Studs and duds KC

milani

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
Messages
4,239
Reaction score
1,530
I've always believed a new QB needs at least two years sitting, and learning, so they don't lose their confidence. It isn't always the most talented QB who is the best one on the field. It's quite often the smartest one, who knows how to move the team, despite not being as good as the other guy. A prime example is Bart Starr. He was a fairly accurate passer, but most of all, he knew how to insure the Packers were all on the same page, play after play. It's called "leadership," and it isn't something the new kid on the block automatically can step in and offer. It takes time, and patience, getting there.

The problem, in today's game, is that if you don't win it all this year as a coach, you're in serious danger of being fired. So, they throw the kids to the wolves, and it's either sink or swim, from day one. Because of it, way too many fail miserably. When the self confidence, almost bordering on arrogance, is gone, so is that little margin of difference between them being a really good QB, and one who isn't going to be around too long.
Brock Purdy may not have gotten his chances had it not been for injuries. But he got going pretty early on with a great team. Kaepernick got the same opportunity and did well until the team around him was dismantled.
 

milani

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
Messages
4,239
Reaction score
1,530
Also why the gory years of the 70's & 80's happened. Word on the street was the board members kept trying to run the team and not the franchise. Bob Harlan put a stop to that when he took over.
We could have used some impatience back then.
 

GBkrzygrl

Cheesehead
Joined
Apr 6, 2012
Messages
777
Reaction score
243
Officiating was an unimaginable dud. There were 4, count them 4 egregiously bad calls on the last drive, 3 of them benefitting the Chiefs.

1 - The bogus personal foul on Owens, obviously

2 - Line judge egregiously calling for the clock to stop when MVS had his forward progress clearly stopped in the field of play.

3 - The Rice overturned non-fumble should have resulted in a 10 second clock runoff AND the clock being run before the snap. Again, an egregious oversight by the officiating crew.

4 - Finally, the missed PI, which, not for nothing, would have never had a chance to be called anyway if 2 and 3 had been called correctly.
I totally agree. But you have to admit that when they didn't call PI on Valentine for him climbing up the back of that player was major in our favor.
 

milani

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
Messages
4,239
Reaction score
1,530
I totally agree. But you have to admit that when they didn't call PI on Valentine for him climbing up the back of that player was major in our favor.
Sometimes wonder if it was a makeup non-call. Refs were hoping for a no controversy last 2 minutes so they could jump on the plane and relax.
 

AmishMafia

Cheesehead
Joined
Sep 27, 2010
Messages
7,397
Reaction score
2,496
Location
PENDING
^^^^^^THIS

Don't assume the goal is to always kick as deep as you can. Some teams are better than others on kick returns and the Chiefs are not particularly good in that regard. It makes perfect sense that Rich would want those kicks shorter to force them to return and be tackled short of the 25.
The perfect kick, IMHO, is high and lands around the 15. The extra hang time and shorter distance is enough to have a couple of tacklers ready to hit the returner or grab a muff. I'm thinking you will an average starting field position around the 20. 5 better than the normal touchback.
 

AmishMafia

Cheesehead
Joined
Sep 27, 2010
Messages
7,397
Reaction score
2,496
Location
PENDING
Sometimes wonder if it was a makeup non-call. Refs were hoping for a no controversy last 2 minutes so they could jump on the plane and relax.
Lol. Maybe. They might have been getting cold and wanted nothing to do with overtime.
 

milani

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
Messages
4,239
Reaction score
1,530
The perfect kick, IMHO, is high and lands around the 15. The extra hang time and shorter distance is enough to have a couple of tacklers ready to hit the returner or grab a muff. I'm thinking you will an average starting field position around the 20. 5 better than the normal touchback.
Some teams would trade that 5 or 6 yards simply to avoid possible injury because many ST players are position players as well. On the other side return teams let it go so they tend to get called for holding on the return.
 

El Guapo

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 7, 2011
Messages
6,250
Reaction score
1,675
Location
Land 'O Lakes
Their official statement after the game, was that they didn't see anything that materially impeded MVS' ability to go for the ball. I don't think that anyone believes that, but it was their official statement:

You must be logged in to see this image or video!
 

AmishMafia

Cheesehead
Joined
Sep 27, 2010
Messages
7,397
Reaction score
2,496
Location
PENDING
Some teams would trade that 5 or 6 yards simply to avoid possible injury because many ST players are position players as well. On the other side return teams let it go so they tend to get called for holding on the return.
Didn't consider injury risk. No teams do it, so it must not be a good idea for some reason and injury risk could be it.
 

El Guapo

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 7, 2011
Messages
6,250
Reaction score
1,675
Location
Land 'O Lakes
Officiating was an unimaginable dud. There were 4, count them 4 egregiously bad calls on the last drive, 3 of them benefitting the Chiefs.

1 - The bogus personal foul on Owens, obviously

2 - Line judge egregiously calling for the clock to stop when MVS had his forward progress clearly stopped in the field of play.

3 - The Rice overturned non-fumble should have resulted in a 10 second clock runoff AND the clock being run before the snap. Again, an egregious oversight by the officiating crew.

4 - Finally, the missed PI, which, not for nothing, would have never had a chance to be called anyway if 2 and 3 had been called correctly.
In all fairness, #5 on the list should be the non-call on the hail mary throw. Now I personally believe that what we conclusively learned from the Fail Mary game is that officials pretty much let anything go (in the endzone) on hail mary plays. However, from a Chiefs perspective, #5 should be on the list of grievences as well.

I think that a no-call was correct, but it should be on the list.
 

Schultz

Cheesehead
Joined
Mar 8, 2021
Messages
2,862
Reaction score
1,631
Officiating was an unimaginable dud. There were 4, count them 4 egregiously bad calls on the last drive, 3 of them benefitting the Chiefs.

1 - The bogus personal foul on Owens, obviously

2 - Line judge egregiously calling for the clock to stop when MVS had his forward progress clearly stopped in the field of play.

3 - The Rice overturned non-fumble should have resulted in a 10 second clock runoff AND the clock being run before the snap. Again, an egregious oversight by the officiating crew.

4 - Finally, the missed PI, which, not for nothing, would have never had a chance to be called anyway if 2 and 3 had been called correctly.
Could somebody please explain this run off I keep reading on here. Strictly from watching football games I see run offs occur when a team with no timeouts do something to stop the clock. An injury, intentional grounding, purposely fumble out of bounds. KC did nothing that would have stopped the clock. They reset the ball and the clock ran. Now if you want to say the ref was too slow to wind the clock, I could see that. Please enlighten me on this runoff. What am I missing. Thanks in advance. P.S. I totally agree with 1,2 & 4.
 

milani

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
Messages
4,239
Reaction score
1,530
In all fairness, #5 on the list should be the non-call on the hail mary throw. Now I personally believe that what we conclusively learned from the Fail Mary game is that officials pretty much let anything go (in the endzone) on hail mary plays. However, from a Chiefs perspective, #5 should be on the list of grievences as well.

I think that a no-call was correct, but it should be on the list.
It should but historically on Hail Marys nothing is called unless it is egregious and that means obviously extreme and probably a foul other than pass interference. Now on that scenario the league is consistent and teams understand that. On the MVS play that probably gets called in the 2nd quarter. Before the famous Rodgers Hail Mary there was the foul on Detroit the previous play which many Lion fans argue should have been let go. It may not have been a face mask but it was unnecessary roughness. Had Rodgers been a big guy like Daniel Jones the defender does not have the leverage to reach or pull the collar and the QB does not go down.
But even on the famous Rodgers Hail Mary pass interference could have been called on both sides as is usually the case when you get down to it.
 

Schultz

Cheesehead
Joined
Mar 8, 2021
Messages
2,862
Reaction score
1,631
I've always believed a new QB needs at least two years sitting, and learning, so they don't lose their confidence. It isn't always the most talented QB who is the best one on the field. It's quite often the smartest one, who knows how to move the team, despite not being as good as the other guy. A prime example is Bart Starr. He was a fairly accurate passer, but most of all, he knew how to insure the Packers were all on the same page, play after play. It's called "leadership," and it isn't something the new kid on the block automatically can step in and offer. It takes time, and patience, getting there.

The problem, in today's game, is that if you don't win it all this year as a coach, you're in serious danger of being fired. So, they throw the kids to the wolves, and it's either sink or swim, from day one. Because of it, way too many fail miserably. When the self confidence, almost bordering on arrogance, is gone, so is that little margin of difference between them being a really good QB, and one who isn't going to be around too long.
I agree that patience is at an all time low for coaches due to the job security issue. IMO another contributing factor to rookie QBs playing is that the game is so catered to offense, specifically the passing game and the fact that there are not 32 good NFL QBs out there.
 

milani

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
Messages
4,239
Reaction score
1,530
Their official statement after the game, was that they didn't see anything that materially impeded MVS' ability to go for the ball. I don't think that anyone believes that, but it was their official statement:

You must be logged in to see this image or video!
This new " material restriction " is a " new " one on me. Never heard of it before. Either there is interference or not against the defender or the receiver or coincidental contact which negates anything.
 

milani

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
Messages
4,239
Reaction score
1,530
In all fairness, #5 on the list should be the non-call on the hail mary throw. Now I personally believe that what we conclusively learned from the Fail Mary game is that officials pretty much let anything go (in the endzone) on hail mary plays. However, from a Chiefs perspective, #5 should be on the list of grievences as well.

I think that a no-call was correct, but it should be on the list.
What I would say is that we listen to Mahommes on the post game. He was not crying about the INT. He referenced that the defender got there a little early but he understood how that gets judged. In other words he sees his team getting in the same situations on defense and does not want to see that get called on his team as well. Pretty professional response on his part.
 

BrokenArrow

Cheesehead
Joined
Jan 14, 2017
Messages
2,928
Reaction score
1,356
Their official statement after the game, was that they didn't see anything that materially impeded MVS' ability to go for the ball. I don't think that anyone believes that, but it was their official statement
It's a moot point anyway. If they were going to get it right on that play it should have been offsetting penalties and replaying the down, not first down at the 15 yard line.
 

El Guapo

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 7, 2011
Messages
6,250
Reaction score
1,675
Location
Land 'O Lakes
What I would say is that we listen to Mahommes on the post game. He was not crying about the INT. He referenced that the defender got there a little early but he understood how that gets judged. In other words he sees his team getting in the same situations on defense and does not want to see that get called on his team as well. Pretty professional response on his part.
Travis Kelce on the non-call in the endzone: "I ain't gonna blame this on anybody but ourselves..."
 

milani

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
Messages
4,239
Reaction score
1,530
Travis Kelce on the non-call in the endzone: "I ain't gonna blame this on anybody but ourselves..."
Most champion teams rarely put the blame on referees or on one call.
 

BrokenArrow

Cheesehead
Joined
Jan 14, 2017
Messages
2,928
Reaction score
1,356
Travis Kelce on the non-call in the endzone: "I ain't gonna blame this on anybody but ourselves..."
They're being "classy" about it because they know they got a free 15 yards and 2-3 extra plays at the end of the game.
 

adambr2

Cheesehead
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
4,013
Reaction score
609
Could somebody please explain this run off I keep reading on here. Strictly from watching football games I see run offs occur when a team with no timeouts do something to stop the clock. An injury, intentional grounding, purposely fumble out of bounds. KC did nothing that would have stopped the clock. They reset the ball and the clock ran. Now if you want to say the ref was too slow to wind the clock, I could see that. Please enlighten me on this runoff. What am I missing. Thanks in advance. P.S. I totally agree with 1,2 & 4.
You must be logged in to see this image or video!
From the NFLs own rulebook. There are many situations where a 10 second runoff applies. One is a situation where a replay occurs, and the correct ruling (Rice down in field of play), would have resulted in the clock still running.

A 10 second runoff should have applied, and the clock should have been running at the whistle, not the snap.

https://operations.nfl.com/the-rules/nfl-video-rulebook/play-clock/
 

Pugger

Cheesehead
Joined
Aug 26, 2008
Messages
2,617
Reaction score
756
Location
***** Gorda, FL
That 15 yards, despite hitting Mahomes in bounds, was a game breaker, no matter what they say. It gave them the ball in Packer territory, stopped the clock, and gave them the opportunity of building momentum. Even on the pass play where interference could have been called against Green Bay, if you watch, the KC left tackle clearly put his hand inside the Packer's outside rush man's grill, directly in front of an official who saw it. That should definitely have been called a penalty, so at best, the Chiefs would have had offsetting penalties, so they would have to repeat the down.

What was worse is that the final play, in the end zone, for them to be nit picking for a call against GB, considering that it was a free for all of pushing and shoving, as it always is, in a jump ball like that was. For every defensive infraction, there would be an offensive one as well. His bias during the last quarter was not acceptable, in any way.
I had to laugh at the guy on the NFL Network's morning show who said the only way a flag would be out on a Hail Mary play is if a defender hit a WR with a crow bar. For me it was pay back for Fail Mary.
 

Staff online

Members online

Latest posts

Top