McCarthy, Clement & Rodgers need to help the receivers succeed

[Mondio]

The Packers keep appointing people who never played WR to the WR Coach position. For years it was Edgar Bennett a former RB and now it's Van Pelt a former QB. Doesn't seem like they know enough about the WR position.

I think Edgar Bennett was a very good receivers coach. Jury is out on Van Pelt I guess, but I would think a former QB understands the in's and out's of what a receiver needs to do and where they need to be. Maybe they are missing some of the smaller nuances, but then Jordy, Randall, and Jones have been around a while

 

[easyk83]

Jordy Nelson. Randall Cobb. James Jones. And you think they don't know WRs???
Really ???

We lost the game, the world isn't falling apart.

Why is that game surprising, our offense has looked like crap against top flight pass defenses for years now and that article should crystallized the why for many of us. Against Denver the Tripp sets were used on occasion but when they were they consistently got guys open and yielded positive yards.

EDIT: There have been multiple years in which we have had top notch bump and run cover corners. Yet whenever we played the Saints they always seemed to scorch us. Because Sean Payton refused to let cats like Williams Harris Woodson and Shields squat on his receivers. Payton's NO scheme heavily relied on crossing routes rubs stack and tripp sets which forced our corners to back off into a zone scheme where they were less effective.

 

[I asked LT to delete my acct]

Why is that game surprising, our offense has looked like crap against top flight pass defenses for years now and that article should crystallized the why for many of us. Against Denver the Tripp sets were used on occasion but when they were they consistently got guys open and yielded positive yards.

EDIT: There have been multiple years in which we have had top notch bump and run cover corners. Yet whenever we played the Saints they always seemed to scorch us. Because Sean Payton refused to let cats like Williams Harris Woodson and Shields squat on his receivers. Payton's NO scheme heavily relied on crossing routes rubs stack and tripp sets which forced our corners to back off into a zone scheme where they were less effective.

My reaction was knee jerk I apologise, but we were beaten by probably a serious AFC contender in thier own house. It happens to the best.

 

[PackerDNA]

Why is that game surprising, our offense has looked like crap against top flight pass defenses for years now and that article should crystallized the why for many of us. Against Denver the Tripp sets were used on occasion but when they were they consistently got guys open and yielded positive yards.

EDIT: There have been multiple years in which we have had top notch bump and run cover corners. Yet whenever we played the Saints they always seemed to scorch us. Because Sean Payton refused to let cats like Williams Harris Woodson and Shields squat on his receivers. Payton's NO scheme heavily relied on crossing routes rubs stack and tripp sets which forced our corners to back off into a zone scheme where they were less effective.

This. Nail, meet head.

 

[easyk83]

My reaction was knee jerk I apologise, but we were beaten by probably a serious AFC contender in thier own house. It happens to the best.

That's true, but is there a pattern here? Yes. Our offense flops against top flight secondaries. It's not because the O-line can't block long enough and it's not because our receivers can't catch. It's because we have a flawed offensive approach that shows up against good bump n run coverage. We need to do more to scheme guys open. Or we can expect to just lay down againts the Denver's and Seattle's of the world, think we would have beaten Seattle with a healthy Kam Chancellor? This Packer fan wonders.

 

[Packerlifer]

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/po...-rodgers-might-need-to-force-feed-packers-wrs

 

[Sky King]

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/po...-rodgers-might-need-to-force-feed-packers-wrs

Clements says he would not be surprised if the Panthers play the same defense as the Broncos. The big question is whether the Packers will adjust their offensive scheme to counter that, or will they stubbornly cling to what has been solved and perfected by their last three opponents?

 

[Packerlifer]

http://www.packersnews.com/story/sp...rs-capable-making-contested-catches/75252900/

 

[OldSchool101]

Good post. We just played arguably the best overall pass D in the league after a 2 week gap in an unusual environment (altitude) on the road. Some may contest that the additional rest shouldve helped us last Sunday night and I somewhat agree. I think it does help in healing injuries, but as far as a young receiver group trying to achieve solidarity 40% of the way into regular season? I think we all saw that answer loud n clear.
Although MCarthy may not hold chief play calling duties in 2015, I would be highly surprised if there wasn't also an Offense coaches meeting that included his input and expertise this week to formulate a counter plan of attack for a mirrored Defensive approach. This, combined with a renewed commitment of each player to step up their performance, should equate into a significant increase in production.
The offensive production will do 1 of 2 things or both.. Increase scoring or increase time of possession. This in turn keeps our D motivated when on the field and longer periods of rest when not on the field. The less our D is in the action the better.
Our D has been on the field for an unbalanced amount of time recently. In short, I would challenge our O to carry the day this weekend.
Personally, I'd like to see time of possession for GB at 35+ min.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Although MCarthy may not hold chief play calling duties in 2015, I would be highly surprised if there wasn't also an Offense coaches meeting that included his input and expertise this week to formulate a counter plan of attack for a mirrored Defensive approach.

I'm absolutely convinced that McCarthy, while not calling the plays anymore, has had a huge influence on the offensive game plan every single week so far and that won't change anytime soon.

 

[TJV]

I'm absolutely convinced that McCarthy, while not calling the plays anymore, has had a huge influence on the offensive game plan every single week so far and that won't change anytime soon.

I agree he has an influence but we don't know how much. Here's an article by Dougherty in which he quotes Brian Billick on the subject of McCarthy giving up the play calling duties. The following isn't a quote from Billick and I view it as a more general statement than particular to the Packers:

To understand how preoccupying play calling is, here’s a thumbnail look at what goes into it. First, during the week, the play caller has to assemble the game plan based on his own film study and input from his assistants, who are responsible for studying specific game segments (third down, short yardage, red zone, etc.). Then the play caller has to determine what plays to practice against what defensive calls in the limited time the team spends on the practice field.

http://www.packersnews.com/story/sp...015/10/10/mccarthy-makes-right-call/73654624/

If that's precisely Clements' weekly duties, that would give him more power over the game plan than I thought. But I don't think that's the case - I'd bet McCarthy certainly and even Bennett have input into the game plan. Michael Rodney picked up something from McCarthy Unplugged that I view as good news:

This week’s McCarthy Unplugged segment on the team’s website produced an interesting sound bite. Here’s what Mike McCarthy said when asked by host Larry McCarren about his struggling offense: “We’re going to make an adjustment this week, we can talk about it Monday. Frankly, in hindsight, job responsibility, we go through a change, I probably might have asked too much of Tom [Clements].”

While writing he doesn't know what the adjustment is, Rodney says he's glad they're trying something new. Me too.

http://packersnotes.com/2015/11/change-coming-to-offense/

 

[Shawnsta3]

If you're going to read one article this week I strongly encourage you read this piece by Andy Benoit from MMQB. It deals with what I think has been this offenses biggest problem with receivers struggling to get open all year.

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2015/11/02/...kers-offense-problems-broncos-loss-nfl-week-8

I've seen a lot of trips, doubled up receivers this week which was a welcome change, but this came a little late and now it looks like we have bigger problems on our hands

 

[Ogsponge]

I've seen a lot of trips, doubled up receivers this week which was a welcome change, but this came a little late and now it looks like we have bigger problems on our hands

I am not sure what you are seeing, there is a difference between trips and bunch formations, trips don't mean **** when all three routes in the formation run independently of each other. So yes, they have run trips but not in any fashion that helps beat man coverage. Routs have to cross and then need to bunch the receivers up.

 

[Fadam1137]

I am not sure what you are seeing, there is a difference between trips and bunch formations, trips don't mean **** when all three routes in the formation run independently of each other. So yes, they have run trips but not in any fashion that helps beat man coverage. Routs have to cross and then need to bunch the receivers up.

That, and wr need to put out when running routes. I watched Adams and jones both running slow and sloppy routes on multiple plays

 

[Patriotplayer90]

That, and wr need to put out when running routes. I watched Adams and jones both running slow and sloppy routes on multiple plays

Adams has always been slow and lazy.

 

[easyk83]

Making adjustments in route trees are not easily made in season... too bad they didn't have a bye week to make some changes to the offense

Anyways I would expect some growing pains for a couple of weeks until the offense picks up the changes. BTW trips formation helps if it at least backs corners off and it appeared to today. We have dynamic playmakers, we just need to get them the ball in space.

As for defense get Datone Jones in there rushing from the outside and see what he does.

 

[TJV]

Adams has always been slow and lazy.

 

[JP Doyal]

I think that article was a great read. Don't get me wrong Tom Brady is an Elite QB, but it makes me wonder would he be as good without Belichick offensive scheme?

 

[Patriotplayer90]

He averaged 13 yards per reception in college...in the Mountain West conference.... with Derek Carr throwing to him.

 

[TJV]

He averaged 13 yards per reception in college...in the Mountain West conference.... with Derek Carr throwing to him.

You posted Thompson doesn’t want to win, and “gets idolized”. You pretend to know how much input everyone in the organization has on the drafting process. You post Adams is lazy (YPC isn’t indicative of laziness in college or the NFL) and that he is a “career <10 YPC guy. Always has been, always will be”. Just so you know, there’s no prize for hyperbole. BTW, your “always will be” statement comes after 5 games (for him) into his second season in the league. I'm not a betting man but I'd be happy to take your money if you want to put it where your mouth is regarding him being a career <10 YPC guy. So again .

 

[Patriotplayer90]

You posted Thompson doesn’t want to win, and “gets idolized”. You pretend to know how much input everyone in the organization has on the drafting process. You post Adams is lazy (YPC isn’t indicative of laziness in college or the NFL) and that he is a “career <10 YPC guy. Always has been, always will be”. Just so you know, there’s no prize for hyperbole. BTW, your “always will be” statement comes after 5 games (for him) into his second season in the league. I'm not a betting man but I'd be happy to take your money if you want to put it where your mouth is regarding him being a career <10 YPC guy. So again .

He's very average, considering talent like Martavis Bryant was taken in later rounds.

 

[TJV]

He's very average, considering talent like Martavis Bryant was taken in later rounds.

That response doesn't address a single point I made in my post: It doesn't make him lazy and it doesn't make him a sub 10 YPC guy. BTW, I assume you don't want to take the bet.

 

[Patriotplayer90]

That response doesn't address a single point I made in my post: It doesn't make him lazy and it doesn't make him a sub 10 YPC guy. BTW, I assume you don't want to take the bet.

With Rodgers throwing the ball, I'll pass on that bet. I didn't see enough effort from him to get open. Cobb seems to be the only one who really, really wants the ball.

 

[Shawnsta3]

He's very average, considering talent like Martavis Bryant was taken in later rounds.

I suppose Aaron Rodgers is average too cause that guy from New England was drafted in the 6th round

 

[Deleted member 6794]

He averaged 13 yards per reception in college...in the Mountain West conference.... with Derek Carr throwing to him.

You´re putting way too much stock into yards per catch. Adams caught 233 passes for 3,031 yards and 38 TDs with Fresno State. Those numbers are pretty impressive.

He's very average, considering talent like Martavis Bryant was taken in later rounds.

Adams is a different type of receiver than Bryant, doesn´t make any sense to compare them based on YPC.