Vikings

[Zombieslayer]

But most Packer fans assume that he is going to step in and be able to play as well, if not better then Favre. Given the history of new QB's in the league that is expecting too much. Sure he has 3 years riding the bench, or "learning" the system, but he has very little time on the field. You can only learn so much in practice. How well Rodgers does will be how well the Packers do. Since we have seen so little of him it is hard to judge how well he will do. Just hope the Packers are not into the Miami problem of finding someone to replace Marino.

I disagree.

I'm under the impression that most Packer fans see Favre's retirement as a step back for the Green Bay Packers.

Take a look at our record predictions thread. Almost everyone says worse than last year because of Favre's retirement. Well, Obi1 said 16-0, but he says that every year.

I would say that most reasonable packer fans see it that way. But if it is "almost everyone", then there sure is a vocal minority on this site.

Nodak - this is the thread I was referring to:
http://www.packerforum.com/index.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=15320&finish=25&start=0

It's still active, and by last count, there were more folks saying we'd be under 13-3 than over 13-3.

 

[Zombieslayer]

Really? I think I'm going to have to throw a flag on that comment. (Is "illeagal use of the hands - hands to the keyboard" a five post or a ten post penalty?)

Adrian Peterson 2007:
1341 yards on 238 carries, 5.6 yards per attempt, 12 TDs

Chester Taylor 2007:
844 yards on 157 carrries, 5.4 YPA, 7 TDs

5.4 doesn't look that much worse than 5.6. In the first game that AD was out, Taylor ran for 165 yards on 22 carries, for a 7.5 average, and 3 touchdowns. That doesn't look like the run game went into free-fall with AD out. In the second game, CT ran a bunch, but it was all in garbage time. That was the game against the Giants where the D scored three times, and the Vikings hung 41 points on New York before anyone knew what happened.

It's true that the running game carried the offense last year, but both players played well. Even if AD gets hurt again, the Vikings will still be able to run the ball well with CT.

Heh. Here I am defending a Viking fan.

Chester Taylor is a dang fine RB, and I'd be more than happy to see him in a Packer uniform. You have 2 exceptional RBs, and the young one is one of the top 3 RBs in the NFL. He may even give LT a run. We'll see.

That's why I used a plural when I said RBs. I didn't say RB, I said RBs. Thanks for filling in the stats. You proved me right.

 

[Raptorman]

Heh. Here I am defending a Viking fan.

Careful, you will be called a traitor if you do it to much. :lol:

 

[cheesey]

Heh. Here I am defending a Viking fan.

Careful, you will be called a traitor if you do it to much. :lol:

(ONCE is too much!!!!) :wink:

But i have also defended Viking fans, so i guess i'm a traitor too! I'm a regular "Eggs" Benedict Arnold! (Hey......was he any relation to Tom Arnold?) :lol:

 

[Zombieslayer]

Heh. Here I am defending a Viking fan.

Careful, you will be called a traitor if you do it to much. :lol:

Several of the Viking fans on this board are genuinely good people. One of them is exceptionally funny, giving Cheesey a run for his money as the funniest person on this board, and there's one more who has a dry wit that gets me a chuckle every now and then.

We all have flaws. You guys just happen to root for the wrong team.
Of course, as humans, you're always entitled to fix your flaws.

 

[cheesey]

Heh. Here I am defending a Viking fan.

Careful, you will be called a traitor if you do it to much. :lol:

Several of the Viking fans on this board are genuinely good people. One of them is exceptionally funny, giving Cheesey a run for his money as the funniest person on this board, and there's one more who has a dry wit that gets me a chuckle every now and then.

We all have flaws. You guys just happen to root for the wrong team.
Of course, as humans, you're always entitled to fix your flaws.

Thats true..........there are some Packer fans that i would gladly "trade" for some of these Viking fans! :wink:
Maybe TT can make a deal for us!!! :lol:

Hey Zombie.......your next post is number 4000! How ya gonna celebrate?

 

[Raptorman]

Heh. Here I am defending a Viking fan.

Careful, you will be called a traitor if you do it to much. :lol:

Several of the Viking fans on this board are genuinely good people. One of them is exceptionally funny, giving Cheesey a run for his money as the funniest person on this board, and there's one more who has a dry wit that gets me a chuckle every now and then.

We all have flaws. You guys just happen to root for the wrong team.
Of course, as humans, you're always entitled to fix your flaws.

Did you say dry s.......never mind, you said wit.

 

[Vikeman]

Heh. Here I am defending a Viking fan.

Careful, you will be called a traitor if you do it to much. :lol:

Several of the Viking fans on this board are genuinely good people. One of them is exceptionally funny, giving Cheesey a run for his money as the funniest person on this board, and there's one more who has a dry wit that gets me a chuckle every now and then.

We all have flaws. You guys just happen to root for the wrong team.
Of course, as humans, you're always entitled to fix your flaws.

I am the best Viking fan here...just ask Cheesey...he loves me!

 

[cheesey]

Heh. Here I am defending a Viking fan.

Careful, you will be called a traitor if you do it to much. :lol:

Several of the Viking fans on this board are genuinely good people. One of them is exceptionally funny, giving Cheesey a run for his money as the funniest person on this board, and there's one more who has a dry wit that gets me a chuckle every now and then.

We all have flaws. You guys just happen to root for the wrong team.
Of course, as humans, you're always entitled to fix your flaws.

I am the best Viking fan here...just ask Cheesey...he loves me!

Me love you long time Vikeman!!!!! :lol:

 

[Zombieslayer]

Thats true..........there are some Packer fans that i would gladly "trade" for some of these Viking fans! :wink:
Maybe TT can make a deal for us!!! :lol:

Hey Zombie.......your next post is number 4000! How ya gonna celebrate?

By sweeping da Bears and beating the Cows. That would make '08 just splendid.

 

[Zombieslayer]

Thats true..........there are some Packer fans that i would gladly "trade" for some of these Viking fans! :wink:
Maybe TT can make a deal for us!!! :lol:

Hey Zombie.......your next post is number 4000! How ya gonna celebrate?

By sweeping da Bears and beating the Cows. That would make '08 just splendid.

Heh. I'm a GM now. Move over, TT.

 

[cheesey]

Thats true..........there are some Packer fans that i would gladly "trade" for some of these Viking fans! :wink:
Maybe TT can make a deal for us!!! :lol:

Hey Zombie.......your next post is number 4000! How ya gonna celebrate?

By sweeping da Bears and beating the Cows. That would make '08 just splendid.

Heh. I'm a GM now. Move over, TT.

I heard the Detroit Lions were gonna try to trade you for Matt Millen and some other things to sweeten the pot. Ryan was gonna make the trade, but the Lions wouldn't make the trade with what Ryan wanted for you. Ryan was asking for Millen, and the naming rights to "Ford Field". He was gonna have it renamed "Packerforum Field". The Lions counter offered him the naming rights and Millen for you, a six pack of Miller light and a package of Johnsonville Brats. But Ryan thought that was too steep. :lol:

 

[packerfan1245]

yeah but nodak.... your so called "bend but dont break" defense got broke more often than bending 8 times last year.


you can make stats say anything you want them to say. But i say your pass defense sucked last year because we threw for 700 yards against you and theres only one stat that you cant argue.

0-2 in 08 against the packers.

Let's see what the record is this season...

TO be honest, with Fav-re at the helm, and no Vikings pass rush, it doesn't surprise me that the pack put up decent passing numbers against us last year.

This year, however, you won't have Fav-re, and we will have a pass rush.

LOL. Vikings fans are so happy that Favre is done. They think they have a chance. Holy crap you made my day.

 

[Raptorman]

yeah but nodak.... your so called "bend but dont break" defense got broke more often than bending 8 times last year.


you can make stats say anything you want them to say. But i say your pass defense sucked last year because we threw for 700 yards against you and theres only one stat that you cant argue.

0-2 in 08 against the packers.

Since I'm bored and have nothing better to do. I would not blame the Vikings D for all 8 losses. I would blame the offense. If you hold other teams to 19.2 points a game your offense has to step up and score some points.

And the first game last year if I remember correct wasn't over until the Packers made an interception in the last minute or so. So did you win, yes, did you kill us the first game, no. Now the second game, well that was just bad.

And I wouldn't expect the Packers to put up 700 yards passing against the Vikings this year. But then who knows, AR may be the second coming of Favre.

 

[NodakPaul]

LOL. Vikings fans are so happy that Favre is done. They think they have a chance. Holy crap you made my day.

LOL. Some Packer fans think that Rodgers will be as good as Fav-re. They think they have a chance. Hold crap you made my day.

 

[Zombieslayer]

Since I'm bored and have nothing better to do. I would not blame the Vikings D for all 8 losses. I would blame the offense. If you hold other teams to 19.2 points a game your offense has to step up and score some points.

Agreed. When you're allowing under 20 points a game, you should be better than 8-8. So I'd too put the blame on the O, not the D.

 

[packerfan1245]

LOL. Vikings fans are so happy that Favre is done. They think they have a chance. Holy crap you made my day.

LOL. Some Packer fans think that Rodgers will be as good as Fav-re. They think they have a chance. Hold crap you made my day.

The question is not is he better then Favre. The Question is "is he better then Jackson?"

Hell Yeah he is.

 

[Formo]

LOL. Vikings fans are so happy that Favre is done. They think they have a chance. Holy crap you made my day.

LOL. Some Packer fans think that Rodgers will be as good as Fav-re. They think they have a chance. Hold crap you made my day.

The question is not is he better then Favre. The Question is "is he better then Jackson?"

Hell Yeah he is.

Based on what? Your supreme football intelligence? You guys (well.. no one really) haven't seen enough of Rodgers to stake any sort of claim on him. Sorry, you have to play the 'waiting game' on Rodgers for this coming season, and more than likely next season as well, much like us Viking fans had/have to do for T-Jack.

Fellas, you are forgetting that T-Jack is in his 2nd year starting. Childress is letting the reigns a bit loose on him as far as the playcalling goes (or so he claims). Jackson is not only learning the playbook (which I hear is the size of a Twin Cities phonebook) but is also learning to read defenses. He's been thrown to the wolves the past season, partially to help his learning process, but also because the alternative was worse for the team. Jackson hasn't even played a full year yet, and he's got people (Viking fans as well as Pack fans) writing him off like he's Rex Grossman. And fight it as you will, you can't compare the two until/if he sucked as long as Rex has. This will be the year to make a judgment call on Jackson, not last year, or the 2 pitiful starts the year before.

And in defense of Childress, yes, he had an outstanding RB in AD. But no one really knew how outstanding he was until the game at Soldier Field, and he did a repeat performance in the 'Dome against the Chargers. Those games were not in the first 5 weeks of the season. Chilly didn't want to run AD into that 'rookie wall' later in the season. In '06, Chester Taylor hit that wall because it was his first season as a featured back. Not to mention AD doesn't have the softest hands, or is the best pass blocking back, either. AD, just like T-Jack, is learning the offense. Childress was giving AD breaks to help with his development and his fatigue-factor.

So... with that given. How is Childress a horrible coach? I'm not saying he's the best... but given what he had the past two years, in the style of offense he's running, I gotta say, the Vikings final record was right about where I expected.

 

[Zombieslayer]

Based on what? Your supreme football intelligence? You guys (well.. no one really) haven't seen enough of Rodgers to stake any sort of claim on him. Sorry, you have to play the 'waiting game' on Rodgers for this coming season, and more than likely next season as well, much like us Viking fans had/have to do for T-Jack.

Fellas, you are forgetting that T-Jack is in his 2nd year starting. Childress is letting the reigns a bit loose on him as far as the playcalling goes (or so he claims). Jackson is not only learning the playbook (which I hear is the size of a Twin Cities phonebook) but is also learning to read defenses. He's been thrown to the wolves the past season, partially to help his learning process, but also because the alternative was worse for the team. Jackson hasn't even played a full year yet, and he's got people (Viking fans as well as Pack fans) writing him off like he's Rex Grossman. And fight it as you will, you can't compare the two until/if he sucked as long as Rex has. This will be the year to make a judgment call on Jackson, not last year, or the 2 pitiful starts the year before.

And in defense of Childress, yes, he had an outstanding RB in AD. But no one really knew how outstanding he was until the game at Soldier Field, and he did a repeat performance in the 'Dome against the Chargers. Those games were not in the first 5 weeks of the season. Chilly didn't want to run AD into that 'rookie wall' later in the season. In '06, Chester Taylor hit that wall because it was his first season as a featured back. Not to mention AD doesn't have the softest hands, or is the best pass blocking back, either. AD, just like T-Jack, is learning the offense. Childress was giving AD breaks to help with his development and his fatigue-factor.

So... with that given. How is Childress a horrible coach? I'm not saying he's the best... but given what he had the past two years, in the style of offense he's running, I gotta say, the Vikings final record was right about where I expected.

Formo - Heh. Here I was preparing to argue with you, but I can't. What you said from a logical standpoint makes sense. All I can counter is we'll see by the end of '08.

As for Childress though, I've watched your Offensive playcalling and will stand by what I've said earlier - it's inferior to MM's playcalling. Childress won't make the necessary changes as the game goes on. It becomes predictable, and opposing Ds find ways to shut him down.

 

[NodakPaul]

LOL. Vikings fans are so happy that Favre is done. They think they have a chance. Holy crap you made my day.

LOL. Some Packer fans think that Rodgers will be as good as Fav-re. They think they have a chance. Hold crap you made my day.

The question is not is he better then Favre. The Question is "is he better then Jackson?"

Hell Yeah he is.

Hell, he probably is - although that remains to be seen. But it doesn't matter. I think that Fav-re was more instrumental in your 13-3 record than TJack was in our 8-8. We've upgraded the rest of our team (significantly), while you've lost the most important part of yours.

So yes, I am happy that Fav-re is gone, just as I am sure you were when Moss left. And yes, I do think that the Vikings have as much of a chance at taking the NFL North as the Pack does.

 

[NodakPaul]

Formo - Heh. Here I was preparing to argue with you, but I can't. What you said from a logical standpoint makes sense. All I can counter is we'll see by the end of '08.

As for Childress though, I've watched your Offensive playcalling and will stand by what I've said earlier - it's inferior to MM's playcalling. Childress won't make the necessary changes as the game goes on. It becomes predictable, and opposing Ds find ways to shut him down.

Childress really doesn't call the plays, Bevell took over at the beginning of last year. One of Childress's biggest critiques was that he was too married to the offense, and missed the whole team approach. He took that in stride, and improved on it last year considerably.

But I understand what you were trying to say - in 06 he was horrible at adjustments, and rightly deserved the criticism. However, in 07 he was much better. If you look back at the game logs, the Vikings played better in the second half almost every game. That means that the adjustments were working. I think a lot had to do with him giving up play calling IMHO.

 

[Zero2Cool]

The difference between Tavaris and Aaron?

Aaron has a coach who knows how to coach to win games.

 

[Formo]

Based on what? Your supreme football intelligence? You guys (well.. no one really) haven't seen enough of Rodgers to stake any sort of claim on him. Sorry, you have to play the 'waiting game' on Rodgers for this coming season, and more than likely next season as well, much like us Viking fans had/have to do for T-Jack.

Fellas, you are forgetting that T-Jack is in his 2nd year starting. Childress is letting the reigns a bit loose on him as far as the playcalling goes (or so he claims). Jackson is not only learning the playbook (which I hear is the size of a Twin Cities phonebook) but is also learning to read defenses. He's been thrown to the wolves the past season, partially to help his learning process, but also because the alternative was worse for the team. Jackson hasn't even played a full year yet, and he's got people (Viking fans as well as Pack fans) writing him off like he's Rex Grossman. And fight it as you will, you can't compare the two until/if he sucked as long as Rex has. This will be the year to make a judgment call on Jackson, not last year, or the 2 pitiful starts the year before.

And in defense of Childress, yes, he had an outstanding RB in AD. But no one really knew how outstanding he was until the game at Soldier Field, and he did a repeat performance in the 'Dome against the Chargers. Those games were not in the first 5 weeks of the season. Chilly didn't want to run AD into that 'rookie wall' later in the season. In '06, Chester Taylor hit that wall because it was his first season as a featured back. Not to mention AD doesn't have the softest hands, or is the best pass blocking back, either. AD, just like T-Jack, is learning the offense. Childress was giving AD breaks to help with his development and his fatigue-factor.

So... with that given. How is Childress a horrible coach? I'm not saying he's the best... but given what he had the past two years, in the style of offense he's running, I gotta say, the Vikings final record was right about where I expected.

Formo - Heh. Here I was preparing to argue with you, but I can't. What you said from a logical standpoint makes sense. All I can counter is we'll see by the end of '08.

As for Childress though, I've watched your Offensive playcalling and will stand by what I've said earlier - it's inferior to MM's playcalling. Childress won't make the necessary changes as the game goes on. It becomes predictable, and opposing Ds find ways to shut him down.

NodakPaul already stated this, but Chilly doesn't make the offensive calls 100% of the time anymore, Bevell does. Also, if we talking about '06, I wouldn't say his playcalling was inferior to MM's.. I'd lean more towards Chilly was playing Capt. HardAnus, and was limited with what he could call, what with Brad Johnson and later T-Jack at the helm. MM had who? Oh yeah, one of the best, if not THE best QB in the history of the game.

I will give you the rigidity of Chilly's adjustments was really bad. That's the ONLY problem I have with his coaching. Everything else is just fine, if ya ask me.

 

[Zombieslayer]

NodakPaul already stated this, but Chilly doesn't make the offensive calls 100% of the time anymore, Bevell does. Also, if we talking about '06, I wouldn't say his playcalling was inferior to MM's.. I'd lean more towards Chilly was playing Capt. HardAnus, and was limited with what he could call, what with Brad Johnson and later T-Jack at the helm. MM had who? Oh yeah, one of the best, if not THE best QB in the history of the game.

I will give you the rigidity of Chilly's adjustments was really bad. That's the ONLY problem I have with his coaching. Everything else is just fine, if ya ask me.

The game we beat you last year that was close at half-time, AD was giving us fits. I think he already had 100+ yards in the 1st half. Then you guys pulled him in the 2nd half. I think he had like 3 carries in the 2nd half.

Whomever made that call is an idiot.

 

[NodakPaul]

NodakPaul already stated this, but Chilly doesn't make the offensive calls 100% of the time anymore, Bevell does. Also, if we talking about '06, I wouldn't say his playcalling was inferior to MM's.. I'd lean more towards Chilly was playing Capt. HardAnus, and was limited with what he could call, what with Brad Johnson and later T-Jack at the helm. MM had who? Oh yeah, one of the best, if not THE best QB in the history of the game.

I will give you the rigidity of Chilly's adjustments was really bad. That's the ONLY problem I have with his coaching. Everything else is just fine, if ya ask me.

The game we beat you last year that was close at half-time, AD was giving us fits. I think he already had 100+ yards in the 1st half. Then you guys pulled him in the 2nd half. I think he had like 3 carries in the 2nd half.

Whomever made that call is an idiot.

I can't disagree... that game pissed me off as a fan.

But I kind of understand the reported ideas behind it. There was a legitimate concern about overusing AD during the season and him hitting the rookie wall. We didn't want to lose his performance in the stretch, when we needed it the most, so AD was not utilized as much last year as he would be this year. The other reason that I am aware of was that AD, simply put, sucked at pass blocking. He was horrible at it. SO he was very, very rarely put in on passing plays.

Ideally, neither of these issues will exist this year. He is in his second year, so the transition from a 10 or 12 game college season to a full 20+ game NFL season won't be an issue. And pass blocking is something that normally takes a year or so for a RB to pick up on in the NFL.