Datne Jones

[HardRightEdge]

Mike Neal had a bigger adjustment going from DT, to OLB. Jones has always been a defensive end and he looked natural playing in space when asked to do it.

Whether one watches the games or reads Capers unvarnished assessment of the matter, Jones cannot play against guards and centers in tight quarters; his best option is going against OTs in space, as you say. That means he's not fit for the D-Line.

Will he take a few snaps inside on passing downs? Probably, just as Neal and Peppers did, and maybe dubbed an elephant playing some down as well as up, but he's not a 3-4 D-Lineman any more than the second iteration of Neal.

 

[easyk83]

Whether one watches the games or reads Capers unvarnished assessment of the matter, Jones cannot play against guards and centers in tight quarters; his best option is going against OTs in space, as you say. That means he's not fit for the D-Line.

Will he take a few snaps inside on passing downs? Probably, just as Neal and Peppers did, and maybe dubbed an elephant playing some down as well as up, but he's not a 3-4 D-Lineman any more than the second iteration of Neal.

His 2 cent draft profile on NFL.com said he couldn't anchor and struggled with drive blockers. Sometimes their analysis can be cursory but Datone appears to be right on the money. Perhaps he has a mentality issue, he seems like more of a finesse guy than say a Mike Daniels type.

 

[XPack]

I don´t think moving the Packers best defensive player to his best position as well as drafting a rookie in the third round means the team has given up on Datone.

Best defensive player? He was very average in his first 3 seasons and move to OLB made him a bit more effective. I'd be still be wary of portraying him as a defensive mainstay for now. I'd grade him 5.5/10 over his 4 years here. If Peppers decides to retire next year, he'll be useful and that's all there's to say about him. If he continues to improve this season he'll get a Perry'esque contact at the end.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Best defensive player? He was very average in his first 3 seasons and move to OLB made him a bit more effective.

If I might interject, he was clearly referencing Matthews as the "best defensive player".

 

[HardRightEdge]

Look at those arms and legs, at that point he went about 275. This is Aaron Kampman at his pinnacle as an NFL player, 15 sacks on the year. IMHO he could have bulked up to 285, and at that played played 4/4I/5 tech DE.

I can sorta see where you're going with this...kind of a poor man's J.J. Watt.

It would be on a bet, though, without anything to suggest it would or wouldn't work. Kind of an expensive bet, don't you think? Suddenly I'm reminded of Matthews' move which I regard as a failed experiment. Somehow, I think if your suggestion had been made to Kampman it would have been met with less enthusiasm than the easier switch to OLB.

 

[easyk83]

I can sorta see where you're going with this...kind of a poor man's J.J. Watt.

It would be on a bet, though, without anything to suggest it would or wouldn't work. Kind of an expensive bet, don't you think? Suddenly I'm reminded of Matthews' move which I regard as a failed experiment. Somehow, I think if your suggestion had been made to Kampman it would have been met with less enthusiasm than the easier switch to OLB.

Aaron Kampman wouldn't even have been switching positions though. As a 5 tech/4/4I his role would have been largely the same, the difference would have been the alignment around him.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Aaron Kampman wouldn't even have been switching positions though. As a 5 tech/4/4I his role would have been largely the same, the difference would have been the alignment around him.

Take it up with Capers. Tell him he should have adjusted his scheme around one player like they do in Houston. The closest thing you've ever seen to that is Woodson freelancing in the box, and I would not be so sure that wasn't done solely on the player's initiative, where if it works the coach doesn't try to stop it.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

He said he preferred it but even he had to know that A) he's a tweener and B) his position at USC was not as a true DE, he was an elephant end. I don't think that that's his optimal weight, I look at him at USC and he was always a muscular guy but since he's been in Green Bay he's just looked massively muscled. Just a hunch but if he can't stay healthy playing at 265-270 why not slim down to 255 and see what happens? At this point he's just a guy who plays like a young DeMarcus Ware for about 2-3 games a year when he's healthy and then goes back to looking like a backup.

When healthy he's a force even as an OLB, but he's never healthy. I don't buy it that he'd have less trouble with injuries as a 43 end.

First, I'm not sure he could drop the weight to play OLB effectively and second, he wouldn't have to do as much cutting/moving in space at DE and so his ankle/foot injuries might not come into play as much. Perhaps the injuries would be similar but it's obvious that he can't stay healthy at OLB so he wouldn't be really losing anything by trying DE.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

First, I'm not sure he could drop the weight to play OLB effectively and second, he wouldn't have to do as much cutting/moving in space at DE and so his ankle/foot injuries might not come into play as much. Perhaps the injuries would be similar but it's obvious that he can't stay healthy at OLB so he wouldn't be really losing anything by trying DE.

The post you replied to was about Nick Perry though who has played outside linebacker since the Packers drafted him in 2012.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

The post you replied to was about Nick Perry though who has played outside linebacker since the Packers drafted him in 2012.

I know. Perhaps my phrasing in the first sentence was confusing. When I said I didn't think he could drop the weight to play OLB effectively I was speaking to the idea of him dropping into the 255-260 lb range and staying there. The rest of what I said still stands. He can't stay healthy at OLB so putting on some more weight and trying DE wouldn't really cost him much if it turned out he couldn't stay healthy there either.

 

[PFanCan]

I was amazed to see how many busts or non-factors were drafted in the 1st round four years ago. Makes me feel better about Datone Jones. See the summary below with my own opinion on whether or not the player has produced at a high level, mediocre, or low:

#1 Eric Fisher, Kansas City Chiefs: Meh.

#2 Luke Joeckel, Jacksonville Jaguars: Disappointing.

#3 Dion Jordan, Miami Dolphins: Substance abuser. Bust.

#4 Lane Johnson, Philadelphia Eagles: Good pick.

#5 Ezekiel Ansah, Detroit Lions: Good pick.

#6 Barkevious Mingo, Cleveland Browns: Meh.

#7 Jonathan Cooper, Arizona Cardinals: Traded to Patriots. Disappointing.

#8 Tavon Austin, Los Angeles Rams: Good pick.

#9 Dee Milliner, New York Jets: Bust.

#10 Chance Warmack, Tennessee Titans: Disappointing.

#11 D.J. Fluker, San Diego Chargers: Meh.

#12 D.J. Hayden, Oakland Raiders: Disappointing.

#13 Sheldon Richardson, New York Jets: Good pick.

#14 Star Lotulelei, Carolina Panthers: Good pick.

#15 Kenny Vaccaro, New Orleans Saints: Good pick.

#16 EJ Manuel, Buffalo Bills: Bust.

#17 Jarvis Jones, Pittsburgh Steelers: Disappointing.

#18 Eric Reid, San Francisco 49ers: Good pick.

#19 Justin Pugh, New York Giants: Good pick.

#20 Kyle Long, Chicago Bears: Good pick.

#21 Tyler Eifert, Cincinnati Bengals: Good pick.

#22 Desmond Trufant, Atlanta Falcons: Good pick.

#23 Sharrif Floyd, Minnesota Vikings: Good pick.

#24 Bjoern Werner, Indianapolis Colts: Bust.

#25 Xavier Rhodes, Minnesota Vikings: Good pick.

#26 Datone Jones, Green Bay Packers: Meh.

#27 DeAndre Hopkins, Houston Texans: Good pick.

#28 Sylvester Williams, Denver Broncos: Disappointing.

#29 Cordarrelle Patterson, Minnesota Vikings: Disappointing.

#30 Alec Ogletree, Los Angeles Rams: Good pick.

#31 Travis Frederick, Dallas Cowboys: Good pick.

#32 Matt Elam, Baltimore Ravens: Disappointing.

 

[easyk83]

Take it up with Capers. Tell him he should have adjusted his scheme around one player like they do in Houston. The closest thing you've ever seen to that is Woodson freelancing in the box, and I would not be so sure that wasn't done solely on the player's initiative, where if it works the coach doesn't try to stop it.

Thats the thing by the time Capers was brought in Aaron had already shed some of his weight, I think he was already around 260-265 in a bid to become quicker and more agile. Besides it's easier to shed good weight than to gain it in the offseason

 

[Sunshinepacker]

I was amazed to see how many busts or non-factors were drafted in the 1st round four years ago. Makes me feel better about Datone Jones. See the summary below with my own opinion on whether or not the player has produced at a high level, mediocre, or low:

#1 Eric Fisher, Kansas City Chiefs: Meh.

#2 Luke Joeckel, Jacksonville Jaguars: Disappointing.

#3 Dion Jordan, Miami Dolphins: Substance abuser. Bust.

#4 Lane Johnson, Philadelphia Eagles: Good pick.

#5 Ezekiel Ansah, Detroit Lions: Good pick.

#6 Barkevious Mingo, Cleveland Browns: Meh.

#7 Jonathan Cooper, Arizona Cardinals: Traded to Patriots. Disappointing.

#8 Tavon Austin, Los Angeles Rams: Good pick.

#9 Dee Milliner, New York Jets: Bust.

#10 Chance Warmack, Tennessee Titans: Disappointing.

#11 D.J. Fluker, San Diego Chargers: Meh.

#12 D.J. Hayden, Oakland Raiders: Disappointing.

#13 Sheldon Richardson, New York Jets: Good pick.

#14 Star Lotulelei, Carolina Panthers: Good pick.

#15 Kenny Vaccaro, New Orleans Saints: Good pick.

#16 EJ Manuel, Buffalo Bills: Bust.

#17 Jarvis Jones, Pittsburgh Steelers: Disappointing.

#18 Eric Reid, San Francisco 49ers: Good pick.

#19 Justin Pugh, New York Giants: Good pick.

#20 Kyle Long, Chicago Bears: Good pick.

#21 Tyler Eifert, Cincinnati Bengals: Good pick.

#22 Desmond Trufant, Atlanta Falcons: Good pick.

#23 Sharrif Floyd, Minnesota Vikings: Good pick.

#24 Bjoern Werner, Indianapolis Colts: Bust.

#25 Xavier Rhodes, Minnesota Vikings: Good pick.

#26 Datone Jones, Green Bay Packers: Meh.

#27 DeAndre Hopkins, Houston Texans: Good pick.

#28 Sylvester Williams, Denver Broncos: Disappointing.

#29 Cordarrelle Patterson, Minnesota Vikings: Disappointing.

#30 Alec Ogletree, Los Angeles Rams: Good pick.

#31 Travis Frederick, Dallas Cowboys: Good pick.

#32 Matt Elam, Baltimore Ravens: Disappointing.

First, looking at the teams at the top always makes drafts seem worse since bad teams tend to take bad players (e.g., how many "good" players have the Browns taken in the first round?). Just look at picks 18-32, there are only 4 busts and 1 m'eh....That's 10 good players that were taken with picks 18-32 and the Packers didn't get one. That's not a good year for the Packers.

Also, the Packers are the most draft-centric team in the NFL so the Packers can't just be content with being on-par with other teams, or even really slightly better. The Packers, to justify their personnel model, need to be amazingly better than the other teams in the NFL.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I know. Perhaps my phrasing in the first sentence was confusing. When I said I didn't think he could drop the weight to play OLB effectively I was speaking to the idea of him dropping into the 255-260 lb range and staying there. The rest of what I said still stands. He can't stay healthy at OLB so putting on some more weight and trying DE wouldn't really cost him much if it turned out he couldn't stay healthy there either.

Perry adding weight to play defensive end would most likely result in him being even more injury prone.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Perry adding weight to play defensive end would most likely result in him being even more injury prone.

Again though, he gets hurt a lot playing OLB so it wouldn't hurt to try to add the weight. Downside, he gets hurt and misses the 4 healthy games he plays a year at OLB...upside, he plays more than 4 healthy games a year.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

Im looking forward to seeing Jones in at OLB more this year. He could find his groove and play great there.

 

[Sanguine camper]

I find it difficult to see how Jones has the speed and quickness to play linebacker. His best fit is an end playing over the tackle in a 4-3. His best role with the Packers may be to play at 275 pounds and rush the passer from the 5 position on passing downs. Moving him to OLB looks like a failed experiment. If he lines up standing up on the outside of the tackle, o coordinators are going to make him cover a RB which could get real ugly fast.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

I find it difficult to see how Jones has the speed and quickness to play linebacker. His best fit is an end playing over the tackle in a 4-3. His best role with the Packers may be to play at 275 pounds and rush the passer from the 5 position on passing downs. Moving him to OLB looks like a failed experiment. If he lines up standing up on the outside of the tackle, o coordinators are going to make him cover a RB which could get real ugly fast.

If Peppers can do it, I assume Jones can do it as well.

 

[Half Empty]

Not so sure that, just because a HOF player can do something, another player can do it, also.

 

[rodell330]

If Peppers can do it, I assume Jones can do it as well.

Two different types of athletes and skilled. There really is no comparison now that I think about it. That's like comparing Blaine Gabbert to Andrew Luck.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I find it difficult to see how Jones has the speed and quickness to play linebacker. His best fit is an end playing over the tackle in a 4-3. His best role with the Packers may be to play at 275 pounds and rush the passer from the 5 position on passing downs. Moving him to OLB looks like a failed experiment. If he lines up standing up on the outside of the tackle, o coordinators are going to make him cover a RB which could get real ugly fast.

First of all Jones already played more snaps at outside linebacker than defensive end in the second half of last season. Most likely his best position with the Packers is as an inside rusher in subpackages.

Capers doesn't ask his outside linebackers to cover running backs. That would be absolutely insane.

 

[RepStar15]

I hope to not see Datone Jones on the 52 man roster this year. It will free up 1.4 million to save in case we have another slew of injuries and that means that our rookies are most productive than him. I would have to say Jones is one of the biggest disappointments in the Ted Thompson era.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I hope to not see Datone Jones on the 52 man roster this year. It will free up 1.4 million to save in case we have another slew of injuries and that means that our rookies are most productive than him. I would have to say Jones is one of the biggest disappointments in the Ted Thompson era.

There's no reason to believe Datone won't make the Packers final roster.

 

[PikeBadger]

Not so sure that, just because a HOF player can do something, another player can do it, also.

Julius Peppers is almost a once in generation athletic talent. Not fair trying to compare other players to him. Jones is your typical pick 15-50 talent. I don't have high expectations for him to be anything other than a role player right now.

 

[Sanguine camper]

T

First of all Jones already played more snaps at outside linebacker than defensive end in the second half of last season. Most likely his best position with the Packers is as an inside rusher in subpackages.

Capers doesn't ask his outside linebackers to cover running backs. That would be absolutely insane.

True it would be crazy to have Jones cover a RB in the flat but that's exactly what O coordinators are paid to do. Create a match up problem where the OLB has to cover. At this point perhaps the best option for Datone is a pass rush specialist in their dime package.