Kenny Clark

[McKnowledge]

You mean we don't already play a 3-4 defense? The 2-4-5 is not an every-down formation.

My mistake. I meant a 4-3 base. The way Martinez was playing. I think he could be a solid if not very good Middle LB. I also think Matthews should be a LB/DE hybrid, especially @ DE as he gets older. He could be a Troy Polamalu type for the front seven. He is still effective. I don't know @ that price, but effective nonetheless. Mike Daniels and a healthy Kenny Clark at DT respectively, rotate edge rushers from OLB and DE, and mix some blitzes from the safety positions. 4-3 base would showcase some players' strengths.

 

[Reese2017]

That's why I say don't draft a Dlineman ,capers ruins dlinemen draft a WR for Aaron he has 3to 5 years left , when you cut price he goes to Dallas and played pretty good until injury , then the guy you keep you cut after Dallas takes price , ringo so why lose price to keep a guy your gonna cut??????

 

[gbgary]

goes on IR now.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

goes on IR now.

Good move on Gutes part, time to bring in another guy from another teams practice squad!

Last year the Packers were eliminated with 2 games to go and I don't remember TT making all these kinds of moves. Seems smart to bring in more guys for the off season roster, which I believe can be up to 90 players.

Former Denver Broncos quarterback Paxton Lynch was among the six players who worked out for the Green Bay Packers on Tuesday.

According to Rob Demovsky of ESPN, Lynch was joined by receiver Chris Brown, defensive lineman Eric Cotton, cornerback D.J. Killings, cornerback Trevon Mathis and receiver Ka’Raun White at the workout. The Packers signed Cotton and Killings to the practice squad.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Last year the Packers were eliminated with 2 games to go and I don't remember TT making all these kinds of moves. Seems smart to bring in more guys for the off season roster, which I believe can be up to 90 players.

I don' think there's a roster limit during the season limiting players being put on injured reserve. The league might get suspicious if that number exceeds 27 though

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I don' think there's a roster limit during the season limiting players being put on injured reserve. The league might get suspicious if that number exceeds 27 though

Could be, I couldn't find the rules pertaining to IR and if there is a limit and how long they can sit on IR in the off season, etc. Gute isn't the first GM to do it, but I think its a smart move to shift as many guys to the IR as the rules allow and pluck guys you like off of other teams practice squads.

 

[HardRightEdge]

....if there is a limit and how long they can sit on IR in the off season, etc.

That aspect doesn't really matter. Whether a player was on IR or not, he is subject to the top-51 cap limit like any other player under contract for the following season. If a player on IR is in a contract year, like Ryan or Wilkerson, he'll be a free agent and go off the books just like a player in his contract year who was on the active roster at the end of the season.

In season, there isn't much advantage in cutting a player on IR in most cases since his salary was guaranteed as of week 1 and he's not earning any per game roster bonuses. Even then you'd have to wait until he's healthy enough to play if he's vested. You cannot cut a vested injured player in-season. Non-vested players on IR can be cut, but are subject to injury settlement negotiations. Once the season is over, guys who were on IR are like everybody else...they're free agents, or you hold onto them under their current contract stretching into the next year, or you're free to cut them with the associated dead cap/cap savings like a healthy player.

I don't believe there is any limit to the number of guys you can have on IR, but once the season ends it doesn't really matter. You just have to be under that top-51 cap.

And I don't believe you'll run afoul of stashing players on IR unless a particular player complains that he's healthy and is being stashed. I can't think of one who has done that.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I don't believe there is any limit to the number of guys you can have on IR, but once the season ends it doesn't really matter. You just have to be under that top-51 cap.

Actually teams can even be over the cap between the end of the season and the start of the new league year.

 

[SoonerPack]

Kenny is the type of kid you want to build a defensive unit around. He is young, talented, motivated and plays with heart. His age also speaks to the fact his best football is likely ahead of him which is exciting as all get out. I don't think it can be overstated how important getting to grow up in the league right beside a gut like Mike D is for a guy like Kenny. This season has obviously been a bust. At this point Gute has to identify some building blocks for the future and 97 has to be a major component in getting things back to where they need to be. I am not expecting a long turn-around and will be greatly disappointed if next season has any semblance of this current one. Merry Christmas to you all and G P G!

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Regardless, a 73% snap count is too high for any extended period of time so more snaps for Clark is clearly not the answer. If you want Clark to take more passing down snaps, then what you want is another run-defending DL, a guy like Guion for example.

There's no point in burning out a good young player in a lost season.

I used to think this but, when looking at the best interior players in the league, his 720 snaps isn't really that compared to elite interior linemen. I honestly thought that one of the reasons that Raji regressed so much was overuse before I actually looked at how other DTs are used and realized that, no, his use was inline with those other guys.

For comparison, this year Clark has averaged 55.4 snaps per game (in the 13 games he's played this year). Aaron Donald has averaged 58 snaps per game, Fletcher Cox 53.6 snaps per game, Akiem Hicks 50.6 snaps per game, Grady Jarrett 49.6 per game, Suh has averaged 56.3 snaps per game, Cameron Heyward 52.9, DeForest Buckner 53.6, and Leonard Williams 55.6.

Clark has also played 95.3% of the pass rushing snaps on the team (he's missed 13 passing downs all season); and, when removing guys who have played fewer than 100 passing downs, Clark is tied with Cameron Heyward as the 13th best interior pass rusher in the NFL this year, getting pressure on 6.8% of his pass rushes. For reference, Aaron Donald gets pressure 11% of the time he rushes and Chris Jones with the Chiefs is second at 9.1%. Aaron Donald is REALLY freaking good.

Anyway, I guess my point is that, while it would be nice to have other good players on the defense to give Clark a break, the fact is that the Packers' defense had exactly ONE great player in Clark (Daniels' run defense fell off a cliff this year, hopefully it's just a blip) and sitting that guy down would be basically terrible for the defense. While it would be nice to give Clark a few more snaps off per game, his usage isn't too terribly high compared to other great players.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I used to think this but, when looking at the best interior players in the league, his 720 snaps isn't really that compared to elite interior linemen. I honestly thought that one of the reasons that Raji regressed so much was overuse before I actually looked at how other DTs are used and realized that, no, his use was inline with those other guys.

For comparison, this year Clark has averaged 55.4 snaps per game (in the 13 games he's played this year). Aaron Donald has averaged 58 snaps per game, Fletcher Cox 53.6 snaps per game, Akiem Hicks 50.6 snaps per game, Grady Jarrett 49.6 per game, Suh has averaged 56.3 snaps per game, Cameron Heyward 52.9, DeForest Buckner 53.6, and Leonard Williams 55.6.

Clark has also played 95.3% of the pass rushing snaps on the team (he's missed 13 passing downs all season); and, when removing guys who have played fewer than 100 passing downs, Clark is tied with Cameron Heyward as the 13th best interior pass rusher in the NFL this year, getting pressure on 6.8% of his pass rushes. For reference, Aaron Donald gets pressure 11% of the time he rushes and Chris Jones with the Chiefs is second at 9.1%. Aaron Donald is REALLY freaking good.

Anyway, I guess my point is that, while it would be nice to have other good players on the defense to give Clark a break, the fact is that the Packers' defense had exactly ONE great player in Clark (Daniels' run defense fell off a cliff this year, hopefully it's just a blip) and sitting that guy down would be basically terrible for the defense. While it would be nice to give Clark a few more snaps off per game, his usage isn't too terribly high compared to other great players.

My observation on Clark's snap count is a long term consideration, i.e., through his second contract. What would be the impact of high snap counts year after year by the time you get to year 6 or 7 or 8 once you've paid him the big bucks? Will we be diving into dead cap vs. cap savings by the time we get to the middle of that contract? I believe we're there now with Daniels. Or could fatigue be a factor in his recent injury?

A couple of the guys you listed have not gotten to 6, 7, 8 years. And of the longer tenured players you listed, how many counter examples might there be? Are there 2, 3, 4 examples like Raji or Wilkerson for every Cox or Heyward? We remember the successes that are fresh in the current perspective and forget the failures of the past. Are the long tenured guys you listed the exceptions that prove the rule? As for Suh, is he really worth $15 mil? I don't think so, more a luxury accruing to having a cheap QB.

On the subject of Wilkerson, while the optimism surrounding this signing ran along the lines of a resurgence in being reunited with Pettine I expressed skepticism given his 80 - 90% snap count year after year and an evident decline in performance as a result. In those brief 3 games, we saw a solid player evidently beyond his days as an impact player. And we don't know how solid he would have been had the season wore on with 46 snaps per game as he had in his first two games. At least he was paid more or less in line with the risks.

I'm not suggesting Clark should be babied, but I believe throwing him out there at over 70% snap counts risks a day not too long in the future where we start talking about his dead cap.

 

[XPack]

Is #97 close to breaking out?

He's done real good in Skins game and that should be a big boost to his and the team's confidence.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Is #97 close to breaking out?

He's done real good in Skins game and that should be a big boost to his and the team's confidence.

Could be and imagine if he had another guy or two on the DL that was playing at a high level too. As I watch some of the better defenses in the NFL play, it is pretty obvious to me that DL is a position that is really lacking in Green Bay. Much like the WR position with Davante, the Packers have Kenny and not much else. Could be Gute got caught with his pants down during last years off season, hoping Clark, Lowery, Montravious Adams and Daniels were enough, but I think it should be a position of high in the upcoming off season.

 

[XPack]

Could be Gute got caught with his pants down during last years off season, hoping Clark, Lowery, Montravious Adams and Daniels were enough,

Yeah, if we create enough chaos in interior we'll disrupt both run lanes and create mismatches for OLBs. Clark is defacto leader there and hopefully we'll give him some more support.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Yeah, if we create enough chaos in interior we'll disrupt both run lanes and create mismatches for OLBs. Clark is defacto leader there and hopefully we'll give him some more support.

Yup and as much as I don't want to give Blake Martinez a pass, nor do I not want the Packers to go out and get better ILB's, one can't help but wonder just how much of Blake's "issues" are connected to the DL issues?

 

[Pugger]

Could be and imagine if he had another guy or two on the DL that was playing at a high level too. As I watch some of the better defenses in the NFL play, it is pretty obvious to me that DL is a position that is really lacking in Green Bay. Much like the WR position with Davante, the Packers have Kenny and not much else. Could be Gute got caught with his pants down during last years off season, hoping Clark, Lowery, Montravious Adams and Daniels were enough, but I think it should be a position of high in the upcoming off season.

I think Gute tried to improve our pass rush with LBers like the Smith 'Brothers' and Gary, not necessarily the DL.

 

[Pugger]

goes on IR now.

Who went on IR??

 

[Mondio]

Who went on IR??

that was the end of last season, and i'm going to assume it was Clark he was talking about who was put on IR with a game or 2 remaining and the playoffs out of the question

 

[XPack]

one can't help but wonder just how much of Blake's "issues" are connected to the DL issues?

For me, it's a combination of factors between the line and linebackers. We's short of quality at both and that shows. He seems very indecisive on moving up to stop the run or back to handle coverage. Probably we need to fix his role and pair him up with others who are complimentary.

 

[OldSchool101]

I’d love to get a formidable DL and ILB. 1 through FA and 1 in the upcoming draft. As someone said Kenny alongside someone equally talented and with both Smiths on either Edge would make us exponentially better.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

For me, it's a combination of factors between the line and linebackers. We's short of quality at both and that shows. He seems very indecisive on moving up to stop the run or back to handle coverage. Probably we need to fix his role and pair him up with others who are complimentary.

I would prefer the Packers to move on from Martinez with him being set to become a free agent and definitely asking for a lucrative contract.

I’d love to get a formidable DL and ILB. 1 through FA and 1 in the upcoming draft. As someone said Kenny alongside someone equally talented and with both Smiths on either Edge would make us exponentially better.

Gutekunst finally needs to address the receiving corps next offseason. If there are resources left to improve the defense after that I'm fine with it.

 

[milani]

Anyone else notice how good this kid has played this year? This guy hustles every play and is a straight up bully inside. The great thing is he’s only 22 years old and is really starting to come into his own. He is an incredible athlete for his size and really seems to use his hands well. I hope to see him in a GB uniform till he retires. Get well big boy

I agree he is good but not necessarily that good. If he was teams would not successfully pound our middle for so many rushing yards. Maybe he really plays better in a 4-3. Maybe we need to draft one of those studs we saw in the LSU - Georgia game to play next to him.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I agree he is good but not necessarily that good. If he was teams would not successfully pound our middle for so many rushing yards. Maybe he really plays better in a 4-3. Maybe we need to draft one of those studs we saw in the LSU - Georgia game to play next to him.

Clark is definitely an elite player when healthy. The Packers need more talent around him to improve defending the run though.

 

[longtimefan]

Most of year Clark had horrible ankle issue..

Seems to have been cleared up

 

[OldSchool101]

Gutekunst finally needs to address the receiving corps next offseason. If there are resources left to improve the defense after that I'm fine with it.

I couldn’t agree more. You’ve heard me be vocal about (in print ) addressing the Offense. There’s many ways to skin a resource cat. Trades, the Draft, FA etc.. I believe GB will use some of those resources at either WR, TE and not surprised if they were to hit both early.

However, we need to shore up our DL alongside Clark. Another option would be to double down at a D position mid-draft similar to what we did at RB a few years ago or grab a more proven answer in FA.