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What number will Malcolm Jenkins wear for the Packers?

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by freefromwhatyouare, Feb 24, 2009.

  1. GreenMan69

    GreenMan69 Cheesehead

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    I'll use my first post to say I hope the Pack sign Igor Olshansky, and draft Everette Brown to both fit the new 3-4 scheme.

    Igor Pickett Jenkins
    Kampman Hawk Barnett Brown


    Yes, please.
     
  2. A. Rodgers

    A. Rodgers Cheesehead

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    that would help since more than half of the teams they play dont have that great of lines
     
  3. freefromwhatyouare

    freefromwhatyouare Cheesehead

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    You don't draft players out of need. You pick out of need and you lose your job.

    More so even when you are talking about a top ten pick.

    From now on I'll take the high road and stay away from stuff like this.

    peaCe
     
  4. Jess

    Jess Movement!

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    So if Matthew Stafford falls to us we take him because he's the best player available and the fact that we don't need a QB doesn't factor in?

    There's always some sort of need factored in to a pick. If the draft was solely done on taking the best available player, Brady Quinn would be a Packer right now, but we didn't need a QB. We had Favre, we had Rodgers, so we took Justin Harrell instead, a guy who clearly wasn't the best player available. Picking based completely on need will result in reaches, but need is always a factor.
     
  5. Spanish Rose

    Spanish Rose Cheesehead

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    Fixed
     
  6. freefromwhatyouare

    freefromwhatyouare Cheesehead

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    Jess,

    Who said Matthew Stafford was even on Ted's board? I know he wasn't high on him. Just because many mock drafts have Stafford going first doesn't mean he's the best player in the draft.

    You take the best player available on board at the time of of your pick. It has been proven many times that when you pick based solely on need you wind up regretting it. Many a GM has lost their job doing that (Mike Sherman and many others)

    I have Malcolm Jenkins as the best player in this draft. That's my opinion nothing more nothing less. I feel he will have the best pro-career out of ANY of the players in this draft. Only time will tell if I am right. The past three years of watching him play and practice prove to me I have more chance of being right than wrong.

    Also keep in mind that the Packers would not have Aaron Rodgers if Ted picked based on "need"
     
  7. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    I agree with you most of the time, man, but I can't this time.
    You need to balance both, Need and Evaluation. Picking only one is the recipe for failure.
    About Rodgers, when you have a QB threatening to retire every year, you need a backup QB. It was both a need and a value, because before the draft Rodgers was seen as a 1# pick...
    About CB, if TT thinks the same as you, and if you're right, then it would be the pick, because CB can be a need in the future.
    But I don't see that margin of distance between Jenkins and the other guys. Actually, Jenkins isn't even my top defensive player...
     
  8. freefromwhatyouare

    freefromwhatyouare Cheesehead

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    A draft board is made of many different things.

    Your top players at every position is one.

    You don't list players you don't like and thus a player like Stafford wouldn't even be considered in Green Bay as he wouldn't make it on the board. So saying picking the best player available might get Green Bay Matthew Stafford is ridiculous.

    In picking Aaron Rodgers Ted took the best player available on his board at the time. Ted himself has said many many times "I will always take the best player available" and his drafts have proven this.

    You "evaluate" players before you put them on a board. So that process is done by draft day. "need" doesn't factor in as you may take a player you don't need at the moment but will blossom into a impact starter in a couple years.

    I think a lot of fans think of drafts as you would a fantasy draft. In a fantasy draft you do indeed draft players out of "need"

    I think Ted said it once but I'll repeat it "this is not fantasy football"
     
  9. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    No man. In fantasy you draft WR, RB and QB, 2, 3 of each.
    Like I said, you have to balance both. If you completely disregard Need than you are MATT MILLEN...
     
  10. WoodyG

    WoodyG Cheesehead

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    Watching a player practice & play in a college setting can't be equated to the NFL. I'm sure that Jenkins was the 'star on campus' his entire career at OS. However, the NFL is a whole new level of dedication, skill & learning. Everyone's faster, stronger & smarter.

    Too be so high on one player because you saw him numerous times from the sideline could lead to major disappointment. Jenkins will fall into the 20-30 range & may very well have to learn the ropes for a year or two before even starting in the NFL. It's not unusual. The transition from college to the NFL is greater than most realize.
     
  11. freefromwhatyouare

    freefromwhatyouare Cheesehead

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    The draft is indeed a risky venture. There are no "sure things" and that has been proven time and time again. You can however see players that have all the tools and smarts to be successful at the next level.

    I've seen a lot of college players in my day and many CB's including Champ and Charles and thought they would be great pro's. I was right. What I've seen from Malcolm is a combo of the shut-down corner that Champ was/is and the smarts and pure talent that Charles had and has.

    I'm not saying he is the second coming of Christ. But he is the best CB I've seen come out since Champ Bailey and I think that will translate well to the NFL. He has all the tools and smarts to be succesful at the next level. Is he a "sure thing"? He is as close as I've seen in a long time.

    I also will put up ANY amount of money to prove wrong whoever said he will last 'till 20 or later in the first. Care to put cash where your mouth is on that?
     
  12. c_mac

    c_mac Cheesehead

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    Great question. Remember Justin Harrell? DT was one of the last things we needed in that draft yet TT took a DT anyway. Granted, it would be nice to have a good one now but at the time we were loaded at DT.
     
  13. WoodyG

    WoodyG Cheesehead

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    I have very little money so any cash transaction is out.

    I'll concede your knowledge about Jenkins as being superior to mine. However, I'm afraid you'll never see him in a Packer uniform.

    Another interesting thought: Will Jenkins even be the 1st DB taken in the draft? Some no longer think that he will be. This could really screw up your April 25th. :devil:
     
  14. Jess

    Jess Movement!

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    We needed a replacement for Favre. Favre was in his twilight, we needed someone to step in when he retired.

    Exactly.
     
  15. A. Rodgers

    A. Rodgers Cheesehead

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    i would say take Cushing or maybe Orakbo in 1st round, because they probably won't stay on the board for too long.

    get you OT and OG players in the 3rd and later, because there will probably be some good players still on the board at those positions.
     
  16. freefromwhatyouare

    freefromwhatyouare Cheesehead

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    I would love to see him wear the green and gold but where ever Jenks ends up I am confident he will be a very good player.

    My draft day won't be "screwed up" by anything you say. Sorry. If you get some joy out of Jenkins not going high in the draft or to someone else besides the Packers that's on you and I won't disrupt your fun.

    Jess,

    Are you trying to tell me that Ted Thompson picks out of need when you need to prove your point? Or should we listen to Ted and his history of drafting here to tell us that he picks the best player available on his board on draft day. He doesn't pick out of need. If there were to be 2 players at the same level on the board in any given round then you would choose between the 2 based on position.

    Best player available is how Ted works.

    I think I'll listen to Ted when he says he doesn't pick out of need.

    Some here are now so set on posting crap to try and prove me wrong that they end up looking foolish in the attempt.
     
  17. Jess

    Jess Movement!

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    I'm not going to lie, I enjoy contradicting you simply because you seem to think you're so much smarter than everyone here.

    That sentence right there says that need is factored into his picks just a bit. Early in a draft, you're always going to have players on your board that are graded out basically the same. Heck, for the entire draft you're going to have players who grade out the same, and that's when you pick one based on need. Like it or not, need for a player has to play a factor, otherwise you'll end up taking a player that will be buried on the bench because he's in a position of depth instead of taking someone who will help your team win right away.

    TT probably takes the best player available at a position of need, no matter what he tells the public. And i'll give him this, that's absolutely the right strategy to build a winner.
     
  18. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    Exaclty, that's what I'm trying to say. Unless you have a player that's way above everybody else, you build a strategy based on the quality of the players from the positions you think are needed. EX.: You take Cushing at 1st instead of Raji because you think he's more valuable. Also, you think that Brace will fall to your second, and think he has more quality than Matthews. (I actually think that, but it's an example. Don't know about Cushing being better than Raji, but I think Cushing + Brace is better than Raji + Matthews)
    If you think the later rounds will complete your starting lineup, then you can take a guy that's not an urgent need, but I personally don't think that's the case, and don't see Jenkins so above everybody else...
     
  19. freefromwhatyouare

    freefromwhatyouare Cheesehead

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    I'm amused some get enjoyment out of trying to contradict me. Whatever gets you off I suppose.

    Jess,

    I do not however think I'm "smarter" than everyone here. That would be on you since you brought it up you may indeed be thinking it but not I.

    My point being Mike Sherman was a pick by need type of draft day guy. How did he do? Taking punters high in drafts and etc doesn't work too well.

    You think you know how Ted drafts but I'm not sure you have ever spoken to him. You say he lies "to the public" and does indeed draft by need because that is what you need to "prove me wrong". I'm not trying to say I'm better than you here but I have spoken to him personally and that's as much as I'll say about that.

    peaCe

    p.s. Have fun trying to prove me wrong. It hasn't worked yet. haha
     
  20. Spanish Rose

    Spanish Rose Cheesehead

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    i see what you are trying to say but it does not make any sense whatsoever.. if you choose based on what is on the board at the time then if stafford is there you pick him over orakpo, brown, raji, jenkins ect.. but what you stated before was "who says stafford is on ted's board anyway", but in what your saying stafford should be on ted's board because he is "the best player in the draft" and if he is there at the time he should be drafted.. if he isnt on teds board it is because he is not NEEDED so in essence you do pick out of NEED not just on what is on the board
     
  21. freefromwhatyouare

    freefromwhatyouare Cheesehead

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    Who says "Stafford is the best player in the draft"? I certainly never said that so I'm not sure who you are quoting there. He may be on some peoples board as that, but I can say with fact that not everyone shares that opinion. Myself included.

    Ted has stated publicly many times that he drafts with a BPA mentality. You can argue what YOU feel is a better way to go about a draft but can't argue with facts.
     
  22. Spanish Rose

    Spanish Rose Cheesehead

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    im not saying you think stafford is the best player in the draft i was merely using that as an example because i do not believe he is either but according to how you believe tt drafts if ted had the first overall pick he would choose stafford because he is the BPA.. why are the lions projected to get stafford at 1.. according to your theory is because he is the BPA not because they need a qb.. i do not care was TT says about the way he draft and im not giving my opinion on how one should draft.. its a fact that you draft with your needs in mind not solely based on BPA.. Need is a huge factor in the decision..another example is if crabtree is avaliable and so is orakpo you pick crabtree because he is the BPA regardless that we have 4 really good recievers.. doesnt make sense to me
     
  23. freefromwhatyouare

    freefromwhatyouare Cheesehead

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    The Lions may have Stafford number 1 on their board. They may not. We don't know this. Ted may have Stafford #1. He may not. We don't know this.

    You say TT would take Stafford first based on what? BPA? WHO SAID Ted thinks he is the best player available? Ted says he drafts with a BPA mentality if you don't agree with his way of drafting it doesn't mean he doesn't draft that way.

    If Ted thought Crabtree was the BPA at #9 then he would draft him based on his record of drafting and what he has said. If he could be the top WR in the NFL would you not want him on the Packers? Who cares how many WRs you have you don't pick talent based on "need". You can pick based on need but it's been proven many many times that those that do don't last long in the NFL.
     
  24. Spanish Rose

    Spanish Rose Cheesehead

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    i agree with you to some extent but the only reason why crabtree and stafford wouldnt be on ted's board is because they are of no need.. they are clearly the best players coming out of college so why wouldnt they be on ted's list.. simply because the packers would have no need for them on the team
     
  25. freefromwhatyouare

    freefromwhatyouare Cheesehead

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    You say they are "clearly the best players coming out of college" YOUR OPINION!

    I don't think this and many others I deal with don't either.

    Did you ever think that maybe Ted doesn't agree with you either?

    Ted has said publicly OVER and OVER that he drafts with a BPA mentality. That is FACT. It can not be argued.
     

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