Bobby Tonyan

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think you see a mix bag of what 1st and 2nd round picks are drafted for. Some are hopeful rookie starters, some are long term investments in positions where finding that kind of talent immediately is usually a top 5 pick.

Gary was an investment. All the 1st and 2nd round picks on DB's that the Packers have used over the past 6+ years were thought to be in immediate starters. Many of them didn't even turn out to be capable backups for the Packers or other teams.

So far Gute has had mixed results in "going off script" or what many think he should be doing in the draft. His first draft (2018) is proving to be mostly fails. The 2019 and 2020 draft I think is a mix bag, but still too early to conclude.

 

[GleefulGary]

So far Gute has drafted a top 3 CB in the NFL, and OL that can play just about every position at an above average rate.

Regardless of the rest, he’s doing fine at minimum.

 

[longtimefan]

So far Gute has drafted a top 3 CB in the NFL, and OL that can play just about every position at an above average rate.

Regardless of the rest, he’s doing fine at minimum.

Thems the facts

 

[PackAttack12]

But i'm certain they didn't view him as back up player.

Long term, I'm sure you're correct. For this season, I'm not convinced.

 

[Dantés]

We're coming up on the end of year three with Gute's first offseason, where we can really get a good grip on how he did that first year. His first draft was neither a homerun, nor a total miss.

We all go into drafts with dreams of the entire class being studs, but the reality is that 3-4 useful players is a good draft.

All-Pro level corner, depth corner, guys filling out the bottom of the WR depth chart-- it's OK.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say they didn't draft anyone in the first 3 rounds to be a "backup"

The Packers definitely plan on their first three picks in this year's draft at some point but it was pretty obvious from the get-go none of them will contribute this season.

That was a mistake considering the Packerd went to the NFCCG in 2019.

The Love pick was one that considered the ugly reality that our first picked successor to Rodgers will likely fail. By taking Love this year the team gets a chance to evaluate him and hopefully he keeps getting better each year. If not they can grab a 2nd rounder or two over the next 4 years or even grab another first rounder.

How about using those draft picks to improve the talent around the team's HOF quarterback instead?

I think they drafted him to be a crucial cog in LaFleur’s offense that isn’t being used right now bc they don’t have anybody at that position.

Deguara’s role is not an easy one. Hard to fill, hard to find.

I would have been fine with using a day three pick on Deguara but don't like Gutekunst selected him in the third round.

Pretty normal for rookies to be non starters for a season or 2 from every round in the draft.

That's true but it's not normal for an entire rookie class to hardly contribute anything during their first season.

The Packers rank dead last in the league in snaps played by prospects drafted in the first three rounds with a total of only 80 snaps played.

 

[Mondio]

My guess is, if everything goes well, they’ll keep that distinction.

 

[PackAttack12]

The Packers rank dead last in the league in snaps played by prospects drafted in the first three rounds with a total of only 80 snaps played.

This is crazy, but it's what happens when DeGuara gets hurt in fairness. I still agree with the overall point about the line of thinking with the draft picks. Because picks 1 and 2 were never going to be big contributors regardless.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

This is crazy, but it's what happens when DeGuara gets hurt in fairness. I still agree with the overall point about the line of thinking with the draft picks. Because picks 1 and 2 were never going to be big contributors regardless.

While I understand Gute and the Packers rationale for the first 2 picks, I would disagree with the notion that the Packers couldn't have used them on players that would have provided more of an immediate impact. Both players drafted were at best 2nd and most likely 3rd string.

 

[PackAttack12]

While I understand Gute and the Packers rationale for the first 2 picks, I would disagree with the notion that the Packers couldn't have used them on players that would have provided more of an immediate impact. Both players drafted were at best 2nd and most likely 3rd string.

Agreed, I think my post was poorly worded. I was vehemently against Love and Dillon. If in fact we lose Jones in the offseason and Dillon replaces him at least adequately, then I'll consider revising my position.

Hopefully Love proves me wrong one of these days. I just don't see it. Not sure he has "it".

 

[easyk83]

How about using those draft picks to improve the talent around the team's HOF quarterback instead?

Personally I would have preferred Higgins who has been a pretty good rookie receiver this year. I wasn't so much supporting the decision to draft Love as much as explaining why I think they did select Love.

 

[gopkrs]

Ahhh...to have hindsight. Whether you liked him or not; there were probably others you liked also. My thought (and I have no proof) is that of all the W/Os drafted in the first two rounds; only a few are having really good seasons. And one of them is the guy from Minnihaha who most of you did not like at all.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Ahhh...to have hindsight. Whether you liked him or not; there were probably others you liked also. My thought (and I have no proof) is that of all the W/Os drafted in the first two rounds; only a few are having really good seasons. And one of them is the guy from Minnihaha who most of you did not like at all.

I don't disagree with the Love and Dillon picks, since if either or both players turn into quality starters, they were solid picks. However, it was pretty obvious, without hindsight, that neither Love or Dillion were drafted to play much in 2020. So I totally understand how some Packer fans are feeling both or at least one of those picks should have been used on a player that at least had a shot at immediately improving a 13-3 team.

Love is a boom or bust pick at a very expensive position to find top talent. We won't know for several years if he was the steal of the draft or the wasted pick that many feel he might have been.

Dillon was selected to take over for either Jones or Williams in 2021.

 

[gopkrs]

I was listening to some commentary about the Eagles and their QB situation. One guy said that they were at that point where they were just good enough so that they will not draft high enough anytime soon to get their franchise QB if Wentz or their 2nd rounder does not work out. IMO that is why we picked Love. Like you say Pokerbrat...boom or bust there...as are a lot of QB picks...ala Wentz.??

 

[Mondio]

In general, if you're drafting for immediate impact, you likely aren't very good. Could we have used different picks, sure. Are rookie WR's likely to have a big impact? not really "could they have picked one that did? sure. are there many DL having big impacts their rookie year? not usually. ILB's? same say Queen is, some say not. I've only seen 1 Ravens game really, the last one. He made a nice INT on a deflected ball but other than that nothing stood out for me.

anyway, the Love pick is what it is. If he's good, Qb's have different rules when drafting and i'm ok with it. In many years in the recent past, 3 RB's hasn't been enough, I think they were counting on Dillion to be playing a fair amount right now if nothing else to keep Jones and Wiliams just as fresh for the post season as there are now. Degura was getting getting more snaps early and was then out for the year. They have nobody doing what they used him for now. My guess is they had plans for him this year but we'll never know.

 

[Mondio]

I was listening to some commentary about the Eagles and their QB situation. One guy said that they were at that point where they were just good enough so that they will not draft high enough anytime soon to get their franchise QB if Wentz or their 2nd rounder does not work out. IMO that is why we picked Love. Like you say Pokerbrat...boom or bust there...as are a lot of QB picks...ala Wentz.??

Wentz has fallen off a cliff. though year for sure as a QB with everyone around him and crap Oline etc, but he's bee affected. His game looks completely different. Not sure he recovers from this.

 

[GleefulGary]

The Packers definitely plan on their first three picks in this year's draft at some point but it was pretty obvious from the get-go none of them will contribute this season.

That was a mistake considering the Packerd went to the NFCCG in 2019.



How about using those draft picks to improve the talent around the team's HOF quarterback instead?



I would have been fine with using a day three pick on Deguara but don't like Gutekunst selected him in the third round.



That's true but it's not normal for an entire rookie class to hardly contribute anything during their first season.

The Packers rank dead last in the league in snaps played by prospects drafted in the first three rounds with a total of only 80 snaps played.

In the one game Deguara was completely healthy, he got a little over 30% of the offensive snaps. On game one as a rookie. I think it’s safe to assume that would have increased.

If he was healthy, he’s playing a good role on an excellent offense. But I guess that’s a pick with no chance at helping the immediate.

Then you have Dillon, who has missed a lot of time with COVID. Hard to predict that. Meanwhile, here’s LaFleur on Dillon as of this week: "We're going to be careful with him because he's extremely important to the stretch run here."

Again, I can understand not liking the picks. But immediate contribution from draft picks is overrated. You’re not drafting them for year 1 in most cases.

 

[jon]

Hopefully Love proves me wrong one of these days. I just don't see it. Not sure he has "it".

I don't see it either.

I am thinking about Russel Wilson coming out of college into a starting role and doing well. Obviously, he is a major exception, but if Love is Roger's replacement wouldn't we expect to see him at least achieve #2 status by now? He's not even active against Boyle, a guy the GM obviously believes is not a franchise QB.

 

[longtimefan]

How one can tell a player doesnt have "it" with out even seeing this player in a game setting? Ie preseaons games

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

This whole "Love is the #3 QB right now, so he must be a bust" is getting old. I realize that most of you aren't actually saying "bust", but you might as well. We aren't talking about a 3rd string RB, CB, LB, etc. that would see meaningful developmental snaps during a game, we are talking about a freaking backup QB. Aaron Rodgers is the Packers starting QB and there is miles between his skill level and the backups. This isn't a Foles or Trubisky situation. Throw in the fact that Love had a shortened training camp and no preseason games, and you have your answers as to why he is the #3.

Now if the Packers were 3-9, I would have expected Love to be active on Game days and he and Boyle would both play. However, that isn't the case and until Love actually plays a game (preseason or regular season), those trying to evaluate him based on depth position, are really reaching to try and make a point.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

How one can tell a player doesnt have "it" with out even seeing this player in a game setting? Ie preseaons games

Stop peaking at my posts in advance!

 

[Dantés]

People can obviously discuss whatever they want to, and I’m not complaining here, but I find it a little bit shocking that people are content to have the same argument about the draft picks day after day after day.

 

[PackAttack12]

How one can tell a player doesnt have "it" with out even seeing this player in a game setting? Ie preseaons games

It's a determination that I have made based on his play and studying his demeanor. I could be completely off base (wouldn't be the first time nor the last), but it's an element that is considered by every personnel person in the NFL when evaluating quarterbacks.

It would be a lot easier for NFL GMs though if they were able to watch college players participate in preseason games before drafting them though.

 

[jon]

I am not Love bashing and the jury is not only still out, it hasn't seen much evidence on which to base a decision.

But we are seeing some indications. Rodgers played a bit in his rookie season. Garbage time and not much of it, but he showed enough to his coaches to get on the field.

Does this make Love a 'bust'? Obviously not, but it is, if not concerning, well, it can't be called encouraging as weeks go by with GB holding some decent second half leads.

What, then, is our basis for thinking he's going to be good? In Gute we trust?

 

[longtimefan]

I am not Love bashing and the jury is not only still out, it hasn't seen much evidence on which to base a decision.

But we are seeing some indications. Rodgers played a bit in his rookie season. Garbage time and not much of it, but he showed enough to his coaches to get on the field.

Does this make Love a 'bust'? Obviously not, but it is, if not concerning, well, it can't be called encouraging as weeks go by with GB holding some decent second half leads.

What, then, is our basis for thinking he's going to be good? In Gute we trust?

So do you use a roster spot for a 3rd string qb, who didnt have a traditional off season?

Imo that if this was a normal season I believe by now he would be moved up