Why is Sean Payton considered a better HC than MM?

[red4tribe]

As we are playing the Saints on Sunday night, I spent a litte bit of time comparing the careers of MM and Sean Payton. They are extremely similar.

Year hired
MM- 2006
Payton- 2006

Regular Season Record and Winning Percentage
MM- 87-47-1, .649
Payton- 75-43, .636

Playoff Record
MM- 6-5
Payton- 6-4

Division Titles
MM- 4
Payton- 3

Lombardi Trophies
MM- 1
Payton- 1

Challenge Success Rate
MM- 48.5%
Payton- 42.0%

Yet, as you'll see in the NFL Head Coach power ranking below, Payton is consistently ranked above MM. In the three rankings, MM came in at 6, 6 and 9. Payton came in at 5, 2, and 4. They both have future HOF, have run high powered offenses and both have had suspect defenses. Why does Payton get more credit than MM?

http://www.nfl.com/photoessays/0ap2000000365040
http://cover32.com/2014/02/04/power-rankings-rating-nfl-head-coaches-from-1-32/
http://www.nfl.com/photoessays/0ap1000000208735

 

[Forget Favre]

Number of teams that encouraged it's defense to intentionally injure and sideline opposing players
MM - 0
Payton - 1

 

[Forget Favre]

I dunno. Maybe it's because Payton turned around a bunch of losers into a winning team but with a lot of help from a scandal filled defense?
Mike didn't have to go through with that.
He steps in with an already sorta winning QB and a team with the rich championship winning history.
Also, Green Bay as far as I know, hasn't had any hurricanes or tornados to make the rest of the country feel bad for us and then happy when GB won the SB.

 

[longtimefan]

As we are playing the Saints on Sunday night, I spent a litte bit of time comparing the careers of MM and Sean Payton. They are extremely similar.

Year hired
MM- 2006
Payton- 2006

Regular Season Record and Winning Percentage
MM- 87-47-1, .649
Payton- 75-43, .636

Playoff Record
MM- 6-5
Payton- 6-4

Division Titles
MM- 4
Payton- 3

Lombardi Trophies
MM- 1
Payton- 1

Challenge Success Rate
MM- 48.5%
Payton- 42.0%

Yet, as you'll see in the NFL Head Coach power ranking below, Payton is consistently ranked above MM. In the three rankings, MM came in at 6, 6 and 9. Payton came in at 5, 2, and 4. They both have future HOF, have run high powered offenses and both have had suspect defenses. Why does Payton get more credit than MM?

http://www.nfl.com/photoessays/0ap2000000365040
http://cover32.com/2014/02/04/power-rankings-rating-nfl-head-coaches-from-1-32/
http://www.nfl.com/photoessays/0ap1000000208735

Sean had one less season dont forget

 

[Forget Favre]

Sean had one less season dont forget

That seems to be a point at a couple of the links.
He goes away, they suck again. He comes back, they get better.
He should have a few more seasons of scandal free teams along with a clean SB before making a judgement on how good he really is IMO.

 

[ivo610]

As we are playing the Saints on Sunday night, I spent a litte bit of time comparing the careers of MM and Sean Payton. They are extremely similar.

Year hired
MM- 2006
Payton- 2006

Regular Season Record and Winning Percentage
MM- 87-47-1, .649
Payton- 75-43, .636

Playoff Record
MM- 6-5
Payton- 6-4

Division Titles
MM- 4
Payton- 3

Lombardi Trophies
MM- 1
Payton- 1

Challenge Success Rate
MM- 48.5%
Payton- 42.0%

Yet, as you'll see in the NFL Head Coach power ranking below, Payton is consistently ranked above MM. In the three rankings, MM came in at 6, 6 and 9. Payton came in at 5, 2, and 4. They both have future HOF, have run high powered offenses and both have had suspect defenses. Why does Payton get more credit than MM?

http://www.nfl.com/photoessays/0ap2000000365040
http://cover32.com/2014/02/04/power-rankings-rating-nfl-head-coaches-from-1-32/
http://www.nfl.com/photoessays/0ap1000000208735

They are close in success, but Payton is a RAH RAH coach. The one that yells and screams alot. People buy into his big personality and give him more credit. Its why you still hear Grudens name for possible coaching positions

 

[red4tribe]

They are close in success, but Payton is a RAH RAH coach. The one that yells and screams alot. People buy into his big personality and give him more credit. Its why you still hear Grudens name for possible coaching positions

That was an initial thought of mine. MM is a lot more low key and seemingly unemotional, while Payton isn't at all.

 

[profile_removed]

I look at it this way. I think it's a respect thing. If all things were equal I myself would rather play for Payton if I played, and I couldn't even tell you why. You're either a Payton guy or a McCarthy guy.

 

[ivo610]

I look at it this way. I think it's a respect thing. If all things were equal I myself would rather play for Payton if I played, and I couldn't even tell you why. You're either a Payton guy or a McCarthy guy.

free pills?

 

[Bensalama21]

Because according to the media's logic: Sean Payton is more hip and nicer to look at.

 

[Dagger85]

The media loves the coaches who are animated, yell and/or give them something to talk about in pressers. ("We are on to Cincinatti")

McCarthy is the kind of guy who isn't the biggest yeller and doesn't make a ton of jokes. He is very business-like. If you see McCarthy smiling really big on the sideline, you know we are having a good game. Granted, I guess a ton of coaches aren't smiling if their team is having a bad game, but it just seems different with McCarthy.

Some coaches are also on twitter and are very open about things. McCarthy is just kind of old school.

 

[ls1bob]

I like MM personally and if I was a player I would rather play for him. He seems pretty even keel but you can tell when things go bad he gets a little gruff and takes it personally like it is a failure on his part,not the team most of the time. AND when he says he will get involved in a part of the team that is having a problem(run game last year,defense this year)you see results.

 

[Vrill]

That list is automatically bunk. Mike Smith at #11? He could get fired any week now.

 

[rodell330]

I'll take Mike Tomlin over MM or Sean Payton any day!! Hate the steelers but love Mike Tomlin's demeanor, passion, and that he's a true players coach.

 

[NOMOFO]

They are close in success, but Payton is a RAH RAH coach. The one that yells and screams alot. People buy into his big personality and give him more credit. Its why you still hear Grudens name for possible coaching positions

Yep! It's what fans want to see and it kind of makes sense. If we're sitting at home on pins and needles and being emotional, how the heck can the coach be seen on TV not screaming, right?

I agree about Gruden also. I laugh at the "We want Gruden as our coach!" crap. Really? ...and what makes a person think he's a fantastic coach?

 

[NOMOFO]

I'll take Mike Tomlin over MM or Sean Payton any day!! Hate the steelers but love Mike Tomlin's demeanor, passion, and that he's a true players coach.

I think he's awesome as well. One of the classiest coaches in the league as well. After the Pack beat them in the SB a reporter was trying to bait him into giving excuses for why they lost and he looked her in the eye and said "I WILL NOT make excuses! The Packers played better than us, they were the better team and they deserved to win this game."

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I think he's awesome as well. One of the classiest coaches in the league as well.

I wouldn´t call a guy classy who tried to get in the way of a punt returner during last season.

 

[NOMOFO]

I wouldn´t call a guy classy who tried to get in the way of a punt returner during last season.

I would call that a brain fart from a very competitive coach. One event doesn't dictate who a person is. If that were true your irrational love for Greg Olson would make you about the most insane person on this forum.

Yes, that guy is all class.

 

[PackCrazed4]

Piggybacking off what others have said, I think it has everything to do with this:

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

MM is the most under-the-radar coach in the National Football League. His persona is very vanilla by emotional standards; unlike Bill Belichick, he cooperates with the media fully, but doesn't give away many trade secrets and toes his party line diligently. He does little to draw attention to himself, doesn't have outlandish antics on the sideline, doesn't make overly emotional speeches in the locker room and, in fact, leaves most of the motivational moments and roles to his players.

The less interesting, the less scrutiny, the less appreciation.

 

[bozz_2006]

he's not fat.

 

[Raptorman]

Oh, a power ranking on coaches. Which has about as much importance to the game as power ranking the teams. Zero importance. Not even worth reading the article.

 

[NOMOFO]

Oh, a power ranking on coaches. Which has about as much importance to the game as power ranking the teams. Zero importance. Not even worth reading the article.

That's my feeling. My favorite all time has been the Tom Coughlin saga. That guy has gone from the firing line to coach of the year candidate back to the firing line faster than Brent Fvfer can throw a pick six. I remember a few years back I was watching an early season game and they said he would very possibly be fired the next day. Just 5 weeks later he was being hailed as a coach of the year candidate!

 

[TJV]

I really don't care which is considered the better HC, I just want to see McCarthy win another Super Bowl. If he does and Payton doesn’t that will, or should, end the discussion. But I won't care if it does or not. What I find interesting is at the time of McCarthy’s hiring, Sean Payton not only interviewed for the job but really thought he may get it. Thompson zeroed in on two very good HCs. This is from a Vandermause article written in February of 2010:

The similarities between McCarthy and Payton are striking. Both are 46 and were born within seven weeks of each other in 1963. Both were quarterbacks coaches as they worked their way through the NFL ranks. Both have creative offensive minds with track records for producing explosive attacks. Both have reputations for grooming top-of-the-line quarterbacks. Both were ready to land their first head coaching jobs in 2006 and interviewed with Thompson for the Packers’ position. Once hired, both traveled nearly identical paths in the standings and are among just four survivors from that large coaching class.

Payton guided the Saints to the NFC title game in his first season as coach. McCarthy led the Packers to the NFC championship game in his second year. Both lost their initial bids to qualify for the Super Bowl and stumbled to losing records the next season.Both compiled the same four-year regular-season records (38-26) and heading into this year’s playoffs also had matching 1-1 postseason marks.

http://archive.greenbaypressgazette...reen-Bay-Packers-New-Orleans-Saints-lot-alike

Reading the article knowing what happens about one year after it was written…

 

[El Guapo]

What pimple-faced kid did they pay to log the number of times a player or coach made it onto the television? Mind bogglingly useless info.

I agree that it's mostly about how bad the Saints were before Sean P turned them around, and the feel-good story surrounding their emergence post-Katrina. Turning around a perennially bad team nicknamed "The Ain'ts" into a perennial playoff team says something. Had MM pulled a Holmgren with the Packers instead of just dusting off a perfectly good donut that was the Packers in 2005, he might get a little more.

His record certainly bears his credentials.

 

[Forget Favre]

MM... ....doesn't make overly emotional speeches in the locker room and, in fact, leaves most of the motivational moments and roles to his players.

The less interesting, the less scrutiny, the less appreciation.

Yeah, I noticed that in comparing post game locker rooms.
Other coaches go on sermons and Mike is like, "Good job guys. Great win. See ya Tuesday." and that's pretty much it yet I watch to expect something different.