookie season than Anquan Boldin.
     
  15. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    Who the hell cares?!?!
    Urlacher is Urlacher!
    How many LB's have stepped in and did what he has done?
    The guy is a freak of nature. Why don't you compare Hawk to what other LB's have done their first season?
    Thats like comparing every QB to Favre, and if they arn't as great as him, they are nothing.
     
  16. warhawk

    warhawk Cheesehead

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  17. Oannes

    Oannes Cheesehead

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    I have simply compared AJ Hawk's rookie season to Brian Urlacher's rookie season. Nothing more, nothing less. Why does that upset you? Urlacher was a more impactful rookie and to debate that is just plain silly.

    Do you want to compare AJ to others? Look at Ernie Sims in Detroit and Demeco Ryans in Houston. Since the fans of Hawk are using tackling numbers as validation as to why he's the impact player, that he really isn't, take a look at Sims and Ryan's numbers...both are better. Demeco Ryans is light years ahead of Hawk in tackling numbers and he went in Round 2.

    Brian Urlacher completely changed the Bears defense. AJ Hawk did NOT do that for the Packer defense. Urlacher is more of freak than Hawk. I hate the Bears, but can't deny Bear Brian is a better player, now, and was better as a rookie.
     
  18. Bertram

    Bertram Cheesehead

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    You don't suppose that our overall defensive tackle count went down because the opponents offense had less posession of the ball than previous years. Our defense has been our weak link for several years now and the opponents have had the ball more. I think we improved last season and our offense had the ball more often because our defense managed to create important turnovers and stop the opponents offense dead.

    So actually if our defense and offense becomes even better, look for the number of tackles to go down. AJ Hawk was extremely important to us last season, he and the linebacker corp developed into a solid unit.

    Lombardi always said he would take the solid player whom gave everything he had always rather than the great player who didn't give everything he had all the time. The only way we can become a good team is by adding solid players at all positions. Of course we need some great players as well, but Hawk was a solid player as a rookie and might become a great as he develops.

    Greg Jennings showed he can play, unfortunatly he was injured. I will be looking for him to have an 800 - 900 yard season, if he's better at this point than I think it is he could surprise us with a 1000 yard season.
     
  19. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

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  20. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    Thats what i was saying.......Urlacher is a freak. To compare Hawk to him isn't fair. You are holding Hawk to a level that is not normal.
    You are belittling what Hawk has done, and my opinion is that he was VERY good for a rookie. Maybe not "Superman", but i think he had an excellent rookie campaign.
    Yes, Urlacher was a better rookie then Hawk.
    So what is the point of your argument then? That TT sucked because Hawk wasn't Urlacher as a rookie?
    You keep comparing them, as if there is some importance to it. I'm just trying to figure out why.
     
  21. Oannes

    Oannes Cheesehead

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    93z... Lombardi would've loved Urlacher. Urlacher lays it all on the line just as much as AJ Hawk. He has more skill than Hawk. If anyone has any recordings of draft programs, or has any draft guides, look and see how AJ rated compared to Urlacher. There wasn't one thing ever said about AJ being more athletic than Urlacher, because Urlacher is more athletic than Hawk. Could Hawk play safety? Urlacher sure could've. The only thing Hawk had going over Urlacher coming out of school is that he went to a better program and that is it. As a prospect, Urlacher was the much more impressive of the two. Why is that so hard to believe? Just because Urlacher is a Bear and Hawk is a Packer? If Hawk was a Bronco and Urlacher was a Seahawk, you wouldn't even be arguing AJ Hawk's case.

    Cheesey... Again, I love AJ Hawk. He's just not in Urlacher's league like some have argued. My argument is that Hawk should've had more impact than he did for being a 5th overall pick. Urlacher was 9th overall and his impact dwarfed Hawk's. That is all I'm saying. I'm glad we have AJ. I'm just tired of the Packer fans who think because Hawk is one of ours he's better than he actually is. Thank you for admitting Urlacher was a better rookie....that is all I was saying and no one would admit it. All I got were stats and silly arguments about how AJ was on the same level as Urlacher as a rook and that is simply untrue.
     
  22. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

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    LOL.. everyone is saying the same thing here I think... just emotions are in the way again... He had a rock solid rookie campaign and hopefully will take another step. THE POTENTIAL IS THERE :)
     
  23. MassPackersFan

    MassPackersFan Cheesehead

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    There's really no good way to compare a rookie LB to a 7 year starter. At least not for a number of years.
     
  24. Bertram

    Bertram Cheesehead

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    It's impossible to say much about Hawk because he has only played one season. We don't know what he will develop into but we know at this point that Hawk is a solid player.
     
  25. Oannes

    Oannes Cheesehead

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    Ugh. The comparison is apples to apples not apples to oranges.... I am comparing HAWK AND URLACHER AS....ROOKIES. No comparison. Urlacher was the better of the two. No argument.

    Hawk is a solid player who should get better. Why is this such a hassle?
     

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