Transfer portal and NIL Money, how they have changed college sports".

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,593
Reaction score
8,170
Location
Madison, WI
In April of 2021, the NCAA eliminated the rule about sitting out a year. Now, they have granted athletes a one-time waiver to transfer without penalty and with immediate eligibility. It has had major effects on the number of athletes that transfer.

What are peoples thoughts on its impact on college Sports and the athletes?

Personally, I think it is great for the Athlete. They aren't being paid and should be free to change programs if the one they originally committed to is not what they want. I do like the one-time only waiver, otherwise there just might be too much bouncing around.

Things I don't like about it, are the potential for Title chasing. Programs that are already at the top, will probably remain there, since there will most likely be more athletes wanting to transfer into a winning program, if there is an opening at their position.

All sorts or Pro's and Con's of the Transfer Portal. Just in football alone, 1,695 FBS players entered the portal in the 2019-20 cycle but after the eligibility rules changed in 2021, that number increased to 3,085 for the 2021-22 cycle.
 

Voyageur

Cheesehead
Joined
Nov 10, 2021
Messages
2,476
Reaction score
1,960
What's muddying the waters most on the transfer portal is NIL money. It's turned it all into the wild west, and everyone is looking for the gold in them there hills.

Look at the University of Texas as an example. They're going to rise quickly. A booster group threw out a guarantee of $50k a year for each of their offensive linemen. Of course these kids will have to attend a rubber chicken dinner now and then, or visit Billy Bob and his oil buddies on their party barge on Lady Bird Lake to make it legit, but it's there. Don't forget about Arch Manning, who's already getting paid a million dollars a year, and he's just arriving on campus for Texas. He'll red shirt this year, count on it. Land hit the portal, and it's Quinn Ewers job for one or two years. He might opt to go to the NFL after this coming season. I'm not certain how much Ewers is making, but I do know it's substantial.

I do think Fickell is going to do a good job. I also believe there will be decent money in NIL for a lot of these guys heading to Madison. It may not be Texas and Oklahoma oil money sized deals, but it will be substantial enough that they can afford than a 15 year old egg beater for a car.
 
OP
OP
Pokerbrat2000

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,593
Reaction score
8,170
Location
Madison, WI
What's muddying the waters most on the transfer portal is NIL money. It's turned it all into the wild west, and everyone is looking for the gold in them there hills.

Look at the University of Texas as an example. They're going to rise quickly. A booster group threw out a guarantee of $50k a year for each of their offensive linemen. Of course these kids will have to attend a rubber chicken dinner now and then, or visit Billy Bob and his oil buddies on their party barge on Lady Bird Lake to make it legit, but it's there. Don't forget about Arch Manning, who's already getting paid a million dollars a year, and he's just arriving on campus for Texas. He'll red shirt this year, count on it. Land hit the portal, and it's Quinn Ewers job for one or two years. He might opt to go to the NFL after this coming season. I'm not certain how much Ewers is making, but I do know it's substantial.

I do think Fickell is going to do a good job. I also believe there will be decent money in NIL for a lot of these guys heading to Madison. It may not be Texas and Oklahoma oil money sized deals, but it will be substantial enough that they can afford than a 15 year old egg beater for a car.
Great points on NIL and I think this is a case of one feeds the other. A rising star at a small or low ranked school, might be attracted to go to a bigger and more successful program, with big NIL incentives waiting. The transfer portal allows that to happen immediately.

I actually have no issues with Student athletes making money on their name, image, likeness and accomplishments. Not much different than the YouTubers at college that find themselves filthy rich due to sitting in their dorm rooms, making popular vids. I also don't really have an issue with the new transfer portal rules. Since they allow a student athlete the opportunity to get a fresh start at a new school and team, without waiting a year.

Both the new transfer portal rules and NIL are slowly changing the landscape of college athletics. The part I do not like is that I think it changes the competitive balance within most college sports. The top teams will attract more top players and the bottom teams will lose players that have risen to the top. How to fix or change that, is something that I think college sports will need to figure out soon. Maybe limit the number of transfers a team can sign each season?
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
15,893
Reaction score
3,797
They just need to completely disconnect the schools from the football at this point. Build your stadiums, get your coaches pay your players. Finally the paid system for the NFL. Leave academia out of it. They aren't related anymore.
 

Voyageur

Cheesehead
Joined
Nov 10, 2021
Messages
2,476
Reaction score
1,960
They just need to completely disconnect the schools from the football at this point. Build your stadiums, get your coaches pay your players. Finally the paid system for the NFL. Leave academia out of it. They aren't related anymore.

You do realize that will never happen, don't you? It's an impossible scenario.
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
15,893
Reaction score
3,797
You do realize that will never happen, don't you? It's an impossible scenario.
of course, there's way too much money involved for now. I still think it's ridiculous what it's all become. Wouldn't care if it all came to a screeching halt tomorrow. what I once found very enjoyable in amateur sports has been infested all the way down to youth sports and getting worse every year.
 

Voyageur

Cheesehead
Joined
Nov 10, 2021
Messages
2,476
Reaction score
1,960
of course, there's way too much money involved for now. I still think it's ridiculous what it's all become. Wouldn't care if it all came to a screeching halt tomorrow. what I once found very enjoyable in amateur sports has been infested all the way down to youth sports and getting worse every year.
It's pretty much been this way forever. I could tell you stories from over 60 years ago, and how it worked.
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
15,893
Reaction score
3,797
It's pretty much been this way forever. I could tell you stories from over 60 years ago, and how it worked.
I'll take your word for it. I happen to think the tentacles are much more widespread these days. Wish it would have stopped at college instead of infesting high school youth sports too, but it is what it is.
 

Voyageur

Cheesehead
Joined
Nov 10, 2021
Messages
2,476
Reaction score
1,960
I'll take your word for it. I happen to think the tentacles are much more widespread these days. Wish it would have stopped at college instead of infesting high school youth sports too, but it is what it is.
I agree. It is more far reaching than what it was. It's too the point of absurd. The money is outrageous. It's turned into a sham. And it's not going to stop anytime soon. There's too much money on the board for the schools to try to rein it in, without facing serious problems in the courts.

It's a simple plan. the rich get richer, and the poor pay for it.
 

Pkrjones

Cheesehead
Joined
Jul 3, 2014
Messages
3,857
Reaction score
1,767
Location
Northern IL
I initially thought this was a good thing, allowing student athletes to go to a "better situation" without penalizing them by forcing them to sit out a year.

Lately we're seeing the corruption involved with the NIL system & the transfer portal. Student-athletes now are deciding on their school based on NIL money offered. Also, students already in a program are using the transfer portal as leverage to either secure NIL $ from that institution OR using the portal to chase the money.

In just 2 years the corruption & ugly side of both are on full display.
 

Voyageur

Cheesehead
Joined
Nov 10, 2021
Messages
2,476
Reaction score
1,960
I initially thought this was a good thing, allowing student athletes to go to a "better situation" without penalizing them by forcing them to sit out a year.

Lately we're seeing the corruption involved with the NIL system & the transfer portal. Student-athletes now are deciding on their school based on NIL money offered. Also, students already in a program are using the transfer portal as leverage to either secure NIL $ from that institution OR using the portal to chase the money.

In just 2 years the corruption & ugly side of both are on full display.
It's just starting to get ugly. It's going to get a lot worse. I've talked to people inside of this whole thing, and I have to tell you there are HS kids out there who already have verbal contracts to make millions (plural for a reason) of dollars a year from NIL endorsements, "if" they attend specific schools.

Most of it we're never going to hear about, directly, because it's private enterprise.
 
OP
OP
Pokerbrat2000

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,593
Reaction score
8,170
Location
Madison, WI
No doubt both the NIL money and Transfer portal are here to stay and in my opinion, a good thing for a student athlete. However, as you guys are pointing out, both have some serious issues that need to be addressed. My suggestion for the Transfer portal is to cap the number of transfers that a team could take in. That # would have to be set for each sport.

As far as the NIL money, I haven't given it a ton of thought, but much like politics, it may ruin the integrity of many sports. Somehow they need to separate the Universities from the source of the money and cap the amount that each source can give to a program and possibly, set some kind of cap on how much a player can take in. Now I know that last part will set off a few posters here, but so be it.
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
15,893
Reaction score
3,797
It’s going to set off the US court system more than anything. They are no longer student athletes. The only thing that prevents the ruin of collegiate sports at this point is taking back what is the university’s in terms of coaches and facilities and allow real student athletes to play in them and let the professional leagues go be Saturday alternatives to the NFL.
 

Voyageur

Cheesehead
Joined
Nov 10, 2021
Messages
2,476
Reaction score
1,960
How much do these kids end up getting? Depends on position, and how highly rated. That's for incoming freshmen. I've given an article on Arch Manning to look at. But, despite the article's info, I know it's closer to $5 mill in his pocket. Not bad for a kid out of high school. Sure beats the $78 a month I got from the US Army, that I got, then ended up in Nam. I'd take his route first.

then there's the issue of NIL deals being dangled for kids to enter the portal, to get them. It's funny how that works. You play for Bogey Tech, you get a free pizza now and then. But, if you go to Mega Bucks University, there's a new sports car, penthouse apartment to live in, and a neat little $2 mill a year in cash, for the rights to show your image for the building owner where you live, the car dealer, who hands you the car, and all the boosters for that school that want you to attend their off season BBQs, and schmooze with their friends, to give them a testosterone boost.

Want to stop it? How? It's called a right to make a living. It's going to be hard changing the whole thing. If you force it into an equal pay for everyone on a specific team based on their NIL deals you create an even worse mismatch, because the mega buck schools like the University of Texas, where a lot of donors still wear $20k gold nugget belt buckles will bury the average team in donations. After all, the kid is going to go where he makes the most money, in almost every case. In four years of college, a large percentage of these kids can be financially set for life, if they have a solid financial adviser handling things.

Imagine that? An 18 or 19 year old already making more money just out of high school, in 4 years, that will exceed what the majority of us out here will make in a lifetime.


 
OP
OP
Pokerbrat2000

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,593
Reaction score
8,170
Location
Madison, WI
How much do these kids end up getting? Depends on position, and how highly rated. That's for incoming freshmen. I've given an article on Arch Manning to look at. But, despite the article's info, I know it's closer to $5 mill in his pocket. Not bad for a kid out of high school. Sure beats the $78 a month I got from the US Army, that I got, then ended up in Nam. I'd take his route first.

then there's the issue of NIL deals being dangled for kids to enter the portal, to get them. It's funny how that works. You play for Bogey Tech, you get a free pizza now and then. But, if you go to Mega Bucks University, there's a new sports car, penthouse apartment to live in, and a neat little $2 mill a year in cash, for the rights to show your image for the building owner where you live, the car dealer, who hands you the car, and all the boosters for that school that want you to attend their off season BBQs, and schmooze with their friends, to give them a testosterone boost.

Want to stop it? How? It's called a right to make a living. It's going to be hard changing the whole thing. If you force it into an equal pay for everyone on a specific team based on their NIL deals you create an even worse mismatch, because the mega buck schools like the University of Texas, where a lot of donors still wear $20k gold nugget belt buckles will bury the average team in donations. After all, the kid is going to go where he makes the most money, in almost every case. In four years of college, a large percentage of these kids can be financially set for life, if they have a solid financial adviser handling things.

Imagine that? An 18 or 19 year old already making more money just out of high school, in 4 years, that will exceed what the majority of us out here will make in a lifetime.


Kind of reminds me when Amateur Sports/Olympics, finally threw their hands up and gave up on not allowing "professional athletes" to compete. The eastern blocks countries were creating "military units", that specialized in such things as Hockey, gymnastics, etc. and calling their "soldiers", "amateur athletes".

Let's face it, everything is now about money and prestige. With NIL, it won't be just about recruiting athletes to play for a school, it will be about recruiting big sponsors to pay the athletes.
 

Voyageur

Cheesehead
Joined
Nov 10, 2021
Messages
2,476
Reaction score
1,960
Kind of reminds me when Amateur Sports/Olympics, finally threw their hands up and gave up on not allowing "professional athletes" to compete. The eastern blocks countries were creating "military units", that specialized in such things as Hockey, gymnastics, etc. and calling their "soldiers", "amateur athletes".

Let's face it, everything is now about money and prestige. With NIL, it won't be just about recruiting athletes to play for a school, it will be about recruiting big sponsors to pay the athletes.
That's exactly how it went. We were always sending our amateur athletes to compete against professionals, whose whole life was devoted to nothing but preparing for competition. That's why the 1980 U.S. Olympic hockey team was so important to our entire Olympic program. That was such an amazing ride to watch.

What made it even better was that Mark Johnson was so darned instrumental in beating the Russians, and winning the gold. A player from the University of Wisconsin, and the son of our hockey coach, the legendary Bob Johnson, who made the men's program a real winner. It's amazing how many kids he put into the NHL.

Those kids couldn't even get a free pizza to share. The Russians, on the other hand, lived like kings, with every perk known to them at that time, including the ability to take illegal contraband like Levi's back into Russia when they won. In 1980, when they lost the gold, and to the US, everything they bought in their trip to the US was confiscated at the airport as "illegal" to punish them for failing to provide the gold.

I'll take the route we've gone over the Russian and East German route any day. They weren't athletes. Over half of them were juiced with every chemical that enhanced play known to mankind.
 

Heyjoe4

Cheesehead
Joined
Apr 30, 2018
Messages
6,688
Reaction score
1,843
That's exactly how it went. We were always sending our amateur athletes to compete against professionals, whose whole life was devoted to nothing but preparing for competition. That's why the 1980 U.S. Olympic hockey team was so important to our entire Olympic program. That was such an amazing ride to watch.

What made it even better was that Mark Johnson was so darned instrumental in beating the Russians, and winning the gold. A player from the University of Wisconsin, and the son of our hockey coach, the legendary Bob Johnson, who made the men's program a real winner. It's amazing how many kids he put into the NHL.

Those kids couldn't even get a free pizza to share. The Russians, on the other hand, lived like kings, with every perk known to them at that time, including the ability to take illegal contraband like Levi's back into Russia when they won. In 1980, when they lost the gold, and to the US, everything they bought in their trip to the US was confiscated at the airport as "illegal" to punish them for failing to provide the gold.

I'll take the route we've gone over the Russian and East German route any day. They weren't athletes. Over half of them were juiced with every chemical that enhanced play known to mankind.
Agreed. I remember all those years we were sending part time athletes to compete with seasoned athletes, the best in their field. It never seemed fair, and the definition of amateur v professional was always fuzzy.

Only problem with NIL, most of the talent will follow the money. Little schools will be forgotten. So much for March Madness..

It’s not here yet, and $$$ have been paid under the table for decades. On the other hand, the athletes drive the $$$ so they should get paid.
 
OP
OP
Pokerbrat2000

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,593
Reaction score
8,170
Location
Madison, WI
Only problem with NIL, most of the talent will follow the money. Little schools will be forgotten.
That is the one big variable that I worry about. The powerhouses are just going to get more powerful.

I guess there could be an argument that small schools might have big donors that want their alma mater to succeed in a sport. So whatever company that alumni donor works for/owns, doles out some big NIL money to athletes willing to play there. The problem with that logic, smaller schools get a lot less national coverage, as do their players, so the whole reason for NIL money, isn't really serving its intended purpose.

The only solution I have come up with and I am sure that there are several more being thrown around, would be to put a cap on the amount of money (NIL) that a team or an individual student athlete could collect in a year. Schools would then have to come up with their own policy as to how they can spread that "cap" among players.

I guess a second and a hybrid of that would be for the NIL money to be paid to the school into a "NIL fund", all of which has to be distributed equally among all rostered players. Put a cap on the total that a school could collect. Some might complain about that and say that the athlete generating the NIL isn't getting it all. Yup, but if it wasn't for that school giving that athlete a chance to play, they probably aren't being offered any NIL.
 

Heyjoe4

Cheesehead
Joined
Apr 30, 2018
Messages
6,688
Reaction score
1,843
That is the one big variable that I worry about. The powerhouses are just going to get more powerful.

I guess there could be an argument that small schools might have big donors that want their alma mater to succeed in a sport. So whatever company that alumni donor works for/owns, doles out some big NIL money to athletes willing to play there. The problem with that logic, smaller schools get a lot less national coverage, as do their players, so the whole reason for NIL money, isn't really serving its intended purpose.

The only solution I have come up with and I am sure that there are several more being thrown around, would be to put a cap on the amount of money (NIL) that a team or an individual student athlete could collect in a year. Schools would then have to come up with their own policy as to how they can spread that "cap" among players.

I guess a second and a hybrid of that would be for the NIL money to be paid to the school into a "NIL fund", all of which has to be distributed equally among all rostered players. Put a cap on the total that a school could collect. Some might complain about that and say that the athlete generating the NIL isn't getting it all. Yup, but if it wasn't for that school giving that athlete a chance to play, they probably aren't being offered any NIL.
I like that idea - have all players benefit from NIL money. There’s something socialist about it, but the greater good is to make sure there are good teams in the first place. It’s a good idea.
 
OP
OP
Pokerbrat2000

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,593
Reaction score
8,170
Location
Madison, WI
I like that idea - have all players benefit from NIL money. There’s something socialist about it, but the greater good is to make sure there are good teams in the first place. It’s a good idea.
The greater good and really an equitable solution. Sure "Joe Superstar" is the one that is bringing in a lions share of the NIL money, but without the University and his teammates, that probably wouldn't have been happening.
 

Heyjoe4

Cheesehead
Joined
Apr 30, 2018
Messages
6,688
Reaction score
1,843
The greater good and really an equitable solution. Sure "Joe Superstar" is the one that is bringing in a lions share of the NIL money, but without the University and his teammates, that probably wouldn't have been happening.
Correct. And “Joe Superstar” needs his team, and he’ll have his big payday most likely. It’s just a good idea to keep NCAA BB and FB from being dominated by a few deep pocket schools. Well, FB seems destined to be dominated by the SEC, but that predates NIL.
 

Voyageur

Cheesehead
Joined
Nov 10, 2021
Messages
2,476
Reaction score
1,960
The NCAA is no longer viable. It's a toothless relic of the past, who has no credibility, and less control than anyone imagines. In fact, conferences and teams could pretty much tell them to stuff it, and continue business as usual. If the NCAA threatened to take away their bowl games, the conferences would have their own configuration. As for income from sports, the NCAA doesn't provide the income anyhow. They just suck money out of the system, to act like they're really a governing body. Their loss, in the NIL issue, made that perfectly clear.

There are 5 major conferences who have good media incomes, and they will be the schools who get the most NIL money coming to their players through both, support groups, and individual representative houses that will act as individual agents for the players.

Anyhow, it's here, and it's going to hurt a lot of schools. Those who end up on the plus side will be those that have alumni and boosters with deep pockets who don't mind writing out 6 to 7 figure checks to hob-*** with the athletes, and through companies like Nike, who will pour money into the super athletes. The eventual winner is always going to be the ones who put money into the hands of the athletes, and schools, not the NCAA.

This article is worth the read. It tells a lot about how the NCAA is approaching the issue, and you can see that they're ready to let things pretty much take it's course, between schools, the players, and NIL.




As for the real NIL money, it's not going through the collectives. It's going directly to the players, from the donor. As an example, the deal for Arch Manning, at Texas. It didn't go through the school, but came directly to him, from donors, "IF" he attended Texas, and a lot of it if he went to school elsewhere. At this point, Manning is either 3rd or 4th on the QB list, and will probably end up being red-shirted this year, if possible. It will be just an extra year, and probably another $2 to $4 mill in NIL money because he won't have to compete with others on the team for a lot the extra money.


The #1 Texas QB will more than likely be Quinn Ewers. He's also a $4 million dollar NIL man.
 

Heyjoe4

Cheesehead
Joined
Apr 30, 2018
Messages
6,688
Reaction score
1,843
The NCAA is no longer viable. It's a toothless relic of the past, who has no credibility, and less control than anyone imagines. In fact, conferences and teams could pretty much tell them to stuff it, and continue business as usual. If the NCAA threatened to take away their bowl games, the conferences would have their own configuration. As for income from sports, the NCAA doesn't provide the income anyhow. They just suck money out of the system, to act like they're really a governing body. Their loss, in the NIL issue, made that perfectly clear.

There are 5 major conferences who have good media incomes, and they will be the schools who get the most NIL money coming to their players through both, support groups, and individual representative houses that will act as individual agents for the players.

Anyhow, it's here, and it's going to hurt a lot of schools. Those who end up on the plus side will be those that have alumni and boosters with deep pockets who don't mind writing out 6 to 7 figure checks to hob-*** with the athletes, and through companies like Nike, who will pour money into the super athletes. The eventual winner is always going to be the ones who put money into the hands of the athletes, and schools, not the NCAA.

This article is worth the read. It tells a lot about how the NCAA is approaching the issue, and you can see that they're ready to let things pretty much take it's course, between schools, the players, and NIL.




As for the real NIL money, it's not going through the collectives. It's going directly to the players, from the donor. As an example, the deal for Arch Manning, at Texas. It didn't go through the school, but came directly to him, from donors, "IF" he attended Texas, and a lot of it if he went to school elsewhere. At this point, Manning is either 3rd or 4th on the QB list, and will probably end up being red-shirted this year, if possible. It will be just an extra year, and probably another $2 to $4 mill in NIL money because he won't have to compete with others on the team for a lot the extra money.


The #1 Texas QB will more than likely be Quinn Ewers. He's also a $4 million dollar NIL man.
Interesting, thanks. So what value does the NCAA add? Not much it seems.
 

Voyageur

Cheesehead
Joined
Nov 10, 2021
Messages
2,476
Reaction score
1,960
Interesting, thanks. So what value does the NCAA add? Not much it seems.
You're right. They no longer add anything. There was a time that they controlled things associated with the games, but not any longer.

Good or bad, it doesn't matter. They've always been less than equal in how they treated schools in regards to rules violations.

Here's something that will tell you how it really works, with their non-existent power.

 
Top