John Ross requests trade.

[Sunshinepacker]

I tend to believe that WR is one of the more overrated positions in the league in terms of importance.

That's not to say it's unimportant, but I would put it behind QB, Pass Rusher, OL, and CB. And if you look back over Super Bowl winners and look at their rosters, there isn't a strong correlation between rings and high end WR corps.

You just listed the 4 most important positions on a football team. So yeah, WR is below those. However, having a terrible receiving group is a bad thing. The Packers game one legit nfl receiver, that's a bad thing.

 

[Dantés]

It's not a bargain. Ppl trying to find bargains aren't going to help the team win. Yes, it's a gamble, but the payoff is massive and the cost to re-sign him is going to be much lower than his talent would normally dictate because he played with terrible quarterbacks last year and the Steelers have found cheaper receivers to replace him with this year.

Ok, well you said that people who don’t think we should trade a 2nd and a 3rd for him are insane, so I took that to be a pretty clear indication that you think it would be a bargain.

 

[Dantés]

You just listed the 4 most important positions on a football team. So yeah, WR is below those. However, having a terrible receiving group is a bad thing. The Packers game one legit nfl receiver, that's a bad thing.

Of course having a terrible receiving corps is a bad thing. Having terrible players at any position is a bad thing.

The Packers’ receiving corps is neither great nor terrible.

But the value of the position is generally overrated.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

"skill" is a different story, but he's on a different level than MVS athletically. Why he's not catching on in Cinci is beyond me, he kinda was breaking out last year, but then that got derailed.

Worth a 6th? Maybe.

Why? Zac Taylor is a garbage coach who already ruined Andy Dalton, and I doubt too many should be stars will be catching on in his system. I almost feel bad for Burrow being stuck with him.

Now ... I'm not too high on Ross. I think we could have some better options coming, although at this point I'm still leery about how long Lazard will be out for. But if we landed him for practically nothing, at this point I don't really feel like there'd be much to lose either.

 

[Dantés]

We haven't seen enough from Taylor to know if he's a good or bad coach yet. But he didn't ruin Andy Dalton. That's silliness. Dalton can play up to a great supporting cast, but he absolutely can't elevate a bad group of players. And the Bengals put a bad group of players around him last year.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

Of course he's a bad HC, his record speaks for itself.

 

[GleefulGary]

Why? Zac Taylor is a garbage coach who already ruined Andy Dalton, and I doubt too many should be stars will be catching on in his system. I almost feel bad for Burrow being stuck with him.

Now ... I'm not too high on Ross. I think we could have some better options coming, although at this point I'm still leery about how long Lazard will be out for. But if we landed him for practically nothing, at this point I don't really feel like there'd be much to lose either.

Lol. Nobody ruined Dalton.

 

[Dantés]

Lol. He’s been there barely over one season. The roster he inherited was garbage. He’s 37. No one knows.

 

[GleefulGary]

Of course he's a bad HC, his record speaks for itself.

Bill Belichick had a 45% winning percentage in his first stint as a HC, 5 years worth of data.

Did his record speak for itself?

I’m not going to pretend I know a lot about Zac Taylor, but I dang sure know there’s a handful of coaches in NFL history that could win with that roster.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

Lol. Nobody ruined Dalton.

Well, Dalton was never going to be a great QB, but his performance was certainly better in years where he had OCs like Bill Lazor working with him. He may have already been on a decline when Zac Taylor got hired, but Taylor proved to be a farce of a HC and did nothing to help him.

So ... I stand by my statement that he's a rotten HC, and only a joke of an organization run by the awful Mike Brown has proven to be insane enough to hire him.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

Bill Belichick had a 45% winning percentage in his first stint as a HC, 5 years worth of data.

Why do people keep bringing up this ridiculous anomaly? BB was lucky enough to get a second chance and hit gold in New England, but who else has done something similar? Other than perhaps Pete Carroll, almost nobody.

I seen enough of Taylor to know how good he is, and it's not anywhere near BB's level.

 

[HardRightEdge]

If you look at John Ross' record after whiting out his draft status there is no reason to think he could pass MVS on the depth chart.

If his superficial numbers were not bad enough, like a 41.5% career catch rate, consider the drops that partially account for that terrible number. Since tracking drops in 2018, pro-football-reference.com has him down for 16 drops on 121 targets, a 13.2% drop rate.

You think MVS drops a lot of balls? PFR has him down for 11 drops on 159 targets for 2018 - 2020, 6.9%, around half as often as Ross.

If Ross were cut I might sign him to the practice squad if he'd accept and see how it goes from there.

 

[GleefulGary]

Why do people keep bringing up this ridiculous anomaly? BB was lucky enough to get a second chance and hit gold in New England, but who else has done something similar? Other than perhaps Pete Carroll, almost nobody.

I seen enough of Taylor to know how good he is, and it's not anywhere near BB's level.

You’re missing the point. I’m not saying he’s BB.

I’ll try to keep it real simple.

Jimmies and Joes matter a lot more than X’s and O’s.

Again, I don’t pay attention to the Bengals. Therefore, it’s pretty hard to say whether Taylor is actually as bad as his record indicates. Again, what coach is winning with that roster? They suck.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Ok, well you said that people who don’t think we should trade a 2nd and a 3rd for him are insane, so I took that to be a pretty clear indication that you think it would be a bargain.

Ahhh, ya got me. Still qualifies as insane though.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Of course having a terrible receiving corps is a bad thing. Having terrible players at any position is a bad thing.

The Packers’ receiving corps is neither great nor terrible.

But the value of the position is generally overrated.

The Packers receiving group is pretty terrible. One nfl caliber starting receiver and....nope, that's it.

 

[Dantés]

The Packers receiving group is pretty terrible. One nfl caliber starting receiver and....nope, that's it.

When I look at the WR groups around the league, I would say they’re average to below average. Like, somewhere from 16-20.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

When I look at the WR groups around the league, I would say they’re average to below average. Like, somewhere from 16-20.

Please, tell me another receiving group with the same gap between #1 to #2 and #3.

 

[Dantés]

Please, tell me another receiving group with the same gap between #1 to #2 and #3.

I realize there’s a sizable gap. But that’s not what we were talking about. On the whole, as a unit, I don’t think they’re awful. I’m not saying they’re a great unit. They’re probably sub average.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

I realize there’s a sizable gap. But that’s not what we were talking about. On the whole, as a unit, I don’t think they’re awful. I’m not saying they’re a great unit. They’re probably sub average.

If you don't think they're awful then it should be easy for you to name a few other teams (let's say 3) with a larger gap than the Packers. I'll wait.

 

[Dantés]

If you don't think they're awful then it should be easy for you to name a few other teams (let's say 3) with a larger gap than the Packers. I'll wait.

It’s weird to me that you arbitrarily changed the terms of the discussion.

In my opinion, the Packers’s WR corps as a whole is better than the following.

49ers, Broncos, Raiders, Colts, Patriots, Jets, Dolphins, Eagles, Redskins, Giants, Bears, Bengals, Ravens.

I think it’s a discussion between them and the Chargers and Saints.

So that would have them 17-19 depending on those last two.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I think "bungals" think they should get a 4th. There are many Wr needy teams that will come calling. He will cost a 5th easily. We got a 6th for Davis. I have no problem with giving a 5th. Matt needs this type of recievier in his scheme. 4.2 on jet sweeps and quick pass then with the same formation drop it in over the top to MVS . With this edition we will have the final piece to what this offense needs to bad Bengals did not pick up 5th yr option cheap speed like this is hard to find.

Ross has great speed but hasn't proven to rake advantage of it to become an even decent receiver in the NFL. The Packers should pass on him.

I have been hoping we trade a 5th or 6th and josh jackson to Dallas for Gallup.

I would love to send a bag of used footballs to the Vikings for Justin Jefferson while we're at it as well but unfortunately that's not how it works.
p

Was he with the Eagles at some point previously? I thought I had heard that.

No, Fulgham was with the Lions before his short stint with the Packers.

 

[lambeaulambo]

Ill throw this in - Lazard was exploding and got hurt, this WR group was on the rise, and the loss of Lazard threw that into peril. I will stand by my opinions of MVS and ESB. Both are definitely replaceable.

 

[thequick12]

I realize there’s a sizable gap. But that’s not what we were talking about. On the whole, as a unit, I don’t think they’re awful. I’m not saying they’re a great unit. They’re probably sub average.

So what would they be minus adams? Worst in the league easy, yeah? I guess how about this take the number 1 wr for each team out of the equation. Then where would you rank them?

 

[thequick12]

Ill throw this in - Lazard was exploding and got hurt, this WR group was on the rise, and the loss of Lazard threw that into peril. I will stand by my opinions of MVS and ESB. Both are definitely replaceable.

Lazard is replaceable as well. He is a really good #4 wr. Kind of a ruevell martin type. He's not gonna play for anyone but the Packers with Rodgers. Once the Packers are done with him he's done in the nfl.

And that's fine. It's just compare Rodgers wr group when he first became a starter thru Jordy and Cobb leaving to what he has now....when doing so you realize wow! That's a pretty big difference. No wonder Rodgers hasn't been as good

 

[Mondio]

Lazard is way above a Ruevell Martin type player.