Clay Matthews Should Be Cut

[Dantés]

Which is the exact reason why I said at SEASONS END.

Where did you say that? Kind of a moot point anyways. He’s a FA after this season.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

What would you do with it this offseason at this point?

Next offseason they’re currently slated to have around 60M depending on what the cap ceiling does. I don’t think they need more given how they seem to want to operate.

The Packers could use additional cap space to sign some veterans like Breeland or Rodgers-Cromartie for example this offseason. With teams being allowed to roll over cap space into next season it's always a smart way to handle it by cutting ties with players being overpaid when there's a cheaper option available on the roster. Unfortunately the Packers don't find themselves in such a situation with Matthews.

 

[Dantés]

The Packers could use additional cap space to sign some veterans like Breeland or Rodgers-Cromartie for example this offseason. With teams being allowed to roll over cap space into next season it's always a smart way to handle it by cutting ties with players being overpaid when there's a cheaper option available on the roster. Unfortunately the Packers don't find themselves in such a situation with Matthews.

I don’t think they need to cut Matthews to bring in a guy like DRC or Breeland.

As to next offseason, I should be more specific. Any team can always use more cap space. But the Packers are slated to have plenty as it is already, given that they aren’t the Miami Dolphins or some similar team. Matthews’ presence on the roster this season compared to the alternative is significantly more valuable than padding the cap number next offseason.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I don’t think they need to cut Matthews to bring in a guy like DRC or Breeland.

Matthews’ presence on the roster this season compared to the alternative is significantly more valuable than padding the cap number next offseason.

As I've mentioned repeatedly there's no doubt that Matthews currently presents way more value than another $11 million of cap space.

It's true that the Packers can definitely sign another veteran with the cap space available this offseason but the team might be able to add several with additional money. It's a moot point as the team is in no position to release Clay though.

 

[gbgary]

Clay Matthews Should Be Cut

letmethinkaboutitno.

 

[XPack]

Matthews should definitely line up primarily on the outside but it makes sense to move him around occasionally.

I recall he was moved mainly to stop the run. Our new front 3 should help a lot here. Plus Martinez nearly made pro-bowl. I'm not fully sold on Jake Ryan yet and there are couple of good options in the draft..despite need for WR and CB/Safety before moving to linebackers.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I recall he was moved mainly to stop the run. Plus Martinez nearly made pro-bowl.

The Packers used Matthews as a pass rusher from inside as well. Martinez performed at an above average level last season but not worthy of being selected to the Pro Bowl.

 

[rodell330]

Matthews is set to become a free agent after this season therefore the Packers wouldn't have to release him to part ways with him.

That’s right, you are correct.

 

[MassPackersFan]

It's not the best plan to always replace vets with rookies. You draft an OLB this year, and then you let him take over next year and part ways with Clay.

 

[Mondio]

I don't think there's any question GB is going to use some valuable draft stock on pass rusher this year. Whether it's in quantity or high round, they are going to have to try and address the future of this position. I don't think Fackerell is it and I think Biegel is going to be our niche guy that makes his plays, but isn't our every down guy

 

[thequick12]

I don't think there's any question GB is going to use some valuable draft stock on pass rusher this year. Whether it's in quantity or high round, they are going to have to try and address the future of this position. I don't think Fackerell is it and I think Biegel is going to be our niche guy that makes his plays, but isn't our every down guy

I'd like to see them draft enough guys that fackrell gets knocked off the roster, so I guess at least 2 one high

 

[Sanguine camper]

If the Packers cut CM3 would they get a comparable pass rusher or starting caliber DB with the money? The answer is no given the pool of players left unsigned. That is why Gute has left CM3 in place. This year's free agent pool lacked the impact pass rushers that would make cutting CM3 a low risk.

 

[PikeBadger]

It's not the best plan to always replace vets with rookies. You draft an OLB this year, and then you let him take over next year and part ways with Clay.

Agree that you should draft to replace a player a year or two out. Give the rookie some time to get acclimated. This is in a perfect world of roster creation and maintenance. In some cases, you are forced to get a guy in there too early. Stuff happens.

 

[PikeBadger]

If the Packers cut CM3 would they get a comparable pass rusher or starting caliber DB with the money? The answer is no given the pool of players left unsigned. That is why Gute has left CM3 in place. This year's free agent pool lacked the impact pass rushers that would make cutting CM3 a low risk.

I think we are going to see better production out of Matthews this year with a new DC and hopefully better DL play than we’ve seen in quite a few years.

 

[SoonerPack]

Clay is still a big-time athlete and that is something we don't have a plethora of at this time. MP is bringing in an entirely new D and eliminating one of our few playmakers before the scheme is even implemented would be a bad look. I envision MP using 52 in a multitude of ways including edge and ILB. He could really help in coverage and not having him rush every down would keep the OL/QB on their toes. Yes, 31 isn't a spring chicken but we're talking a Matthews here. They have a legendary ability to play at a pretty high level at more advanced ages well beyond the average pro.

I think we can ALL agree the Capers scheme was outdated and tired. Bringing in a new coach with a brand new scheme could do wonders for a guy like Clay and we have to at least give it a go. If we are sitting here one year from now looking at a 3.5 sack season with only a handful of impact plays, I could probably get down with this idea. I may be completely wrong but I am betting 52 has a bit of a renaissance year and I imagine MP is banking on this as well.

 

[Dantés]

I am decidedly against the idea of cutting Matthews (because it's stupid), but I would offer a little caution to those thinking that Pettine will rejuvenate him. For one, I don't know how much better he could realistically be at age 31. Despite the ravings of ignorant pitchfork holders, he was still pretty good last season. Secondly, Pettine's defenses have rarely featured dominance at edge rusher. He was a DC/HC from 2009-2015 (7 seasons). Paul Kruger had 11 sacks in 2014, while Williams had 13 sacks in 2013 and Hughes had 10. Those are the only instances of double digit sacks in seven seasons.

There is a little bit of a chicken/egg conundrum here, as he lacked edge rushing talent in 2015 and during his time with the Jets. But I don't think there's a strong case to be made that he's a big plus for the stats of a given team's edge rushers.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Clay is still a big-time athlete and that is something we don't have a plethora of at this time. MP is bringing in an entirely new D and eliminating one of our few playmakers before the scheme is even implemented would be a bad look. I envision MP using 52 in a multitude of ways including edge and ILB. He could really help in coverage and not having him rush every down would keep the OL/QB on their toes.

I like your optimism about Matthews entering this season but highly doubt that he will be effective in coverage.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I like your optimism about Matthews entering this season but highly doubt that he will be effective in coverage.

Clay Matthews is "just a guy" in coverage. And I keep coming back to the question raised when Matthews played in the middle: "How in h*ll does an ILB go 2 straight games without making a tackle?" That's an unprecedented level of cluelessness.

 

[SoonerPack]

I like your optimism about Matthews entering this season but highly doubt that he will be effective in coverage.

We'll see. Covering guys on deeper routes won't be his strong suit for sure but over the middle and in closer quarters I believe he can be an asset. His quick burst, explosiveness in compacted areas should and length work in his favor. Consistently running with guys on wheel routes, go routes and the like will be where he gets beaten. Let's be honest though, there are a handful of guys that can handle that responsibility on a consistent basis.

 

[easyk83]

Clay is still a big-time athlete and that is something we don't have a plethora of at this time. MP is bringing in an entirely new D and eliminating one of our few playmakers before the scheme is even implemented would be a bad look. I envision MP using 52 in a multitude of ways including edge and ILB. He could really help in coverage and not having him rush every down would keep the OL/QB on their toes. Yes, 31 isn't a spring chicken but we're talking a Matthews here. They have a legendary ability to play at a pretty high level at more advanced ages well beyond the average pro.

I think we can ALL agree the Capers scheme was outdated and tired. Bringing in a new coach with a brand new scheme could do wonders for a guy like Clay and we have to at least give it a go. If we are sitting here one year from now looking at a 3.5 sack season with only a handful of impact plays, I could probably get down with this idea. I may be completely wrong but I am betting 52 has a bit of a renaissance year and I imagine MP is banking on this as well.

He had a strong finish last year once Capers stopped ****ing around and started getting Clay out wide. Out in the 7 and wide 9 tech it was like he found his old burst, ability to bend around corners and even showed his counter move again. Stack Clay up over an OT and he's just average, but get him outside and the old man can still get it done.

 

[mradtke66]

He had a strong finish last year once Capers stopped ****ing around and started getting Clay out wide. Out in the 7 and wide 9 tech it was like he found his old burst, ability to bend around corners and even showed his counter move again. Stack Clay up over an OT and he's just average, but get him outside and the old man can still get it done.

This is something I noticed, as in my opinion, IS something you can rail on Capers for.

He was a very run-minded defensive coordinator. It showed with how he used his OLBs in particular. EDGE players were aligned more as a 5-technique (7-tech to the TE side) and seemed very obviously (to me, anyway) that he was to rush through the outside shoulder of his man and maintain outside contain. On first down, that makes sense. On 3rd and long, less so.

It also seemed like Clay was given more freedom to do this once Perry got injured. Perry got most of the free rushes from the right side early, Clay got them later and as a result, his sack rate went up.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

We'll see. Covering guys on deeper routes won't be his strong suit for sure but over the middle and in closer quarters I believe he can be an asset. His quick burst, explosiveness in compacted areas should and length work in his favor. Consistently running with guys on wheel routes, go routes and the like will be where he gets beaten. Let's be honest though, there are a handful of guys that can handle that responsibility on a consistent basis.

The Packers are definitely better off with Matthews not having to drop into coverage on a consistent basis.

 

[Conso]

It's time to cut him. He is not an impact defender anymore. The TD pass from Newton to McCaffrey when we got eliminated from the playoffs by Carolina sums up what he is now. All bark no bite. He called out the wrong route, Cam made fun of him pre-snap, then Clay got sonned like a little kid by the left tackle/tripped and fell down. He wasn't a factor on the play and probably confused Josh Jones in the process of trying to be a "leader". I'd like to put Clay's $11 million cap # towards making Aaron happy with his impending mega-extension and go get Harold Landry to be a cheaper, younger, better replacement via the draft. Thoughts?

You don’t cut a guy for one mistake, even Aaron has had bad games, you going to cut him too? Not to mention we had Capers in charge of the defense. He may be getting old but considering we had TT in charge and Capers running the D I’m inclined to give him a pass for at least another 2 seasons with the new leadership before the talk of cutting him becomes real.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

He may be getting old but considering we had TT in charge and Capers running the D I’m inclined to give him a pass for at least another 2 seasons with the new leadership before the talk of cutting him becomes real.

The Packers have to make a decision on Matthews next offseason as he's set to become a free agent in 2019 though.

 

[easyk83]

This is something I noticed, as in my opinion, IS something you can rail on Capers for.

He was a very run-minded defensive coordinator. It showed with how he used his OLBs in particular. EDGE players were aligned more as a 5-technique (7-tech to the TE side) and seemed very obviously (to me, anyway) that he was to rush through the outside shoulder of his man and maintain outside contain. On first down, that makes sense. On 3rd and long, less so.

It also seemed like Clay was given more freedom to do this once Perry got injured. Perry got most of the free rushes from the right side early, Clay got them later and as a result, his sack rate went up.

With Capers my beefs were with the execution which suggests an overly complicated scheme, the way he used his OLBs and really I saw him as a brilliant guy who was just too wedded to his system. His best defense was not a classic Capers defense. In his units he likes to keep his safeties even and mix their drops and rotations. In 10 it was just Nick Collins playing centerfielder with a role player like Peprah playing up in the box. This maximized Collins talent by forcing quarterbacks to throw over crowded passing lanes and allowed Collins to run stuff down.

Perry as a powerful bull rusher has the makeup to attack head up or outside shoulder. Clay has an average bull rush but its most effective when he can mix it up with his outside inside moves. Kind of like a pitcher who can play up his 3rd and 4th offerings because his fastball change up combo is lights out.